Can I reduce the price?

Amaroque · Jan 28, 2005

Originally posted by: beany323

Yea i understand this, but you can oc a fx-55 higher then a 3000 or 3200... yea there is a major gap in price (cant argue with numbers!) and whats 500 dollars more... lol... (ok 1/3 of a big Assd monitor!!)

That's not necessarily true. The FX is 130nm, while the Winchester is 90nm.

As far as the unlocked higher multipliers, yeah that's nice... But not worth the price tag it comes with.

beany323 · Jan 28, 2005

doesn't 1MB L2 Cache help?

(not arguing and i know that the cost may exceed performance, but if i am gonna get top of the line, well might as well spend it)

thanks!

Amaroque · Jan 28, 2005

1 MB L2 doesn't do a whole lot for the A64. The A64 isn't bandwidth limited due to the on die memory controller. Heck, even dual channel RAM doesn't do a whole lot either.

IMO AMD came up with such an efficient design, that they are having problems improving it with the currently available technology.

Crescent13 · Jan 28, 2005

WOW! I didn't expect this many people to write in! Not that I'm complaining. First, I didn't shop around much. I found the antec PSU fan (even though I won't be using it) for $3.59 instead of $11.99. I kinda want to keep the liquid cooling, I will only get rid of it as a last resort. I'll shop around for cheaper Koolance parts. I might go with the PC-601 instead of the PC-650. I'll also post the specs after I have finished reducing the price.

The Demon · Jan 28, 2005

LOL.... did someone say Alienware!!! Geez.... atleast warn me next time you crack a joke on Alienware. I practically sprayed coffie all over my monitor!!

It is quite amusing how advertising a gaming system with 6800 graphics, (not Ultra), 1GB 512x2, (hopefully low-density RAM, awww hell I can't find the OCZ Platinum Rev 2 thingy pass me the Komura).

Hey let's install this SLI board, ( tech stumbles on golf-putting artificial turf setup.... "Oops spilled my Scotch on the mobo... that's ok we'll just use this generic PCI board instead!!!) After throwing in some massive 400GB 7200 RPM Hardrives, (bigger is better, right?), and some exausting, rigoruos installation of Windows XP ($200 techie install, bend-over please), it's time to test the rig.

Wow, this thing really blows, I mean the competition away. Hey, I got an idea!! Let's give it a neat looking case and water-cool it! Now that's futuristic lookin. This kinda of technology must be Alien by the looks of it. Let's charge alien prices. (Devious, hellish laughter arises in the background). Wow!!! It's him, oh Lord of ass-ramming, please advise us on how to price this "unique" Alienware technology that only we can manufacture. "It's simple my unworthy followers. Just charge tripple what it would cost your brainless consumers to build, Mu hahahahhaha!!!!!"

I'm sorry, I couldn't help myself... Bad Demon ... BAD!!!!

Crescent13 · Jan 28, 2005

beany323 · Jan 28, 2005

how much is that setup without the cooling aspect? (at work can't use calculator atm)

Matthias99 · Jan 28, 2005

Originally posted by: Crescent13
I have gone over everything and it is cheaper but still overpriced. Here are the NEW specs.

Power Supply: Pc Power & Cooling 510 SLI with PFC $309.95
Case: Koolance PC2-650BK $199.95
Motherboard: DFI LANParty UT nF4 SLI-D $299.00
Processor Cooling: Koolance CPU-300-H06 $49.95
Video Card Cooling: Koolance VID-NV2-LO6 VID $79.99
Hard Drives: Western Digital Raptor 74 GB $154.89 x 2 = $309.78
Hard Drive Cooling: Koolance HD-40-HO6 HD $31.99
Second Hard Drive Cooling: Koolance Second Hard Drive Kit $16.49

That's because all of these things are overpriced and/or unnecessary. You're just not going to make inroads into getting this cheaper unless you ditch the watercooling, the super-expensive case/PSU, and probably the motherboard as well ($300!)

Ditching the watercooling, and going with:

really nice Lian-Li (or other brand) Aluminum case -- $116
Chaintech NF4 MB -- $128
Seagate 200GB SATA2/NCQ drive -- $135

Edit: forgot the PSU. Toss in, say:

Seasonic Super Tornado 400W -- $85

And you'll drop your price by $835, and have essentially zero impact on performance. You pay a huge premium for watercooling and SLI, and that PSU is way overkill.

Tarrant64 · Jan 28, 2005

Matthias makes a good point. Ditch the watercooling already. It's not needed!

<---Still can't believe this is still going.

Bump.

...

Couldn't help it.

Crescent13 · Jan 28, 2005

I am now convinced that I can't go with water cooling and make it cheap enough. I will remove the water cooling parts and post the specs.

Crescent13 · Jan 28, 2005

Here it is with only the liquid cooling removed.

