CAFTA Passes House

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: EatSpam

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: EatSpam

Originally posted by: Helenihi

Originally posted by: conjur
Manufacturing jobs pay a helluva lot more in the States than do the service industry jobs.

Trade deficits are irrelevant? :roll:

Oh really, lawyers and doctors make less than factory workers? That's interesting news.

Do you have some evidence that average wages went down?

And yes, they're irrelevant, why would they matter?

Doctors and lawyers are not your typical service worker and more importantly, not everyone can be a doctor or lawyer. But you're just playing dumb. When he said service worker, you knew he meant retail sales, burger flipper, sandwich artist, etc.

So we get to pick and choose now? I am sure there are a few factory jobs that pay 8 bucks an hour also.

8 bux an hour isn't bad money in the rural south. Too bad that's too much for Big Business...

I am guessing it is the 30 dollar an hour factory jobs watching a machine stamp metal that are in jeopardy.

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: EatSpam

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: EatSpam

Originally posted by: Helenihi

Originally posted by: conjur
Manufacturing jobs pay a helluva lot more in the States than do the service industry jobs.

Trade deficits are irrelevant? :roll:

Oh really, lawyers and doctors make less than factory workers? That's interesting news.

Do you have some evidence that average wages went down?

And yes, they're irrelevant, why would they matter?

Doctors and lawyers are not your typical service worker and more importantly, not everyone can be a doctor or lawyer. But you're just playing dumb. When he said service worker, you knew he meant retail sales, burger flipper, sandwich artist, etc.

So we get to pick and choose now? I am sure there are a few factory jobs that pay 8 bucks an hour also.

8 bux an hour isn't bad money in the rural south. Too bad that's too much for Big Business...

Actually, I don't know too many jobs (at least here in NJ) that pay less than that. Heck, I bagged groceries for a week when I turned 14 and got $7.75 and $10.50 sundays.

 

[tommywishbone]

Oh yea, CAFTA is going to be great. I can see it now..... downtown San Salvador will be awash in Cadillacs & Hattteras yachts. They (Central American countries) can buy nothing from us, but our manufacters can buy anything they want for pennies, thanks to the slave labor wage, and in turn, make millions for the shareholders. Crap.

 

[dahunan]

Do you people have any F'ing idea how little money those people in the almost 3rd World Countries in the CAFTA actually get paid?

What is the number one goal of any corporation.... reduce the costs of manufacturing and production so you can increase the profit... The Elite in this country want us to be good little Corpes' = Slaves for Corporations.

 

[Gunslinger08]

Originally posted by: tommywishbone
Oh yea, CAFTA is going to be great. I can see it now..... downtown San Salvador will be awash in Cadillacs & Hattteras yachts. They (Central American countries) can buy nothing from us, but our manufacters can buy anything they want for pennies, thanks to the slave labor wage, and in turn, make millions for the shareholders. Crap.

Please research before you post.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0107489.html

Unemployment: 6.3%?but the economy has much underemployment.

The people who will be going to work at these corporations will either:
-be finding a job after being unemployed
or
-be finding a better paying job after being underemployed

They have absolutely no motivation to take a job with a big corporation for lower wages and worse working conditions.

GDP/PPP (2004 est.): $32.35 billion; per capita $4,900.

Do you realize how low that is? The standard of living in these countries is nothing like that compared to the US.

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: joshsquall

Originally posted by: tommywishbone
Oh yea, CAFTA is going to be great. I can see it now..... downtown San Salvador will be awash in Cadillacs & Hattteras yachts. They (Central American countries) can buy nothing from us, but our manufacters can buy anything they want for pennies, thanks to the slave labor wage, and in turn, make millions for the shareholders. Crap.

Please research before you post.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0107489.html

Unemployment: 6.3%?but the economy has much underemployment.

The people who will be going to work at these corporations will either:
-be finding a job after being unemployed
or
-be finding a better paying job after being underemployed

They have absolutely no motivation to take a job with a big corporation for lower wages and worse working conditions.

