Cold Air Intakes

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amicold

Platinum Member
Feb 7, 2005
2,656
1
81
Originally posted by: Ragnarok2
Since they're pretty cheap and and actually increase the HP somewhat I'm thinking about putting in a cold air intake in my chrysler.

The question is, can I use the factory air intake tube and just buy a coupler and filter, or do I have to get a new intake tube as well? Thanks a whole bunch!

The less restrictive the tubing is the more power you will get. Depending on your engine size, anywhere from 1 to maybe 15 horsepower gain. I noticed slightly better fuel efficiency as well.
 
Jan 31, 2002
40,819
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BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
1
81
Originally posted by: Ragnarok2
I understand that a CAI won't make my Chrysler sedan gain lots of HP, but hey, it still does something, and it does look nice under the hood, which increases the resell value even if by a little. They're pretty cheap nowadays anyway, so why not get one eh? Isn't it a better idea to just get a CAI rather than go and buy a $20 paper filter for the factory intake?

You're still not getting it. It does nothing. Think about this logically:

You can only gain in WOT acceleration. How often do you do that? Once, maybe twice a day? Unless it's WOT, you gain nothing, because you can always just open the throttle more.

And at WOT, you're already not too fast. And AT BEST, you will gain an imperceptible amount of HP. Just about every other time, you will be dealing with a loss in low end torque.

The only thing you will really gain is a louder engine, lower resale value, and open yourself up to hydrolock. If you're doing it for sound or to ruin your car quicker, then get a CAI, and put on the douche cap. Believe me, if you have something to gain, and nothing to lose, then I'd be all for it.

And don't get me started on oiled filters.

CAI's have their uses - this isn't one of them.
 

OS

Lifer
Oct 11, 1999
15,581
1
76
Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire
Originally posted by: Vic
Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire
Originally posted by: ElFenix

screw the car, i'm taking the girl

I'd rather screw the girl and take the car, but whatever floats your boat.

- M4H

I already own that car.

So you're saying you'd rather the former of the two options?

- M4H


I can afford the car, but not the chick.


 
Jan 31, 2002
40,819
2
0
Originally posted by: OS
Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire
Originally posted by: Vic
Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire
Originally posted by: ElFenix

screw the car, i'm taking the girl

I'd rather screw the girl and take the car, but whatever floats your boat.

- M4H

I already own that car.

So you're saying you'd rather the former of the two options?

- M4H


I can afford the car, but not the chick.


She looks pretty cheap to me.



- M4H
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,336
136
Originally posted by: OS
Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire
Originally posted by: Vic
Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire
Originally posted by: ElFenix

screw the car, i'm taking the girl

I'd rather screw the girl and take the car, but whatever floats your boat.

- M4H

I already own that car.

So you're saying you'd rather the former of the two options?

- M4H


I can afford the car, but not the chick.







edit: LOL, M4H! :beer:
 

Ilikepiedoyou

Senior member
Jan 10, 2006
685
0
0
I would say install one if you are looking for a decrease in daily perfomrance and a decrease in fuel economy
 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
I have those pictures that I mentioned earlier, M4H, if you're interested in seeing it

The car itself:
http://www.aikouka.com/DSM/IMAG0016.JPG

Borked stuff:
http://www.aikouka.com/DSM/IMAG0027.JPG - Piston head.. somewhat
http://www.aikouka.com/DSM/IMAG0028.JPG - Piston head + half rod
http://www.aikouka.com/DSM/IMAG0029.JPG - Bent rod
http://www.aikouka.com/DSM/IMAG0030.JPG - One of the few good ones...
http://www.aikouka.com/DSM/IMAG0031.JPG - Bent valve
http://www.aikouka.com/DSM/IMAG0032.JPG - Holy hole
http://www.aikouka.com/DSM/IMAG0033.JPG - Holy hole 2
http://www.aikouka.com/DSM/IMAG0034.JPG - Look closely and you'll see what's wrong...
 

DivideBYZero

Lifer
May 18, 2001
24,117
2
0
WTF? How do I get called the 'Village Idiot' for pointing out what a stupid idea this was first? All we have seen since is the same advice with technical backup, which I just could not be arsed to provide.

PS: BMW M made my bike...
 

