Congress Approves $87.5 Billion Aid Package for War Effort - via voice vote

[BaliBabyDoc]

I don't understand. The Bushies crowed about the donor's conference which essentially saddles Iraq with $12B+ in debt over the next 5 years. The Bush League strong-armed members of Congress and claimed ANY vote other than a total grant would do more harm than good. I guess the GOP will sponsor a resolution condemning the donors conference for giving loans.

 

[nutxo]

Originally posted by: SuperTool
It's good that the Iraqis won't have a lot of debt to worry about. Too bad us Americans will add half a trillion dollar debt a year. It's Ironic that Bush admin has to go to Iraq to practice some sanity in it's fiscal policies.
It's nice how this administration (FERC) stood by during the CA energy crisis, but is making sure Iraqis get their gas at 15 cents/gallon at US taxpayer expense.
It's nice how they are making sure every Iraqi gets vaccines and medicine, while the US population goes uninsured and unable to afford prescriptions.
It's just dandy how they are investing in Iraqi infrastructure and rebuilding schools, while our schools are in shameful disrepair.
Their policies in Iraq are 180 degree opposite of their policies here. They are warm and cuddly liberals in Iraq, but tough love conservatives here.
This Iraq issue is becoming a hot potato, no wonder almost none of our so called representatives want to be on record either voting for or against it.

I dont know what country you live in but where I live we just got another brand new school, and I know of at least 3 that have been expanded and rebuilt in the last few years.

Was'nt the california enegry crisis created by the state government in California?

 

[SuperTool]

Originally posted by: nutxo

Originally posted by: SuperTool
It's good that the Iraqis won't have a lot of debt to worry about. Too bad us Americans will add half a trillion dollar debt a year. It's Ironic that Bush admin has to go to Iraq to practice some sanity in it's fiscal policies.
It's nice how this administration (FERC) stood by during the CA energy crisis, but is making sure Iraqis get their gas at 15 cents/gallon at US taxpayer expense.
It's nice how they are making sure every Iraqi gets vaccines and medicine, while the US population goes uninsured and unable to afford prescriptions.
It's just dandy how they are investing in Iraqi infrastructure and rebuilding schools, while our schools are in shameful disrepair.
Their policies in Iraq are 180 degree opposite of their policies here. They are warm and cuddly liberals in Iraq, but tough love conservatives here.
This Iraq issue is becoming a hot potato, no wonder almost none of our so called representatives want to be on record either voting for or against it.

I dont know what country you live in but where I live we just got another brand new school, and I know of at least 3 that have been expanded and rebuilt in the last few years.

Was'nt the california enegry crisis created by the state government in California?

I know some schools in Los Angeles have leaking roofs and exposed wiring. Also, energy crisis was caused by both Wilson administration that created a broken deregulated market, and the energy companies who conspired to exploit it. What FERC did is ignore the blatant market manipulation. Afterwards they acknowledged there was such manipulation but still didn't do anything about it.

 

[GrGr]

Originally posted by: Crimson

Originally posted by: GrGr
Another question is much of the $ 87 billion will end up in the pockets of those Bush backers and donors who were given the contracts to rebuild Iraq without competition.

About the same as would have ended up going to the SAME companies if Gore were elected. These companies give to both candidates..

Study: Bush backers land Iraq deals

Campaign donors garner $8 billion in reconstruction projects


MSNBC NEWS SERVICES

?This situation alone shows how susceptible the contracting system is to waste, fraud and cronyism.?
? CHARLES LEWIS


WASHINGTON, Oct. 30 ? Companies awarded $8 billion in contracts to rebuild Iraq and Afghanistan have been major campaign donors to President Bush, and their executives have had important political and military connections, according to a study released Thursday.

THE STUDY of more than 70 U.S. companies and individual contractors turned up more than $500,000 in donations to the president?s 2000 campaign, more than they gave collectively to any other politician over the past dozen years.

