Connecting to University internet, DHCP

[NarcoticHobo]

Originally posted by: spidey07
BUT I'M ENTITLED!!!!!

IT'S NOT FAIR!!!!

WAAAAAA!!!!!

Hat's off to your Uni for employing best practices for network security. Get used to it as the entire networking industry is moving to this model....don't comply, you don't talk. College camuses are the absolute worse in terms of difficult sense of entiltement, You can't tell me what to do, I know better than you, I'm smarter than you, I'm a special snowflake so your policy doesn't apply to me, you owe me. You get the picture.
:thumbsup:

Here's another tip. No woman your age wants to go back to your dorm room and have some fun. Move out of the dorms.

Once again you present no argument... a simple ad hominem attack. Also it seems you missed the part where the I said the network admins have no problem with me doing this.

Our uni actually provides apartment complexes for juniors and seniors, so I have my own room, which is better than a lot of college students who live on their own. Not to mention the uni requires everyone to live on campus except for 30% of seniors. So you have made a personal attack once again, with no grounds whatsoever.

Also I don't see how I am holding an "entitled attitude" I don't claim to be entitled just because, I present good reasons as to why this service should be provided. Namely 1) I paid for it 2) they don't give me the option of not paying for it 3) the policy was changed after committing payment 4) the policy is unreasonable given the wide variety of computer options available 5) the solution which I'm proposing has almost no cost to either party involved.

Also it matters not to the argument that you are an admin at another college, all I'm asking for is a reason why my proposition is not the best approach and what would be better.

I've been civil, so all I ask is the same in return, respond with an actual argument rather than calling names or telling me I am whining. I came here to try and fix the problem, not complain about it, your comments forced me to further explain my situation and eventually defend it.

 

[spidey07]

NarcoticHobo,

I'm sorry for being so harsh. I will try to help....

They're not going to immediately and completely change the policy. The security system they have in place is very complex and not easily changed. I suggest writing a letter calmly explaining your point, pointing out that xp64 will become more and more commonplace, and how you would like to become a beta tester in an effort to provide feedback.

That right there will get you very far. Don't e-mail. Send a letter. It will carry more weight. Follow normal blook business letter format. Be nice and offer solutions to your specific problem.

Secondly, make sure you call the support desk and provide the IP address of the DHCP server that is handing out addresses. It is possible that your floor has a "rogue DHCP server", but given that the UNI has put in place such good security it is highly unlikely. But in addition to your hard mail, send an e-mail with this information just incase that's what you are experiencing. Also from a security perspective they can force the switch to monitor DHCP transacations/mappings and disallow layer3 addresses that do not have a valid DHCP binding.....meaning you can't set your address.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: NarcoticHobo
Once again you present no argument... a simple ad hominem attack. Also it seems you missed the part where the I said the network admins have no problem with me doing this.

Our uni actually provides apartment complexes for juniors and seniors, so I have my own room, which is better than a lot of college students who live on their own. Not to mention the uni requires everyone to live on campus except for 30% of seniors. So you have made a personal attack once again, with no grounds whatsoever.

Also I don't see how I am holding an "entitled attitude" I don't claim to be entitled just because, I present good reasons as to why this service should be provided. Namely 1) I paid for it 2) they don't give me the option of not paying for it 3) the policy was changed after committing payment 4) the policy is unreasonable given the wide variety of computer options available 5) the solution which I'm proposing has almost no cost to either party involved.

Also it matters not to the argument that you are an admin at another college, all I'm asking for is a reason why my proposition is not the best approach and what would be better.

I've been civil, so all I ask is the same in return, respond with an actual argument rather than calling names or telling me I am whining. I came here to try and fix the problem, not complain about it, your comments forced me to further explain my situation and eventually defend it.

OK, I take it back.

You feel you are entitled and are a special snowflake to whom the rules don't apply.

you aren't entitled to jack crap. good luck.

entitlement mentality for the freakin' loss. You are whining. You want everybody else to bend to your entitlement mentality. It's not going to happen.

 

[NarcoticHobo]

Originally posted by: spidey07
NarcoticHobo,

I'm sorry for being so harsh. I will try to help....

They're not going to immediately and completely change the policy. The security system they have in place is very complex and not easily changed. I suggest writing a letter calmly explaining your point, pointing out that xp64 will become more and more commonplace, and how you would like to become a beta tester in an effort to provide feedback.

