Californians......Vote NO on 30........and YES on 32!!! PLEASE!!!

[rockyct]

I should be able to decide what politicians get my money, not the unions. The unions head spend money to protect them self, not the members. The unions have contributed far more to defeat 32 than any outside groups, most of which came from people who were forced to give to the union.

Rockyt how would yo like it if your employer decided to take 1000 form your paycheck without asking you to give to Romney, I am sure you wouldn't like it, but according to you it is OK for the union to do the same.

My mom is in a union, my aunt is in the teacher's union, my personal friends are in the teachers unions. More than half are going to vote for Romney, but they are ALL deeply against this proposition. One of them even voted for Ron Paul in the primary and he's still very much against this prop. Of course the unions are spending like crazy on this proposition, they know this would destroy their political power. Much of that money is spent to protect themselves from bullshit propositions like these.

I have no idea why you personally want to break up unions, but you obviously chose the wrong line of work. Unions don't just sneak up on you. Of course, you still aren't saying why the Koch brothers through an Iowa group feels like it needs to get involved in CA.

 

[rockyct]

Thats a piss poor reason.
EVERYTHING thats good for America will be liked by at least one asshole. Theres 300 million of us, do you really think its possible to have an issue on the table on the most noble people will support?

There are always assholes on both sides, but a single Iowa group tied to the Koch brothers are financing half of the support for the prop. It's not a matter of a few assholes giving a few thousand. It's one group giving $4 million of about the $8 million they got so far.

 

[DCal430]

My mom is in a union, my aunt is in the teacher's union, my personal friends are in the teachers unions. More than half are going to vote for Romney, but they are ALL deeply against this proposition. One of them even voted for Ron Paul in the primary and he's still very much against this prop. Of course the unions are spending like crazy on this proposition, they know this would destroy their political power. Much of that money is spent to protect themselves from bullshit propositions like these.

I have no idea why you personally want to break up unions, but you obviously chose the wrong line of work. Unions don't just sneak up on you. Of course, you still aren't saying why the Koch brothers through an Iowa group feels like it needs to get involved in CA.

I do not want to break up the union. You basically ignored what this proposition actually does, and haven't answered why it is ok for the unions take my money for political purposes without my permission. FYI many people at my work are for this proposition, they are tired of having to jump through a bunch of hoops to stop the union from stealing our money each year.

 

[DCal430]

There are always assholes on both sides, but a single Iowa group tied to the Koch brothers are financing half of the support for the prop. It's not a matter of a few assholes giving a few thousand. It's one group giving $4 million of about the $8 million they got so far.

Atleast that money was voluntarily given, the money the union use isn't voluntarily given, it is just taken.

 

[bfdd]

My mom is in a union, my aunt is in the teacher's union, my personal friends are in the teachers unions. More than half are going to vote for Romney, but they are ALL deeply against this proposition. One of them even voted for Ron Paul in the primary and he's still very much against this prop. Of course the unions are spending like crazy on this proposition, they know this would destroy their political power. Much of that money is spent to protect themselves from bullshit propositions like these.

I have no idea why you personally want to break up unions, but you obviously chose the wrong line of work. Unions don't just sneak up on you. Of course, you still aren't saying why the Koch brothers through an Iowa group feels like it needs to get involved in CA.

Oh so you mean they will have to participate in the union now and that's the issue? It changes nothing, besides the union leadership now having to ask their members for funds besides just swindling it away. Anyone who votes no on 32 is a retard.

 

[redgtxdi]

There are always assholes on both sides, but a single Iowa group tied to the Koch brothers are financing half of the support for the prop. It's not a matter of a few assholes giving a few thousand. It's one group giving $4 million of about the $8 million they got so far.

That's only because they can't afford to give the 10's of millions the unions can to get this thing done once and for all.

But to end the debate........R-E-A-D...T-H-E...F-A-C-T-S!!!!

http://www.yesprop32.com/downloads/Myth_Facts.pdf?_c=10vsemgzm4ttzps&sr_t=p

Koch brothers, or Beelzebub....this thing stops ALL corprorate giving!!!

Unionizing the public sector was and is borderline criminal. The net resource for income, after all the red tape, is the taxpayer. That is ridiculous on its face. This proposition will stop it once and for all!!!

YES on 32!!!


Oh ya.......and just to be sure..... NO on 30!!

 

[bfdd]

Also the Iowa group bankrolling it is stupid. Are you trying to tell me you see yes on prop32 everywhere?I have to go out of my way to find yes on prop32 info. No on 32 is shoved in our faces everywhere. Twitter has promoted tweets, Facebook ads, emails. Lol you know who is pushing yes on prop 32? The people are.

