Cat about to be declawed.... :(

[SmoochyTX]

Originally posted by: maxster

Originally posted by: SmoochyTX

Originally posted by: Wag
Hmm, I wonder if all the people who think it's OK to declaw a cat think it's ok to "debark" a dog?

That makes no sense.

He's talking about cutting out a part of the throat such that the dog can't bark anymore. Personally I never even heard of it until today.

Last time I checked, cat's claws weren't located in their throat so his argument still makes no sense. A dog doesn't tear up furniture by barking at it.

 

[maxster]

Originally posted by: Atomic Playboy

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
you shouldn't own or encourage people to own a pet that requires butchery of their genitals then. you are creating that situation for your own selfish enjoyment. if the natural state of the animal is not good enough, then don't own it right? apply this to your own situation. you shouldn't own a cat.

Interesting point. However, I don't think it's fair to compare the reproductive organs of a cat to the claws. If a cat's reproductive organs are removed, it prevents the cat from getting pregnant, right? We're already dealing with an overpopulation problem in stray cats, and many cats end up dying either at the pound or on the streets. Spaying/neutering a cat helps prevent overpopulation which ultimately means fewer kittens end up starving to death.

Declawing a cat protects your couch from scratches.

Which is a nobler reason to maim a cat?

I don't think it's any nobler. Both are solutions to problems involving animals.

If it was you, I think that you would rather have parts of your toes missing than to get your balls cut off.

 

[Deeko]

Originally posted by: Atomic Playboy

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
you shouldn't own or encourage people to own a pet that requires butchery of their genitals then. you are creating that situation for your own selfish enjoyment. if the natural state of the animal is not good enough, then don't own it right? apply this to your own situation. you shouldn't own a cat.

Interesting point. However, I don't think it's fair to compare the reproductive organs of a cat to the claws. If a cat's reproductive organs are removed, it prevents the cat from getting pregnant, right? We're already dealing with an overpopulation problem in stray cats, and many cats end up dying either at the pound or on the streets. Spaying/neutering a cat helps prevent overpopulation which ultimately means fewer kittens end up starving to death.

Declawing a cat protects your couch from scratches.

Which is a nobler reason to maim a cat?

You want to talk maiming - which would you prefer? Losing your nails/tips of your fingers, or losing your genitals? Keep in mind, the former doesn't REALLY affect you very much, whereas the 2nd not only prevents you from accomplishing your biological goal in life, it fundamentally changes your personality?

As for the reasons to do it - if you kept your cat inside like a responsible pet owner, you don't need to have them spayed/neutered anyway. You can say it's to prevent them from a life of sexual frustration and you're doing them a favor - ok - well the physical act of scratching is just as natural to a cat. A declawed cat can (and does) still "scratch" at the furniture, without fear of a horrible smell, scolding, or spray of water.

I mean really, justifying the differences is pointless. They are, in essence, BOTH maiming the animal and robbing them of something natural to them, but NEITHER is really that bad in the long run.

 

[Number1]

Originally posted by: jagec
[
Sure, she'll be happy. But I have issues with the idea of using surgery to alter other creatures to better conform to our idea of how they should be.

I am trying to see your point of view from your perspective but I cant shove my head up my ass that far.

In my house, the animals are going to conform to the way I think they should live. If that invovles surgery or training them, so be it.

 

[maxster]

Originally posted by: SmoochyTX

Originally posted by: maxster

Originally posted by: SmoochyTX

Originally posted by: Wag
Hmm, I wonder if all the people who think it's OK to declaw a cat think it's ok to "debark" a dog?

That makes no sense.

He's talking about cutting out a part of the throat such that the dog can't bark anymore. Personally I never even heard of it until today.

Last time I checked, cat's claws weren't located in their throat so his argument still makes no sense. A dog doesn't tear up furniture by barking at it.

I think his argument is modification of the animal in order to suit his owner's wishes/preferences.

Where the line should be drawn is really what we are talking about here.

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: SmoochyTX

Originally posted by: maxster

Originally posted by: SmoochyTX

Originally posted by: Wag
Hmm, I wonder if all the people who think it's OK to declaw a cat think it's ok to "debark" a dog?

That makes no sense.

He's talking about cutting out a part of the throat such that the dog can't bark anymore. Personally I never even heard of it until today.

