Caution! Wells Fargo Home Mortgage

[gr8tango]

I just refinanced through Wells Fargo and got a 4.625% 5/1 mortgage, however stuffed in the middle of the paperwork is nearly unethical language that can cause you problems if you don't catch it.

One of the forms has the following: "You give Wells Fargo the right to sell your mortgage and any financial information you have provided"... it goes on to explain how your taxes, bank info, and retirement account info, and even your social security number can be sold. There IS NO RESTRICTION on the sale or use of the info.

Selling the mortgage is common practice, selling someone's identity is not. Buyer beware. Read your documents well. Hopefully this posting helps at least one person avoid identity theft or credit denial at some later stage.

 

[NetworkDad]

selling your mortgage is common industry practice - no worries, the terms of your loan do not ever change.

If you dont want your personal info provided any further, all businesses are required to provide an 'opt-out' policy....look into it.

 

[Braxus]

Yikes! Thanks for the heads up. Parents just recently refied the moragage... Good thing to take a look into.

 

[MontyBurns]

You'd be hard pressed to find someone whose mortgage had the same owner for its entire life. Banks buy and sell mortgages every day, and you have no control over it. Wells is more upfront about this in their disclosures than others are, it looks like.

 

[Allaamu]

Another word of caution - look for the fine print about PREPAYMENT PENALITIES.

This applies when you are able to refinance and sign your intial loan documents. I had a second from Ditech.com (screw DITECH.COM) that had the fine print of PREPAYMENT PENALITIES. After it was all said and done, I had to pay $2100 out of my pocket just to refinance the Ditech loan through another company.

AVOID DITECH.COM AT ALL COST!!!!

Also, I think that what this guy is saying in his Wells Fargo post is that Wells Fargo has hidden the right to sell your IDENTITY and CREDIT INFORMATION to anyone they chose to. In the financial industry these days, this is a common practice. Just look at how many offers for credit cards, loan refinances, and junk that you get in the mailbox everyday!

 

[labgeek]

Prepayment penalties are ALWAYS stated in the truth-in-lending statement for a mortgage. Before signing anything much less something as important as a mortgage, you should read and understand the document. Ditech is a part of GMAC. I looked at them and a couple of others not that long ago. They were as straightforward as the others. None of the loans they offered me had a prepayment penalty.

Also, when you go to close, the lender and the closing company should give you a privacy statement. That they will ask you to read and sign. Both specifically stated that they would not disclose my information. The lender added a provision allowing it only upon sale of my loan.

 

[tw1164]

I would double check well's privacy policy.

Just look at how many offers for credit cards, loan refinances, and junk that you get in the mailbox everyday!

You can request your names taken off the the marketing list via the credit reports agencies.

 

[Allaamu]

Originally posted by: labgeek
Prepayment penalties are ALWAYS stated in the truth-in-lending statement for a mortgage. Before signing anything much less something as important as a mortgage, you should read and understand the document. Ditech is a part of GMAC. I looked at them and a couple of others not that long ago. They were as straightforward as the others. None of the loans they offered me had a prepayment penalty.

Also, when you go to close, the lender and the closing company should give you a privacy statement. That they will ask you to read and sign. Both specifically stated that they would not disclose my information. The lender added a provision allowing it only upon sale of my loan.

The loan agent from Ditech that I have talked to said that "keep your loan for two years and you will not incure any prepayment penalities". Well, I did keep that dumb loan for two years, and Ditech still managed to stiff me with a Prepayment Penalty based on Subordination of Mortgages. Tricky bastards they were. But, don't take my word for it; just let it happen to you and you will be mad too.

Thanks for the advice.

 

[kami333]

Good heads up, just wait another minute for the thread crappers to come in saying that this isn't a hot deal so it's in the wrong forum.

 

[SgtZulu]

Can we pricematch this to Staples and maybe use a 30 off 150 coupon to make this deal even HOTTER

 

[icecube]

<Threadcrap>This isn't a hot deal and it's in the wrong forum. </threadcrap>

 

[sat4fun]

My bank will re-write every 90 days if the rates go down, at no cost. I love it! I have refi'd 4 times in two years at very, very competitive rates.

 

[emmpee]

Originally posted by: SgtZulu
Can we pricematch this to Staples and maybe use a 30 off 150 coupon to make this deal even HOTTER

Can you show me ONE productive or informative post you've EVER made in ATHD? All I EVER see from you is threadcraps and psuedo-flames.

