California AT folks, you okay? Governor issues historic drought restrictions:

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NutBucket

Lifer
Aug 30, 2000
27,036
548
126
good. And it should be that way all over the planet. Nothing worse than a golf course.


anyway, while this is good, it should have been done last year or even the year before.
Appropriately some of the largest public golf courses in LA are located near water reclamation facilities and are watered with reclaimed water. That's fine by me.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
69,557
27,861
136
I recently read a story about how water rights work in the Western states. Apparently when you own water rights, your ownership is for a quantity of water, not a percentage of available water. So if someone upstream from you takes the amount of water they are entitled to, and due to low water supply there's not enough left for you, you're screwed. That's the system. So those who are far enough upstream to get all the water they are entitled to are going to take it. And too bad, so sad for those downstream.
It's a first in time, first in right system so down stream users with senior rights would get their water allotment before upstream junior users get any of their allotment. However, being upstream with a good lawyer is a pretty good position to be in.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,821
29,574
146
Appropriately some of the largest public golf courses in LA are located near water reclamation facilities and are watered with reclaimed water. That's fine by me.

it's not just direct water use. It's the nitrogen load and useless chemicals that golf courses demand, and are constantly dumped into the water table so mouthbreathers can have their purdy grass to step on.
 

Svnla

Lifer
Nov 10, 2003
17,999
1,396
126
This is just a tip of the iceberg. Learn more about the potential water crisis.


In essence, only 0.007 percent of the planet's water is available to fuel and feed its 6.8 billion people.
Due to geography, climate, engineering, regulation, and competition for resources, some regions seem relatively flush with freshwater, while others face drought and debilitating pollution. In much of the developing world, clean water is either hard to come by or a commodity that requires laborious work or significant currency to obtain.

http://environment.nationalgeographic.com/environment/freshwater/freshwater-crisis/
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
63,436
11,762
136
Most orchards (almonds, walnuts, pistachios) are on a drip system and have been for some time. I live in Butte County (almonds, English walnuts) and you rarely see a flooded orchard. Rice farmers make up for it though - can't believe they grow such a water hungry crop in the Sacramento Valley and then sell almost all of it to South Korea.

MAYBE up there...but farther south, around Modesto, flood irrigation is still by far the most common way to irrigate crops, whether it's the entire field, like this:



or just flooding the rows, like this:



We moved out of NorCal just over 2 years ago. When we were there last summer, I was STUNNED by how dry and "dirty" everything looked...and the air? Hell, it almost hurt to breathe it. I guess, living there, you get used to the "brown haze" that's the central valley air.
 

DesiPower

Lifer
Nov 22, 2008
15,366
740
126
I was listening on the radio and sounded like shit's going down... they mentioned that CA gets 20% of its water from melting snow and this time of the year Sierra Nevada should have like 5ft of snow but this year its zero... CA will only get 5% of what it usually gets from melting snow. Seems like its time to churn out those Nuclear desalination plants by the dozens. Either way, RIP CA
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,403
8,199
126
Pistachios are pretty awesome...but if it takes that much water to produce them...I think humanity as we know could somehow manage to survive without them.

Almonds are no where as tasty...but they have more purpose in cooking and extracts. I'll give them a pass for now.
 

kranky

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
21,014
137
106
it's not just direct water use. It's the nitrogen load and useless chemicals that golf courses demand, and are constantly dumped into the water table so mouthbreathers can have their purdy grass to step on.

They will have to do whatever is necessary to make sure people have water. This could require massive changes in behavior. Will they have to make a choice between irrigation and water to homes? Could devastate some growers, and of course they'll want reimbursed for their losses.

But if history is any indication, people will use all the water they want up to the day the tap runs dry, figuring why should I conserve when my neighbor is still washing his car in the privacy of his closed garage.
 
Mar 11, 2004
23,182
5,646
146
Is this just a completely silly notion, or should say California and Texas look into water pipelines to send seawater inland to reservoirs? I've kinda wondered about this with the sea rising (which no pumping the water inland won't solve that but it could help some while also helping to provide water relief to ag areas that droughts wreak havoc on). Obviously this would take a long time to setup, let alone for it to contribute a lot to water supply in the regions it gets pumped to (and they'd have to figure out some way to keep it from getting drained ASAP). The reservoirs could also double as recreational areas.
 

Crusty

Lifer
Sep 30, 2001
12,684
2
81
Is this just a completely silly notion, or should say California and Texas look into water pipelines to send seawater inland to reservoirs? I've kinda wondered about this with the sea rising (which no pumping the water inland won't solve that but it could help some while also helping to provide water relief to ag areas that droughts wreak havoc on). Obviously this would take a long time to setup, let alone for it to contribute a lot to water supply in the regions it gets pumped to (and they'd have to figure out some way to keep it from getting drained ASAP). The reservoirs could also double as recreational areas.

What about the salt?
 

Ruptga

Lifer
Aug 3, 2006
10,247
207
106
What about the salt?

Or the fact that it would have absolutely no effect on sea level, whatsoever? For reference, removing every single ship on the ocean would reduce sea levels by six microns, which would be wiped out in 16 hours. Six million years ago when the Mediterranean dried up the global sea level rose by 10m. How big would these reservoirs be, compared to that? Here's a hint, if we turned all of Texas into an aquarium (reservoir) large enough to hold the Mediterranean, its walls would have to be 4 miles tall. For something slightly more comprehensible, it would take a 400 yard dam around all of Texas to make a reservoir that could lower the global sea level by about two feet.

