Call of Duty Ghosts Impressions

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JeffMD

Platinum Member
Feb 15, 2002
2,026
19
81
My target had lots of ghost stock... right there next to all that ipad air stock.
 

BarkingGhostar

Diamond Member
Nov 20, 2009
8,409
1,617
136
The CoD franchise is dying a slow death atm. They need to revamp everything if they want to still have a franchise.
Hmm, yesterday there were 884K people playing multiplayer online at 11AM EST. I guess that could speak of impending doom, but I'm not putting a time frame on it.

What is strange is that I am playing with four friends, all in various suburbs of Atlanta. Three are on U-verse, on on Charter and myself on Comcast. One friend can't resolve an issue of getting kicked from the game server--his Live session remains fine.

He is one of the three on U-verse and the other two are not having issues. We are all in WAN, and it has turned into a mystery for a second night of disconnects for him. He just played a map and ~30 seconds from the end got kicked (disconnected) from the game server.

Message is server is no longer available. He's already been on the phone with Activision's neanderthals and about to give up. We've been playing COD since the first MW. First time this has occurred.

What is amusing is that one other friend use to have this exact same issue 8-9 years ago on the original X-box with Ubi's Ghost Recon. too funny
 

BikeJunkie

Golden Member
Oct 21, 2013
1,390
0
0
In the Military they preach "check your corners". You don't think Taliban insurgents try to hide in corners hoping to shoot a Marine in the back?

Now in a FFA deathmatch style game this gameplay style is lame. In a team based game and you are on point, expect to take the first hits.

Do we really need bad real life military analogies to justify an entirely boring and frustrating element in a shooter built around the premise of fast-paced arcade-style CQ combat?

With maps this large, so much clutter, and so many vertical options, camping some remote little shadow crushes gameplay no matter how one tries to justify it. Due to how long it takes to traverse some of these maps, it's exponentially more frustrating in Ghosts than in any previous installment.
 
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cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
Do we really need bad real life military analogies to justify an entirely boring and frustrating element in a shooter built around the premise of fast-paced arcade-style CQ combat?

With maps this large, so much clutter, and so many vertical options, camping some remote little shadow crushes gameplay no matter how one tries to justify it. Due to how long it takes to traverse some of these maps, it's exponentially more frustrating in Ghosts than in any previous installment.

Fine but it is still an legit strategy, whether you like it or not. It happened in quake 3 all the time. Until everyone memorized the map and would be able to predict where people would hide.
 

BikeJunkie

Golden Member
Oct 21, 2013
1,390
0
0
Fine but it is still an legit strategy, whether you like it or not. It happened in quake 3 all the time. Until everyone memorized the map and would be able to predict where people would hide.

While your assertion is debatable, it's not the strategy of camping that was attacked, but rather the map design which facilitates it that was attacked. And what a ~15 year old arena shooter has to do with anything is beyond me

Modern Warfare, Black Ops, and Black Ops 2 made such camping very difficult because there was less clutter on the maps, the maps were smaller, and the corners of rooms were designed in such a way that it was difficult entrench yourself and get yourself out of sight. There also wasn't nearly as much vertical space to the maps, which in a video game like this, introduces little more than chaos and randomness. If you tried to hide in some remote corner of the map, you were either going to get very lonely or, if someone did manage to stumble upon you, they were as likely to see you first as you them. This made such camping unrewarding and it was therefore inherently discouraged by the map design.

The problem with Ghosts (and MW2 and MW3) is that the maps are much larger. This means that you have people desperately searching for a confrontation out of pure boredom, which blatantly contradicts the proposed nature of the game. The nooks and crannies that are spread throughout these maps enable and reward those who just want to sit back and exploit random encounters. Without getting into the legitimacy of such tactics, the point here is that this doesn't appeal to a lot of COD fans because it's inconsistent with the implied philosophy of the other installments.

Making matters a little worse is that this predicament does not appear to be intentional given the arcadish/fast-paced nature of all other elements in the game. Instead, this seems to be an accident perpetrated by contracted resources hired to help ship a game by November.

If people were just being sensitive to getting picked off as a result of their own carelessness, you would have seen similar sentiments with the release every every COD installment, but that's not been the case. These were very loud and prolific complaints in response to MW2, MW3, and now Ghosts.
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
Lol at people being pissed off that a CoD map isn't just a square box or straight line anymore. God forbid there is more to do than run around 4 corners over and over again and twitch click.
 
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purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,027
5,912
126
Lol at people being pissed off that a CoD map isn't just a square box or straight line anymore.

Lol at people who don't play or care about dudebro shooters coming into threads about them and discussing them.
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
Lol at people who don't play or care about dudebro shooters coming into threads about them and discussing them.

