Cryptocoin Mining?

Page 267 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

harobikes333

Platinum Member
Sep 18, 2005
2,385
7
81
daily-page.com
You are in the same boat as me. I pay a little more (.07kWh), but typically use 750kWh a month during the fall and winter and double during the summer. We have an AMI meter and I was comparing charts from a day we were out of town to yesterday and the additional load may had $15/month at the most.

You're paying between 2.3 and 5.3 cents per kWh, that is ridiculously cheap to the point of being almost free compared to the rest of the world.

Yes its worth it. If you already have radeons, set them to work. Otherwise you can decide to invest $$ to buy coins or invest $$ to buy more radeons to mine, up to you to read into the pros and cons of each move.

Thanks for the replies I was just curious... I realize it's pretty much too late in the game to make any kind of serious money. More so just curious
 

nwo

Platinum Member
Jun 21, 2005
2,309
0
71
wemineltc.com down for anyone else? It seems like their site and stratum servers are both down right now
 

AnonymouseUser

Diamond Member
May 14, 2003
9,943
107
106
Is there a way to restart display driver without full system reset? I my driver sometimes crashes when I quit by pressing 'x' icon, or after long 20 intensity mining session I try to do something. When it recovers by itself I loose quite a bit on hashrate.

Start > right-click Computer > Manage



Device Manager > Display Adapter > GPU > Disable



Screen should blank and recover to lower resolution, then re-enable it:

Device Manager > Display Adapter > GPU > Enable
 

philipma1957

Golden Member
Jan 8, 2012
1,714
0
76
@Imouto

There you go again. Trying to predict the next difficulty based on few hours of data.
Remember how that ended the last time




180 days? LOL
GPU LTC mining has excellent chances of going dodo in 2-3 months.

why do you think it will go asic in 3 months?

I think it will last until april just for the free heat it offers.
 

suklee

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
4,585
10
81
Basic (and possibly stupid) question, how do I know which video card is which in cgminer? Is there a way to order them like they show up in Catalyst Control Center / MSI Afterburner, with the primary card always as GPU0 (seated in the 'top' PCI-E slot) and the other card as GPU1?
 

relztes

Junior Member
Apr 19, 2009
8
0
0
Hey guys, I live in ND and currently pay the following for electricity:
Rate:
Basic Service Charge: $0.35 per day

Energy Charge:
October – May:
First 750 Kwh per month 5.304¢ per Kwh
Over 750 Kwh per month 2.304¢ per Kwh
June – September: 5.304¢ per Kwh

I currently don't have a mining machine... would it be "worth" getting into? Just curious

I've looked into calculators.. but they're a bit over my head as I haven't read up too much on the whole mining process.

Electric Supplier : http://www.montana-dakota.com/docs/default-source/rates-tariffs/NDElectric10
You have cheap electricity, but it's not quite that cheap. You're forgetting a "Fuel and Purchased Power" rate of 2.758¢ per Kwh (2.087 base + 0.671 adjustment) and a transmission adjustment of 0.030¢ per Kwh, plus possibly some taxes which I couldn't find. So the rate is 5.092 to 8.092¢ per Kwh + tax depending on season and usage. My rate in Atlanta is 9.4 to 16.1¢ per Kwh, so you've got me beat by a long shot.
 
Feb 19, 2009
10,457
10
76
Or alternatively have 0 value, there are plenty of opinionated people (granted a lot can be seen through the color of their gpu sadly).

The risks are high.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulip_mania

Except the trends over the past few years have shown otherwise, its going up longterm. There's no real reliable prediction, if there were, whoever knows it would be billionaires. We can only work with trends and global events.

Which is why statements such as fisher's is idiotic because there's no excellent chance of anything since he has no clue.
 

blastingcap

Diamond Member
Sep 16, 2010
6,654
5
76
The trends over the past few years have shown that mining is 10+ times less efficient than simply buying coins outright, while offering very little protection if the coins go to zero due to all the hardware depreciation and electricity costs involved with mining. Not to mention babysitting miners to restart them if they crash, if the power goes out, etc., and replacing burned out PSUs/GPUs/etc.

I did a back of the envelope analysis in another thread where Silver claimed that if you bought something like 8 high-end GPUs at the beginning of the year that it would have produced 50k LTC. Assuming typical USA electric prices, the cost of the GPUs, CPUs, mobos, RAM, etc. + the power costs would have totaled about $7.5k for 2013. 50k LTC for $7.5k sounds pretty good, until you consider that if you had simply bought $7.5k worth of LTC at the beginning of the year, you would have 714k LTC. Or put another way, rather than spending $7.5k in mining and power costs and dealing with mining headaches, you could have gotten similar results by simply buying $750 worth of LTC at the beginning of the year.

