Clinton’s popular vote lead surpasses two million.

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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,815
49,509
136
Electors are based 100% on representation in congress, the 3/5th compromise took power away from slave states that they wanted. The "best" thing would have been to abolish slavery at the founding but that wasn't possible. The EC had nothing to do with slavery.

If you think the EC had nothing to do with slavery then take it up with James Madison as he disagrees with you.

The 3/5ths compromise did not take power away from slave states, that's nonsense. They wanted to count the enslaved population of their states as people for the purposes of representation but as property otherwise. It was a transparent, immoral, and hypocritical power grab. They were unwilling to join the union without institutional protections for slavery though, hence the compromise. From the 3/5ths compromise comes the EC.

Easy peasy.
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
If you think the EC had nothing to do with slavery then take it up with James Madison as he disagrees with you.

The 3/5ths compromise did not take power away from slave states, that's nonsense. They wanted to count the enslaved population of their states as people for the purposes of representation but as property otherwise. It was a transparent, immoral, and hypocritical power grab. They were unwilling to join the union without institutional protections for slavery though, hence the compromise. From the 3/5ths compromise comes the EC.

Easy peasy.
I wish you would respond to my actual words instead of twisting them. Not going to play your games today.
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
14,681
7,181
136
If you think the EC had nothing to do with slavery then take it up with James Madison as he disagrees with you.

The 3/5ths compromise did not take power away from slave states, that's nonsense. They wanted to count the enslaved population of their states as people for the purposes of representation but as property otherwise. It was a transparent, immoral, and hypocritical power grab. They were unwilling to join the union without institutional protections for slavery though, hence the compromise. From the 3/5ths compromise comes the EC.

Easy peasy.

So it seems that the EC isn't enough of an equalizer any more what with Repub controlled states having the need to institute selective voter disenfranchisement and suppression laws. Nice to know that there's some "tradition" and history involved with these kinds of scurrilous acts.
 

Commodus

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2004
9,215
6,818
136
Well, according to Trump...


I was just going to post this. The irony: if he actually believes this (which he might not, since he lies often), then that's all the more reason to have a recount. I want to see the Trump apologists on the forum try to spin this one.
 

agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
12,203
1,242
86
So considering we pay vastly more taxes then everyone else why are we not having a equal vote to billy bob joe dip spit?

The only real solution to such a contentious relationship is a divorce. It's really too bad liberals are such pussy-whipped cucks to pull such a thing.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,815
49,509
136
I was just going to post this. The irony: if he actually believes this (which he might not, since he lies often), then that's all the more reason to have a recount. I want to see the Trump apologists on the forum try to spin this one.

I was just about to say the same thing. What Trump has just said should mandate a nationwide recount as he believes the election he just won was tainted by millions of cases of fraud.

What combination of stupidity and carelessness would cause someone to try and undermine the legitimacy of their own election?
 
Reactions: ivwshane
Jul 9, 2009
10,723
2,064
136
I was just going to post this. The irony: if he actually believes this (which he might not, since he lies often), then that's all the more reason to have a recount. I want to see the Trump apologists on the forum try to spin this one.
yes, a recount in New York and California.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,706
6,198
126
Has buckshot ever given a shit about making demonstrably false or nonsense statements?

Interesting reflection on human psychology why people hold him up to any standards.
I believe you have concluded the obvious, that he is entertained by the erection of endless mindless distractions to deflect debate away from relevance. He works for the force of darkness without knowing by whom he is employed. Who could take pleasure in what is morally disgusting?
 

Balt

Lifer
Mar 12, 2000
12,674
482
126
What combination of stupidity and carelessness would cause someone to try and undermine the legitimacy of their own election?

The fact that he lost the popular vote and so many people are talking about it has really gotten under that notoriously thin skin of his. Rationality is completely out the window.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,706
6,198
126
The only real solution to such a contentious relationship is a divorce. It's really too bad liberals are such pussy-whipped cucks to pull such a thing.
I was going to say 'I think they have decided instead to rip Republicans a new asshole', but then I realized they've decided rip on the Republicans new asshole they ripped themselves.
 
Jul 9, 2009
10,723
2,064
136
I was just about to say the same thing. What Trump has just said should mandate a nationwide recount as he believes the election he just won was tainted by millions of cases of fraud.