If its selling poorly and dudebros dont like it because anything more than running around in circles in a small box is too hard on their brains, I might actually look into it!
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
While your assertion is debatable, it's not the strategy of camping that was attacked, but rather the map design which facilitates it that was attacked. And what a ~15 year old arena shooter has to do with anything is beyond me

Modern Warfare, Black Ops, and Black Ops 2 made such camping very difficult because there was less clutter on the maps, the maps were smaller, and the corners of rooms were designed in such a way that it was difficult entrench yourself and get yourself out of sight. There also wasn't nearly as much vertical space to the maps, which in a video game like this, introduces little more than chaos and randomness. If you tried to hide in some remote corner of the map, you were either going to get very lonely or, if someone did manage to stumble upon you, they were as likely to see you first as you them. This made such camping unrewarding and it was therefore inherently discouraged by the map design.

The problem with Ghosts (and MW2 and MW3) is that the maps are much larger. This means that you have people desperately searching for a confrontation out of pure boredom, which blatantly contradicts the proposed nature of the game. The nooks and crannies that are spread throughout these maps enable and reward those who just want to sit back and exploit random encounters. Without getting into the legitimacy of such tactics, the point here is that this doesn't appeal to a lot of COD fans because it's inconsistent with the implied philosophy of the other installments.

Making matters a little worse is that this predicament does not appear to be intentional given the arcadish/fast-paced nature of all other elements in the game. Instead, this seems to be an accident perpetrated by contracted resources hired to help ship a game by November.

If people were just being sensitive to getting picked off as a result of their own carelessness, you would have seen similar sentiments with the release every every COD installment, but that's not been the case. These were very loud and prolific complaints in response to MW2, MW3, and now Ghosts.

OK...well implied philosophy you say? I thought the idea was to shoot the enemy. You are the enemy and I shoot you. I get the kill and you respawn somewhere. That's the point of this game no? It seems that people are mad that the game and the maps aren't so simple anymore and they need to reevaluate their gameplay.

I mentioned quake 3 because it is one game I remember clearly having maps with trap zones. You could sit and wait until someone ran for the rocket launcher but they had no idea you were there waiting for them and shooting at them from above. After people learned these spots it was near impossible to use them because people would be prepared for that tactic.
 

boomhower

Diamond Member
Sep 13, 2007
7,228
19
81
OK...well implied philosophy you say? I thought the idea was to shoot the enemy. You are the enemy and I shoot you. I get the kill and you respawn somewhere. That's the point of this game no? It seems that people are mad that the game and the maps aren't so simple anymore and they need to reevaluate their gameplay.

I mentioned quake 3 because it is one game I remember clearly having maps with trap zones. You could sit and wait until someone ran for the rocket launcher but they had no idea you were there waiting for them and shooting at them from above. After people learned these spots it was near impossible to use them because people would be prepared for that tactic.

I think that is the big issue. Folks bought the game expecting a certain type of gameplay. From what I hear the Battlefield series has larger more complex maps. That is not what the CoD series has traditionally been. It's been pretty much run and gun with some sniping thrown in the mix. These large drawn out maps isn't what I was expecting and going from a lot of the others talking them either.

I spent some more time with it and it seems sub guns are almost useless in most maps. I've never been a fan of scope or ACOGs but they are mandatory pretty much in a lot of maps. Just not what I thought I was going to be getting.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
By larger and more complex, you mean they have a bunch of elevated areas for snipers to camp? Because that is the "complexity" of 90% of the BF4 maps. I haven't played Ghosts, but every COD since MW has suffered from this. Rather than simple maps that flow, they are making makes with a bunch of artificial choke points or points with a clear advantage, thus once one team takes it, it is game over.

Granted, there have been a few maps that were done pretty well.
 

Sixguns

Platinum Member
May 22, 2011
2,258
2
81
Yea exdeath has blessed us with his hate of anything new!

Im kind of bummed on the hardcore playlist. I love HC CTF but they removed it from BO2 so moved to domination and now there isnt either one. I dont mind KC but I hope they add more game modes soon!
 

BikeJunkie

Golden Member
Oct 21, 2013
1,390
0
0
I thought the idea was to shoot the enemy. You are the enemy and I shoot you.

Sorry, you just summarily dismissed the fact that there's a little more to the story here than "I thought the idea was to just shoot people." The implications of your argument are that enjoyment is derived from the same basic gameplay mechanic in any shooter and that little if nothing else factors into the equation. Never mind how strategy might differ based on the general approach to map design in a given game. Never mind how strategy in Q3 might be a tad different than strategy in COD (or that it at least ought to be).

Ghosts has a few salvagable maps. Tremor, for instance, is a fantastic map that doesn't suffer from the problems rampant in Stormfront and Stonehaven. But before we actually delve into a discussion on Ghosts' maps and away from one of Q3 maps, have you actually played Ghosts? What are your thoughts on the maps themselves?
 