"But it's riskier to buy coins than to mine" some people claim. That's not necessarily true and in fact it's often false. If litecoins had gone to zero, the guy who bought $750 in January 2013 would lose $750. The miner would have lost between $500 and $5500 depending on exactly when litecoin went to zero. $500 loss = if the coin went to zero value almost immediately, so that the miner doesn't really lose anything on electricity costs, but then has to return or resell all that equipment, probably for a loss (let's say $500 in losses; if the coin crashes, so does demand for mining equipment). $5500 loss = if LTC crashed at the end of the year, after 12 months of power bills and equipment depreciation. The breakeven point would probably be around 2-3 weeks of mining--at that point, both the guy who mined and the guy who bought $750 worth, are both going to lose about $750. Anything beyond that, and the miner would lose more money.

In conclusion, if you think a coin won't go to zero in the next 3 weeks and might go up, then buy it instead of mining it, because you will likely get at least 10 times more profit that way (this has held true for every year that BTC has existed--it's always been more profitable to buy coins directly than to mine). If you think that a coin will go to zero within 3 weeks, then mining is better than buying the coin directly, but in such a case, why are you even buying/mining at all? Just stay away from it. If you can justify mining some other way, like if you were going to buy a GPU anyway or whatever, that lessens the risk of mining because you were going to game on the card anyway. But once you start to buy more GPU power than you would normally buy, you are going to start losing out to the people who simply bought coins directly.

And always remember, all of this stuff is extremely risky so treat it like gambling and don't ever put more money into it than you can afford to lose.

P.S. for the people responding, I already covered your issues in this post except for coin-hopping. Re: hopping from coin to coin, all coins go up and down depending on what bitcoin does. Like precious metals being led around by gold (if gold goes up or down it tends to drag silver with it), there is a clear leader and that is bitcoin. If bitcoin goes up, it drags everything else up, and if goes down to zero, all the rest of the currencies will go to near-zero or zero as well.
 
Last edited:

3DVagabond

Lifer
Aug 10, 2009
11,951
204
106
The trends over the past few years have shown that mining is 10+ times less efficient than simply buying coins outright, while offering very little protection if the coins go to zero due to all the hardware depreciation and electricity costs involved with mining. Not to mention babysitting miners to restart them if they crash, if the power goes out, etc., and replacing burned out PSUs/GPUs/etc.

I did a back of the envelope analysis in another thread where Silver claimed that if you bought something like 8 high-end GPUs at the beginning of the year that it would have produced 50k LTC. Assuming typical USA electric prices, the cost of the GPUs, CPUs, mobos, RAM, etc. + the power costs would have totaled about $7.5k for 2013. 50k LTC for $7.5k sounds pretty good, until you consider that if you had simply bought $7.5k worth of LTC at the beginning of the year, you would have 714k LTC. Or put another way, rather than spending $7.5k in mining and power costs and dealing with mining headaches, you could have gotten similar results by simply buying $750 worth of LTC at the beginning of the year.

"But it's riskier to buy coins than to mine" some people claim. That's not necessarily true and in fact it's often false. If litecoins had gone to zero, the guy who bought $750 in January 2013 would lose $750. The miner would have lost between $500 and $5500 depending on exactly when litecoin went to zero. $500 loss = if the coin went to zero value almost immediately, so that the miner doesn't really lose anything on electricity costs, but then has to return or resell all that equipment, probably for a loss (let's say $500 in losses; if the coin crashes, so does demand for mining equipment). $5500 loss = if LTC crashed at the end of the year, after 12 months of power bills and equipment depreciation. The breakeven point would probably be around 2-3 weeks of mining--at that point, both the guy who mined and the guy who bought $750 worth, are both going to lose about $750. Anything beyond that, and the miner would lose more money.

In conclusion, if you think a coin won't go to zero in the next 3 weeks and might go up, then buy it instead of mining it, because you will likely get at least 10 times more profit that way (this has held true for every year that BTC has existed--it's always been more profitable to buy coins directly than to mine). If you think that a coin will go to zero within 3 weeks, then mining is better than buying the coin directly, but in such a case, why are you even buying/mining at all? Just stay away from it. If you can justify mining some other way, like if you were going to buy a GPU anyway or whatever, that lessens the risk of mining because you were going to game on the card anyway. But once you start to buy more GPU power than you would normally buy, you are going to start losing out to the people who simply bought coins directly.

And always remember, all of this stuff is extremely risky so treat it like gambling and don't ever put more money into it than you can afford to lose.





What about buying a video card or two to game with and making a few grand off of them? Better than all of the same expenses and getting nothing in return.
 
Feb 19, 2009
10,457
10
76

You have to factor in that the mining rig can move onto newer more lucrative altcoins once a particular one you were mining goes bust. If you were to buy coins outright and it suddenly crash on you, you are screwed.

