Can the average person bust through a door with those electromagnetic door locks?

[jtvang125]

They come in 600 lbs or 1200 lbs of holding force. Can an average person be able to kick the door in or push through using their body? Let's say it's a solid wood door. It's unlock and the only thing holding is the electromagnetic lock (the kind that uses a plate instead of a bolt.

 

[Jzero]

Generally you will break the door or the bracket holding the mag on before you break the mag itself.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

If they're committed, I can see 600LBs given a good body slam. 1200LBs isn't likely from one person though.

 

[BassBomb]

If they're committed, I can see 600LBs given a good body slam. 1200LBs isn't likely from one person though.

People are pretty fat these days!

 

[sdifox]

not likely.

 

[PottedMeat]

probably not. are these like the ones at dorms - the surface area is like 1.5' x 4" or something, they should be fairly strong

 

[SunnyD]

I've wondered this myself. Enough instantaneous force in the general vicinity of the magnet should hypothetically work. Hammer+2x4 for example, and then constant force on the door to continue to move it away from the field once it separates.

 

[illusion88]

One of those multi-tools used for remodeling defeats a wooden door pretty easily.

 

[Krazy4Real]

You'll break the door before you go through the lock.

 

[PingSpike]

Can't you just do the math on that? Force = mass x acceleration right? Just thinking to myself, I doubt an average person...but a regular sized guy hauling it might bust it.

 

[Modelworks]

1200lbs is more than most home doors. Locks and frames on home doors are seriously inadequate to stop anyone most of the time.

 

[BoomerD]

Just turn off the power...lock disabled.

 

[Rubycon]

Just turn off the power...lock disabled.

That's what opening it does...
Of course it does not take much battery power to keep an electromagnet going either. (so those waiting for the power to fail are going to be dissapointed!)

It really depends on the installation too. A magnet may be rated to hold/pull 1200 pounds but that is only guaranteed if the metal is of certain thickness and completely covers the active area of the magnet. (to a lesser degree the type of metal affects this as well) The security company usually ships the proper block for the magnet so this is pretty accurate I would presume.

Most systems do have the ability to sense if the door is forced open. Best security is achieved with a conventional lock as well so the "run and kick" technique won't work!

There's other ways to get these to open but that is not a matter to be discussed.

 

[Connoisseur]

That's what opening it does...
Of course it does not take much battery power to keep an electromagnet going either. (so those waiting for the power to fail are going to be dissapointed!)

It really depends on the installation too. A magnet may be rated to hold/pull 1200 pounds but that is only guaranteed if the metal is of certain thickness and completely covers the active area of the magnet. (to a lesser degree the type of metal affects this as well) The security company usually ships the proper block for the magnet so this is pretty accurate I would presume.

Most systems do have the ability to sense if the door is forced open. Best security is achieved with a conventional lock as well so the "run and kick" technique won't work!

There's other ways to get these to open but that is not a matter to be discussed.

Out of curiosity, Rubycon, what is it that you do for a living? You apparently have expert knowledge on all things technical spanning everything from yogurt makers to magnetic doors (j/k on the yogurt makers). If I didn't think otherwise, it almost seems like you've memorized every article in "How Stuff Works". Sorry not meant to be joking or insulting, just honestly curious.

 

[Mark R]

A lot depends on how secure the system has been specified.

Most systems are installed on the cheap, so don't have battery backup. Cut the mains power, and the doors open. This is a 'fail safe' system - people can always get out in an emergency.

Upgrading this with batteries can keep the system secure during a power failure - and even a 1200 lbf electromagnet doesn't need more than about 0.2A at 24V, so it'll stay on for a good many hours without power, even from a modest (7 Ah) battery.

'Fail secure' locks are available - these tend to work by having a motor retract/advance a locking bolt into the door from the frame. If the power goes out, the door stays locked - until power is restored and appropriate authorisation given. These such installations tend to be installed only rarely because people can get locked in during system faults (as might happen in case of fire).

In terms of the strength of the magnets - good luck forcing one open. You'll almost certainly find the frame is the weak spot (unless it's steel). I was once called to an emergency in a restricted area at work, and couldn't get in because my access card didn't work - so I half-heartedly shoulder barged the door in protest. There was a sick cracking sound, and this split appeared in the top of the frame. Another couple of attempts, and I suspect the frame would have given way completely. Thankfully, if you weren't actually looking for it, you wouldn't have noticed it. So I just kept my trap shut, and went to go the long way round (where there was no door to obstruct me - no idea why that door had a key card lock on it, when you could just go around the back) - although someone with a key card showed up first.