 

[nutxo]

Originally posted by: SuperTool

Originally posted by: nutxo

Originally posted by: SuperTool
It's good that the Iraqis won't have a lot of debt to worry about. Too bad us Americans will add half a trillion dollar debt a year. It's Ironic that Bush admin has to go to Iraq to practice some sanity in it's fiscal policies.
It's nice how this administration (FERC) stood by during the CA energy crisis, but is making sure Iraqis get their gas at 15 cents/gallon at US taxpayer expense.
It's nice how they are making sure every Iraqi gets vaccines and medicine, while the US population goes uninsured and unable to afford prescriptions.
It's just dandy how they are investing in Iraqi infrastructure and rebuilding schools, while our schools are in shameful disrepair.
Their policies in Iraq are 180 degree opposite of their policies here. They are warm and cuddly liberals in Iraq, but tough love conservatives here.
This Iraq issue is becoming a hot potato, no wonder almost none of our so called representatives want to be on record either voting for or against it.

I dont know what country you live in but where I live we just got another brand new school, and I know of at least 3 that have been expanded and rebuilt in the last few years.

Was'nt the california enegry crisis created by the state government in California?

I know some schools in Los Angeles have leaking roofs and exposed wiring. Also, energy crisis was caused by both Wilson administration that created a broken deregulated market, and the energy companies who conspired to exploit it. What FERC did is ignore the blatant market manipulation. Afterwards they acknowledged there was such manipulation but still didn't do anything about it.

So California screwed itself and then the people, after electing incredibly inept people for years, expect the feds to come clean up?

I left that shythole 12 years ago and never looked back, Ca is by far the most backwards assed place I've ever been. They brought it on themselves and expecting anyone to clean up thier mess is ridiculous, much less to lay blame on someone else.

The money for schools is alloted by the fed and the states choose how to spend it, plus the lottery for education crap in CA, where is the money goin????

 

[Nitemare]

Originally posted by: tnitsuj

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: tnitsuj

Originally posted by: Nitemare
I can't believe they are making it a grant rather than a loan

Making it a loan would almost ensure that Iraq never became a prosperous democracy rather than another failed 3rd world rathole. The administration has it 100% correct on that point, and I applaud them for standing firm on that point.

Iraq has a confirmed 112 billion barrels of oil and 220 billion more probable barrels. Saddam has squirreled away probably well over a billion. He has over a billion more in assets in Iraq. I doubt very seriously that they would be hurting. We have other matters to deal with at home, paying off the debt, hiring advisers to trim the fat on federal overspending, maybe even economic incentive for companies that use domestic workers rather than shipping the jobs overseas

We have already spent much of around 2 billion dollars in US currentcy Saddam and his cronies had squirelled around Iraq. The Iraqi central bank is very low on currency reserves, and the country has over 100billion dollars in foriegn debt not including war reperations from the first war.

Now that we are in the country the administration and industry experts are saying that it could be years before the Iraqi oil industry recovers the large amounts of capitol investments required to bring it back online in a profitable manner (contrary to what they said before the war).

Iraq has no ability anywhere in the forseeable future to pay of its debts, and we don't need to be piling more on.

The administration made the right call on this, and I can see them asking for more money next year which they should also get. IMHO

Make them long term loans then. We cannot be the world's policeman no more than we can be the world's welfare provider

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: tnitsuj

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: tnitsuj

Originally posted by: Nitemare
I can't believe they are making it a grant rather than a loan

Making it a loan would almost ensure that Iraq never became a prosperous democracy rather than another failed 3rd world rathole. The administration has it 100% correct on that point, and I applaud them for standing firm on that point.

Iraq has a confirmed 112 billion barrels of oil and 220 billion more probable barrels. Saddam has squirreled away probably well over a billion. He has over a billion more in assets in Iraq. I doubt very seriously that they would be hurting. We have other matters to deal with at home, paying off the debt, hiring advisers to trim the fat on federal overspending, maybe even economic incentive for companies that use domestic workers rather than shipping the jobs overseas

We have already spent much of around 2 billion dollars in US currentcy Saddam and his cronies had squirelled around Iraq. The Iraqi central bank is very low on currency reserves, and the country has over 100billion dollars in foriegn debt not including war reperations from the first war.

Now that we are in the country the administration and industry experts are saying that it could be years before the Iraqi oil industry recovers the large amounts of capitol investments required to bring it back online in a profitable manner (contrary to what they said before the war).

