Connecticut School shooting!

[s0me0nesmind1]

Good points made on both sides.

More gun control is not going to solve this problem. The real problem is addressing mental health issues early on and making sure that all citizens in this country have access to quality health care and good social programs to curtail this kind of behavior.

That being said, it is FAR too easy for someone to obtain a high powered weapon these days. There HAS to be serious reform as a result of these shootings. Assault weapons should be outright banned, and there needs to be much stricter laws around who can obtain a gun. It's downright sickening what goes on at these gun shows and how easy it is for people to obtain weapons.

1) You say more gun control is not going to solve the problem
2) Next Paragraph: "That being said, it is FAR too easy for someone to obtain a high powered weapon these days. There HAS to be a serious reform..." LULZ
3) Assault Weapons are banned.
4) You are - yet another - complete liberal moron that thinks the answer to the problem is to shove more pills down people's throats

 

[Darwin333]

Maybe I'm wrong but weren't laws put in place to keep people from purchasing large amounts of fertilizer after this?

Edit: Looks like it was proposed but never passed (from what I can tell).

I am not a farmer nor a batshit crazy asshole that wishes to kill a bunch of people so I am honestly not sure but I think that the specific fertilizer (something nitrate) is sort of like psuedoephedrine in which you have to give an ID to purchase some and large purchases are flagged by the .gov. I am not sure so don't take that as gospel though.

My point is rather simple though, I have the knowledge to make something go "boom" from chemicals that I have under my sink. A quick google search will give you the same knowledge and since they have not yet been used to kill a bunch of people they aren't on whatever lists the .gov has. If I was batshit crazy and hellbent on killing a lot of people and had no gun, do you honestly think that I would just give up and all of a sudden and not be a batshit crazy asshole hellbent on killing a lot of people? Or do you think that I would seek out other methods of achieving my goals, methods that are potentially much worse than the one you banned?

 

[dmens]

Then by all means, go do them. Nobody is holding you to your keyboard....

You have your life. 20 kids and 7 adults don't today and they didn't have a choice in what they got to do with their time.

If you're going to cite the Butcher's Bill, governments with guns have slaughtered innocent civilians by the tens of millions. So if you're argue for a gun ban because of casualty numbers, go tell the governments and the police to toss theirs in the furnace. I'll follow suit.

 

[Darwin333]

But... but... if there was 1 armed guard, he would make like the action movies - like when he gets shot 40 times and twice to the skull - he will bairly roll over to get a shot in on the killer as he breathes his last breath! Right? RIGHT?!

LOL! I truly enjot the use of sarcasm in a debate and quite often do so myself.

A teacher with a small .38 might have saved quite a few lives in this case but as I outlined in a previous post I am not sure if I would have even been carrying it considering the circumstances.

One thing that I know for absolute fact is that "gun free zones" are absolute bullshit and have done nothing to save lives. Arguably, they have done the exact opposite.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

My wife just brought up an excellent idea....why doesn't the schools install a button similar to what banks use, that will lock down areas and notify authorities that help is needed immediately? Maybe sound an alarm while at it. It may have not helped but it surely wouldn't have hurt.

Interesting point - however, how do you do that at an elementary school where you walk from class to class to lunch to gym...without it being like a prison cell? I'm not saying it doesn't have potential. I'm guessing you mean something to the likes of pushing the button slams/locks all doors closed? So people that aren't in a class room are fucked?

 

[Darwin333]

Then by all means, go do them. Nobody is holding you to your keyboard....

You have your life. 20 kids and 7 adults don't today and they didn't have a choice in what they got to do with their time.

The 7 adults were never allowed to make a choice for themselves because the government declared where they work as a gun free zone. Funny how only law abiding folk actually follow laws isn't it?

And for the record, I am not saying the concealed carry would have made any difference in this situation. I am simply saying that it would have given one of the adults an option to make a difference. I would much prefer to have an option to sop something like this then none at all ANY day. If I chose not to exercise that option that is my choice, in this case the government chose for them. Unfortunately, the bad guy didn't really give a shit about the law yet here you are arguing for new laws that the future bad guys will care about......

 

[Engineer]

Interesting point - however, how do you do that at an elementary school where you walk from class to class to lunch to gym...without it being like a prison cell? I'm not saying it doesn't have potential. I'm guessing you mean something to the likes of pushing the button slams/locks all doors closed? So people that aren't in a class room are fucked?

I really wasn't thinking about locking down the school in the terms of inside doors, more outside doors, blaring alarms, flashing lights and immediate call for emergency personnel without the need for a 911 delay.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I really wasn't thinking about locking down the school in the terms of inside doors, more outside doors, blaring alarms, flashing lights and immediate call for emergency personnel without the need for a 911 delay.

