Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords Shot In Arizona

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JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,750
2,334
126
Only time will tell if he is a teabagger or not.

Really? Then why do you keep calling him a teabagger? Should I go dig up the quote of you wishing all of the Republicans that voted for Bush hanged?
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,750
2,334
126
Posting pictures of retarded right wingers is irrelevant if you can't prove that the guy was influenced by them.
 

matt0611

Golden Member
Oct 22, 2010
1,879
0
0
Really? Then why do you keep calling him a teabagger? Should I go dig up the quote of you wishing all of the Republicans that voted for Bush hanged?

I'm sure he'll be back here to admit he is wrong if he doesn't turn out to be right?
 

matt0611

Golden Member
Oct 22, 2010
1,879
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0
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manimal

Lifer
Mar 30, 2007
13,559
8
0
I would join in on this conversation but find too much of it innapropriate for a thread that is supposed to be about people getting killed.


Lets lock this up and start an appropriate thread where people can discuss this stuff without sounding like douchebags...
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
10,505
2
0
That is the problem, you decide your own risk and you completely ignore the risk you put other people into. Innocent people who have nothing to do with it.

Risk to others in terms of the risk of violating others' rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness is a valid consideration, but much of what I have a problem with using government to correct or prevent poses no risk to others.

Why, because you believe in a great conspiracy that does not exist ?
It makes it very relevant. Ever heard of paranoia ?

I don't believe in conspiracies, mainly because I do not believe the government is competent enough to pull one off. That doesn't mean I trust the government to properly wield the power it has, however.

An reality you do not seem to like given your political view.

I neither like nor dislike it.

Well, here is the problem. You have a habit of contradicting yourself :



You see, A government is not only a reflection of the people wishes. But a government states laws for the few individuals that might not behave as a decent human being. A government performs many tasks. And sometimes centralization can have benefits.

Why are so very many laws and so many regulations required, though? Since there will always be a small minority of indecent people there is little to be gained by going through the work and expense of passing and enforcing laws beyond the basics of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

You think of utopias, because at one moment you say that people should be wise enough while at the moment before you say that people cannot become wise enough, there will always be a few that will cause problems. You admit problems will arise but you forget that usually innocent people pay the price.

There will always be victims, no matter how many laws and regulations are passed and enforced. There comes a point where the more laws we make to thwart the misdeeds of a small minority, the more unnecessary hurdles and obstacles everyone else must go through; the burden of regulation on the majority exceeds the benefit. We're definitely at that point on many issues right now.

You yourself admit that one person from another is different mentally and physically, yet you completely ignore the effects of what happens when you put people with different views together who do not want to cooperate. Just as the violence preaching political idiots. You need to learn to see with a broader view.

Cooperation depends on more than just passing laws and regulations. Cooperation can and does happen without them.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,750
2,334
126
Just seeing an update on the news, poor woman. That piece of shit needs to be hanged for what he's done to these innocent people.
 

bamacre

Lifer
Jul 1, 2004
21,029
2
61
That's sure as hell tyranny, but do you really think Beck, Palin, Bachmann, Angle, O'Donnel really care?

I honestly don't pay much attention to those people. Usually I may hear one thing or two that comes out of their mouth, and they get shut off. Then there's the right vs left drama that comes with those figures, and that's another reason to ignore. While there is nothing wrong with wanting to achieve success of your agenda over the opposition's, anyone who instigates the use of violence to achieve those means is guilty.
 

Pneumothorax

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2002
1,181
23
81
Just seeing an update on the news, poor woman. That piece of shit needs to be hanged for what he's done to these innocent people.

Sometimes I do pine for the days of the "Wild West", where this guy would've been dragged out of the courthouse and hanged before sundown.

It was heertbreaking too to hear the interview on the 9 -year old's mom. Can't believe she was born on 9-11-01.
 
May 11, 2008
20,141
1,149
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I honestly don't pay much attention to those people. Usually I may hear one thing or two that comes out of their mouth, and they get shut off. Then there's the right vs left drama that comes with those figures, and that's another reason to ignore. While there is nothing wrong with wanting to achieve success of your agenda over the opposition's, anyone who instigates the use of violence to achieve those means is guilty.

Very true to the last character.
I fully agree.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
24,155
10,840
136
I would join in on this conversation but find too much of it innapropriate for a thread that is supposed to be about people getting killed.


Lets lock this up and start an appropriate thread where people can discuss this stuff without sounding like douchebags...

As someone who is as guilty as anyone else in taking this thread off track, I agree.
 

wirednuts

Diamond Member
Jan 26, 2007
7,121
4
0
its being reported that she is conscious and communicating. this is VERY good news! she will be a hero now, just like in the movie MACHETE
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
I wish some of these whiners would come up with any of the visual, verbal examples that you easily are finding from the right.

I listen to a lot of progressive radio, the only personality that I know of that puts out hateful retoric is Mike Malloy, who I won't listen to.
I did in another worthless thread.

Here are some.


Az Congressional race ad for Hayworth/Mitchell

http://i54.tinypic.com/34ys6rb.jpg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XqB4tyvxWKA

Here is a "Snipers Wanted" bit "targeting" Bush in 2000....

http://xd6.xanga.com/058f530476c33252601817/w200655796.jpg

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/crime/kilborn-cbs-target-bush-0

Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee’s use of red and white bullseyes last year to target Republican incumbents.

http://www.postonpolitics.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/dccc-target-map.jpg

http://www.verumserum.com/media/2010/03/DLC-Targeting-map.gif

Daily Kos targets (Gifford IS ONE of them)

http://hillbuzz.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/screen-shot-2011-01-08-at-3-05-33-pm.png
 

Lanyap

Elite Member
Dec 23, 2000
8,181
2,221
136
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/09/jared-loughner-youtube-videos-_n_806370.html

Guy is associated with an anti-immigration hate group, liberal he is not...