Of course, these magnets only deliver their rated force if they get flat contact with an appropriate plate. Anything that interfers - e.g. incorrect installation or a damaged plate will drastically reduce the effectiveness

 

[Matthiasa]

Yeah the lock unlikely, the door yeah. Though the wall would generally easier, or a window.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Not that this is what you're talking about exactly, but:

When I worked security for a regional hospital the seclusion area (secure lockdown area for drunks, druggies, people from the jail, mentally ill, etc) used magnetic locks on all doors (interior and exterior). The doors themselves were security doors, much thicker and tougher than a normal door. We really loved our safe and easy forget about em holes.

Until one day we had a severely disturbed individual come in. He'd been threatening harm and broken up a few things around his place. He was basically average in size, though definitely strong. Anyway, he became a problem and we put him in lockdown to give him time to calm down. After a while he got up and started kicking the door. No big deal, lots of people do it. Except he was building up strength on each kick, and was beginning to actually make the door move. Since he'd also just torn his mattress nearly in half with one pull, we realized he might have just a bit of crazy strength going on so I had to come stand guard. Soon after I got there, he did in fact manage to kick his door open. He didn't break the door, or the frame, or anything else. He just plain old forced it open.

We've had lots of people in there...nearly seven foot tall people, people that weighed over three-hundred pounds, former professional athletes, etc. None of them could even budge the doors. But this guy managed to open it. We never felt quite as secure in there again.

 

[NFS4]

Ask Jason Chen

 

[Tim]

Out of curiosity, Rubycon, what is it that you do for a living? You apparently have expert knowledge on all things technical spanning everything from yogurt makers to magnetic doors (j/k on the yogurt makers). If I didn't think otherwise, it almost seems like you've memorized every article in "How Stuff Works". Sorry not meant to be joking or insulting, just honestly curious.

Just accept her complete omniscience and move on. She's got to be the brightest person I've seen on these forums. Pretty much all of her post amaze me.

 

[Fox5]

If they're committed, I can see 600LBs given a good body slam. 1200LBs isn't likely from one person though.

600lbs is fairly easy. 1200lbs would take a strong man, but is doable, especially with running head room.

How strong is the door and its hinges? Though if they're that determined to get in:
Maybe slide something in between the lock and the door?
Unscrew the door if the hinges are reachable?
Take any kind of tool or weapon to the door and break it in?

 

[JEDI]

They come in 600 lbs or 1200 lbs of holding force. Can an average person be able to kick the door in or push through using their body? Let's say it's a solid wood door. It's unlock and the only thing holding is the electromagnetic lock (the kind that uses a plate instead of a bolt.

if the latchbolt at the door handle is latched in the doorjamb, and the mag lock is on top of the door, then no for an avg person.

is the latchbolt isnt latched, then the person can kick/shoulder rush hard enuf for the maglock to break loose from the doorframe.


Latchbolt - A bolt that has an angled surface which acts as a ramp to push the bolt in while the door is being closed. By the use of a latchbolt, a door can be closed without having to operate the handle.


edit:
it might be easier to use a $3 drywall saw and saw thru the drywall to get into the room.

you'll be surprised how many SKIF rooms and secondary armory for building security have just drywall above the ceiling

of course to u also have to defeat infrared motion detectors, plus the 3hr rated gun safe/vault

 

[MotionMan]

Just turn off the power...lock disabled.

Yeah, like they did in Die Hard!

Oh...wait...nm.

MotionMan

 

[sygyzy]

That's what opening it does...
Of course it does not take much battery power to keep an electromagnet going either. (so those waiting for the power to fail are going to be dissapointed!)

Does the amount of power directly relate to how strong the electromagnet is? Saying something like "it does not take much power" doesn't really mean much. How much power for what? For the 600-1200 lb of holding force? Really? How much is "not much"?

 

[Rubycon]

Does the amount of power directly relate to how strong the electromagnet is? Saying something like "it does not take much power" doesn't really mean much. How much power for what? For the 600-1200 lb of holding force? Really? How much is "not much"?

Mark R has it right - 200mA at 24VDC. Minuscule power for the amount of grip. Heck it's easy to make an electromagnet that will hold in excess of 100lb running off a single D dry cell! A large wet cap of 10F would probably hold for a few minutes.

Most places that use these will have frames much greater than wood frames in residential settings so that is not an issue. If it's a glass door and the plate is through bolted with little stress relief I pity the person that runs it and shatters that door!

Out of curiosity, Rubycon, what is it that you do for a living? You apparently have expert knowledge on all things technical spanning everything from yogurt makers to magnetic doors (j/k on the yogurt makers). If I didn't think otherwise, it almost seems like you've memorized every article in "How Stuff Works". Sorry not meant to be joking or insulting, just honestly curious.

Sound/Lighting on a cruise ship.

 

[JEDI]

Just turn off the power...lock disabled.

most secured govt rooms have the mag lock (24v) on an battery UPS circuit, usually rated for 2hrs. but within 5min, the backup diesal generators should kick in

a better way is just trip the fire alarm.