Hardware is still useful even when the coin is worthless. Buying a bunch of worthless coins = pure loss.

I'm not talking dudes who setup 69 x 7950s, I'm talking small scale, 5 to 10 GPUs in the garage. Or heck, 5-10 GPUs (open air design, not noisy) in the house if you live in a cold climate, its heating the house and making $$, rather than buying a heater that costs $$ to run.

You may think mining is as risky as buying, but we have to disagree. Small scale mining is next to zero risk, given how quick it is to set it up to different coins. There's even pools where they automatically select the most profitable coin to mine for you, at any given time. Once all said and done, R290s on ebay will fly off the shelf at $350 each, so think about that.

Edit: OBVIOUSLY buying coins outright has always have the potential to earn much higher rewards. Like most things in life, more risk = more reward.
 

Freaksterz

Member
Sep 25, 2013
56
0
0
What about buying a video card or two to game with and making a few grand off of them? Better than all of the same expenses and getting nothing in return.

This is pretty much my situation here, Pretty profitable too, 2coins a week give or take so a month and a half max for my card to its own expenses.
 

holden j caufield

Diamond Member
Dec 30, 1999
6,324
10
81
hey guys how do you withdraw your bitcoins off coinbase. I'm verified, I sent my LTC to BTC-E, converted those ltc to btc, sent those btc to coinbase. Now I clicked merchant settings "instantly exchange new bitcoin orders to USD and credit my primary bank account once a day." But so far nothing. is .04 btc too small to withdraw? I just wanted to test it out
 

JDG1980

Golden Member
Jul 18, 2013
1,663
570
136
Scrypt based ASIC in the works. The wait for my BFL ASIC was six months.
https://alpha-t.net

I'm skeptical. The scrypt algorithm was specifically chosen to be ASIC-resistant; unlike SHA-256, it needs fast access to a decent amount of RAM (about 128K for each hash). So, unlike SHA-256, you can't just put a bunch of ALUs together on a FPGA or ASIC to get a workable design; you either have to include a substantial amount of memory on-die (which increases costs) or add a memory controller (which increases complexity substantially). Sure, theoretically, it could be done - but the company whose website you linked has no track record of delivering anything. All they've got currently is some renderings. Any reason to think is is more than vaporware?

Incidentally, I'm curious as to how a Xeon Phi would do on Litecoin mining. It's got plenty of fast RAM on board, so that shouldn't be a problem, and it is specifically designed for massive parallelism, much as graphics cards are. The cheapest Xeon Phi (3120A, 57 cores, 8GB RAM, 300W) costs about $1700, so it would probably have to do 3500-4000 KH/sec to be cost-effective compared to Radeons.
 
sale-70-410-exam    | Exam-200-125-pdf    | we-sale-70-410-exam    | hot-sale-70-410-exam    | Latest-exam-700-603-Dumps    | Dumps-98-363-exams-date    | Certs-200-125-date    | Dumps-300-075-exams-date    | hot-sale-book-C8010-726-book    | Hot-Sale-200-310-Exam    | Exam-Description-200-310-dumps?    | hot-sale-book-200-125-book    | Latest-Updated-300-209-Exam    | Dumps-210-260-exams-date    | Download-200-125-Exam-PDF    | Exam-Description-300-101-dumps    | Certs-300-101-date    | Hot-Sale-300-075-Exam    | Latest-exam-200-125-Dumps    | Exam-Description-200-125-dumps    | Latest-Updated-300-075-Exam    | hot-sale-book-210-260-book    | Dumps-200-901-exams-date    | Certs-200-901-date    | Latest-exam-1Z0-062-Dumps    | Hot-Sale-1Z0-062-Exam    | Certs-CSSLP-date    | 100%-Pass-70-383-Exams    | Latest-JN0-360-real-exam-questions    | 100%-Pass-4A0-100-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-300-135-exams-date    | Passed-200-105-Tech-Exams    | Latest-Updated-200-310-Exam    | Download-300-070-Exam-PDF    | Hot-Sale-JN0-360-Exam    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Exams    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-JN0-360-exams-date    | Exam-Description-1Z0-876-dumps    | Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps    | Dumps-HPE0-Y53-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-HPE0-Y53-Exam    | 100%-Pass-HPE0-Y53-Real-Exam-Questions    | Pass-4A0-100-Exam    | Latest-4A0-100-Questions    | Dumps-98-365-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-98-365-Exam    | 100%-Pass-VCS-254-Exams    | 2017-Latest-VCS-273-Exam    | Dumps-200-355-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-300-320-Exam    | Pass-300-101-Exam    | 100%-Pass-300-115-Exams    |
http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    | http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    |