That right there will get you very far. Don't e-mail. Send a letter. It will carry more weight. Follow normal blook business letter format. Be nice and offer solutions to your specific problem.

Secondly, make sure you call the support desk and provide the IP address of the DHCP server that is handing out addresses. It is possible that your floor has a "rogue DHCP server", but given that the UNI has put in place such good security it is highly unlikely. But in addition to your hard mail, send an e-mail with this information just incase that's what you are experiencing. Also from a security perspective they can force the switch to monitor DHCP transacations/mappings and disallow layer3 addresses that do not have a valid DHCP binding.....meaning you can't set your address.

Thank you for the change in attitude. I've actually talked to them in person, we are a small uni so it is all local and easily walked to.

What resulted from these talks is that there will be a 64-bit version of antivirus coming out which they will provide us with in the coming months, but until then I have no way of connecting other than the downgrade path. They didn't have an immediate solution for what I should do but when I found the workaround they were of a sort of "Don't ask don't tell" policy where they didn't mind me doing it as long as I didn't share it around. This was all at the beginning of last semester though, and this semester it looks like they have forced the switch to monitor DHCP.

At this point I have manually supplied the DNS which gets me to a very restricted internet called bradford remediation. I can access anything except for online apps in this mode.

I set up a call with the network admin before I posted this and he should call me before the week is out to help solve the problem, but expecting the same as last semester I was trying to go ahead and get it knocked out.

What I have figured out so far though is that there is a certain DHCP server which takes care of unregistered machines and assigns their restricted network stats with an IP of *.*.104.8 and that there are at least two other DHCP servers which hand out non-restricted IP statistics.

 

[spidey07]

Narcotic...

You are being placed into a guest or remediation network. This allows you to gain access to things to "fix your stuff". There is nothing you can do to get around this outside of hard core packet manipulation which if they did it right won't work. This remediation network is normally tightly firewalled to only allows EXACTLY what you need to get into compliance and nothing else.

You can probably get a copy of XP for cheap from your UNI. If it is small they may not have the strength in network security to act quickly to support xp64. And quite honestly a few students complaining does not dictate a change in policy.

 

[NarcoticHobo]

OK, I take it back.

You feel you are entitled and are a special snowflake to whom the rules don't apply.

you aren't entitled to jack crap. good luck.

entitlement mentality for the freakin' loss. You are whining. You want everybody else to bend to your entitlement mentality. It's not going to happen.

I still fail to see how i think I am entitled... I understand why they set broad rules for people to comply to, but I also don't see the problem with my case. There are exceptions to every rule as I'm sure you know. If I was expecting them to change their entire policy for me I would see your point, but I am not. Hell if they had a problem with me circumventing I probably would just bite the bullet and downgrade, but they don't.

If you wish to keep saying I feel entitled all you have to do is explain why I should not be allowed to use the internet in my situation, and "because its their policy" is not a valid answer, actually give me a reason why its A) a valid policy B) it applies to my case and C) what is a better solution than circumvention.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: NarcoticHobo
If you wish to keep saying I feel entitled all you have to do is explain why I should not be allowed to use the internet in my situation, and "because its their policy" is not a valid answer, actually give me a reason why its A) a valid policy B) it applies to my case and C) what is a better solution than circumvention.

Because it's their policy is a totally valid answer.

A) It's a private network owned by the UNI, they control it. Don't like it? Use another network. Similar to why you can't call 900 numbers from a campus phone system
b) It applies to your case because you want special exemption to security.
c) A better solution is to use another network.

You have a choice. You do NOT have a right. You are NOT entitled.

 

[NarcoticHobo]

Originally posted by: spidey07
Narcotic...

You are being placed into a guest or remediation network. This allows you to gain access to things to "fix your stuff". There is nothing you can do to get around this outside of hard core packet manipulation which if they did it right won't work. This remediation network is normally tightly firewalled to only allows EXACTLY what you need to get into compliance and nothing else.

You can probably get a copy of XP for cheap from your UNI. If it is small they may not have the strength in network security to act quickly to support xp64. And quite honestly a few students complaining does not dictate a change in policy.

Remediation... but only sort of. Allowing completely automatic IP config puts me into this network, where it is tightly firewalled and all I can access is the stuff to fix it (antivirus, security app). By specifying my DNS server to the one used by registered computers (ones with full access) I am able to get outside of this realm, but it is still connecting through it. When I do pathping I see that somehow my connection is going through the remediation server and accessing the outside web.

Also XP home from uni is $130.