"Is"?
From your article.

Jared Loughner YouTube Videos, MySpace Suggest Alleged Shooter May Have Ties To Hate Group

WASHINGTON -- Jared Lee Loughner, the alleged shooter of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and others on Saturday, may have ties to anti-Semitic, anti-immigration hate group American Renaissance, according to a leaked memo from the Department of Homeland Security.

It's unclear whether Loughner maintains a direct connection to the group, however, "strong suspicion is being directed" at American Renaissance in the wake of the group being referenced in Loughner's Myspace and YouTube videos, according to the memo, which was obtained by Fox News.
 
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Pneumothorax

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2002
1,181
23
81
its being reported that she is conscious and communicating. this is VERY good news! she will be a hero now, just like in the movie MACHETE

It sounds like the bullet went through and ravaged her Left Hemisphere. Hopefully her language centers survived as the majority of the population only have the ability to speak in the left hemisphere.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
24,155
10,840
136
its being reported that she is conscious and communicating. this is VERY good news! she will be a hero now, just like in the movie MACHETE

Saw it last night to cut the heaviness of the day. Once again over the top Rodrigez at his finest. One scene is over the top violent then the next has awesome eye candy!
 
May 11, 2008
20,141
1,149
126
Risk to others in terms of the risk of violating others' rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness is a valid consideration, but much of what I have a problem with using government to correct or prevent poses no risk to others.
I hear that broken record again. I do not hear arguments.

I don't believe in conspiracies, mainly because I do not believe the government is competent enough to pull one off. That doesn't mean I trust the government to properly wield the power it has, however.
But you believe someone or something is out there do you ?

I neither like nor dislike it.
I would say you do not like it then. Staying indifferent is just the same as not wanting to participant for whatever reason.

Why are so very many laws and so many regulations required, though? Since there will always be a small minority of indecent people there is little to be gained by going through the work and expense of passing and enforcing laws beyond the basics of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

Life is complex. I can remember times were i did not had to lock my bike, where i could leave my door open. Now it is not possible anymore. There is always a reason for it to happen. That does not mean that laws are not needed, it means that people not willing to comply to normal social behavior exist and have not accepted and adjusted yet.


There will always be victims, no matter how many laws and regulations are passed and enforced. There comes a point where the more laws we make to thwart the misdeeds of a small minority, the more unnecessary hurdles and obstacles everyone else must go through; the burden of regulation on the majority exceeds the benefit. We're definitely at that point on many issues right now.

You can write all you want, again the sole reason is to minimize the victims as much as possible. Not to make sure no one ever gets hurt again, because that would be an utopia. How wonderful it may be.


Cooperation depends on more than just passing laws and regulations. Cooperation can and does happen without them.
Cooperation happens in those cases that laws and regulations are not needed, by the use of contracts or silently agreed upon rules. As for example in a social structure. Again, you miss the whole point of why laws, legislations and advisories are needed. You do not understand anything of the social aspect of an society.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
24,155
10,840
136
That is good news.

Fortunately, the bullet only went through the left lobe and not both sides. It's a very good sign that she is communicating with the caveat that the left side controls speech and understanding speech.

My dad who recently passed away, had a heart attack while caring for my mother who had Alzheimers so she did not make a call to 911. Fortunately, a neighbor happened to come by, but we never really knew how long that was. Anyway, due to this, my dad suffered brain damage on the left side of his brain due to lack of oxygen. He spent the last 10 years of his life very frustrated due to his condition known as global aphasia. This rendered his ability to speak a difficult if not impossible task.
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
10,505
2
0
I hear that broken record again. I do not hear arguments.

Ditto.

But you believe someone or something is out there do you ?

No.

I would say you do not like it then. Staying indifferent is just the same as not wanting to participant for whatever reason.

.. says you.

Life is complex. I can remember times were i did not had to lock my bike, where i could leave my door open. Now it is not possible anymore. There is always a reason for it to happen. That does not mean that laws are not needed, it means that people not willing to comply to normal social behavior exist and have not accepted and adjusted yet.

Yes, life is indeed very complex.. and government is a very poor method of dealing with complexity. Some laws are needed, but not all of the ones we have in place today.. not by a long shot.

Let me ask you a question, even though I think I already know the answer. Do you believe that the current body of law and regulation, in its entirety, offers a benefit to society that outweighs its cost in terms of convenience, liberties of the majority, and money? Or do you believe, as I do, that we do not need all of the laws we have to achieve the same or better benefits?

You can write all you want, again the sole reason is to minimize the victims as much as possible. Not to make sure no one ever gets hurt again, because that would be an utopia. How wonderful it may be.

Minimizing the number of victims is not something government is good at.

Cooperation happens in those cases that laws and regulations are not needed, by the use of contracts or silently agreed upon rules. As for example in a social structure. Again, you miss the whole point of why laws, legislations and advisories are needed. You do not understand anything of the social aspect of an society.

Actually, yes, I do. Agreements between people are necessary for a society to function and to be free. Society needs these agreements and social structures much more than it needs a welfare, regulatory, and nanny-state government.
 
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