Uhm.. who will be "The people who will be going to work at these corporations" ?? << Americans?

 

[tommywishbone]

Good advise on the research. I did read the link, and the number that stood out the most was the average annual income in El Salvador: $4,900. I don't know what else to say.

I do hope CAFTA works to help ALL Americans, but I know the answer already.

 

[Engineer]

Originally posted by: Helenihi
Ah, and it is revealed.

Funny how letting them compete with American workers and not using unfair subsidies and trade barriers is "lifting them out." I'd call it letting them compete on an even playing field. I guess the idea of those funny brown people from down south getting jobs bothers you a little too much eh? Its okay if robots take jobs from Americans, but not Mexicans.

You can shove the funny brown people comment up your ass. I have full respect for Mexican people, but it's their country and it's their problem getting their own jobs, not mine. My job is to keep it here in the US, period.

Robots may take US jobs, but they keep more here than sending it all to Mexico. At least the plant stays open in the US and there are engineers, quality personel, a few operators, managers etc and it supports the local economy with tax revenues, etc. Mexico doesn't do anything except wear the fvcking highways out with trucks delivering parts.

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: dahunan
Do you people have any F'ing idea how little money those people in the almost 3rd World Countries in the CAFTA actually get paid?

What is the number one goal of any corporation.... reduce the costs of manufacturing and production so you can increase the profit... The Elite in this country want us to be good little Corpes' = Slaves for Corporations.

What's the number one goal of people? Make as much money as you can while doing as little work as you can. Corporations aren't the only greedy ones.

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: dahunan
Do you people have any F'ing idea how little money those people in the almost 3rd World Countries in the CAFTA actually get paid?

What is the number one goal of any corporation.... reduce the costs of manufacturing and production so you can increase the profit... The Elite in this country want us to be good little Corpes' = Slaves for Corporations.

What's the number one goal of people? Make as much money as you can while doing as little work as you can. Corporations aren't the only greedy ones.

So, what you are saying is that you would rather be on the side that supports the Corporations and not the people?

 

[zendari]

Corporations are owned by the people. It's one and the same. Don't point fingers while doing the same exact thing yourself.

 

[Gunslinger08]

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: joshsquall

Originally posted by: tommywishbone
Oh yea, CAFTA is going to be great. I can see it now..... downtown San Salvador will be awash in Cadillacs & Hattteras yachts. They (Central American countries) can buy nothing from us, but our manufacters can buy anything they want for pennies, thanks to the slave labor wage, and in turn, make millions for the shareholders. Crap.

Please research before you post.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0107489.html

Unemployment: 6.3%?but the economy has much underemployment.

The people who will be going to work at these corporations will either:
-be finding a job after being unemployed
or
-be finding a better paying job after being underemployed

They have absolutely no motivation to take a job with a big corporation for lower wages and worse working conditions.

Uhm.. who will be "The people who will be going to work at these corporations" ?? << Americans?

Re-read the whole post (quotes and all), and the link. I'm talking about El Salvador.

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: zendari
Corporations are owned by the people. It's one and the same. Don't point fingers while doing the same exact thing yourself.

So, there is no such thing as socioeconomic classes... a Hierarchy.. etc?

Of these people who own the coroporations.. which ones have any say in matters that we are talking about?

Are they

>>Production Line Workers
>>Management and Stockholders

---

Which Americans will CAFTA hurt..

>>Production Line Workers
>>Mangaement and Stockholders

--

 

[Kalbi]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: dahunan
this is so disgusting..

I am truly afraid for America with these Republicans in charge....

I don't see how it will survive and rebound from the total destruction by them.

riiiight....and that's why the US is #1 superpower...because we are such liberal socialists...

 

[EatSpam]

Originally posted by: zendari
What's the number one goal of people? Make as much money as you can while doing as little work as you can. Corporations aren't the only greedy ones.