 

[Netopia]

Originally posted by: sat4fun
My bank will re-write every 90 days if the rates go down, at no cost. I love it! I have refi'd 4 times in two years at very, very competitive rates.

What bank?

Joe

 

[sat4fun]

Originally posted by: Netopia

Originally posted by: sat4fun My bank will re-write every 90 days if the rates go down, at no cost. I love it! I have refi'd 4 times in two years at very, very competitive rates.

What bank? Joe

May be regional. Fremont bank in the San Francisco Bay area.

 

[dpjax]

Just read the fine print. Failure to do so is stupidity.

 

[Allaamu]

Originally posted by: dpjax
Just read the fine print. Failure to do so is stupidity.

Do you even have a chance to see what a home loan or refinance document looks like? Its over 50 pages long, with terms that would take financial/legal specialist to comb through. By the time that you've signed everything, you don't really want to read it over again. Sometimes, you would just have to ask the right questions and trust the agent to get loans through.

Say, if you wanted to buy your first house; all you want to do is for the escrow to close and for you to start moving in. Impatience is what will kill you, so do youself a favor and ask smart questions.

 

[razor2025]

Originally posted by: Allaamu

Originally posted by: dpjax
Just read the fine print. Failure to do so is stupidity.

Do you even have a chance to see what a home loan or refinance document looks like? Its over 50 pages long, with terms that would take financial/legal specialist to comb through. By the time that you've signed everything, you don't really want to read it over again. Sometimes, you would just have to ask the right questions and trust the agent to get loans through.

Say, if you wanted to buy your first house; all you want to do is for the escrow to close and for you to start moving in. Impatience is what will kill you, so do youself a favor and ask smart questions.

Yeah, that's one way of sneaky sales trying to shove some sneaky term into those contracts.. Impatient people would just sign off the paper without seriously looking at the fine prints and get screwed over at the end. Then again, there should be ALOT less of these paperworks.

 

[Vic]

You're reading that wrong.
They're not selling your personal information for profit or marketing purposes, they sell it because it is a part of your loan file. When they sell, transfer, and/or portfolio your loan, your loan application and all supporting documentation go with it. This is known in the industry as the "collateral package" and it is unavoidable with any lender. I'm sorry, but if you don't like it, don't borrow. Do you honestly expect your loan to be purchased without your application and documentation? And do honestly think that this would lead to identity theft? This has been a common practice in mortgage for decades...

I think this thread title should read, "Caution! Uneducated mortgage borrower inside"

Pre-payment penalties (PPP) vary by state. Some states allow them, some do not. Usually borrowers in states that do not allow PPP's have to pay slightly higher rates, IF the product is one that usually has a PPP (so that means that this slightly higher rate doesn't apply to FNMA/FHLMC/FHA/VA 1st mortgages, because they NEVER have PPP's -- although VA loans have a non-refundable "funding fee" and FHA's can occassionally have a "recapture" if the initial interest rate was subsidized below market). The maximum PPP allowed by federal law is 6 months advance interest charged on 80% of the original principal balance if more than 20% of the original principal balance is paid during any 12 month period in the first 60 months (5 years).
Of any type of loan product, 2nd mortgages are the most likely to have a PPP. On "A paper" 2nd mortgages, the typical PPP is 1-3% flat fee for the first 2-3 years. This is normal, and I am VERY sure that the terms were disclosed.
Allaamu, that's why there is a federal 3 day right-of-recision period on owner-occupied refinances. The amount of disclosure in home mortgage is staggering and unbelievably complete. However, no one can (or should) help you if you won't (or can't) read the documents.

 

[Allaamu]

Originally posted by: Vic
You're reading that wrong.
They're not selling your personal information for profit or marketing purposes, they sell it because it is a part of your loan file. When they sell, transfer, and/or portfolio your loan, your loan application and all supporting documentation go with it. This is known in the industry as the "collateral package" and it is unavoidable with any lender. I'm sorry, but if you don't like it, don't borrow. Do you honestly expect your loan to be purchased without your application and documentation? And do honestly think that this would lead to identity theft? This has been a common practice in mortgage for decades...