Uhhh, by the time they push that button - something tells me the person with the gun will be inside... thus locking the doors outside would mean everyone is stuck inside

That would suck major balls to be stuck in the building with the killer.

 

[Retro Rob]

The 7 adults were never allowed to make a choice for themselves because the government declared where they work as a gun free zone. Funny how only law abiding folk actually follow laws isn't it?

And for the record, I am not saying the concealed carry would have made any difference in this situation. I am simply saying that it would have given one of the adults an option to make a difference. I would much prefer to have an option to sop something like this then none at all ANY day. If I chose not to exercise that option that is my choice, in this case the government chose for them. Unfortunately, the bad guy didn't really give a shit about the law yet here you are arguing for new laws that the future bad guys will care about......

People are tired of it having to come to that, especially when it comes to having your kids in a safe, clean, learning enviroment.

The day that school staff have to carry is the day I start homeschooling.

 

[Engineer]

Uhhh, by the time they push that button - something tells me the person with the gun will be inside... thus locking the doors outside would mean everyone is stuck inside

That would suck major balls to be stuck in the building with the killer.

Locking in terms of can't enter from outside but can still open from inside (i.e. like an Emergency door).

 

[rchiu]

Bottomline.

It's other people's sons and daughter that died and not those gun nuts' sons and daughter and those gun nuts are not going to give up their beloved toy and penis extension.

They are not even going to give up the access to high powered guns, large number of ammunition, or make the waiting period longer, or make background check more comprehensive and thorough.

Oh no, they said, they can't be bothered by the trouble, it's their toys and other people's life, and they will choose their toys and their fun everyday. They say it with straight face it's their right against some dictator like with today's election system, separation of state and military, they still need guns to fight against army of tanks, jets and nuclear war ahead. Please, we know those gun nuts are not too intelligent, but don't keep telling these shit like we are as dumb as they are.

And it's this kind of selfish act and idiotic justification that those gun nuts keep pushing that this great nation is going to see this type of tragedy year after year. How many mass gun shooting we had this year? I lost count. Nothing has been done and will be done. Guns will continue to fall into the wrong hand. People with shit life, mental problem, or just having a bad day with lots of alcohol is gonna to take advantage of this easy access to guns and ammunition that makes killing easy to take out their pain on someone else.

While people like that in the rest of the world have to rely on their bare hand, or just some knife and damage will be kept to the minimum. People like that in the US can easily take out 20, 30, 40, man, women and in the case yesterday, children, before they can be stopped or kill themselves.

This will keep happening. Because after all these shooting, not one single action has been taken. NRA has even make it easier to access gun and to take guns around everywhere.

The selfishness of those gun nuts is responsible for every single one of those gun violence. Their rush to defend themselves every time a mass shooting happened showed that they know it themselves. They can keep denying it, make up shit excuse and reasons thinking the rest of the world is as dumb as they are, but they know deep down in their heart, their hand has the blood of every single one of those beautiful 6 and 7 years old that died so unnecessarily.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

People are tired of it having to come to that, especially when it comes to having your kids in a safe, clean, learning enviroment.

The day that school staff have to carry is the day I start homeschooling.

Oh shut the fuck up. People walk the streets with concealed carry all the time, do you keep off the streets?

DUR HUR I'M MAKING THREATS ABOUT NEVER TAKING MY CHILD TO PUBLIC SCHOOL IF YOU DO X BECAUSE I DISAGREE AND AM ALWAYS RIGHT. REGARDLESS OF FACTUAL EVIDENCE.

 

[Engineer]

the bad guy didn't really give a shit about the law yet here you are arguing for new laws that the future bad guys will care about......

If that's the case, why have any laws against bad guys then? Obviously, if they are bad guys and disobey the law, they don't care about it (any of them) in the first place, right?

 

[exdeath]

Fuck me... pictures of the victims starting to circulate... I was dumb and clicked on them... sigh :'(

 

[dmens]

high powered guns, large number of ammunition

LOLWUT. Define high power. Or "large number of ammunition".

separation of state and military

Stopped reading after that. LOL.

By the way, two worst spree killers in history:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woo_Bum-kon
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Norway_attacks

The first is in a country where civilian ownership of guns is totally banned, the second is extremely heavily regulated. I wonder why people weren't going on about gun control after the Norway shootings.

The irony of someone condemning the penises of gun owners when he posts a nonsensical, emotional rant written by his mangina.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

If that's the case, why have any laws against bad guys then? Obviously, if they are bad guys and disobey the law, they don't care about it (any of them) in the first place, right?

Laws are there to define what someone who disobeys them will get. They don't deter the action from occurring

 

[Darwin333]

My wife just brought up an excellent idea....why doesn't the schools install a button similar to what banks use, that will lock down areas and notify authorities that help is needed immediately? Maybe sound an alarm while at it. It may have not helped but it surely wouldn't have hurt.