Way to generalize. I'd like to provide a comfortable quality of life for my family and work a fair amount of hours. I could care less about "being rich."

 

[Kalbi]

Originally posted by: EatSpam

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: dahunan
Do you people have any F'ing idea how little money those people in the almost 3rd World Countries in the CAFTA actually get paid?

What is the number one goal of any corporation.... reduce the costs of manufacturing and production so you can increase the profit... The Elite in this country want us to be good little Corpes' = Slaves for Corporations.

What's the number one goal of people? Make as much money as you can while doing as little work as you can. Corporations aren't the only greedy ones.

Way to generalize. I'd like to provide a comfortable quality of life for my family and work a fair amount of hours. I could care less about "being rich."

would you rather them get paid little or get paid nothing and starve?

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: Kalbi

Originally posted by: EatSpam

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: dahunan
Do you people have any F'ing idea how little money those people in the almost 3rd World Countries in the CAFTA actually get paid?

What is the number one goal of any corporation.... reduce the costs of manufacturing and production so you can increase the profit... The Elite in this country want us to be good little Corpes' = Slaves for Corporations.

What's the number one goal of people? Make as much money as you can while doing as little work as you can. Corporations aren't the only greedy ones.

Way to generalize. I'd like to provide a comfortable quality of life for my family and work a fair amount of hours. I could care less about "being rich."

would you rather them get paid little or get paid nothing and starve?

Yes, you are confused... re-think why I highlighted the the amount these people earn...

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: EatSpam

Originally posted by: zendari
What's the number one goal of people? Make as much money as you can while doing as little work as you can. Corporations aren't the only greedy ones.

Way to generalize. I'd like to provide a comfortable quality of life for my family and work a fair amount of hours. I could care less about "being rich."

And there are hundreds of corporations which also are the same. Text
Text

Yes, you are confused... re-think why I highlighted the the amount these people earn...

Like Spam, they probably want to provide a comfortable quality of life for my family and work a fair amount of hours. And they are able to do that now with CAFTA.

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: dahunan
Do you people have any F'ing idea how little money those people in the almost 3rd World Countries in the CAFTA actually get paid?

What is the number one goal of any corporation.... reduce the costs of manufacturing and production so you can increase the profit... The Elite in this country want us to be good little Corpes' = Slaves for Corporations.

What's the number one goal of people? Make as much money as you can while doing as little work as you can. Corporations aren't the only greedy ones.

You need to take some econ classes. First of all jsut about every developing nation that has opened up to global trade has experienced an increase in per capita GDP. Look up any of the data for developing asian countries. The people that argue that nike is raping little kids in bangladesh don't realize that without nike those people would earn even less.

Your second argument is completly wrong. Corporations enjoy trade barriers - they can make more profit due to the fact that the internal prices are higher (supply and demand). Why do you think all these companies lobby so hard to stop this? Even removing tarrifs on good from china turned out to be a huge fight.

It's the consumer that benefits from more efficent economics markets - we get lower prices... so please save me the "eeevil corporations" rhethoric

 

[cquark]

Originally posted by: Helenihi
Yeah NAFTA was so bad, remember the terrible economy of the late 90s....

I dont think we can survive another period of record job growth, economic growth, record home purchases, income growth, etc., etc.

Do you have any evidence that was the result of NAFTA? It seemed like the commercialization of the Internet and application of computers as communications devices produced the boom, not trade with Mexico.

 

[cquark]

Originally posted by: gsaldivar
"Why in the world should people stick to the path of democracy if supposedly the most richest, most generous democracy in the world rejects a trade agreement with these countries?" (House W&M Committee Chairman Bill Thomas).

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

Rich countries have a long history of trade agreements that screw poorer countries, so there's nothing positive about trade agreements as such.