I think this thread title should read, "Caution! Uneducated mortgage borrower inside"

Pre-payment penalties (PPP) vary by state. Some states allow them, some do not. Usually borrowers in states that do not allow PPP's have to pay slightly higher rates, IF the product is one that usually has a PPP (so that means that this slightly higher rate doesn't apply to FNMA/FHLMC/FHA/VA 1st mortgages, because they NEVER have PPP's -- although VA loans have a non-refundable "funding fee" and FHA's can occassionally have a "recapture" if the initial interest rate was subsidized below market). The maximum PPP allowed by federal law is 6 months advance interest charged on 80% of the original principal balance if more than 20% of the original principal balance is paid during any 12 month period in the first 60 months (5 years).
Of any type of loan product, 2nd mortgages are the most likely to have a PPP. On "A paper" 2nd mortgages, the typical PPP is 1-3% flat fee for the first 2-3 years. This is normal, and I am VERY sure that the terms were disclosed.
Allaamu, that's why there is a federal 3 day right-of-recision period on owner-occupied refinances. The amount of disclosure in home mortgage is staggering and unbelievably complete. However, no one can (or should) help you if you won't (or can't) read the documents.

Very cool... Thanks!

 

[sat4fun]

Originally posted by: Allaamu

Originally posted by: dpjax Just read the fine print. Failure to do so is stupidity.

Do you even have a chance to see what a home loan or refinance document looks like? Its over 50 pages long, with terms that would take financial/legal specialist to comb through. By the time that you've signed everything, you don't really want to read it over again. Sometimes, you would just have to ask the right questions and trust the agent to get loans through. Say, if you wanted to buy your first house; all you want to do is for the escrow to close and for you to start moving in. Impatience is what will kill you, so do youself a favor and ask smart questions.

This is why I refuse to do business with a broker. I know several brokers that I do not trust. Brokers usually sell the loan that is best for them. It is my personal preference to deal with a bank. To date I have bought a couple houses and refinanced several times, all without a dime out of my pocket and having to deal with a broker. I just wish that I could have taken advantage of the 15 year rates, but one income makes that difficult. I make additional payments a year to get the term down, so the difference in interest is an low payment safety net. I add an additional principal payment when the $ is available, make the low payment when times are tough.

 

[bfunny27]

Wrong Forum....

 

[ericboo]

I am still waiting for HSBC to get my Super Doc Saver paperwork pushed through. It took them 6 weeks to get me a committment letter, and now I have to wait for them to get my current mortgage paperwork for my mortgage assignment. They tell me that could take anywhere from 2 weeks to 2 months. But it saves me the darn NY 1% mortgage transfer tax.

Dumb thing is this is the 3rd friggin' time I am refinancing with HSBC. They suck bad, and this is completely off topic but I could live with selling my mortgage on the open market.

My father just bought a new place and it was sold to one bank at the closing and then sold again within two weeks later.

 

[Lestan]

Actually this could be a hot deal for me if someone could tell me how to get a 4.625 rate. We just got a house and the best we could do was 5.5 :-(

Of course, we're first time home buyers, had no money down, and we used a broker, so I'm not complaining. But if we had skipped the broker and gone directly to lender, could we have gotten a better rate or is that riskier for first-timers?

 

[KevinH]

Originally posted by: Vic
You're reading that wrong.
They're not selling your personal information for profit or marketing purposes, they sell it because it is a part of your loan file. When they sell, transfer, and/or portfolio your loan, your loan application and all supporting documentation go with it. This is known in the industry as the "collateral package" and it is unavoidable with any lender. I'm sorry, but if you don't like it, don't borrow. Do you honestly expect your loan to be purchased without your application and documentation? And do honestly think that this would lead to identity theft? This has been a common practice in mortgage for decades...

I think this thread title should read, "Caution! Uneducated mortgage borrower inside"

Pre-payment penalties (PPP) vary by state. Some states allow them, some do not. Usually borrowers in states that do not allow PPP's have to pay slightly higher rates, IF the product is one that usually has a PPP (so that means that this slightly higher rate doesn't apply to FNMA/FHLMC/FHA/VA 1st mortgages, because they NEVER have PPP's -- although VA loans have a non-refundable "funding fee" and FHA's can occassionally have a "recapture" if the initial interest rate was subsidized below market). The maximum PPP allowed by federal law is 6 months advance interest charged on 80% of the original principal balance if more than 20% of the original principal balance is paid during any 12 month period in the first 60 months (5 years).
Of any type of loan product, 2nd mortgages are the most likely to have a PPP. On "A paper" 2nd mortgages, the typical PPP is 1-3% flat fee for the first 2-3 years. This is normal, and I am VERY sure that the terms were disclosed.
Allaamu, that's why there is a federal 3 day right-of-recision period on owner-occupied refinances. The amount of disclosure in home mortgage is staggering and unbelievably complete. However, no one can (or should) help you if you won't (or can't) read the documents.

Thank you Vic...
You sound like you're also a part of the industry (as am I).