I still highly resent being told I am whining, I am attempting to solve the problem on many fronts. I am talking to network admins, fellow techies, and trying to find access on my own accord. These are free methods so I am trying to exhaust these first because as a college student I do not have a lot of resources.

 

[NarcoticHobo]

Because it's their policy is a totally valid answer.

A) It's a private network owned by the UNI, they control it. Don't like it? Use another network. Similar to why you can't call 900 numbers from a campus phone system
b) It applies to your case because you want special exemption to security.
c) A better solution is to use another network.

You have a choice. You do NOT have a right. You are NOT entitled.

A) A private university effectively owned by the students attending it.
B) Once again, the network admin here doesn't care if I circumvent.
C) I would gladly use another network if it were possible, but they require me to live on campus, and require everyone on campus to use their network. There has actually been a large group who wanted to be able to get another option on the network for the uni, but this was denied.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: NarcoticHobo
A) A private university effectively owned by the students attending it.
B) Once again, the network admin here doesn't care if I circumvent.
C) I would gladly use another network if it were possible, but they require me to live on campus, and require everyone on campus to use their network. There has actually been a large group who wanted to be able to get another option on the network for the uni, but this was denied.

Entitlement.

You don't own crap of a uni's network. It is a private network owned, funded and operated by them.

You aren't entitled to jack crap. Learn this lesson early.

WHAT?? You have plenty of options of another network if you don't like this policy. There's dial-up, there's cell, there's satellite, plenty of options. You just don't want to use them. you are NOT entitled.

 

[NarcoticHobo]

Entitlement.

You don't own crap of a uni's network. It is a private network owned, funded and operated by them.

You aren't entitled to jack crap. Learn this lesson early.

WHAT?? You have plenty of options of another network if you don't like this policy. There's dial-up, there's cell, there's satellite, plenty of options. You just don't want to use them. you are NOT entitled.

No... on our bill for uni there is a charge for the network specifically. The university is funded by student tuitions and grants from allumni completely. We do own a part of the network.

Also let me reiterate: there are no other options. We can't use the uni phone line to get dial-up, we aren't allowed to install satellites in our apartment. I suppose I could use cell, but the bill for that would be absolutely tremendous, and I can't afford to pay it.

Once again simplifying this for you:

WE MUST LIVE ON CAMPUS.

IF WE LIVE ON CAMPUS WE MUST USE THEIR INTERNET.

THE ADMINS OF OUR NETWORK DO NOT CARE IF I CIRCUMVENT.

If my options are to do something which conforms with policy but costs me greatly, or do something which breaks policy when the people responsible for the policy genuinely don't care about me breaking it. Why oh why is it the right thing for me to do put my self out so much to comply with a rule which is trite in nature.

Frankly I feel my course of action would be supportable had they not given me consent, but I strongly urge you to see that with their consent there is no reason for me to do otherwise.

Edit: reading your responses it seems that you read half of my sentences and go ahead and respond, I see no reason why you would exclaim that there are plenty of options if you had read my entire post earlier which explained we have no way of obtaining outside internet other than through the uni.

 

[spidey07]

WTF!!!

Your university is preventing you from getting a cell phone?

You are not entitled. Interner service is not a right. You are NOT entitled. Don't like it? Use something else.

Sorry bud, you're like every other college student. You believe it is your RIGHT to Internet. You feel you are entitled. You are not. You take what you get or you go get something else. If you don't like it there are plenty of other unis out there.

 

[NarcoticHobo]

Originally posted by: spidey07
WTF!!!

Your university is preventing you from getting a cell phone?

You are not entitled. Interner service is not a right. You are NOT entitled. Don't like it? Use something else.

Sorry bud, you're like every other college student. You believe it is your RIGHT to Internet. You feel you are entitled. You are not. You take what you get or you go get something else. If you don't like it there are plenty of other unis out there.

Dude the internet is not a right, I am paying the university to provide internet... why can't i expect that they do?

And still, you never respond to the point that they are okay with me circumventing, if they don't care why do you?

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: NarcoticHobo
Dude the internet is not a right, I am paying the university to provide internet... why can't i expect that they do?

And still, you never respond to the point that they are okay with me circumventing, if they don't care why do you?

Mainly because it is your attitude that allows me to sell my services. The more I learn about the enemy and the more I learn about their ways the better I can stop them.

 

[NarcoticHobo]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: NarcoticHobo
Dude the internet is not a right, I am paying the university to provide internet... why can't i expect that they do?