As for CAFTA in particular, do you think including clauses against reverse-engineering and circumvention of protections was added to benefit Central America or the US? Poor countries have a lot to learn from reverse engineering that will help them compete with first world countries and nothing to gain from forbidding it.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: cquark

Originally posted by: gsaldivar
"Why in the world should people stick to the path of democracy if supposedly the most richest, most generous democracy in the world rejects a trade agreement with these countries?" (House W&M Committee Chairman Bill Thomas).

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

Rich countries have a long history of trade agreements that screw poorer countries, so there's nothing positive about trade agreements as such.

As for CAFTA in particular, do you think including clauses against reverse-engineering and circumvention of protections was added to benefit Central America or the US? Poor countries have a lot to learn from reverse engineering that will help them compete with first world countries and nothing to gain from forbidding it.

Or they can license the technology. Basically what you are saying is you would want those countries to in essence steal technology from hard working Americans because those countries are poor.

Copyright and patent protection is essential in protecting all business's regardless of where they reside.

 

[cquark]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: cquark

Originally posted by: gsaldivar
"Why in the world should people stick to the path of democracy if supposedly the most richest, most generous democracy in the world rejects a trade agreement with these countries?" (House W&M Committee Chairman Bill Thomas).

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

Rich countries have a long history of trade agreements that screw poorer countries, so there's nothing positive about trade agreements as such.

As for CAFTA in particular, do you think including clauses against reverse-engineering and circumvention of protections was added to benefit Central America or the US? Poor countries have a lot to learn from reverse engineering that will help them compete with first world countries and nothing to gain from forbidding it.

Or they can license the technology. Basically what you are saying is you would want those countries to in essence steal technology from hard working Americans because those countries are poor.

No, I didn't say that. Please read what I said and not what you wish I had said to make it easier for you to object to my post.

Few corporations will let you license every technology you want, especially if you're trying to build a compatible product that might compete with them. As a result, reverse engineering is essential to our technology-driven economy. The IBM PC would not have led to PC boom of the 1980s or the Internet boom of the 1990s if other companies like Compaq hadn't reverse engineered it to produce their own compatible machines.

A few companies would do well in a monpoly-driven environment that forbidding reverse engineering would lead to, but the overall market would be smaller, there would be fewer technology jobs, and fewer useful products available to consumers.

Copyright and patent protection is essential in protecting all business's regardless of where they reside.

Any type of copyrights and patents can be problematic to developing companies and industries. Modern copyright extremism, such as the DMCA, is dangerous to most technology industries.

The US founded its publishing industry on reproducing British and other foreign works in violation of copyrights. Copyrights are a government granted monopoly, which can be useful in solving a serious problem to capitalism in some circumstances--the effectively infinite supply of copyrighted works. However, copyrights are harmful when they're used to suppress new technologies.

The broadcast TV companies tried to shutdown cable TV for "piracy" of their programs and wanted to be able to refuse to share program licenses with their new competitors. Congress prevented them from using their copyrights in that way and came to a compromise in the form of a compulsory license, which allowed the cable TV companies access to programming in return for a reasonable fixed fee. Satellite TV companies didn't enter the market in time to be part of that compromise, so they couldn't offer local programming in many areas for a number of years until they had the clout to lobby for equal rights to the cable companies.

 

[EatSpam]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: conjur
15 Dems voted for pro-corporate raping of Central America;

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2005/roll443.xml

We do what's best for our corporations, not Costa Rica.

Fixed

I forget, who employs people again?

I know, terrible we do what is best for our "corporations".

This is terrible, i think we should put walls up and isolate ourselves. Dont let our companies compete!

Corporations do employ people, but in this case, the corporations are looking to employ people in Costa Rica and other cheap nations and layoff Americans.

 

[oculus]

Originally posted by: zendari

What's the number one goal of people? Make as much money as you can while doing as little work as you can. Corporations aren't the only greedy ones.

Pathetic. Every once in a while a person will let something slip through that reveals more about their personality than they'd might freely make public.

Speak for yourself, Zendari. *My* goal is to live a long life with friends and family close by, and to travel the world within my means. Money might provide options, but it's a means to an end... it's not the end.