Last time I checked, cat's claws weren't located in their throat so his argument still makes no sense. A dog doesn't tear up furniture by barking at it.

You aren't very good at abstract concepts, are you?

If every single factor is exactly the same, it's no longer an analogy. The point is to compare things which are different, but have many similar factors. The "debark" surgery is actually a pretty good one in this case. Both are routine, but somewhat invasive surgeries which people put their pets through to remove perceived annoyances which would also be addressable through proper training. In both cases there are proponents who argue that the animal is "perfectly happy" afterwards, but the other side sees it as unnecessary, risky, and even cruel.

 

[Deeko]

As for the debarking procedure - I wouldn't have it done to my dog, no. I had a barking problem with him, and I got him a bark collar (which plenty of people have also told me they think is inhumane), and that worked fine. However, if it came down to it and the issue was get it done or get rid of the dog, and I knew more about the procedure to know that it was safe, I wouldn't have a problem with it. Hell, he only barks when he's alone and wants out of his crate anyway.

 

[SmoochyTX]

Originally posted by: maxster

Originally posted by: SmoochyTX

Originally posted by: maxster

Originally posted by: SmoochyTX

Originally posted by: Wag
Hmm, I wonder if all the people who think it's OK to declaw a cat think it's ok to "debark" a dog?

That makes no sense.

He's talking about cutting out a part of the throat such that the dog can't bark anymore. Personally I never even heard of it until today.

Last time I checked, cat's claws weren't located in their throat so his argument still makes no sense. A dog doesn't tear up furniture by barking at it.

I think his argument is modification of the animal in order to suit his owner's wishes/preferences.

Where the line should be drawn is really what we are talking about here.

In the end, cats are property of the owner(s). The owner(s) should do what suits them as long as they're not abusing the animal (declawing a cat is not abuse). Anyway, it really doesn't matter in this case because the OP's cat is obviously facing imminent declawing due to an ultimatum by "the family".

To each owner their own.

 

[maxster]

Originally posted by: SmoochyTX

Originally posted by: maxster

Originally posted by: SmoochyTX

Originally posted by: maxster

Originally posted by: SmoochyTX

Originally posted by: Wag
Hmm, I wonder if all the people who think it's OK to declaw a cat think it's ok to "debark" a dog?

That makes no sense.

He's talking about cutting out a part of the throat such that the dog can't bark anymore. Personally I never even heard of it until today.

Last time I checked, cat's claws weren't located in their throat so his argument still makes no sense. A dog doesn't tear up furniture by barking at it.

I think his argument is modification of the animal in order to suit his owner's wishes/preferences.

Where the line should be drawn is really what we are talking about here.

In the end, cats are property of the owner(s). The owner(s) should do what suits them as long as they're not abusing the animal (declawing a cat is not abuse). Anyway, it really doesn't matter in this case because the OP's cat is obviously facing imminent declawing due to an ultimatum by "the family".

To each owner their own.

Yep. :thumbsup:

 

[Capt Caveman]

Sadly, if people properly trained their pets, cats wouldn't have to be declawed or dogs be debarked, etc. Cats can be trained to know what is appropriate to scratch and what isn't, as dogs can be trained to know when it's appropriate to bark and when it's not. It's too bad people can't be responsible pet owners and take the easy way out. Training takes time, consistency and helps to build a stronger bond between yourself and your pet.

 

[Deeko]

I love the condescending attitude some of you have about this. It's actually pretty funny.

 

[Number1]

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman
Sadly, if people properly trained their pets, cats wouldn't have to be declawed or dogs be debarked, etc. Cats can be trained to know what is appropriate to scratch and what isn't, as dogs can be trained to know when it's appropriate to bark and when it's not. It's too bad people can't be responsible pet owners and take the easy way out. Training takes time, consistency and helps to build a stronger bond between yourself and your pet.

What is sad about having millions of happy declawed cat and cat owner living together? I think the easy way out as you describe it is far better for the cat then the euthanasia they would ultimately face.
This thread is so full of pussies.

Good night, back to American Idols.

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: Atomic Playboy

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
you shouldn't own or encourage people to own a pet that requires butchery of their genitals then. you are creating that situation for your own selfish enjoyment. if the natural state of the animal is not good enough, then don't own it right? apply this to your own situation. you shouldn't own a cat.