Kur

Senior member
Feb 19, 2005
677
0
0
I have an after market intake, and it's funny to see the jiffy lube people try and offer me service on my intake then they open the hood and go "nevermind"
 

Dritnul

Senior member
Jan 9, 2006
781
0
0
thats about all it does for my Scion tC as well

yea CA just makes the car sound faster doesnt actually make it go faster

plus if u install it wrong then it is actually worse for your car
 

Ragnarok2

Senior member
Jul 11, 2006
534
0
0
Alright you guys convinced me not to buy a CAI. I went to PepBoys and the tubing itself was $50 plus the filter and coupler, so I was like screw it, I'll just get a good filter for my factory intake.
 

BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
1
81
Originally posted by: Ragnarok2
Alright you guys convinced me not to buy a CAI. I went to PepBoys and the tubing itself was $50 plus the filter and coupler, so I was like screw it, I'll just get a good filter for my factory intake.

Even the filter is a waste of money. Seriously.

The HP gain is even MORE negligible, and cleaning it is a royal pain in the ass. It will take YEARS for you to make up the difference in cost between using paper. If you have never cleaned an oil based filter before, it might sound like nothing, but your car will be undrivable for hours, and it's messy, and easy to screw up. Over oil the filter and you will foul up your MAF.

The only thing you should consider doing is changing your air filter more often, thats it. Want more throttle response? Tighten your throttle cable and attach lead to the soles of your shoes.

Is your car an auto or manual?
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,336
136
Originally posted by: thescreensavers
viods your warranty
Negative. New car warranties can never be voided by modification (except to the odometer), however warranty claims directly related to the modified parts can be denied on a case-by-case basis.
 

Howard

Lifer
Oct 14, 1999
47,982
10
81
Originally posted by: Vic
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: Aikouka
Colder air compresses better, which means it provides less resistance to the push of the piston, which means that there's less energy being wasted on that compression stroke.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.....

Wow, that's one of the funniest things I've heard in a long, long time. And I've heard some whoppers from people who think they know about cars.

Colder air is denser. This makes it slightly more difficult to compress (not enough to make any real-world difference at all though).

The power increase from colder air is due to the increased density. Because the air is denser, it contains more oxygen per given unit volume. More oxygen allows the engine to burn more fuel, which creates more power. This is one of the reasons that cars typically get poorer mileage in the winter. The colder, denser air causes the FI system to compensate for the extra oxygen by injecting more fuel.

Whoever told you that "colder air compresses better" should be banned from even touching a car as they obviously have no clue.

ZV

WARNING! DANGER TO MANIFOLD!!

:laugh:
Shut up! SHUT UP! *bang*
 

Howard

Lifer
Oct 14, 1999
47,982
10
81
Paper filters filter better than oiled foam or whatever it is K&N filters are made of.
 

Ragnarok2

Senior member
Jul 11, 2006
534
0
0
Originally posted by: BD2003
Originally posted by: Ragnarok2
Alright you guys convinced me not to buy a CAI. I went to PepBoys and the tubing itself was $50 plus the filter and coupler, so I was like screw it, I'll just get a good filter for my factory intake.

Even the filter is a waste of money. Seriously.

The HP gain is even MORE negligible, and cleaning it is a royal pain in the ass. It will take YEARS for you to make up the difference in cost between using paper. If you have never cleaned an oil based filter before, it might sound like nothing, but your car will be undrivable for hours, and it's messy, and easy to screw up. Over oil the filter and you will foul up your MAF.

The only thing you should consider doing is changing your air filter more often, thats it. Want more throttle response? Tighten your throttle cable and attach lead to the soles of your shoes.

Is your car an auto or manual?


Auto
 

BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
1
81
Originally posted by: Ragnarok2
Originally posted by: BD2003
Originally posted by: Ragnarok2
Alright you guys convinced me not to buy a CAI. I went to PepBoys and the tubing itself was $50 plus the filter and coupler, so I was like screw it, I'll just get a good filter for my factory intake.

Even the filter is a waste of money. Seriously.

The HP gain is even MORE negligible, and cleaning it is a royal pain in the ass. It will take YEARS for you to make up the difference in cost between using paper. If you have never cleaned an oil based filter before, it might sound like nothing, but your car will be undrivable for hours, and it's messy, and easy to screw up. Over oil the filter and you will foul up your MAF.

