computer for internet

Konrad

Member
Apr 21, 2000
86
0
0
I need your advice, guys,
I want to build computer,as a gift for my daughter birthday. She will use it just for internet browsing, e-mail and some word processing.
I'm planning to use:
CPU - celeron 600, MB - tyan trinity 400,
V/C - ATI xpert 2000pro,and SB 128 PCI.
How this setup looks to you? Do I need anything
better than this, or not?
Thanks for your opinion.
 

duragezic

Lifer
Oct 11, 1999
11,234
4
81
Looks okay for a internet pc. I'm not familar with the Tyan Trinity 400 so I won't say anything about that. The rest listed sounds good. You don't really need nothing better if that's all it will be used for. One thing you didn't list is the RAM. I would recommend 64mb. NO LESS. My sister has a Dell Celeron 400 w/ 32mb ram and it is even annoying for internet browsing because it is so slow. It is constantly accessing the hard drive (which is nothing fast either) because it is out of RAM. That looks like a good system for what you listed, just make sure to get 64mb ram. I'm not sure if 128mb is necessary, and with RAM prices like they are...?
 

Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,798
1,370
126
Yeah, bare minimum 64 Mb RAM. 96 or 128 Mb is preferred, even just for web browsing and word processing. Less than 64 will not only be slow, it may cause unexplained crashes if she multitasks a lot (which may just mean having 3 or 4 web browser windows open at the same time). I'd do this even if it meant having to get a Celeron 533A (non-overclocked) because the end result would be a much faster computer. (However, I think the Celeron 533A and 600 prices are very close now.)

Another option is a Duron 600 (cheaper) with appropriate motherboard (more expensive).

Get a good keyboard, because the $10 keyboards truly suck.

Why specifically the Tyan board? Just wondering? In any case, BX is probably the best for those purposes.
 

Ulysses

Platinum Member
Jun 17, 2000
2,136
0
0
It looks OK, but you might not need a Cele 600 - a 566 might do if you are going to stick with the slow performance of a stock Cele. Even better would be a Pentium III like a Coppermine 550E or 600E, if you want to stick with an Intel CPU and that does not blow the budget. The P3's are much better performers than the Celerons. Most people in these forums who use Cele's overclock them - i.e., they buy a 566 and run it at maybe 850 - which still is about the same performance-wise as a P3 600E. A non-overclocked Cele is very slow!

You might want to change tracks and consider an AMD CPU instead of an Intel. The new AMD Duron CPU's are much better performers than the Celerons, but cost about the same and are cheaper than the P3's. You can later replace the Duron with an AMD new Athlon/Thunderbird CPU (they're interchangeable) for a performance increase. These new AMD systems are just coming on the market and you may have to shop around for them - but that's easy as pie on the web.

The pecking order of CPU's in most apps is as follows, when comparing CPU's of similar rated speed (MHz): the AMD new Athlon aka Thunderbird is probably fastest and is cheaper than the Intel Pentium III Coppermine which performs a tad slower than the Tbird; the AMD Duron is slower than the Coppermine or Tbird but is cheaper than those CPU's and can be upgraded later by replacing it with a Tbird; the Celeron is the slowest of all and may or may not be cheapest. You will also run into the old Athlon, Celerons like the 533 or slower, and the Pentium III Katmai's - I would avoid them all.

The easiest way to not go wrong and avoid getting very confused when you are shopping is just to look for an AMD Duron CPU that is as fast as fits your budget - there are a very confusing array of Pentium III and old/new Athlon CPU's out there, believe you me. And the Duron is a great performer for the money. To see what I mean about confusing CPU's see:
http://www.sharkyextreme.com/hardware/weekly_cpu/
and
http://www.sharkyextreme.com/hardware/weekly_cpu/2.shtml

As for motherboards, Tyan is a very reliable maker. Unfortunately their boards are almost entirely for Intel CPU's, and they do not make a mobo yet for the Duron or Tbird. If you are going to stick with that Tyan see http:// [url]http://www.anandtech.com/printarticle.html?i=1119 [/url]. I'm not overwhelmed by it myself.