Interesting point. However, I don't think it's fair to compare the reproductive organs of a cat to the claws. If a cat's reproductive organs are removed, it prevents the cat from getting pregnant, right? We're already dealing with an overpopulation problem in stray cats, and many cats end up dying either at the pound or on the streets. Spaying/neutering a cat helps prevent overpopulation which ultimately means fewer kittens end up starving to death.

Declawing a cat protects your couch from scratches.

Which is a nobler reason to maim a cat?

noble? funny how you so easily rationalize your own decision while demonizing others.

theres nothing more intimate to an animal than its genitals. its not about over population. its about you creating a situation where butchery is required and whether that is ethically justified. you seem to think that keeping a frivolous animal(you aren't feeding your family using it as a beast of burden) that requires significant alteration so you can keep it captive like a slave is justified. an alteration so fundamental that it alters its behavior in fact. yet you are condescending when it comes to additional alterations which are justified under the same general justification of convenience yet are frankly less fundamental to the core of its being.

believe me, if most atoters had the choice between losing their balls or their fingernails, i think they'd keep their balls.

 

[tyler811]

My cat was declawed years and still thinks he has claws. He will run up to our furniture and start claw at it like he still has claws

 

[frostedflakes]

I guess it depends on where you grew up, I never realized there was so much controversy surrounding declawing. Having been around numerous declawed cats I can say from personal experience that it's not nearly as bad as some people make it out to be. The cats didn't seem to be in any significant pain during the recovery time and they were back to normal very quick. I'm also not buying the change in personality/behavior, in my experience this is not the case. There are plenty of declawed cats that seem perfectly happy. I tend to agree with others, a week or so of minor discomfort/pain is a small price to pay for a lifetime of love, shelter, and food.

I also find it ironic that some European countries, such as Spain, consider declawing to be inhumane, yet allow bullfighting to continue. I guess animal cruelty is acceptable when it brings in tourists and their money.

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: Shadowknight
Declawing is like cutting off the fingers above the knuckle of a human. It's better if you give him away to someone who WON'T basically cut his fingers off.

Stop crying. There are millions of declawed cats out there, and they are perfectly happy.

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: BudAshes


And neutering them is like cutting off a guys nuts. Whats your point?

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: Canai


It's ILLEGAL in Britain, Germany, Switzerland, etc etc. There's a REASON it's illegal. That is what I'm saying. It is bad. So you beat me at looking crap up on the internet. I'm not writing a god damn paper on it.

ATOT is full of assholes.

And it's illegal to chew gum in some countries. It's also illegal in some places for a woman to go outside with a guy who isn't a family member.

There must be a reason those things are illegal.

 

[Canai]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: Shadowknight
Declawing is like cutting off the fingers above the knuckle of a human. It's better if you give him away to someone who WON'T basically cut his fingers off.

Stop crying. There are millions of declawed cats out there, and they are perfectly happy.

WTF does it matter if they seem happy? The point is that they are maimed. Any creature who is maimed will learn to live with the difficulties created by the injury. Just because they don't seem any different doesn't mean they are happy or living without problems. Cats aren't just going to go around bitching about their feet. They will cope and try to hide any weaknesses. It is the way of the predator.

Originally posted by: Deeko
I love the condescending attitude some of you have about this. It's actually pretty funny.

I also think it's funny how people won't properly taking care of their cat. Doing so would spare their furniture, the cost of the surgery, and the toes of their cat.

I restate my earlier opinion that anyone who gets their cat declawed because it wrecked furniture is a lazy idiot. I keep my cat's claws trimmed, and he still claws on the furniture, but he can't do any damage because his claws are not at all sharp. Five minutes a week is all it takes.

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: Canai

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: Shadowknight
Declawing is like cutting off the fingers above the knuckle of a human. It's better if you give him away to someone who WON'T basically cut his fingers off.

Stop crying. There are millions of declawed cats out there, and they are perfectly happy.

WTF does it matter if they seem happy? The point is that they are maimed. Any creature who is maimed will learn to live with the difficulties created by the injury. Just because they don't seem any different doesn't mean they are happy or living without problems. Cats aren't just going to go around bitching about their feet. They will cope and try to hide any weaknesses. It is the way of the predator.

Originally posted by: Deeko
I love the condescending attitude some of you have about this. It's actually pretty funny.

I also think it's funny how people won't properly taking care of their cat. Doing so would spare their furniture, the cost of the surgery, and the toes of their cat.