We could maybe do that, if we really wanted to and weren't afraid to spend trillions, but that brings us back to the salt. You can't drink seawater, as far as irrigation goes it's probably the only option that's actually worse than Brawndo, and it's not even that useful for industry since it's so corrosive. Seawater is basically useless unless it's desalinated, but then what's the point of the reservoir, to allow the construction of desalination plants in Oklahoma and New Mexico? The only good thing about this plan is that destroying it gave me an excuse to procrastinate for a while.
 

Homerboy

Lifer
Mar 1, 2000
30,856
4,974
126
I know it's been said already in here, but agriculture and business consumes 80%+ of the fresh water in California. Limiting the use for the public isn't going to fix jack shit.

That being said, I like my almonds and pistachios, so keep them cheap.
 

Homerboy

Lifer
Mar 1, 2000
30,856
4,974
126
Or the fact that it would have absolutely no effect on sea level, whatsoever? For reference, removing every single ship on the ocean would reduce sea levels by six microns, which would be wiped out in 16 hours. Six million years ago when the Mediterranean dried up the global sea level rose by 10m. How big would these reservoirs be, compared to that? Here's a hint, if we turned all of Texas into an aquarium (reservoir) large enough to hold the Mediterranean, its walls would have to be 4 miles tall. For something slightly more comprehensible, it would take a 400 yard dam around all of Texas to make a reservoir that could lower the global sea level by about two feet.

We could maybe do that, if we really wanted to and weren't afraid to spend trillions, but that brings us back to the salt. You can't drink seawater, as far as irrigation goes it's probably the only option that's actually worse than Brawndo, and it's not even that useful for industry since it's so corrosive. Seawater is basically useless unless it's desalinated, but then what's the point of the reservoir, to allow the construction of desalination plants in Oklahoma and New Mexico? The only good thing about this plan is that destroying it gave me an excuse to procrastinate for a while.

LOL!
 

Jeff7

Lifer
Jan 4, 2001
41,599
19
81
This is just a tip of the iceberg. Learn more about the potential water crisis.




http://environment.nationalgeographic.com/environment/freshwater/freshwater-crisis/
Too. Many. People.

Just like any other life form, from bacteria up: Abundance of resources and absence of predators = high rate of reproduction and explosive population growth.
Abundance ends, and most of the bloated population dies out.
Unfortunately for us, instinctual urges often exceed our intelligence's ability to mitigate some of their harmful effects.
 

Ruptga

Lifer
Aug 3, 2006
10,247
207
106
Too. Many. People.

Just like any other life form, from bacteria up: Abundance of resources and absence of predators = high rate of reproduction and explosive population growth.
Abundance ends, and most of the bloated population dies out.
Unfortunately for us, instinctual urges often exceed our intelligence's ability to mitigate some of their harmful effects.

Not enough planning for the amount of people, at least. From what I hear about common water use practices there, they'd probably be fine if they were paying more attention to efficiency.

How about a progressive water use tax? Household rates could stay the same while the rate per gallon would increase as water use increases, ensuring that the biggest users have the most incentive to avoid waste (before the state runs out of water and they're literally forced to stop or cut operations, I mean).
 
Last edited:

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
49,606
166
111
www.slatebrookfarm.com


Meanwhile,Nestle pumps 80 million gallons a year out of the aquifer there...out of
Sacramento alone..
They have other wells in California
This nonsense again? The amount that Nestle bottles is insignificant. Why don't you pick a *single* golf course and complain about that golf course. The water use is comparable. For numeric help, a small pond, say 1 acre, 1 foot deep all the way across, is roughly a million gallons.

If people would stop buying the bottled water all the time this would stop.. Comes from the same place as everything else.
Well, don't tell schmuckley, but all the other states import our water, 16 ounce bottles at a time, to use in our showers that pump out 3 gallons per minute, for 30 minute showers twice a day.

It might have been snowy here this winter, it might have been cold, and I might be complaining about the mud the last few days. "Our weather in California is awesome! It's always nice and warm, and never rains!" <insert Nelson "ha ha" image here>
 

Attic

Diamond Member
Jan 9, 2010
4,282
2
76
I replaced my front lawn with gravel last year.

Much less hassle.


I guess the drought get much much worse over next 10 years.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,821
29,574
146
They will have to do whatever is necessary to make sure people have water. This could require massive changes in behavior. Will they have to make a choice between irrigation and water to homes? Could devastate some growers, and of course they'll want reimbursed for their losses.

But if history is any indication, people will use all the water they want up to the day the tap runs dry, figuring why should I conserve when my neighbor is still washing his car in the privacy of his closed garage.

aye. It's human behavior that is the real nutbucket in all of this.

These are relatively fixable issues, but humans are stubborn and selfish--not necessarily a bad thing in all circumstances...but in certain circumstances, we really need to learn how to chip in and accept certain sacrifices. The reality is that it is the only option going forward...but as long as you have well-paid idiots telling you that you can keep doing whatever you want and be happy (just vote for me so that I can make my corporate handlers happy!), no one will give a shit.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,821
29,574
146
This nonsense again? The amount that Nestle bottles is insignificant. Why don't you pick a *single* golf course and complain about that golf course. The water use is comparable. For numeric help, a small pond, say 1 acre, 1 foot deep all the way across, is roughly a million gallons.

Hello!

good. And it should be that way all over the planet. Nothing worse than a golf course.

it's not just direct water use. It's the nitrogen load and useless chemicals that golf courses demand, and are constantly dumped into the water table so mouthbreathers can have their purdy grass to step on.

 
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