The schools in my area have the silent alarm buttons that banks have. To my knowledge, no normal banks actually automatically "lock down" anything once the silent alarm is hit (and my wife has worked in banking for well over a decade). There is simply WAY to much liability.

What happens if someone is in the doorway when the lockdown goes into effect? Does it just smash the fuck out of a person, if not then is it strong enough to keep the bad guy out? What happens if you lock people in with the bad guy offering the innocent people absolutely no escape and the police a more difficult time getting in (when they finally get there)?

I will tell you one thing that seems to be very common in the previous mass killings in the United States. The bad guy is almost ALWAYS done killing people by the time the police show up. That tells me that we need to have the people that are actually there at the time better able to stop the threat, how we achieve that in an elementary school setting I honestly don't know. As I have said numerous times, I wouldn't carry a gun in any sort of bag that I will not be in full control of into a place that I will be spending the entire day with very small children and that is how most women carry guns. I think that this is one of those times that there simply isn't an answer besides batshit crazy.

 

[Retro Rob]

Oh shut the fuck up. People walk the streets with concealed carry all the time, do you keep off the streets?

DUR HUR I'M MAKING THREATS ABOUT NEVER TAKING MY CHILD TO PUBLIC SCHOOL IF YOU DO X BECAUSE I DISAGREE AND AM ALWAYS RIGHT. REGARDLESS OF FACTUAL EVIDENCE.

I think you need to chill, seriously, and stop the stupid mouth frothing becasuse someone disagrees with you.

Why do people resort to asinine equivalencies to stress a stupid point? I don't expect to feel as safe walking down a street as I *should* dropping my kids off at school everyday.

Boy, why do you act so intolerant and stupid when someone disagrees with you?

Grow up...

 

[Darwin333]

If that's the case, why have any laws against bad guys then? Obviously, if they are bad guys and disobey the law, they don't care about it (any of them) in the first place, right?

Laws exist to punish bad guys after they break them. Nothing more.....

Just like the police, the don't actually stop crime from happening they simply find the bad guys AFTER it happened and bring them to justice. You can argue that the laws and cops prevent the bad guy from breaking laws in the future but it doesn't change the fact.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I think you need to chill, seriously, and stop to stupid mouth frothing becasuse someone disagrees with you.

Why do people resort to asinine equivalencies to stress a stupid point? I don't expect to feel as safe walking down a street as I *should* dropping my kids off at school everyday.

Boy, why do you act so intolerant and stupid when someone disagrees with you?

Grow up...

Because you're not going to take a single action That is why.

You will succumb to everything - yet still ignore facts that show a safer environment when people carry.

 

[Darwin333]

People are tired of it having to come to that, especially when it comes to having your kids in a safe, clean, learning enviroment.

The day that school staff have to carry is the day I start homeschooling.

How exactly do you propose to provide that "clean environment"?

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

How exactly do you propose to provide that "clean environment"?

A make-believe utopia with ponies and unicorns everywhere :whiste:

 

[Retro Rob]

Because you're not going to take a single action That is why.

You will succumb to everything - yet still ignore facts that show a safer environment when people carry.

Succomb to everything?

If staff have to start carrying guns (as people do on the street), then you're at a all-time high level of school being an unsafe learning environment. Would you opt to live in a neighborhood where carrying a gun was the mandatory order of the day?

I didn't think so. So why would I want my kids learning in such a place? Learn, think, grow up, dude...

 

[Darwin333]

I think you need to chill, seriously, and stop the stupid mouth frothing becasuse someone disagrees with you.

Why do people resort to asinine equivalencies to stress a stupid point? I don't expect to feel as safe walking down a street as I *should* dropping my kids off at school everyday.

Boy, why do you act so intolerant and stupid when someone disagrees with you?

Grow up...

must resist..... sarcastic comment...... about last debate......


lol, how goes it bud? Not the best of debates to be meeting as adversaries again but I hope all is well with you and your family.

 

[Darwin333]

Succomb to everything?

If staff have to start carrying guns (as people do on the street), then you're at a all-time high level of school being an unsafe learning environment. Would you opt to live in a neighborhood where carrying a gun was the mandatory order of the day?

I didn't think so. So why would I want my kids learning in such a place? Learn, think, grow up, dude...

Would you use a gun to protect the life of your child?

Would you purchase a gun with the intent on protecting the life of your child?

If the life of your child was threatened and moving simply wasn't an option, would you do the above?

You are a good and decent man, at least from what I can tell, Rob. I know you would do it but you wouldn't like it one damn bit. Its sort of the same situation here except they had no prior warning. How do you protect yourself and your family when you don't know a threat even exists?