The only thing you should consider doing is changing your air filter more often, thats it. Want more throttle response? Tighten your throttle cable and attach lead to the soles of your shoes.

Is your car an auto or manual?


Auto

Then it'll be even less noticible, and a complete waste. Seriously, im trying to help you save time and money here. Just put your car in 3 instead of OD, if you want a little more fun.
 

BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
1
81
Originally posted by: Ragnarok2
Just put your car in 3 instead of OD, if you want a little more fun.

Would that actually do anything?

It will keep you out of top gear, preventing you from having to downshift whenever you want to speed up a bit.

More torque at hand, but it'll use more gas and be louder, and I wouldn't do it on the highway.
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
Depends on the car. On a normal passenger car there will probably be no difference.

On a high horsepower car it will make as much as a 30-40 HP difference at the wheels, especially on a blown car with a supercharger or turbo system under higher boost levels which force the engine to 'suck through a straw' on the factory intake.

Two ways an intake "makes" (or rather provides means for producing) more power.

First, it's less restrictive and higher flowing which makes a difference under heavy loads and high RPM only. If the engine air intake needs are not that drastic (non performance oriented engine with a over safe and conservative factory tune) and the original intake is sufficient at all RPMs, there will be no difference.

Second, colder air from outside the engine compartment is denser than the hot under hood air and allows more fuel. But more importantly colder air is less prone to detonation ('pinging') and allows for a more aggressive tune with more timing which creates more power. A true cold air system draws air from outside the engine bay. The ones you see with just a tube and a under hood filter are not CAIs and should not be labeled as such.

Here is mine:

http://jlttruecoldair.com/zencart/index...oduct_info&cPath=1_7_20&products_id=45

Some things you want in a CAI:

1) Draws air from outside the engine bay, from a sealed opening so that no under hood air can enter the filter

2) On mass airflow systems that use a MAF meter, you want as much straight tubing leading to the MAF as you can to get laminar air flow over the sensor. Bends directly in front of the sensor cause turbulence and lead to poor and inaccurate readings and make it impossible to tune properly. On speed-density systems that use a MAP and IAT sensor, it?s not a major concern other than bends cause frictional loss in the flow path.

3) Single piece design with smooth inside walls and constant diameter (ie: mandrel bent/molded). Ridges and mold lines on most factory tubes cause turbulence. Air that circulates in endless circles is not entering the engine and is occupying inlet space that useable air could be flowing through. It also heats up the air via friction. You do need some kind of flexible coupler in the system though, as the engine moves under hard acceleration and the inlet is fixed to the fender well. If the tube is a single piece of metal or plastic, you need some kind of rubber coupler that will flex or something will eventually stress and crack.

4) Ease of filter changing and location. Some of them may relocate filters to impossible locations, etc. Also the location of the filter in the fender well is prone to sucking up water in heavy rain or when driving through shallow water, which will pretty much destroy the engine. Water doesn't compress; the metal in the rods, main bolts, crank, and head bolts will yield first because the water will not compress under any circumstances. This is what is known as hydrolocking and would be the same thing as trying to run 10000 lbs of boost.

Some CAIs like the one I linked change the position of the MAF from the factory position relative to the filter and the throttle body requiring computer and/or MAF sensor recalibration (i.e.: you'll need a new tune to compensate). MAF sensors are so precise which makes them sensitive to changes and very tricky to work with and require custom computer tuning for optimal performance and mileage.

As for filters, larger filters conical filters with surface area on both sides provide more surface area and require less work for the engine to pull air through. But again, if you can hold the throttle open and you don't see or feel the intake tube or filter wanting to collapse or move at all under the vaccuum in that condition, it's probably not going to make much of a difference.

All in all the intake itself doesn't make power, it's just a small piece of a much larger system, which on a engine with other modifications like blower, turbo, large cams, free flowing exhaust, etc. can quickly become a restriction.
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
Originally posted by: LS20
****** subwoofer = bad
aftermarket exhausts = bad
intakes on 4 bangers = low-key and pleasant

You should hear the stock exhaust on a 4v blown Cobra and the sound of a full Bassani system with headers and x-pipe and lumpy cams
 
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