 

[BoberFett]

:thumbsup:

Yeap, the state is totally screwed. You got the liberal coasters, and the wackko righties in the valleys and neither the twain shall meet.

Bottom line. If people want things then they have to be paid for. You can't have things and not pay for them. Somewhere you have to meet in middle and that's not what happening in that state.

That's the problem nationally as well. We want shit, but we don't want to pay for it. When things started to go sour back in the 70s, rather than fix the problem we started buying everything on credit, consumers and government. When corporations started moving our production offshore, they should have felt the demand gap immediately, reminding them that the people they were downsizing in the US were their customers. But rather than stop consuming, stupid Americans just borrowed the money to buy things from the same capital class that just layed them off. They ship more jobs overseas, we borrow more money to buy stuff from them that was made elsewhere. Damn, Americans are stupid.

 

[rockyct]

That's only because they can't afford to give the 10's of millions the unions can to get this thing done once and for all.

But to end the debate........R-E-A-D...T-H-E...F-A-C-T-S!!!!

http://www.yesprop32.com/downloads/Myth_Facts.pdf?_c=10vsemgzm4ttzps&sr_t=p

Koch brothers, or Beelzebub....this thing stops ALL corprorate giving!!!

Unionizing the public sector was and is borderline criminal. The net resource for income, after all the red tape, is the taxpayer. That is ridiculous on its face. This proposition will stop it once and for all!!!

YES on 32!!!


Oh ya.......and just to be sure..... NO on 30!!

It stops giving directly to politicians, but 501c4s couldn't really do that anyway so it's stopping a huge funding source for groups opposed to the Koch brothers. If it was a true measure to stop all corporate giving, why is it only restricted to giving to politicians? It's designed to knock the balance of money out from those opposed to these shady 501c4s. It's just so obvious that the reason isn't limiting special interest money in elections but destroying the power of the unions. The fact that you call public unionization criminal is perfect enough evidence that this whole proposition is about unions.

 

[rockyct]

I do not want to break up the union. You basically ignored what this proposition actually does, and haven't answered why it is ok for the unions take my money for political purposes without my permission. FYI many people at my work are for this proposition, they are tired of having to jump through a bunch of hoops to stop the union from stealing our money each year.

These groups want to break them up. They've tried in WI but recently got overturned.

Atleast that money was voluntarily given, the money the union use isn't voluntarily given, it is just taken.

You weren't born into a union job so I'm not sure what you expected when you joined one. Unions spend money to protect the interest of the union.

 

[rockyct]

Also the Iowa group bankrolling it is stupid. Are you trying to tell me you see yes on prop32 everywhere?I have to go out of my way to find yes on prop32 info. No on 32 is shoved in our faces everywhere. Twitter has promoted tweets, Facebook ads, emails. Lol you know who is pushing yes on prop 32? The people are.

The unions didn't put it on the ballot. Ultra conservative groups to try to cripple unions did. It's understandable that they take a prop like this as a threat to them.

 

[zinfamous]

California, under its present management, is a great drain on the other 49 States. Why should the rest of the country pay for the profligate spending of the California Liberals?

and from whence did you extract this pile of horseshit?


I'm all eyes...

 

[redgtxdi]

It stops giving directly to politicians, but 501c4s couldn't really do that anyway so it's stopping a huge funding source for groups opposed to the Koch brothers. If it was a true measure to stop all corporate giving, why is it only restricted to giving to politicians? It's designed to knock the balance of money out from those opposed to these shady 501c4s. It's just so obvious that the reason isn't limiting special interest money in elections but destroying the power of the unions. The fact that you call public unionization criminal is perfect enough evidence that this whole proposition is about unions.

I'm trying to find that verbage in the proposition & not having much luck.

Just because I call unionization of public sector employees criminal (and *I* feel that way because PSU's don't rely on profits, they rely on taxpayers) doesn't define the proposition itself. Nor does this proposition winning imply that unions are crippled.........UNLESS...........you're admitting that they pocket politicians for their own agenda.

Is this where we all start trying to figure out which union you steward?

 

[DCal430]

These groups want to break them up. They've tried in WI but recently got overturned.

You weren't born into a union job so I'm not sure what you expected when you joined one. Unions spend money to protect the interest of the union.

Not really, they spend money on things I don't support. I don't mind giving them money for barganing, but not for political things that have nothing to do with the union or for things I do not support.

So because I want to work for a job that has the union, that gives the union a right to take my money as they please for what ever they want. It is disgusting that you can't see what is wrong with that.

