CD Projekt fining Pirates who illegally download the Witcher 2 instead of using DRM

[DeathReborn]

I can't see this method working too well, especially since recent events of an IP not being enough to identify anyone.

I remember Championship Manager (Atari ST) having to get results from the manual & some other games asking for specific words from specific pages, paragraphs & lines in the manual.

i haven't played it, but i recall Sacred 2 was never successfully cracked.

I have both Sacred 2 as well as Ice & Blood (the expansion) and they have been cracked a while back. It works just fine with the crack but you do still have SecuROM installed with the game...

 

[Raider1284]

I cant believe this hasnt been brought up but what this company is proposing is basically extortion.... They purposely try and catch you in the act and when you do, they try and force you to pay for the game plus their extortion fee, otherwise they will take you to court.

Piracy isnt legal but neither is extortion. How is this any different then stalking a high up official and then catching him in the act doing something illegal, recording it, then sending him a note saying "pay me $$$ otherwise ill crush you"?

 

[thujone]

i don't understand how simply downloading a torrent of a game can be illegal. if they can prove you downloaded, installed, cracked, and then played the game... i could understand. but how many times have people downloaded a torrent simply because of a lost disc? or because the cracked version has the DRM removed? or any of the other reasons for downloading a torrent of a game you've already paid for?



i don't think downloading a torrent in itself should be considered an illegal action.

 

[KaOTiK]

i don't think downloading a torrent in itself should be considered an illegal action.

Why, you are stealing something that does not belong to you regardless if you use it or not.

 

[thujone]

what if you own the game?

 

[AyashiKaibutsu]

Why, you are stealing something that does not belong to you regardless if you use it or not.

What if your CD breaks? I've downloaded some games I've own. Granted, never had to for ones that were just released.

 

[KaOTiK]

What if your CD breaks? I've downloaded some games I've own. Granted, never had to for ones that were just released.

While I do not agree with it, it is still considered stealing by the law and for this particular issue that I originally quoted that is all that matters. Also one of the catches they try to get you with too is you are also uploading the files while you are downloading.

Granted I've done the same and would tell them to fuck off with a picture of the game box/cdkey/whatever is left of the cd, but lets be honest the amount of ppl that actually do that are in the super extreme minority.

 

[magomago]

horrible analogy is horrible


they aren't looking to find illegal actions and then threaten to expose them if they aren't fed money

they are looking to find illegal actions related to their product, and then force them to BUY they product they are illegally using, as well as a portion of expenses to go out and hire a firm to do this.

Its kind of like suing for the value of something that was stolen, as well as have the other person pay for court fees; its extremely generous.

Now if they were illegally planting the sw to attract people, gather a list of IPs, and slap each with a 250,000 dollar law suit we'd have something different...

 

[zinfamous]

that has to be far more expensive and ineffective than just DRMing everything.

 

[smackababy]

Anyone arguing against this is a pirate! ZOMG!

Seriously, they are releasing a game DRM free for PAYING customers and then taking action against those who steal the game. For anyone saying "what if I break the CD" too bad. If you damage a product (any product) due to your own misuse (because CDs don't just break on their own, be real) the company is not required to offer you shit. If I buy a TV and I throw my remote through it, I have to either pay for it to be repaired or buy another. Same with any of product.

I am buying this game simply on the principle that this is a company geared only towards PC gaming AND they go above to make sure their customers don't have to deal with stupid shit like DRM. I don't care if I hated the Witcher (I didn't because it was great), I'd buy this game just based on the fact that I support their ideas.

 

[AyashiKaibutsu]

While I do not agree with it, it is still considered stealing by the law and for this particular issue that I originally quoted that is all that matters. Also one of the catches they try to get you with too is you are also uploading the files while you are downloading.

Granted I've done the same and would tell them to fuck off with a picture of the game box/cdkey/whatever is left of the cd, but lets be honest the amount of ppl that actually do that are in the super extreme minority.

By the law it's not even stealing. No ones ever been charged with theft for downloading something. It's copyright infringement.

 

[KaOTiK]

Whatever, I'm not going to get all caught up with bullshit technicalities and how each law is.

It is illegal regardless of your reason for downloading it.

 

[alcoholbob]

They should have just done the Batman AA route and have a random authentication check in the middle of the game.

 

[Rebel_L]

I would think that much like most collection agencies the idea is to scare and harass people into paying since legal action would cost them more than they stand to gain, not to mention that a decision in their favor is not a forgone conclusion to begin with

 

[DangerAardvark]

That I will agree with wholeheartedly. I used to pirate games until I realized how much of a toll piracy has on the hobby we love. And of course having the financial freedom now to drop $60 on a game helps as well. Now I buy games, and I've even gone back and bought some of the games I pirated in the past.

What? I'd think you'd be too busy "stealing candy from kids."

 

[Bateluer]

Guys, if you torrented TW2 to replace a lost or damaged disk and can prove it to their legal firm, I would think you'd have a solid defense? Especially if you have a dated receipt of the game. If you've bought the game from GoG, then its already in their database that you bought the game.

 

[frozentundra123456]

This sounds like a fair solution on the surface. However, it seems more like a publicity/intimidation statement to me.

I cant believe that the cost of finding the pirates isn't more than the fine the company will recieve. I mean really, if you have no moral objection (I do BTW), just pirate the game. The worst that could happen is that you have to pay for it if you get caught. Unless of course the lawyers fee is $5,000 or something!!! So I cant believe that the company will pursue this policy aggressively. Its kind of like the old saying, I am losing money on every sale, but will make up for it in volume.