Instead, take a look at AnandTech's monthly Buyer's Guides. Each month they have a High End Systems Guide and a Value Systems Guide outlining numerous different configurations for different purposes and budgets. Print them out and read them if you like - you'll learn a lot. Note that the Guides won't recommend components that are not yet quite on the market, although they may mention them. You can put a lot of faith in the recommendations of AnandTech, IMO. Here are the latest Guides that I?ve seen that are applicable to you:

AnandTech Buyer?s Guide - Value Systems ? July, 2000:
http://www.anandtech.com/printarticle.html?i=1269


Check prices at:
http:// [url]http://www.pricewatch.com/ [/url]
or
http:// [url]http://ibuyer.net/ [/url]

Check vendors at:
http:// [url]http://www.resellerratings.com/ [/url]

---------
Also, for internet surfing high speed access like cable or DSL is very nice if it is available and suits your budget - it may be better than a faster CPU in practice, since your dial-up modem becomes the real bottleneck. On this topic, when you are getting a modem try to avoid a software modem, sometimes referred to as a 'Winmodem.' Most modems that go in a PCI slot are software modems, and if the box says 'requires Windows' then it's surely a s/ware modem. You want a hardware modem, and I believe most modems that fit an ISA slot or that are external modems are hardware modems. Software modems use your CPU to do some of their work, slowing the PC - h/ware modems don't.



P.S.
As was indicated 64 MB of PC133 SDRAM should be adequate for Windows 98. As for your hard drive you should try to get one that has a 7200 rpm speed if it suits your budget maybe a Western Digital Expert - this is better than 5400 rpm. The CPU, motherboard, RAM, and hard drive are the heart of any system, of course.
 

office boy

Diamond Member
Oct 12, 1999
4,210
0
0


<< Most people in these forums who use Cele's overclock them - i.e., they buy a 566 and run it at maybe 850 - which still is about the same performance-wise as a P3 600E. >>


Sound like Intel brainwashing to me
 

Prodigy^

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
4,044
1
0
you should get 128 Mb RAM, with 64 Mb you really get disk trashing all the time and it's highly annoying.

what do you need the ATI card for? I've got with those Voodoo3's that are selling at practically nothing at the moment.
 

Ulysses

Platinum Member
Jun 17, 2000
2,136
0
0

Officeboy:

Take a look at the AnandTech reviews and weep, if you have a Cele - like that of the Cele 700 - the benchmarks show I'm right. The Cele's are crippled by their slow FSB and a puny L2 cache that's one-half that of the P3's .

If you want performance today you get a Duron, Coppermine or Tbird - not a Cele, overclocked or not. Cele's are just cheaper, not better - they're yesterday's newspapers.
 

office boy

Diamond Member
Oct 12, 1999
4,210
0
0
Ulysses This is true in only a few applications. But he's not building a gaming rig, so Q3 and UT benchmarks mean very little.
For general office applications, and surfing. The Celeron2 is a perfect, cheap solution.

You don't need a Caddy or a Porsche to cruise the strip, a Honda will do just fine.

But so will a Duron, if you can find a cheap MB

-edit add-
P.S. very very few ISA modems are hardware anymore.... all external Modems are.... some PCI are also hardware now (ie 3com gamers modem)
 

Konrad

Member
Apr 21, 2000
86
0
0
Thanks for your help.
This is the rest of the system:
RAM - 128 PC133. HD - 15 GB Maxtor Diamond+ (7200)
I'm using Tyan Trinity400 (I can get it for $60), so I'm stuck
with Intel's processors, same with ATI card ($30), MB and V/C,
are new, but in damaged boxes.
I will not overclock, so the only question is, if is worth to go with
P3, or celeron. I,m on the cable (Rogers Home), so no WinModem.
ps. Office Boy,you are right, my daughter is only 11, so honda is enough for her, no need for porche.
 

office boy

Diamond Member
Oct 12, 1999
4,210
0
0
Well if your not overclocking, and it's not to much extra money then a 600EB might be nice....
But it all depends on what's important. What you have (if celeron2) will already make one hell of a Intenet email system.
 

hubbs

Platinum Member
Mar 26, 2000
2,442
0
0
Man this bothers me. People that are using computer for that little have like a WAY better system than me. I multitask so much for 32mb of ram. Right now I have 11 items in the task bar. It pisses me off man.
 

Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,798
1,370
126
In fact I'd go ATi more than I would go Voodoo for a non-overclocked system non-gaming system. It just seems that they have in some ways BETTER support, if you ignore games (because ATi has historically had terrible support for games). For $30 it's a steal. (And if you eventually get a DVD-ROM drive, the ATi has true hardware assist for DVD decoding, and one of the best quality images for DVD in the industry. 3dfx claims hardware assist, but in truth it does basically zero hardware assist.)

&quot;A non-overclocked Cele is very slow!&quot;

True, but for his daughters purposes even a Celeron 400 is adequate, as long as he has enough memory and a fast drive. In all honesty, I notice only a little difference in Windows between my Celly 412 and my Celly 897, and that's mostly only in Photoshop. Hell, at work I use a PII 333, and it's perfectly fine. In games, the difference would be night and day, but that's not an issue here.
 

tom3

Golden Member
Oct 10, 1999
1,996
0
0
If all she will do on the computer is internet, email and word processing, she really doesnt need such a fast computer.

A Celeron 400 on an i810 board with 64 or 128mb of ram will be more than adequate for her. A Celeron 400 CPU should be around $50, and an i810 board can be had for $40 (new) from the tekram online store. This is what I have done for my sister in law's computer.

I understand that you must want to give your daughter the best, but the money could be better spent. For example you can save the money and upgrade the computer when her needs surpass the computer's capabilities. Or invest the money saved into longer lasting hardware, such as a bigger/better monitor, better speakers, etc..

it's just my opinion.
 

Konrad

Member
Apr 21, 2000
86
0
0
Thanks for your advice, guys, just one more question:
why so many of you suggested celeron 566 over celeron 600?
I will not overclock, and the price different between them is minimal,
so what's the advantage of celeron 566?
 

Jimbo

Platinum Member
Oct 10, 1999
2,641
0
76
Tom3 has some well-founded points.
In answer to your Celeron II 566/600 question: the answer is simply price. She will not notice the difference between the two.
OK one last thought?
If you were starting from scratch:
My biggest concern would be someone messing with it while it is away.
For this type of life an 815e is going to be more than adequate and be more reliable and be cheaper and should not be a throwaway in a year.
The Intel D815EEA board will have onboard video (but also has an AGP slot) and onboard sound that is pretty decent. If she will be in a dorm then they also have them with built in 10/100-network capability. This will run ANYTHING S370 from Celeron (first generation) to P-IIIs.
Although Intel boards are NOT known for being able to be over clocked and tweaked to within an inch of their life they are in my opinion the most solid board out there. It will always work. It will not eat her term paper the night before it is due. It will be immune to ?know it all college pukes? that try to ?optimize? her computer for her in an effort to get 5 more FPS out of it in Quake III.
This should save you many hours of potential trouble shooting over the phone for the rest of the year. Cost: about $165
As for the rest of it?
128MB of PC-100. about $145 for DECENT stuff
Get her an IBM Deskstar 75GXP (15 Gig for about $120 or $175 for the 30Gig)
Toshiba 48X CD-ROM for about $45
TEAC Floppy (I like them better than Sony?s and they are quieter) $15
3COM 56K V.90 INTERNAL PCI FAX MODEM MODEL #2977 (OEM) $55
(Yes, you could save about $20 and get a WinModem, but you DO love your daughter, right?)
Processor: You could go with either a 600/566 Celeron II or spend another $40 and get her a 550e Pentium III (FCPGA) and grab a bit more real speed out of the deal.
Case: about $65 for a decent ATX MidTower.

TOTAL: $755 plus monitor.

But if you ALREADY have the parts you list in your later post and/or can get them cheap, then you have the fundimentals covered and she will be very happy with her new computer.

I actually started this post YESTERDAY and only just now got back to it and finished. So many of your questions already seem to have been answered.
 

DDad

Golden Member
Oct 9, 1999
1,668
0
0
This may seem like a silly question, but a lot depends on the age of your daughter.(Edit: I just noticed that shes 11)
If she's old enough (say 16 up) get the max you can afford, because in a couple of years she'll be off to college, and will take the computer with her. Hopefully it won't be too obsolete!
Younger than that, I'd personally get something inexpensive (say a generation or so back) Celerons up to 533 (old stepping), .25 PIII, etc- by the time they get to college you'll be building new again anyway

At least you can recycle computers &amp; parts easier than Clothes!
 
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