 

[Incorruptible]

People need to vote to stop the spending, it will destroy California

 

[bfdd]

The unions didn't put it on the ballot. Ultra conservative groups to try to cripple unions did. It's understandable that they take a prop like this as a threat to them.

I will be voting Yes on Prop 32. I went through my fair share of shitty California teachers. I've seen them do things worthy of being fired only to be forced to resign instead, popping up a city or two over teaching again. I've seen year after year as the CTU exploits us tax payers by screaming "FOR THE CHILDREN". Sure the CTU does some good, but they no longer serve the purpose it was designed for. It's now used to suck us tax payers dry and control our Government to keep up the scam. Fuck you and all those that support 32.

 

[Incorruptible]

I will be voting Yes on Prop 32. I went through my fair share of shitty California teachers. I've seen them do things worthy of being fired only to be forced to resign instead, popping up a city or two over teaching again. I've seen year after year as the CTU exploits us tax payers by screaming "FOR THE CHILDREN". Sure the CTU does some good, but they no longer serve the purpose it was designed for. It's now used to suck us tax payers dry and control our Government to keep up the scam. Fuck you and all those that support 32.

Well said, The teachers union doesn't care about the kids

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

The Howard Jarvis Taxpayers Association created Prop 13. That is why California is in a mess.

Now why would I ever want to vote for anything they suggest?

The OP is clueless.

 

[redgtxdi]

The Howard Jarvis Taxpayers Association created Prop 13. That is why California is in a mess.

Now why would I ever want to vote for anything they suggest?

The OP is clueless.

Really? Did you miss the first 2 times I posted it?

http://defeat30.com/fact-sheet/

Prop 13 has NOTHING to do with why California is as messed up, financially, as it is.

Read 'em & weep, Rocky! Read 'em & weep!

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

Really? Did you miss the first 2 times I posted it?

http://defeat30.com/fact-sheet/

Prop 13 has NOTHING to do with why California is as messed up, financially, as it is.

Read 'em & weep, Rocky! Read 'em & weep!

Post cute cartoons all you want, it doesn't help support your case nor disprove in any way my assertion.

All of California's problems stem from the initiative system and most of its fiscal problems from the fallout of Prop 13 and other stupid initiatives related to how the state raises and spends its money.

Here from an actual reputable source (not the creators of the proposition itself), The Economist:

http://www.economist.com/node/18563638

 

[redgtxdi]

Post cute cartoons all you want, it doesn't help support your case nor disprove in any way my assertion.

All of California's problems stem from the initiative system and most of its fiscal problems from the fallout of Prop 13 and other stupid initiatives related to how the state raises and spends its money.

Here from an actual reputable source (not the creators of the proposition itself), The Economist:

http://www.economist.com/node/18563638

Whoaaaa? Your article neither argues nor says ANYTHING about prop13.

And if you read the facts sheet in the link I posted you will find that not only does California pay:

-The 10th highest property tax rate in the country. But also....
-THE highest state sales tax
And
-The 2nd highest income tax (which STARTS, btw at $46, 349)

Cute cartoons actually work when they represent the truth.

 

[Lithium381]

I just heard a radio ad in support of prop30. . . . paid for by the retired teachers union or something. . . . . hah, 50% of all new budget for education goes to retirement/pension . . . no wonder they're interested in it

 

[RampantAndroid]

You mean like devastating cuts to much needed programs, shutting down high school sports, and other after school programs. Programs to provide service for the poor will be eliminated, children will suffer the greatest of all if 30 fails.

Sports SHOULD be shut down. Why the eff do we have kids skipping classes to play sports? Should banned. Sports are OUTSIDE of the school and SHOULD NOT be a reason to skip classes.

 

[Lithium381]

You mean like devastating cuts to much needed programs, shutting down high school sports, and other after school programs. Programs to provide service for the poor will be eliminated, children will suffer the greatest of all if 30 fails.

if the CTU cared so much about the kids they'd realize their demands all the time are rediculous. pensions and retirement and all of their bennies + not being able to be fired. . . . NO WONDER THE STATE IS IN THE HOLE and who's benefiting? Not the kids.

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

Whoaaaa? Your article neither argues nor says ANYTHING about prop13.

And if you read the facts sheet in the link I posted you will find that not only does California pay:

-The 10th highest property tax rate in the country. But also....
-THE highest state sales tax
And
-The 2nd highest income tax (which STARTS, btw at $46, 349)

Cute cartoons actually work when they represent the truth.

You clearly didnt read it.

Shocking.