Coffeelake thread, benchmarks, reviews, input, everything.

Page 22 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

epsilon84

Golden Member
Aug 29, 2010
1,142
927
136
Why waste $50+ more on the 8700k with base 8700 almost identical in turbo settings, and stock 8700k vs OC 8700k has very minimal performance improvements(only in fully parallel MT workloads).

$50 is hardly a lot of money at this level of the market, especially if you take into account the cost of the platform. The minimum cost of entry for a 8700K including a lower end Z370 motherboard and 16GB DDR4-3200 would be approximately $650. Realistically, a lot of 8700K users will run higher end Z370 motherboards and expensive DDR4-4000 level RAM. This would push the platform cost out to $800+. $50 at this level hardly makes a big difference. You are essentially paying $50 for the possibility of 5GHz on all cores, compared to the 4.2GHz all core turbo on the 8700 non K.
 
Last edited:
Reactions: ozzy702

epsilon84

Golden Member
Aug 29, 2010
1,142
927
136
Watts alone does not tell us efficiency, though.
We need to know how much work is getting done for those watts.

There is actually conflicting information re: power consumption.

Techpowerup for example, shows the 8700K having lower power consumption than the Ryzen 7 chips:
https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Intel/Core_i7_8700K/16.html

Even if the 8700K does prove to consume slightly more power overall, it is also a faster CPU overall. So performance/watt would still be very competitive with Ryzen. As you said, watts alone doesn't show efficiency.
 
Last edited:

R0H1T

Platinum Member
Jan 12, 2013
2,582
162
106
Watts alone does not tell us efficiency, though.
We need to know how much work is getting done for those watts.
You'd have to isolate CPU power consumption then, how many reviews have you seen do that?

Toms is the last major site which did this, for some odd reason they've stopped doing so!

 
Last edited:
Reactions: Grazick

AdamK47

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,323
2,930
126
Went to Micro Center today. They only had the 8400 there. Plenty of motherboards though.
 
Reactions: Phynaz

mohit9206

Golden Member
Jul 2, 2013
1,381
511
136
$50 is hardly a lot of money at this level of the market, especially if you take into account the cost of the platform. The minimum cost of entry for a 8700K including a lower end Z370 motherboard and 16GB DDR4-3200 would be approximately $650. Realistically, a lot of 8700K users will run higher end Z370 motherboards and expensive DDR4-4000 level RAM. This would push the platform cost out to $800+. $50 at this level hardly makes a big difference. You are essentially paying $50 for the possibility of 5GHz on all cores, compared to the 4.2GHz all core turbo on the 8700 non K.
I think the biggest reason people will choose 8700k over 8700 is because you feel good telling people you have an 8700k rather than just the plain 8700.
Its not mentioned in your post but you know its one of the reasons as well.
 

Slappi

Member
Dec 7, 2002
72
31
86
I think the biggest reason people will choose 8700k over 8700 is because you feel good telling people you have an 8700k rather than just the plain 8700.
Its not mentioned in your post but you know its one of the reasons as well.

.... plus you get more women!

Gamer Nerd - "Hey babe, check out my new rig!"

Gamer Babe - "Is that a 8700k chip you got in there?!?"

Gamer Nerd - "Ahhhh..... no, it's just an 8700, but I did save $50."

Gamer Babe - "Later loser!!"
 

epsilon84

Golden Member
Aug 29, 2010
1,142
927
136
I think the biggest reason people will choose 8700k over 8700 is because you feel good telling people you have an 8700k rather than just the plain 8700.
Its not mentioned in your post but you know its one of the reasons as well.

No, the biggest reason people will choose a 8700K over a 8700 is because it has an unlocked multiplier. Not because it 'sounds cool' or gives you extra 'street cred' (or should that be 'geek cred'? Haha)

Edit - OK Slappi nailed it. You will get laid more with the 8700K. Argument over.
 
Last edited:

AdamK47

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,323
2,930
126
I think the biggest reason people will choose 8700k over 8700 is because you feel good telling people you have an 8700k rather than just the plain 8700.
Its not mentioned in your post but you know its one of the reasons as well.

That's just absurd reasoning.
 

Pookums

Member
Mar 6, 2017
32
13
36
$50 is hardly a lot of money at this level of the market, especially if you take into account the cost of the platform. The minimum cost of entry for a 8700K including a Z370 motherboard and 16GB DDR4-3200 would be approximately $650. Realistically, a lot of 8700K users will run higher end Z370 motherboards and expensive DDR4-4000 level RAM. This would push the platform cost out to $800+. $50 at this level hardly makes a big difference. You are essentially paying $50 for the possibility of 5GHz on all cores, compared to the 4.2GHz all core turbo on the 8700 non K.

