@bshole Right. The modus operandi is to not brutalize armed whites obstructing the Government, but if there are unarmed Native Americans protesting the poisoning of their fresh water, it's time to give the attack dogs some work experience.
It isn't? Can you explain these peaceful non-threatening white college kids being pepper sprayed then?
or these peaceful white female protestors brutalized by the cops
I have seen enough protestors brutalized by cops to come to the conclusion that unarmed peaceful protestors have a damn good chance of brutalization no matter what their race or ethnicity. ARMED protestors are another matter altogether. They are definitely treated differently. I think we can agree on that.
I will concede that you could be 100% correct that the native American protestors were brutalized simply because they were native American. That is absolutely possible. However, that being admitted, I have not seen enough evidence to convince me that was the underlying motive. If what you posit is true, the officers involved should be arrested and charged with civil rights violations. Could you lay our your evidence, I am interested in looking at it. As far as I am aware, this is the only incident in the last decade of law enforcement brutalizing peaceful native American protestors. There could be hundreds of other incidents establishing a pattern and therefor a case of simple ignorance on my part.
wow those environmental protestors sure do know how to trash the environment.
Those aren't armed whites. They are hippy scum who should be placed in internment camps till they learn how to work. - a conservative
I thought that was the law for water crossings?Not sure why the pipeline company doesn't propose using an annulus pipe, where the inner pipe carries the crude and the outer pipe is is only full of air. Any leak in the inner pipe is contained by the outer pipe. The whole thing is sloped toward a salvage system that would immediately detect a leak in the inner pipe. This would allow the pipeline to be shut down before any oil made in into the water. This system is used all the time in various industries.
Well I know why, it would be more expensive and they don't want to spend a penny more than they have to.
Those aren't armed whites. They are hippy scum who should be placed in internment camps till they learn how to work. - a conservative
I thought that was the law for water crossings?
Regardless, personally I'd rather see the pipeline threaten Bismark's water supply. Maybe then it will actually be regularly inspected and maintained.
I thought that was the law for water crossings?
Regardless, personally I'd rather see the pipeline threaten Bismark's water supply. Maybe then it will actually be regularly inspected and maintained.
Your comment popped a light bulb in my head. Is there a link between brutality and peaceful PROGRESSIVE protestors? When I did a search of police brutality peaceful protestors, every link that turned up were about police bullying progressive protestors. Interesting...
wow those environmental protestors sure do know how to trash the environment.
I would think it was the code, but I saw the CEO of the company on PBS and he never mentioned that as a mitigating factor. He just was saying that it was new pipe, thick new pipe, it was going to be buried 70 feet below the surface of the river, and that there would be remote shutoff valves on either side. Nothing about a double wall.
Cops aren't going to get into a gun fight with 300 armed "protestors" But some college kids? Yeah lets go in there and fuck them up with batons and mace.
There is a lesson to be learned here by all protestors. Basically carry guns in large numbers and the gov will leave you alone.
You're just now learning the lesson that North Korea learned years ago that if you have sufficient capability to resist that the U.S. government won't fvck with you just because they can? But keep going on about how the 2nd Amendment is obsolete and that you could never stand up to the Army tanks they'd inevitably send against you blah blah blah.
Its a fucking campsite in an area that isnt extraordinarily sensitive. As long as all the plastic and other toxic and nondegradable materials are picked up before long, there wont be any real damage.
The northern route ran through environmentally sensitive wetlands as well.
Here's Fox News, they couldn't even get out to the site.
wow those environmental protestors sure do know how to trash the environment.
It isn't? Can you explain these peaceful non-threatening white college kids being pepper sprayed then?
or these peaceful white female protestors brutalized by the cops
I have seen enough protestors brutalized by cops to come to the conclusion that unarmed peaceful protestors have a damn good chance of brutalization no matter what their race or ethnicity. ARMED protestors are another matter altogether. They are definitely treated differently. I think we can agree on that.
I will concede that you could be 100% correct that the native American protestors were brutalized simply because they were native American. That is absolutely possible. However, that being admitted, I have not seen enough evidence to convince me that was the underlying motive. If what you posit is true, the officers involved should be arrested and charged with civil rights violations. Could you lay out your evidence, I am interested in looking at it. As far as I am aware, this is the only incident in the last decade of law enforcement brutalizing peaceful native American protestors. There could be hundreds of other incidents establishing a pattern and therefor a case of simple ignorance on my part.