Power Supply: Pc Power & Cooling 510 SLI with PFC $309.95
- Molex Connector Color: All UV Blue ConnectX
- Acrylic Cover Color: Neon Blue UV Sensitive
- Sleeve Color: UV Blue
- Heatshrink Color: Green
- Motherboard Cable Sleeve Color: UV Sensitive Blue
- Motherboard Heatshrink Color: Green
Info at: http://www.pcpowercooling.com/...rbocools/510/index.htm
Sold at: http://www.performance-pcs.com...o.php?products_id=2561{96}716{4}234{1}406{2}35{16}416{45}313&osCsid=e534d8b49e0e6c81318fbf5442fddf3e

Case: Lian-LI PC-65B $116.00
Info at: http://www.lian-li.com/product...43906579a8d01e9bd82756
Sold at: http://www.newegg.com/app/view...Cases&CMP=OTC-d3alt1me

Motherboard: DFI LANParty UT nF4 SLI-D $299.00
Info at: http://www.dfi.com.tw/Product/...TEGORY_TYPE=LP&SITE=US
Sold at: http://www.computerhq.com/DFI_...artinfo-id-532379.html

Processor: AMD Athlon 64 3200+ $199.99
Info at: http://www.amd.com/us-en/Proce..._118_9485_9487,00.html
Sold at: http://www.tigerdirect.com/app...INGDF&CMP=OTC-SHOPPING

Processor Thermal Paste: Cooler Master HTK-002 High Performance Thermal Compund $10.99
Info at: http://www.coolermaster.com/in...=HTK-002&other_title=0
Sold at: http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/...407&affiliate=shopping

Video Card: XFX NVIDIA GeForce 6800GT $445.00
Info at: http://www.xfxforce.com/product_view.php?sku=PVT45GUD
Sold at: http://www.newegg.com/app/view...Cards&CMP=OTC-d3alt1me

Hard Drives: Western Digital Raptor 74 GB $154.89 x 2 = $309.78
Info at: http://www.westerndigital.com/...roducts.asp?DriveID=65
Sold at: http://www.newegg.com/app/view...tion=22-144-160&DEPA=1

Memory:
Info at:
Sold at:

Optical Drive: NEC ND-3500A $77.00
Info at: http://www.necsam.com/optical/products/ND3500A/
Sold at: http://www.monarchcomputer.com...=160947&AFFIL=FRG&NR=1

Mouse: Logitech MX 510 Performance Optical Mouse $34.99
Info at: http://www.logitech.com/index....ID=2142,CONTENTID=8070
Sold at: http://www.buy.com/retail/prod...egory=Comp&dcaid=17379

Keyboard: Logitech Elite Keyboard $29.88
Info at: http://www.logitech.com/index....ID=2166,CONTENTID=5013
Sold at: http://www.jr.com/JRProductPag...le.datafeed.LGI+967234

Speakers: Logitech X-530 $79.95
Info at:
http://www.logitech.com/index....ID=2177,CONTENTID=9067
Sold at: http://www.logitech.com/index....ID=2177,CONTENTID=9067

Display:
Info at:
Sold at:

Operating System: Microsoft Windows XP Professional $135.99
Info at: http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/default.mspx
Sold at: http://store.viosoftware.biz/wixpprsp2oem.html

Security: Trend Micro PC-cillin Internet Security $49.95
Info at: http://www.trendmicro.com/en/p.../evaluate/overview.htm
Sold at: http://www.digitalriver.com/dr...=840&PGRP=0&CACHE_ID=0

Total Price: $2,098.47

Tarrant64 · Jan 28, 2005

Unless your gonna raid those raptors, i'm still not convinced why you need to.

Heck, you don't even need to raid them. Just get one. That'll drop you below $2k right there. Bringing you closer to your $1500.

Also, i'm still not convinced on teh $300 power supply. I'm sure there is a better solution.

Ne one know if this is necessary. I know having an adequate PS is essential, but...I will be buildling a new SLI rig soon and I want to know if THAT friggin' PS is what's going to be needed down the road. I mean...come on....$300???

Crescent13 · Jan 28, 2005

Forgot the CPU cooler.

Processor Cooling: Asus Star Ice Cpu Cooler $49.00
Info at: http://usa.asus.com/products/p...g/starice/overview.htm
Sold at: http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/...372300&affiliate=yahoo

Edit: I am going to raid the raptors in raid 0. I wasn't planning on removing the other things on that last post, I was just saying what it was without the liquid cooling.

Matthias99 · Jan 28, 2005

Also, i'm still not convinced on teh $300 power supply. I'm sure there is a better solution.

Ne one know if this is necessary. I know having an adequate PS is essential, but...I will be buildling a new SLI rig soon and I want to know if THAT friggin' PS is what's going to be needed down the road. I mean...come on....$300???

