This thread just keeps on delivering...go RS.:thumbsup:
and thanks for the Chiphell link raghu.
and thanks for the Chiphell link raghu.
What I meant was that if AMD's GCN 2 is inherently not much more efficient than GCN 1.1/1.3 and it relies on a node shrink to compete, it will not be good for AMD when NV and AMD are together on the same node. Node shrinks as you all know will be infrequent moving forward and we're likely to be stuck on one for much longer.
AMD may have a head start and look really uber, but when NV catches up and remains on the same node for a few years..
I am somewhat disappointed the architecture itself isn't massively more perf/w, that is all.
Also if NV ever manages to sell the idea that AIO water cooling is inferior than a noisy blower or open air design that dumps heat in your case requiring even more fans for case airflow.. I'll ROFLMAO.
It would take a very "special" consumer to believe that.
I love the idea of going with AIO for reference for HIGH-END cards. Who the heck buys a beast of a GPU without having a case that has a 120mm slot? Water cooling by default is a damn win for gamers. All that heat, out your case, you don't need to install extra fans, you use the radiator fan as exhaust. Two birds, one fan.
This thread just keeps on delivering...go RS.:thumbsup:
and thanks for the Chiphell link raghu.
You really ought to thank raghu and Silverforce for following the news that closely instead of me
The only possible negative I can foresee if 390X being limited to 4GB of VRAM.
Me too. 2 cards in CF/SLI max overclocked at 80-83C with all the heat leaving your case, minus the noise of reference 290X/980s at 100% fan speed. EPIC win.
It would give AMD another 1.5 years to revise their GCN 2.0 to 3.0 and focus on improving perf/watt of the architecture while they wait for 16nm. It's possible that moving to 20nm + HBM + a 2x more efficient perf/watt "28nm architecture" is simply too much at once. Who knows, as I am not an engineer. If NV doesn't go 16nm for Maxwell and sticks to 28nm until Pascal in 2016, then AMD's gamble with stop-gap 20nm will have paid off.
You can bet a whole host of R9 290X owners (and maybe even 780 Ti / GTX 980 owners ) are going to move to Bermuda. good for those who waited. :thumbsup:Oh but they will. Didn't you already see some gamers opposing AIO high-end cards? If 390X uses 50W more power on a 350W system than a GM200, it will be brought up. hehe
Me too. 2 cards in CF/SLI max overclocked at 80-83C with all the heat leaving your case, minus the noise of reference 290X/980s at 100% fan speed. EPIC win.
Don't you know the response already - Physx, Gameworks, Hairworks, TWIMTBP, DSR, Gsync, drivers etc . But the fact is AMD has as good or even better reasons - Mantle, XDMA CF, Tress FX 3.0, VSR, Gaming Evolved, Freesync .If only AMD introduced a flagship card with faster performance than GM200 and superior performance/watt, I want to see the response of NV users as to why they still aren't switching to AMD.
You really ought to thank raghu and Silverforce for following the news that closely instead of me
The only possible negative I can foresee if 390X being limited to 4GB of VRAM.
While I agree that reference AIO is a good idea, putting 290x and 980 reference blowers on the same plane is a bit of stretch RS. nvidia reference design does a good job (obviously not as good as open air but for what it is its quite good) whereas the 290 reference is intolerable.
Honestly, I just look forward to strong competition from both brands as I don't like this idea of $550-600 980 against a $300 290X for 20% more performance. What non-sense.
Agreed - I'm excited by this Chiphell leak because they are pretty reliable. Curious to see how much the reference AIO will add to the cost. Certainly less then the extra $100 per card I had to spend on Corsair HG10's and H90's for my 290 CF
Agreed - I'm excited by this Chiphell leak because they are pretty reliable. Curious to see how much the reference AIO will add to the cost. Certainly less then the extra $100 per card I had to spend on Corsair HG10's and H90's for my 290 CF
If that performance turns out true AMD will have no problem getting USD 650 for Bermuda XT from enthusiasts. Everyone will be willing to pay that as now you get a GTX 980 which is much slower for USD 550.
No way. 70% of $300+ market (i.e., 970/980/780/780Ti/Titan) users will wait to Pascal or GM200. They won't buy AMD. :sneaky:
Hexus has an article on AMD's next cards:
"According to reports, which have a mostly-reliable track record for AMD leaks, there will be a two-part response. First, AMD will launch a faster revision of its GCN Hawaii architecture that takes advantage of a matured manufacturing process, and this is slated for an early 2015 release. Then, during summer of 2015, AMD will, if predictions hold true, launch a new series of GPUs with the codename 'Caribbean Islands.'