This doesn't address my last point. Gamers 8600k. All arounders 8700. Gamers who want to spend less 8400. The OC on the 8700k will realistically do nothing for games or applications in 1080p or above(where even slower and less core CPUs already max the GPU by sometimes several magnitudes depending on the game.). Large player count large thread Multiplayer games only need the six cores without HT. Throw in HT and you no longer need the OC. MT tasks that are not massively parallel, and that don't scale well will receive minimal benefit(maybe 5%) over 8700 non-k even with the OC. Thus OC will only help for those massively parallel MT tasks. However, its in these tasks that the 8700k also seems to potentially throttle at the 4.9+ barrier and throw out loads of wattage. Thus, the stock or a mild OC are more appropriate. However, once you do this, the difference between 8700k and 8700 non-k is basically non existent. most likely 5-7% at a mild oc, for extra heat/power you still need to consider.

This also doesn't take into account that many all-arounders are small team (less than 10 people in total. As low as 1) business gamers who either don't OC, or only do mild OCs anyways. Their work machine is also the game machine. And the issue is MT are for work. ST for games. With business money is ALWAYS a consideration. Some are so OCD in their business that $1 can make or break a sale. It just doesn't make sense. 8600k will not lose to the 8700k games. It will not throttle given the lack of HT and will lay waste to every other chip in this metric. $50 is a lot of money for something that gives you minute or no tangible benefit. Thats $50 that could be spent on the GPU, or if the person is well off enough, to just buy themselves a nice expensive dinner.

Also: Spec sheet on anand says 8700 has allcore of 4.3. cores 1 through 5 are all a mere 100mhz less than 8700k. All core for both says 4.3. Not sure if correct, but thats the sheet I'm reading. Thus with no OC the 8700k and 8700 should be identical in MT. If you don't OC(which base assumptions suggest the majority of buyers who purchase K models DO NOT OC, then your wasting $50 for absolutely no reason whatsoever.).

So to state again:
- 8700 non-k for all arounders
- 8600k for Max performance gaming
- 8400 for Great gaming at a tighter budget

If you really want to spend $50 to piss around with the 8700k and deal with any issues that crop up, for no ST benefit (or slightly less benefit) over other chips, and possibly 10%-12.5% in massively MT loads if you get the maximum OC to function without throttling in those specific respective loads be my guest.

However, I am consumer first. Thus, I feel obliged to let others know that they are wasting $50 for no reason, when there are other good chips, a few in the exact same architectural release that are better purchases in their respective workloads.
 

mohit9206

Golden Member
Jul 2, 2013
1,381
511
136
No, the biggest reason people will choose a 8700K over a 8700 is because it has an unlocked multiplier. Not because it 'sounds cool' or gives you extra 'street cred' (or should that be 'geek cred'? Haha)

Well it does give you some extra geek cred. You see threads on forums like "8700k owners thread" and not for poor non k models.
 

StrangerGuy

Diamond Member
May 9, 2004
8,443
124
106
An extra $50 is nothing to me for a chip that potentially can last me 5 years. Besides I can easily recoup all of that in a resale down the road; people pay stupid amounts for the used top SKUs for a given Intel socket.
 

mohit9206

Golden Member
Jul 2, 2013
1,381
511
136
Edit - OK Slappi nailed it. You will get laid more with the 8700K. Argument over.

Can i get laid with an i3-8100?

.... plus you get more women!

Gamer Nerd - "Hey babe, check out my new rig!"

Gamer Babe - "Is that a 8700k chip you got in there?!?"

Gamer Nerd - "Ahhhh..... no, it's just an 8700, but I did save $50."

Gamer Babe - "Later loser!!"

What if you have 8700k in your rig but the gamer babe is an amd fangirl?
 

Headfoot

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2008
4,444
641
126
Coffee Lake is an okay launch, really its just making the core line 6 core as it should have been. But reading the Anandtech review showed the 5930k (and likely my 5820k, the first mainstream 6 core from a pure price perspective) beating Coffee Lake in some games, even with its lower frequency. OC vs OC the results would seem like Haswell-E is actually faster, or at least not hardly slower. Really weak for a late 2017 architecture going up against a 2014 architecture...

Weak (looking at 8400, since 8700k clearly has some bug)

Intel's latest platform, socket, architecture, with more cores can't beat 2014's Haswell-E. This is extraordinarily weak. I'll say it now - 5820k was the new 2500k and will serve gamers for as long or longer than the 2500k did.


5820k was ~$330 back in the day which is what 8700k is...
 
