Core M is available but no Anandtech review? Seems strange.

[Hulk]

Over the last 20 or so years we've had a familiar pattern here at Anandtech when it comes time for a new CPU release. There would generally be an architectural "deep dive" anywhere from 6 months to a year before the official release of the part and then a full review upon lifting of the NDA and actual release.

But not with Broadwell and it seems kind of weird how it's going down.

First, no "deep dive" on Anandtech regarding the new architecture/process. Not that this is the fault of Anandtech, there have been some blurbs about the process and efficiency and skus, but not the normal long architectural review for Broadwell.

Then instead of a release date there is no news but there are some laptops that have been available with Broadwell (Core M) for quite a while now. I'm talking specifically about the Lenovo Yoga Pro 3. There are some reviews out there, but not an Anandtech review. Plus those reviews don't really show the full Broadwell capability because it seems the new Yoga is throttling pretty badly with Core M.

I don't know, maybe it's me but this sequence is really out of the ordinary for a new CPU release from Intel? It really does feel like the door is closing on desktop processors in a way.

 

[witeken]

Anand left AT a few months ago, so who would do the deep dives anyway?

 

[hawtdawg]

There is no way to get a good review of it right now. It's only in a handful of ultrabooks, and the only way it can be judged currently, is how it does in those applications, which are extremely limited in their cooling/TDP capabilities.

 

[liahos1]

i feel like a lot of stuff has changed.

delayed reviews on apple products, no deep dives on intel products etc. I'm sure the team is hitting their stride and figuring out what they want to prioritize. i have faith

 

[Phynaz]

You could buy them a Broadwell Ultrabook. I'm sure they would be happy to review it

 

[Hulk]

They have at least a few guys that can do the deep CPU dives. No worries there.

Strange that a new generation CPU just appears in ultrabooks with no official release to reviewers isn't it? It's almost like Intel wants it out there to advertise better efficiency but doesn't want it really investigated/compared or something.

Don't they usually send processors/systems to reviewers first before releasing a product for general sales? The reviewers do their review and then release it when the NDA is lifted. That's what I thought anyway.

 

[NTMBK]

Given that nobody has published a review, there's probably an embargo in place. Hopefully we'll see a bunch of reviews all at once in a week or two.

 

[frozentundra123456]

Anand's has not been exactly prompt with reviews lately. It is troubling though that reviews are not more forthcoming. As for the formfactor, as long as the chip has been delayed, I should think even the first devices to come out would have near optimal TDP/cooling configurations. Could be wrong, but I dont think this bodes well for performance. In any case I am more interested in the higher TDP chips anyway. These ultra slim devices are nice, but too expensive for the performance you get, unless maybe for a business that wants something really cool looking for a sales person who does only light usage.

 

[tential]

Anand's has not been exactly prompt with reviews lately. It is troubling though that reviews are not more forthcoming. As for the formfactor, as long as the chip has been delayed, I should think even the first devices to come out would have near optimal TDP/cooling configurations. Could be wrong, but I dont think this bodes well for performance. In any case I am more interested in the higher TDP chips anyway. These ultra slim devices are nice, but too expensive for the performance you get, unless maybe for a business that wants something really cool looking for a sales person who does only light usage.

The foreign sites are doing far better with reviews/promptness now. Even wtih the Omega Catalyst review, the best review I read was from a German site I believe.

 

[North01]

There is no way to get a good review of it right now. It's only in a handful of ultrabooks, and the only way it can be judged currently, is how it does in those applications, which are extremely limited in their cooling/TDP capabilities.

Based on what I've heard so far, the Dell Venue 11 Pro 7140 (5Y10) would be a good candidate for a review.

 

[exar333]

Re-posting from a different thread, but relevant here:

You are just talking out of your a$$. Please post a link to support your claim.

The best review of the Core M I can find looks pretty good actually. 8% more battery life, with a 22% smaller battery! You are getting ~80% of the performance with only 1/3 the TDP. That looks pretty promising. If 'mature' 14nm is coming, then Broadwell looks pretty awesome. Efficiency looks great, especially considering the first released version is the most efficient one!

How high clocks will go and all that is still up in the air. We should know more when we see some official Core M reviews and/or more products released.

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Process...ng-Broadwell-Y

 

[witeken]

I think (am quite sure) we will get the Broadwell (architecture + Gen8) deep dive together with the Broadwell-K review in ~July.

 

[frozentundra123456]

I think (am quite sure) we will get the Broadwell (architecture + Gen8) deep dive together with the Broadwell-K review in ~July.

That doesnt make any sense. Why wait that long, and anyway they are two completely different markets. Surely Anand's has enough manpower to do a review before then. They seem to be able to review SSDs, phones, NUC formfactors, etc. and a host of other things. Why not the latest cpu on a brand new process?