And still, you never respond to the point that they are okay with me circumventing, if they don't care why do you?

Mainly because it is your attitude that allows me to sell my services. The more I learn about the enemy and the more I learn about their ways the better I can stop them.

How does that answer either of my questions?

Also my gf wanted me to let you know she is laughing at you right now. (yay my first ad hominem)

 

[spidey07]

Fine. You are paying the uni to provide you Internet. All providers come with policies. You don't agree with them. So go find another provider.

It's like every year. College kids complain about not getting their Internet when they don't abide by the rules. Every year. Year over year. Same story, different year, different poster.

 

[NarcoticHobo]

Originally posted by: spidey07
Fine. You are paying the uni to provide you Internet. All providers come with policies. You don't agree with them. So go find another provider.

It's like every year. College kids complain about not getting their Internet when they don't abide by the rules. Every year. Year over year. Same story, different year, different poster.

Even though they say that I can break this policy, the policy they are responsible for, I am supposed to go out of my way to find another provider?

Not to mention the only way to get another provider would be to leave university, and frankly I'd rather go without internet than change schools my junior year.

So in summation: The people who make and enforce the rules said I can break them...

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: NarcoticHobo

Originally posted by: spidey07
Fine. You are paying the uni to provide you Internet. All providers come with policies. You don't agree with them. So go find another provider.

It's like every year. College kids complain about not getting their Internet when they don't abide by the rules. Every year. Year over year. Same story, different year, different poster.

Even though they say that I can break this policy, the policy they are responsible for, I am supposed to go out of my way to find another provider?

Not to mention the only way to get another provider would be to leave university, and frankly I'd rather go without internet than change schools my junior year.

So in summation: The people who make and enforce the rules said I can break them...

blah, blah, blah...I'm entitled.

 

[NarcoticHobo]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: NarcoticHobo

Originally posted by: spidey07
Fine. You are paying the uni to provide you Internet. All providers come with policies. You don't agree with them. So go find another provider.

It's like every year. College kids complain about not getting their Internet when they don't abide by the rules. Every year. Year over year. Same story, different year, different poster.

Even though they say that I can break this policy, the policy they are responsible for, I am supposed to go out of my way to find another provider?

Not to mention the only way to get another provider would be to leave university, and frankly I'd rather go without internet than change schools my junior year.

So in summation: The people who make and enforce the rules said I can break them...

blah, blah, blah...I'm entitled.

Yes, cover your ears and sing and the logic will just go away.

I try very hard not to attack people, but for your own good you should know you are a very rude and pretentious person.

I ask if you purchase a movie from bestbuy and they take it from you as you are walking out the door citing that their policy changed between the time you bought it and the time you got to the door, would you find this fair?

Regardless it doesn't matter I suppose, I'm done with this conversation, I can't be bothered anymore. Adieu.

 

[dphantom]

Originally posted by: NarcoticHobo

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: NarcoticHobo

Originally posted by: spidey07
Fine. You are paying the uni to provide you Internet. All providers come with policies. You don't agree with them. So go find another provider.

It's like every year. College kids complain about not getting their Internet when they don't abide by the rules. Every year. Year over year. Same story, different year, different poster.

Even though they say that I can break this policy, the policy they are responsible for, I am supposed to go out of my way to find another provider?

Not to mention the only way to get another provider would be to leave university, and frankly I'd rather go without internet than change schools my junior year.

So in summation: The people who make and enforce the rules said I can break them...

blah, blah, blah...I'm entitled.

Yes, cover your ears and sing and the logic will just go away.

I try very hard not to attack people, but for your own good you should know you are a very rude and pretentious person.

I ask if you purchase a movie from bestbuy and they take it from you as you are walking out the door citing that their policy changed between the time you bought it and the time you got to the door, would you find this fair?

Regardless it doesn't matter I suppose, I'm done with this conversation, I can't be bothered anymore. Adieu.

Your analogy is completely false. With the movie, you have bought it so now YOU OWN it. With Internet access, you are paying for the priviledge of accessing a private network under the terms of a contract. That contract can be changed by the OWNERS of the network - NOT you, at a time and under circumstances of the owners choosing - NOT yours.

You have no entitlement to anything. You have chosen to run an OS not supported by the university. The university is providing access to their network under the terms and conditions they are currently able to provide for the vast majority of students. If they are like most IT departments, they have neither the time nor staff to deal with special cases.