What combination of stupidity and carelessness would cause someone to try and undermine the legitimacy of their own election?
He's not undermining the legitimacy of his election, he's pointing out the high levels of voter fraud that most like happened in the illegal alien community. It's a valid reason for him to further investigate it as President and then to hold States and municipalities responsible. To get rid of the illegal sanctuary laws that undercut the legitimacy of Federal immigration control. Something like what Obama did in his actions against the States.
 

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
28,058
38,564
136
The electoral college came to be as a way to bypass states gaining power over other states based on their own individual laws and governance. Regardless of state laws and enforcement propelling the voting population of a state to an insurmountable amount in a rigged popular vote system, the electoral college bypasses this conundrum. Rather than states gaining unfair and undue advantage due to the passing of laws and regulations solely effecting and increasing the voting population of that state (or coalition of states), or forcing other states to change their voting laws or lax their enforcement of voter laws in order to remain on equal-footing with states ramping up their eligible voting population using means entirely outside the control of all other states, the electoral college instead renders the states on more-equal footing than a popular voting system. Instead, you would rather have everyone playing the same contest, but each making up their own eligibility rules. Most assuredly, that would not end well for anyone.

Intellectual stupidity: the hallmark of jackshatting, kageshatting, and indushatting


I'd say the stupidity comes in to play when you think you get to speak for me because my response to someone else caused you some butthurt - a response that you apparently feel fully encapsulates my position on the issue, despite no real details being provided.

I think you just confirmed my mention on feelings. Thanks?
 
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kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
28,058
38,564
136
That is not why the electoral college came to be, it came to be in large part to provide institutional protection for slavery. If they had desired to prevent states from gaining federal power by changing voting standards they would have just implemented standards for voting for federal offices. Easy.

Interestingly enough one of the other reasons mentioned was to prevent the election of an unqualified candidate who was otherwise a skilled demagogue. So much for that, haha.

I had a poli sci professor in college who loved to bring that up. He likened it to political cheesecloth; filtering out what you don't want.

If he's still teaching I'm guessing the lecture material is getting tweaked.
 

nickqt

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2015
7,596
7,854
136
He's not undermining the legitimacy of his election, he's pointing out the high levels of voter fraud that most like happened in the illegal alien community. It's a valid reason for him to further investigate it as President and then to hold States and municipalities responsible. To get rid of the illegal sanctuary laws that undercut the legitimacy of Federal immigration control. Something like what Obama did in his actions against the States.
So, are you just a sycophant, or do you actually believe the delusions that have been shat into your skull for the past 25 years?
 

Commodus

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2004
9,215
6,818
136
yes, a recount in New York and California.

You do know that Clinton won by a margin of 3.39 million votes in California, and by 1.5 million in New York, right? And that the likelihood of fraud on that scale in these states (which have been strong liberal bases for decades) is so infinitesimal as to be virtually non-existent?

You know full well that Trump is just drawing from that InfoWars conspiracy bullcrap and has no factual basis for his claim. If he knew there were millions of fraudulent votes... well, he'd be virtually obligated to report that, wouldn't he?
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,815
49,509
136
He's not undermining the legitimacy of his election, he's pointing out the high levels of voter fraud that most like happened in the illegal alien community. It's a valid reason for him to further investigate it as President and then to hold States and municipalities responsible. To get rid of the illegal sanctuary laws that undercut the legitimacy of Federal immigration control. Something like what Obama did in his actions against the States.

He just claimed that there were millions of fraudulent votes in the election he won. That undermines its legitimacy.

Oops. Haha.
 

dyna

Senior member
Oct 20, 2006
813
61
91
Can you describe to me why this is a larger problem than the one we have now? Also, do you think the people of Wyoming OR California think their votes are meaningful now? Finally, the idea that a state with as small a fraction of the US population as California would completely control the country in a popular vote system is absurd.

Wyoming has 3 EC votes and California has 55, I wouldn't worry about Wyoming ever having more influence than California. Wyoming would have the equivalent of 0 electoral votes if it was done by popular vote. It is obvious this argument about the EC is because Hillary lost. However, the logic in the EC is sound when it comes to providing some representation to smaller states. Do you really think it would be a good idea for California to make all the political decisions for the entire country?

Imho, California should have 35 electors for democrats and 20 for republicans that represent the final ratio votes between the candidates. Its a win-win for pro-EC and pro-popular vote.
 
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