BikeJunkie

Golden Member
Oct 21, 2013
1,390
0
0
I think that is the big issue. Folks bought the game expecting a certain type of gameplay.

I think you're correct, but I don't think you and I are interpreting cmdrdredd's comment below in the same way:

It seems that people are mad that the game and the maps aren't so simple anymore and they need to reevaluate their gameplay.

Not quite. It has nothing to do with simplicity on its own. It has to do with the fact that large complex maps are ill-suited to the nature of everything else in the Call of Duty ecosystem. The guns, the perks, player movement, no vehicles, etc. Battlefield-style maps in Ghosts SUCKS for all the same reasons COD-style maps in Battlefield would SUCK. It's not a player adjustment issue, it's a design problem that interrupts the fluidity of the game and, as boomhower mentioned, what players expect out of COD gameplay.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,027
5,912
126
the main reason i have no interest in battlefield games are because the maps are too big. i simply don't like large maps, vehicles or no vehicles. there are some maps in old cod games i don't really enjoy either because i feel they are too large, i too prefer the smaller close quarter maps. while i haven't played ghosts yet, i can see why one would feel this way about it if the maps are larger.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
the main reason i have no interest in battlefield games are because the maps are too big. i simply don't like large maps, vehicles or no vehicles. there are some maps in old cod games i don't really enjoy either because i feel they are too large, i too prefer the smaller close quarter maps. while i haven't played ghosts yet, i can see why one would feel this way about it if the maps are larger.

Battlefield has small maps, if you prefer that game type. Domination and Squad DM are played on smaller versions of the larger maps (sectioned off versions, really). BF3 had a map expansion called Close Quarters that had some excellent smaller maps for that style of gameplay.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,027
5,912
126
Battlefield has small maps, if you prefer that game type. Domination and Squad DM are played on smaller versions of the larger maps (sectioned off versions, really). BF3 had a map expansion called Close Quarters that had some excellent smaller maps for that style of gameplay.

but the mechanics of the game are based around the big maps and vehicles. just not my style of game.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
but the mechanics of the game are based around the big maps and vehicles. just not my style of game.

I don't think so. I run and gun just like I do in CoD. There are subtle differences, but the small maps are very similar in gameplay, at least to me.
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
I don't think so. I run and gun just like I do in CoD. There are subtle differences, but the small maps are very similar in gameplay, at least to me.

I agree with you on this. Honestly though with 64 players and jeeps, jets, choppers, and tanks on a large map there is no shortage of people to shoot. On the populated servers it isn't a problem. It also relies a little bit more heavily on your team being in sync. I never drive more than a few seconds before someone is shooting at me.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
I agree with you on this. Honestly though with 64 players and jeeps, jets, choppers, and tanks on a large map there is no shortage of people to shoot. On the populated servers it isn't a problem. It also relies a little bit more heavily on your team being in sync. I never drive more than a few seconds before someone is shooting at me.

The problem with the larger maps (and I think a lot of people have this complaint) is if you don't have access to a vehicle, there can be an extremely long walk to get into range of people. And if you're not a sniper, you are at an extreme disadvantage because you can't engage enemies until you get close.

I think BF4 (despite it's loads of problems) has done a good job with the balancing of large maps for people that want that and smaller maps for people who want quicker, more run and gun playstyles.

Sadly, most of the maps suffer from the flaw that adding multiple levels makes the more complex and better; when all it really does is give whoever gets to the high level first a distinct advantage, because none of the upper levels are "sealed" off from the lower ones. So many times someone with a LMG or an assault rifle can get the high ground and rain death on the lower levels.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,027
5,912
126
I don't think so. I run and gun just like I do in CoD. There are subtle differences, but the small maps are very similar in gameplay, at least to me.

yeah i'd prefer to play a whole game dedicated to this than just 1 or 2 maps. last bf game i played was the beta of bf3 and it just completely turned me off of the franchise. the commercials for bf4 look pretty badass though.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
yeah i'd prefer to play a whole game dedicated to this than just 1 or 2 maps. last bf game i played was the beta of bf3 and it just completely turned me off of the franchise. the commercials for bf4 look pretty badass though.

Every BF4 map has a "close quarters" variant. BF3 didn't really get this until one of the last map packs. But, on those maps, you'd never want to play with 64 players. It is already pretty hectic on 32 player servers.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,027
5,912
126
Every BF4 map has a "close quarters" variant. BF3 didn't really get this until one of the last map packs. But, on those maps, you'd never want to play with 64 players. It is already pretty hectic on 32 player servers.

f 32 players, i don't ever wanna play with more than 12 people.
 
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ronbo613

Golden Member
Jan 9, 2010
1,237
45
91
I wonder if/when COD Ghosts player stats will show on the Call of Duty ELITE website.
 
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