So even though I havent bought either of the Witcher games, I do respect the company as one of the few that seems to be loyal to PC gaming and is not consolizing their product. I just dont see that this policy will be effective. And by the way, dont hard core pirates have IP masking software??

 

[Martimus]

This sounds like a fair solution on the surface. However, it seems more like a publicity/intimidation statement to me.

I cant believe that the cost of finding the pirates isn't more than the fine the company will recieve. I mean really, if you have no moral objection (I do BTW), just pirate the game. The worst that could happen is that you have to pay for it if you get caught. Unless of course the lawyers fee is $5,000 or something!!! So I cant believe that the company will pursue this policy aggressively. Its kind of like the old saying, I am losing money on every sale, but will make up for it in volume.

So even though I havent bought either of the Witcher games, I do respect the company as one of the few that seems to be loyal to PC gaming and is not consolizing their product. I just dont see that this policy will be effective. And by the way, dont hard core pirates have IP masking software??

I would assume that if you got caught, the cost would probably be a couple hundred dollars. So you would end up paying 3-4 times the cost of the game to pirate it. Of course if you fought it, you would end up paying over $1000 since you would have to cover court fees.

I am assuming that many here haven't had to deal with court fees in the past. The $5000 remark isn't improbable at all, and it wouldn't be surprising that something like this would cost you even more than that.

 

[stag3]

how about make a game with no drm that is actually fun?
look at minecraft and how many people bought it

as for replay value, sure if it's an online multiplayer game
but most sp games are played once and done

 

[Chiropteran]

that has to be far more expensive and ineffective than just DRMing everything.

I disagree. This probably costs close to zero, while DRM has a non-zero cost and isn't effective anyway.

Lawyers get paid on results. They get their cut out of each "pirate" caught. I doubt CD Projekt is directly paying the lawyers anything, so the cost to them is very close to zero.

 

[shingletingle]

Anyone arguing against this is a pirate! ZOMG!

Seriously, they are releasing a game DRM free for PAYING customers and then taking action against those who steal the game. For anyone saying "what if I break the CD" too bad. If you damage a product (any product) due to your own misuse (because CDs don't just break on their own, be real) the company is not required to offer you shit. If I buy a TV and I throw my remote through it, I have to either pay for it to be repaired or buy another. Same with any of product.

I am buying this game simply on the principle that this is a company geared only towards PC gaming AND they go above to make sure their customers don't have to deal with stupid shit like DRM. I don't care if I hated the Witcher (I didn't because it was great), I'd buy this game just based on the fact that I support their ideas.

I agree. The "what if I break the disc" excuse is extremely pathetic. If I break a home appliance or some other item, nobody is going to give me a free replacement.

 

[zinfamous]

I disagree. This probably costs close to zero, while DRM has a non-zero cost and isn't effective anyway.

Lawyers get paid on results. They get their cut out of each "pirate" caught. I doubt CD Projekt is directly paying the lawyers anything, so the cost to them is very close to zero.

well, I'm not sure of the details of how the lawyers are being paid--but the majority of the cost, in my mind, is tied to how ineffective this will probably be. Ineffective = increased pirating. Whatever cost the game industry has touted as the cost of pirating become part of this measure if it truly does become ineffective.

Don't get me wrong--I think this is a great policy from the customer perspective, I just think it's a bad decision for their bottom line.

 

[Martimus]

well, I'm not sure of the details of how the lawyers are being paid--but the majority of the cost, in my mind, is tied to how ineffective this will probably be. Ineffective = increased pirating. Whatever cost the game industry has touted as the cost of pirating become part of this measure if it truly does become ineffective.

Don't get me wrong--I think this is a great policy from the customer perspective, I just think it's a bad decision for their bottom line.

Think of it this way: They get money from Pirates that would have paid them nothign for the game. Even those that wouldn't have bought the game if they couldn't have pirated the game will now end up paying for it (through legal action). So it is a net increase in money for them, where as DRM doesn't involve a tangible amount of increased income.

 

[reallyscrued]

Call me what you will, but I agree with protecting ones property.

Saying DRM does not stop pirating, is like saying car locks do not stop car thieves. If someone wants to steal your car, their going to - regardless of how many locks you have. But I still lock my truck at night.

Asinine. I'm about 3 pages late to this thread so maybe this has been replied to already, but comparing DRM to locks in your truck is a flawed analogy.

The locks on your truck protect your physical property from potential thieves, DRM protects companies' intellectual property from potential customers. If someone is about to steal a car, chances are they really want to a steal a car. They do not have 3-XX grand to buy a car. A $50, $40, $30 game is quite a different investment.

Also, no car manufacturer is incurring losses because of the kind of security they are adding to their cars, gamers are, however, boycotting games little by little that ship with intrusive DRM.

DRM is a bad way to approach the hardheadedness of pirates.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I think that this is a great idea, anything that punishes the pirates, and doesn't punish paying customers (like DRM does), is a-ok in my books.

I haven't purchased any big new PC games since Orange Box and Bioshock, and I never even opened those and played them, because I found out they have DRM.

I'm never going to purchase a PC game with DRM again, if I can help it. So if Witcher 2 doesn't have DRM, I might consider purchasing it.

No, I don't own any (current) consoles either.