 

[Ryan Smith]

That doesnt make any sense. Why wait that long, and anyway they are two completely different markets. Surely Anand's has enough manpower to do a review before then.

You'll see a review well before then.

The limiting factor right now is review samples. Core M devices are only now becoming available, and a number of devices aren't even available until next year. And since these are complete devices and not just a chip, we have to go through laptop OEMs rather than Intel, which adds an extra wrinkle.

There are a few options we're looking at. Though I still have my eye set on a specific device if we can get a review sample.

 

[krumme]

Cool. As bw seems very dependant on implementation (eg regarding throtling) perhaps comparing 2 different designs?

 

[Ryan Smith]

Cool. As bw seems very dependant on implementation (eg regarding throtling) perhaps comparing 2 different designs?

That's part of what we want to do if we can pull it off.

 

[NTMBK]

Would love it if you could compare the Haswell and Broadwell Venue 11!

 

[frozentundra123456]

You'll see a review well before then.

The limiting factor right now is review samples. Core M devices are only now becoming available, and a number of devices aren't even available until next year. And since these are complete devices and not just a chip, we have to go through laptop OEMs rather than Intel, which adds an extra wrinkle.

There are a few options we're looking at. Though I still have my eye set on a specific device if we can get a review sample.

Thanks for the information. Will be very interested in the results, although like I said earlier, I am not really in the market for one of these devices if they are as expensive as I expect.

 

[witeken]

Thanks for the information. Will be very interested in the results, although like I said earlier, I am not really in the market for one of these devices if they are as expensive as I expect.

I don't know what you are expecting, but the Dell Venue 11 isn't as bad as the Yoga Pro 3: http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/dell-venue-11-pro-7000-7140/pd. I also think the prices of Core M might become somewhat cheaper in 2015 once Intel's yields become better and 14nm is ramping at high volume.

That doesnt make any sense. Why wait that long, and anyway they are two completely different markets. Surely Anand's has enough manpower to do a review before then. They seem to be able to review SSDs, phones, NUC formfactors, etc. and a host of other things. Why not the latest cpu on a brand new process?

Ryan told me that they would do a Gen8 deep dive with Broadwell-K, so doing the Broadwell architecture deep dive at the same time (like the also did with Haswell, IB,...) doesn't seem too illogical. I didn't mean that we wouldn't get a Broadwell review before then: there will be plenty of fanless and 15W 14nm tablets and notebooks before then.

You'll see a review well before then.

The limiting factor right now is review samples. Core M devices are only now becoming available, and a number of devices aren't even available until next year. And since these are complete devices and not just a chip, we have to go through laptop OEMs rather than Intel, which adds an extra wrinkle.

There are a few options we're looking at. Though I still have my eye set on a specific device if we can get a review sample.

Great.

 

[Danrr]

I think that Broadwell has not been fully released, as many said there are just a bunch of ultrabooks with the new CPU.

We will have to wait until the new generation gets a desktop release.

 

[Hulk]

You'll see a review well before then.

The limiting factor right now is review samples. Core M devices are only now becoming available, and a number of devices aren't even available until next year. And since these are complete devices and not just a chip, we have to go through laptop OEMs rather than Intel, which adds an extra wrinkle.

There are a few options we're looking at. Though I still have my eye set on a specific device if we can get a review sample.

If possible it would be great to see some thermally unconstrained benchmark results, ie no throttling, as well as what the CPU actually does in the supplied system under thermal constraints. Perhaps you guys could open the system and apply a heatsink/fan or something so the CPU can run "wide open" through the benches. Just to see what it can do without thermal limitations. It would be nice to isolate the CPU for comparison purposes.

 

[positivedoppler]

Yeah what's the hold up.

 

[Qwertilot]

Look at the reply just above

There is also fundamentally no point reviewing this as a chip in and of itself, because it isn't being sold like that and performance seems very variable depending on the device they put it in. So they need devices to review.

Not even sure running one wide open on a bench top would really make sense - it'd presumably then happily turbo up a long way all the time.

 

[Denithor]

"Wide open" benches would give an idea of what to expect from desktop chips that won't have thermal throttling issues. The point would be, these would be available to review before the desktop reviews come out, basically giving a "sneak peak" at desktop before the NDAs lift and/or actual review samples are sent for evaluation.

 

[Hulk]

"Wide open" benches would give an idea of what to expect from desktop chips that won't have thermal throttling issues. The point would be, these would be available to review before the desktop reviews come out, basically giving a "sneak peak" at desktop before the NDAs lift and/or actual review samples are sent for evaluation.

Exactly. The benches that are floating around the web right now are pretty sketchy. It's hard to know the frequency the CPU was running at during the bench, or even if it was changing during the tests. Hit max frequency, then throttling (cooling off), maxing out again, etc... Impossible to get an idea of Broadwell IPC under those conditions.