I just want to jump in here and comment on the use of pepper spray on protestors, since as a newspaper photojournalist I've seen lots of similar protests. This isn't addressing the race of the protesters directly.
I understand to the naive this may seem a "brutal" tactic, but what would you have our law enforcement officers do? Ask nicely and then give up when the protestors say no? Being sprayed with non-lethal pepper spray, which every officer has endured during training, is not the same as a bullet to the head. The protestors are responsible for pushing they authorities hand by refusing a lawful order. The cops have to figure out the move them as safely as possible to comply with the law.
- Cops give a lawful order for protestors to remove themselves from the area, warning they will be removed by force if they don't comply with the order.
- Protestors refuse, sit and join hands, etc.
- Cops weight their options, deciding that laying hands on the protestors to forcibly remove them has a very real chance of injuring protestors and cops. Lots of factors go into this tactical decision: how big is the crowd, are their violent elements among them, are there enough officers and holding facilities to detain the protestors or do they just need to be dispersed...etc.
- Cops then decide to use non-lethal pepper or OC spray to cause pain, but no physical injury, to the protestors to compel them to leave without having to go hands on and possibly injure someone.
da fuck, so go ahead and just trash the environment but pick it up later and all is good? and by later you mean in spring when the snow is gone?
If they dont know how to physically restrain and remove nonviolent individuals without injuring them when they are not hugely outnumbered, then they obviously are notably untrained, lacking understanding of physical arts, and are truly unfit to be law enforcement officers.
I don't think those cops could have done anything to remove those protesters that would have been correct in your mind. You act like this was a dozen people at a quiet sit-in somewhere. Those cops are hugely outnumbered if the crowd turns violent, and you expect them to do something that could lead to exactly that rather than the protesters get a little pepper spray?
Pepper spray is the safer option vs going hands on and starting a physical altercation. All it takes is for a few protesters to resist. When suspects resist the cops resort to the swarm and put the suspect on the ground with 3-5 officers holding them down. The potential for injury to a suspect in that situation, or to a cop from someone in the crowd trying to defend the protester being "attacked unfairly," is far greater than using pepper spray and staying hands-off. Pepper spray is safer for everyone.
But folks supporting the protestors are going to see any attempt to enforce the law as brutal treatment. All this talk about "physical arts" is BS. You are assuming each one of those protestors would have stood up and complied without force being applied by the officers, which is naive at best. I wouldn't want to bet peoples lives on it.
1. verbal skills
2. non-lethal force (pepper spray, taser...)
3. physical force (ideally by multiple officers to limit the chance of injury)
4. deadly force
Cops are often big, fit, and trained in grappling. A 250 lb cop should have little trouble getting a 150 lb teenager on the ground and in handcuffs. This isnt a subject that one can get a clear cut answer, and its highly dependent on context, but your talk of limited answers is BS. And you throw in the "protesters turning violent" card, as if that doesnt change the situation greatly, and change the rules of response, and even more so wasnt the situations that we were actually talking about here. And if cops cant resist swarming due to a kid dragging his feet, then clearly they are badly trained and entirely unfit to be cops. Thats exactly the type of attitude that French knights were well known for, and they paid for it with their lives, via pikes and bodkin arrows. But please continue with the assumptions and fallacies. And the media has often been some of the biggest enablers of corrupt law enforcement.
I don't think those cops could have done anything to remove those protesters that would have been correct in your mind. You act like this was a dozen people at a quiet sit-in somewhere. Those cops are hugely outnumbered if the crowd turns violent, and you expect them to do something that could lead to exactly that rather than the protesters get a little pepper spray?
Pepper spray is the safer option vs going hands on and starting a physical altercation. All it takes is for a few protesters to resist. When suspects resist the cops resort to the swarm and put the suspect on the ground with 3-5 officers holding them down. The potential for injury to a suspect in that situation, or to a cop from someone in the crowd trying to defend the protester being "attacked unfairly," is far greater than using pepper spray and staying hands-off. Pepper spray is safer for everyone.
But folks supporting the protestors are going to see any attempt to enforce the law as brutal treatment. All this talk about "physical arts" is BS. You are assuming each one of those protestors would have stood up and complied without force being applied by the officers, which is naive at best. I wouldn't want to bet peoples lives on it.
1. verbal skills
2. non-lethal force (pepper spray, taser...)
3. physical force (ideally by multiple officers to limit the chance of injury)
4. deadly force