Last edited:

Slappi

Member
Dec 7, 2002
72
31
86
This doesn't address my last point. Gamers 8600k. All arounders 8700. Gamers who want to spend less 8400. The OC on the 8700k will realistically do nothing for games or applications in 1080p or above(where even slower and less core CPUs already max the GPU by sometimes several magnitudes depending on the game.). Large player count large thread Multiplayer games only need the six cores without HT. Throw in HT and you no longer need the OC. MT tasks that are not massively parallel, and that don't scale well will receive minimal benefit(maybe 5%) over 8700 non-k even with the OC. Thus OC will only help for those massively parallel MT tasks. However, its in these tasks that the 8700k also seems to potentially throttle at the 4.9+ barrier and throw out loads of wattage. Thus, the stock or a mild OC are more appropriate. However, once you do this, the difference between 8700k and 8700 non-k is basically non existent. most likely 5-7% at a mild oc, for extra heat/power you still need to consider.

This also doesn't take into account that many all-arounders are small team (less than 10 people in total. As low as 1) business gamers who either don't OC, or only do mild OCs anyways. Their work machine is also the game machine. And the issue is MT are for work. ST for games. With business money is ALWAYS a consideration. Some are so OCD in their business that $1 can make or break a sale. It just doesn't make sense. 8600k will not lose to the 8700k games. It will not throttle given the lack of HT and will lay waste to every other chip in this metric. $50 is a lot of money for something that gives you minute or no tangible benefit. Thats $50 that could be spent on the GPU, or if the person is well off enough, to just buy themselves a nice expensive dinner.

Also: Spec sheet on anand says 8700 has allcore of 4.3. cores 1 through 5 are all a mere 100mhz less than 8700k. All core for both says 4.3. Not sure if correct, but thats the sheet I'm reading. Thus with no OC the 8700k and 8700 should be identical in MT. If you don't OC(which base assumptions suggest the majority of buyers who purchase K models DO NOT OC, then your wasting $50 for absolutely no reason whatsoever.).

So to state again:
- 8700 non-k for all arounders
- 8600k for Max performance gaming
- 8400 for Great gaming at a tighter budget

If you really want to spend $50 to piss around with the 8700k and deal with any issues that crop up, for no ST benefit (or slightly less benefit) over other chips, and possibly 10%-12.5% in massively MT loads if you get the maximum OC to function without throttling in those specific respective loads be my guest.

However, I am consumer first. Thus, I feel obliged to let others know that they are wasting $50 for no reason, when there are other good chips, a few in the exact same architectural release that are better purchases in their respective workloads.


I agree with everything being said above.......



...... so I can get my 8700k quicker.
 
Reactions: psolord

Bouowmx

Golden Member
Nov 13, 2016
1,142
550
146
4.3 vs 4.7 and up GHz, how is it 50 USD for no reason? Personally, I'd skip the Core i5-8600K for the i7-8700 or 8700K.
 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
I thought it was interesting how Anandtech's pre-review saw some anomalies in a few games where the i5-8400 trounced the i7-8700k. Both Rise of the Tomb Raider and Grand Theft Auto 5 saw some rather odd numbers at 1080p. They saw...

RotR-1
i7-8700k: 100.45
i5-8400: 112.43

RotR-2
i7-8700k: 93.73
i5-8400: 121.73

RotR-3
i7-8700k: 116.36
i5-8400: 141.48

GTA5
i7-8700k: 90.14
i5-8400: 98.16

The other games didn't see a spread like this, and it wasn't nearly pronounced at higher resolutions (due to GPU limitations), so it's interesting to see how some games see a lead like this. I'm assuming it's due to the game using HT "cores" instead of physical cores. I checked ArsTechnica's write-up, and they saw the same low maximum framerate in Rise of the Tomb Raider. So, it's likely something that we'll see fixed sort of like what happened with Ryzen.
 

epsilon84

Golden Member
Aug 29, 2010
1,142
927
136
Pookums, I'
This doesn't address my last point. Gamers 8600k. All arounders 8700. Gamers who want to spend less 8400. The OC on the 8700k will realistically do nothing for games or applications in 1080p or above(where even slower and less core CPUs already max the GPU by sometimes several magnitudes depending on the game.). Large player count large thread Multiplayer games only need the six cores without HT. Throw in HT and you no longer need the OC. MT tasks that are not massively parallel, and that don't scale well will receive minimal benefit(maybe 5%) over 8700 non-k even with the OC. Thus OC will only help for those massively parallel MT tasks. However, its in these tasks that the 8700k also seems to potentially throttle at the 4.9+ barrier and throw out loads of wattage. Thus, the stock or a mild OC are more appropriate. However, once you do this, the difference between 8700k and 8700 non-k is basically non existent. most likely 5-7% at a mild oc, for extra heat/power you still need to consider.