Fast CPU: ~100W (A64s right now top out at 89W; we'll give some headroom here).
Two really fast video cards: ~200W (You're looking at about 75-85W each for the 6800GT, so there's a little headroom here as well).
Everything else (MB/RAM/hard disks/optical drives/sound card/etc.): ~100W (probably high, but again, headroom is OK)

So, I would think a VERY high-end SLI rig MIGHT pull 400W (more if you go nuts with overclocking). So I would want a 400-450W PSU if I really intended to build a rig like this -- without SLI, a good 350W model would be more than enough.

The PCP&C 510W model is (IMO) VERY overpriced (~$180-200 ARP), and the one the OP is looking at is even *more* overpriced because the place he's buying from is doing custom UV-reactive sleeving on it. You can get a very good-quality Antec Neopower 480W for $125 at newegg (and maybe less if you shop around). While the PCP&C is a good PSU, it's not worth 2.5x as much as an equivalent 480-500W model from another company. And you can throw your own sleeving on there if you're desperate for glowy wires.

Edit: I am going to raid the raptors in raid 0.

You know this does next to nothing for desktop applications and games, right? Swapping out those Raptors for a good NCQ-enabled SATA drive like the one I recommended above would save you another $150-200.

KoolDrew · Jan 28, 2005

GEt a much cheapear PSU. You can get a Sparkle for a little over $100. Also do you really need that motherboard? I heard the Epox s939 motherboard is good and overclocks very well.

Also how does that thermal compound compare to Arctic Silver?

Do not get a XFX 6800GT. Get yourself a Leadtek 6800GT AGP.

Don't get a Raptor. Too expensive for a minor performance gain.

You did not list memory..

You can get that same optical drive at newegg in black. It will look better with that case

There is no display listed

Do you really need XP Pro?

Do you need the security suite? I would be just fine with Outpost firewall and AVG which are both free.

Also that cooler is massive. Anyone know how it would compare to a XP-120?

Crescent13 · Jan 28, 2005

I thought that 510 watts was close to the minimum for a gaming rig, and I didn't know the two raptors wouldn't do much for performance.

Edit: At the start of the forum I said I would be waiting for Corsair XPERT memory, and I needed suggestions on a good gaming monitor.

Matthias99 · Jan 28, 2005

Originally posted by: Crescent13
I thought that 510 watts was close to the minimum for a gaming rig, and I didn't know the two raptors wouldn't do much for performance.

Uh, 510W is one of the biggest desktop PSUs you can get. If you are not planning on adding another 6800GT at some point, 300-350W would be plenty. Even with it, 400-450W should be enough power. Of course, if you're not planning on adding another 6800GT at some point, you shouldn't be buying an SLI motherboard, either.

Also, is there a reason you're stuck on the DFI SLI board ($300!) when the ASUS SLI is only $200?

You can't build a "budget" system that uses the most expensive components available in every category.

KoolDrew · Jan 28, 2005

High wattage PSU's are the most overated thing on message boards. A cheaper one will be fine. You could get a Antec Sonata case that comes with a 380w PSU even though I do like the case you picked out, it is cheaper.

incinerate55 · Jan 28, 2005

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHSFHLSDFKDSFDFLKJFGLDFIJGDFGLKJFGLKJHHJKLGF WHAT IN THE FLYING F#$#$$%%^%%^& ^%&^%&%^&

YOU ARE A F**KING IDIOT, DROP THE USELESS SH*T ROFLFLFDLDFSDFLKSDFLDSKGFDFDGLKJDFGLKJDFLJFLJKGJLKGFJFHFGHJFGJFGHLKJFGHLKJFGH

KoolDrew · Jan 28, 2005

Nice informative post...

incinerate55 · Jan 28, 2005

thanks, i wasnt joking though, he has so much useless crap he could buy two computers if he gets rid of it

Crescent13 · Jan 28, 2005

I'll get rid of the DFI board, and if you couldn't read the previous message I posted, then I will repeat

I was just saying what it was without the liquid cooling.

I will be removing the other things later.

incinerate55 · Jan 28, 2005

have you ever built a computer before

Crescent13 · Jan 28, 2005

no

Edit: Taken one apart and dusted it and put it back together, and taken one apart and destroyed it (purposefully).

incinerate55 · Jan 28, 2005

how about an MSI motherboard, they make stable mobos, asus mobos get buggy after a while
http://www.newegg.com/app/view...tion=13-130-487&depa=0
and as for the psu, with this system theres no way in hell youre going to need that.. how about this one..
http://www.newegg.com/app/View...tion=17-104-155&depa=0
or even this, same model except 450 watts, peak of 550.. will handle your setup like cake
http://www.newegg.com/app/View...tion=17-104-154&depa=0

Can I reduce the price?

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