Iraq has no ability anywhere in the forseeable future to pay of its debts, and we don't need to be piling more on.

The administration made the right call on this, and I can see them asking for more money next year which they should also get. IMHO

Make them long term loans then. We cannot be the world's policeman no more than we can be the world's welfare provider

They should have thought about that before the invasion.

 

[Nitemare]

Originally posted by: WinstonSmith

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: tnitsuj

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: tnitsuj

Originally posted by: Nitemare
I can't believe they are making it a grant rather than a loan

Making it a loan would almost ensure that Iraq never became a prosperous democracy rather than another failed 3rd world rathole. The administration has it 100% correct on that point, and I applaud them for standing firm on that point.

Iraq has a confirmed 112 billion barrels of oil and 220 billion more probable barrels. Saddam has squirreled away probably well over a billion. He has over a billion more in assets in Iraq. I doubt very seriously that they would be hurting. We have other matters to deal with at home, paying off the debt, hiring advisers to trim the fat on federal overspending, maybe even economic incentive for companies that use domestic workers rather than shipping the jobs overseas

We have already spent much of around 2 billion dollars in US currentcy Saddam and his cronies had squirelled around Iraq. The Iraqi central bank is very low on currency reserves, and the country has over 100billion dollars in foriegn debt not including war reperations from the first war.

Now that we are in the country the administration and industry experts are saying that it could be years before the Iraqi oil industry recovers the large amounts of capitol investments required to bring it back online in a profitable manner (contrary to what they said before the war).

Iraq has no ability anywhere in the forseeable future to pay of its debts, and we don't need to be piling more on.

The administration made the right call on this, and I can see them asking for more money next year which they should also get. IMHO

Make them long term loans then. We cannot be the world's policeman no more than we can be the world's welfare provider

They should have thought about that before the invasion.

two can play that game.
Iraqi citizens should have thought about that before they voted him in unanimously

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: WinstonSmith

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: tnitsuj

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: tnitsuj

Originally posted by: Nitemare
I can't believe they are making it a grant rather than a loan

Making it a loan would almost ensure that Iraq never became a prosperous democracy rather than another failed 3rd world rathole. The administration has it 100% correct on that point, and I applaud them for standing firm on that point.

Iraq has a confirmed 112 billion barrels of oil and 220 billion more probable barrels. Saddam has squirreled away probably well over a billion. He has over a billion more in assets in Iraq. I doubt very seriously that they would be hurting. We have other matters to deal with at home, paying off the debt, hiring advisers to trim the fat on federal overspending, maybe even economic incentive for companies that use domestic workers rather than shipping the jobs overseas

We have already spent much of around 2 billion dollars in US currentcy Saddam and his cronies had squirelled around Iraq. The Iraqi central bank is very low on currency reserves, and the country has over 100billion dollars in foriegn debt not including war reperations from the first war.

Now that we are in the country the administration and industry experts are saying that it could be years before the Iraqi oil industry recovers the large amounts of capitol investments required to bring it back online in a profitable manner (contrary to what they said before the war).

Iraq has no ability anywhere in the forseeable future to pay of its debts, and we don't need to be piling more on.

The administration made the right call on this, and I can see them asking for more money next year which they should also get. IMHO

Make them long term loans then. We cannot be the world's policeman no more than we can be the world's welfare provider

They should have thought about that before the invasion.

two can play that game.
Iraqi citizens should have thought about that before they voted him in unanimously

Ahh, so we are overthrowing democratically elected governments that have not been shown to pose no more than a hypothetical threat?

Shocking! Do tell!

I think you are becoming unpatriotic with all this news!

 

[irrigating]

What a waste of money, and it won't even help in the short term.

What Congress should have done is to properly plan for the future.

Take all those billions, and offer a match making service instead. Take Israeli boys and girls, and match them up with suitable Arab boys and girls. Give them a house, a nice chunk of land, a couple of fancy cars, in a place like Texas. I doubt anyone currently living there would consider them a threat.

The only stipulation should be that when thier children are of age, they do mandatory tour in a branch of the American Armed Forces. As peacekeepers in the Middle East.

And maybe, by the time my young son is old enough to serve, he won't have to go there.