The launch window for Caribbean Islands is subject to change at this early stage, of course, though a launch between June to August is most likely. Other details about Caribbean Islands graphics cards, such as whether they will make use of a 16 or 20nm process, are not known. AMD may reveal more information during its investor relations conference in February 2015 but between now and then the descent into the speculation quagmire begins."
http://hexus.net/tech/news/graphics/78189-next-gen-amd-graphics-codenamed-caribbean-islands/
So similar to HD4870->4890 stop-gap (Hawaii Rev 2) and then full blown 5870 (390X). That would suck if 390X isn't out until June-August 2015.
I guess I'm in the minority but I think this is a very valid concern for AMD.Edit: One thing that isn't great, is that AMD gets these gains by going to 20nm to combat NV's Maxwell on 28nm so it isn't a fair fight. What happens when they both duke it out on 16nm finfet for example. AMD definitely needs to improve the architecture efficiency itself, without reliance on jumping to the next node earlier to compete. :/
I guess I'm in the minority but I think this is a very valid concern for AMD.
Edit: One thing that isn't great, is that AMD gets these gains by going to 20nm to combat NV's Maxwell on 28nm so it isn't a fair fight. What happens when they both duke it out on 16nm finfet for example. AMD definitely needs to improve the architecture efficiency itself, without reliance on jumping to the next node earlier to compete. :/
I guess I'm in the minority but I think this is a very valid concern for AMD.
No way. 70% of $300+ market (i.e., 970/980/780/780Ti/Titan) users will wait to Pascal or GM200. They won't buy AMD. :sneaky:
Hexus has an article on AMD's next cards:
"According to reports, which have a mostly-reliable track record for AMD leaks, there will be a two-part response. First, AMD will launch a faster revision of its GCN Hawaii architecture that takes advantage of a matured manufacturing process, and this is slated for an early 2015 release. Then, during summer of 2015, AMD will, if predictions hold true, launch a new series of GPUs with the codename 'Caribbean Islands.'
The launch window for Caribbean Islands is subject to change at this early stage, of course, though a launch between June to August is most likely. Other details about Caribbean Islands graphics cards, such as whether they will make use of a 16 or 20nm process, are not known. AMD may reveal more information during its investor relations conference in February 2015 but between now and then the descent into the speculation quagmire begins."
http://hexus.net/tech/news/graphics/78189-next-gen-amd-graphics-codenamed-caribbean-islands/
So similar to HD4870->4890 stop-gap (Hawaii Rev 2) and then full blown 5870 (390X). That would suck if 390X isn't out until June-August 2015.
My gripe with this is that my case (Fractal Define R2) doesn't offer much space behind my NH-D14. I'm not sure if a Radiator + fan fits in there and if yes it will get the hot air from the CPU. The Define R2 has a 120mm side vent which could be used. But for cases that don't have a side vent cooling the GPU with hot air from CPU doesn't make a lot of sense?
beginner99 said:My gripe with this is that my case (Fractal Define R2) doesn't offer much space behind my NH-D14. I'm not sure if a Radiator + fan fits in there and if yes it will get the hot air from the CPU. The Define R2 has a 120mm side vent which could be used. But for cases that don't have a side vent cooling the GPU with hot air from CPU doesn't make a lot of sense?
There'd be plenty of non-reference Air cooled designs (e.g. sapphire vapor X).
Hopefully this time AIBs have their non-reference designs ready on release. It took over 2 months, if I recall correctly, for open-air designs to come out for Hawaii. By that time, mining had increased their prices and I was no longer interested.
*sees your sig*Oh man, I can't afford this stuff anymore.
If the reference Bermuda XT and Pro uses Hybrid AIO cooling then AMD reference designs should sell very well. What AMD needs to make sure is they have sufficient production volume and supply to capitalize on the demand.
AMD should know by now if they have a winner on their hands. So the key here is meeting the market demand. AIB designs with open air coolers can arrive after a couple of months, but in all fairness should not cost more than the reference AIO design. I am thinking AMD will price the R9 390X at USD 650 as it seems to have what it takes to compete with big Maxwell.