I restate my earlier opinion that anyone who gets their cat declawed because it wrecked furniture is a lazy idiot. I keep my cat's claws trimmed, and he still claws on the furniture, but he can't do any damage because his claws are not at all sharp. Five minutes a week is all it takes.

You seem too enthusiastic about this subject. It's just a cat.

 

[Canai]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: Canai

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: Shadowknight
Declawing is like cutting off the fingers above the knuckle of a human. It's better if you give him away to someone who WON'T basically cut his fingers off.

Stop crying. There are millions of declawed cats out there, and they are perfectly happy.

WTF does it matter if they seem happy? The point is that they are maimed. Any creature who is maimed will learn to live with the difficulties created by the injury. Just because they don't seem any different doesn't mean they are happy or living without problems. Cats aren't just going to go around bitching about their feet. They will cope and try to hide any weaknesses. It is the way of the predator.

Originally posted by: Deeko
I love the condescending attitude some of you have about this. It's actually pretty funny.

I also think it's funny how people won't properly taking care of their cat. Doing so would spare their furniture, the cost of the surgery, and the toes of their cat.

I restate my earlier opinion that anyone who gets their cat declawed because it wrecked furniture is a lazy idiot. I keep my cat's claws trimmed, and he still claws on the furniture, but he can't do any damage because his claws are not at all sharp. Five minutes a week is all it takes.

You seem too enthusiastic about this subject. It's just a cat.

Well, I value my cat more than my furniture. Living things > inanimate objects.

edit: especially a living thing that greets my by the door and snuggles up to me at night. You can replace a couch with one just like it, or even better. You'll never find another cat like the one you have.

 

[Deeko]

Canai - before you spout your ignorant bullshit some more, I'd love to see you answer the question about neutering/spaying - without reverting to "it prevents overpopulation, and thus other cats being put down" and "it prevents a life of sexual frustration", I've already addressed both of them.

Face the facts - if you've ever had a pet neutered or spayed, you are JUST AS BAD, no if ands or buts about it, than those you seek to demonize. The animal is still maimed! In reality, maimed MUCH more so! Who cares if they are happy? You're maiming the poor thing!

Pathetic.

 

[Insomniator]

I wouldn't declaw a cat, I have 3 that are outside 95% of the time and just hang out in trees and such most of the time. Can't climb trees without claws. I'm guessing they also
couldn't hunt birds and squirrels and play around like they usually do.

Wierd that they scratch though, my cats just claw trees and never any furniture.

 

[Deeko]

Originally posted by: Canai

Well, I value my cat more than my furniture. Living things > inanimate objects.

edit: especially a living thing that greets my by the door and snuggles up to me at night. You can replace a couch with one just like it, or even better. You'll never find another cat like the one you have.

Well then I hope that living thing isn't spayed or neutered, or else you're a hypocritical asshole. If so, what gives you the right to criticize the dedication or love of the other pet owners here, when you only follow that advice when it suits you???

I say again - pathetic.

 

[Canai]

Originally posted by: Deeko
Canai - before you spout your ignorant bullshit some more, I'd love to see you answer the question about neutering/spaying - without reverting to "it prevents overpopulation, and thus other cats being put down" and "it prevents a life of sexual frustration", I've already addressed both of them.

Face the facts - if you've ever had a pet neutered or spayed, you are JUST AS BAD, no if ands or buts about it, than those you seek to demonize. The animal is still maimed! In reality, maimed MUCH more so! Who cares if they are happy? You're maiming the poor thing!

Pathetic.

Humans have been neutering their domesticated animals for thousands of years. Some do it so the animal grows larger, some do it so the animal has a better temperament, some do it because they don't want kittens, some do it so the animal won't smell wild animals and spray all over the house

Bottom line is you can't do anything about the reproductive tendencies of an animal without some form of genital mutilation. No amount of training will stop an unnuetered male cat from spraying if he smells a rival outside. Neutered animals live longer, and are more docile.

All the claw related problems can be taken care of with 5 minutes of time a week, if even that.

If that doesn't make any sense, what I'm getting at is that you neuter a cat to take care of problems down the road that you can't otherwise fix. Any of the problems associated with clawing can be fixed with regular trimming. Cats have fragile respiratory systems, and every time they go under anesthesia there's a not negligible chance they won't come out.