This also doesn't take into account that many all-arounders are small team (less than 10 people in total. As low as 1) business gamers who either don't OC, or only do mild OCs anyways. Their work machine is also the game machine. And the issue is MT are for work. ST for games. With business money is ALWAYS a consideration. Some are so OCD in their business that $1 can make or break a sale. It just doesn't make sense. 8600k will not lose to the 8700k games. It will not throttle given the lack of HT and will lay waste to every other chip in this metric. $50 is a lot of money for something that gives you minute or no tangible benefit. Thats $50 that could be spent on the GPU, or if the person is well off enough, to just buy themselves a nice expensive dinner.

Also: Spec sheet on anand says 8700 has allcore of 4.3. cores 1 through 5 are all a mere 100mhz less than 8700k. All core for both says 4.3. Not sure if correct, but thats the sheet I'm reading. Thus with no OC the 8700k and 8700 should be identical in MT. If you don't OC(which base assumptions suggest the majority of buyers who purchase K models DO NOT OC, then your wasting $50 for absolutely no reason whatsoever.).

So to state again:
- 8700 non-k for all arounders
- 8600k for Max performance gaming
- 8400 for Great gaming at a tighter budget

If you really want to spend $50 to piss around with the 8700k and deal with any issues that crop up, for no ST benefit (or slightly less benefit) over other chips, and possibly 10%-12.5% in massively MT loads if you get the maximum OC to function without throttling in those specific respective loads be my guest.

However, I am consumer first. Thus, I feel obliged to let others know that they are wasting $50 for no reason, when there are other good chips, a few in the exact same architectural release that are better purchases in their respective workloads.

So, in a nutshell... overclockers - get the K. Non overclockers - get the non K and save $50 and get (pretty much) equivalent performance.

I agree with you on that point.

Can anyone confirm if 'multicore enhancement' actually works or doesn't work on non K CPUs though? Because if it doesn't, then the 'value' argument is open for debate again even for non overclockers as the 8700K will be 'automatically' overclocked to 4.7GHz on all cores by default in many Z series motherboards.
 

tamz_msc

Diamond Member
Jan 5, 2017
3,865
3,729
136
4.3 vs 4.7 and up GHz, how is it 50 USD for no reason? Personally, I'd skip the Core i5-8600K for the i7-8700 or 8700K.
All turbo bins on the 8700 non-K are just 100MHz lower than the K for up to five cores, and are identical for 6 cores. For those who don't overclock, there used to be an argument in favor of getting the K version for faster default performance, but not this time around with these two SKUs.
 
Reactions: Drazick and Phynaz
sale-70-410-exam    | Exam-200-125-pdf    | we-sale-70-410-exam    | hot-sale-70-410-exam    | Latest-exam-700-603-Dumps    | Dumps-98-363-exams-date    | Certs-200-125-date    | Dumps-300-075-exams-date    | hot-sale-book-C8010-726-book    | Hot-Sale-200-310-Exam    | Exam-Description-200-310-dumps?    | hot-sale-book-200-125-book    | Latest-Updated-300-209-Exam    | Dumps-210-260-exams-date    | Download-200-125-Exam-PDF    | Exam-Description-300-101-dumps    | Certs-300-101-date    | Hot-Sale-300-075-Exam    | Latest-exam-200-125-Dumps    | Exam-Description-200-125-dumps    | Latest-Updated-300-075-Exam    | hot-sale-book-210-260-book    | Dumps-200-901-exams-date    | Certs-200-901-date    | Latest-exam-1Z0-062-Dumps    | Hot-Sale-1Z0-062-Exam    | Certs-CSSLP-date    | 100%-Pass-70-383-Exams    | Latest-JN0-360-real-exam-questions    | 100%-Pass-4A0-100-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-300-135-exams-date    | Passed-200-105-Tech-Exams    | Latest-Updated-200-310-Exam    | Download-300-070-Exam-PDF    | Hot-Sale-JN0-360-Exam    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Exams    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-JN0-360-exams-date    | Exam-Description-1Z0-876-dumps    | Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps    | Dumps-HPE0-Y53-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-HPE0-Y53-Exam    | 100%-Pass-HPE0-Y53-Real-Exam-Questions    | Pass-4A0-100-Exam    | Latest-4A0-100-Questions    | Dumps-98-365-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-98-365-Exam    | 100%-Pass-VCS-254-Exams    | 2017-Latest-VCS-273-Exam    | Dumps-200-355-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-300-320-Exam    | Pass-300-101-Exam    | 100%-Pass-300-115-Exams    |
http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    | http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    |