Dead mobo?

Addikt

Senior member
Apr 26, 2004
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Alright, so I got home this afternoon for lunch and I booted up my computer to check my e-mail. After doing so, I shut it down and head back out to work. When I finally get home from work the thing up and it won't even POST. All I get is a black screen until my monitor suspends; I can't even get to the BIOS. Also, I notice no flashing of the keyboard or mouse on startup, this always happens...but not this time. Both of these devices are connected to the back panel via USB. On the other hand, I can hear all the hard drives and my optical drive power up, and all the case fans are running. I figure the motherboard's gone.

I tried to reseat the RAM, and even tried some older RAM modules, but neither solution works. Then I borrow a PSU from a friend, and still no luck. It seems that the only thing left is the motherboard. So, what do I do now? Do I clear the CMOS and hope for a miraculous recovery? Could it be as simple as replacing a dead battery?

I'm working with an ASUS P5W DH Deluxe...or at least, I was. Any help would be appreciated.
 

Addikt

Senior member
Apr 26, 2004
242
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Well that rules out tampering. Any power surges that you know of?

Actually yeah, when I got home the microwave had reset, but everything else seemed fine. That said my entire rig is hooked up to a pretty beefy surge protector. None of the other components connected seem tone damaged.
 

Paperdoc

Platinum Member
Aug 17, 2006
2,360
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This may not help at all, but it can't hurt and costs nothing. Disconnect the power cord from the back of your machine and leave it "dead" for at least 5 minutes. Then reconnect and try the front pushbutton again. This will ensure a true "cold boot" IF it boots at all.
 

Davidh373

Platinum Member
Jun 20, 2009
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Does anything else light up? Fans spinning? If not it could also be a bad PSU, or perhaps even bad graphics...
 

mfenn

Elite Member
Jan 17, 2010
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Sounds like you had a bit of a power blip while you were out. Surge protectors are pretty much worthless and give no indication of when their MOVs are used up, so don't trust that.

There are two possibilities:
1) The power was out for long enough to drain the caps in the PSU and you have a dead CMOS battery. This is as simple to fix as buying another CR3032 (I think, look at the lettering on the battery before you buy anything) and clearing the CMOS.

2) Your PSU is dead (you can test it by unplugging everything front it and jumping the green wire on the ATX connector with any black wire). If you're lucky, it will have sacrificed itself to protect your other components.
 

westom

Senior member
Apr 25, 2009
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Actually yeah, when I got home the microwave had reset, but everything else seemed fine. That said my entire rig is hooked up to a pretty beefy surge protector.
A power strip protector that costs $150 is equivalent to the protector circuit also selling for $7 in the grocery store. Or read its numeric specs to learn it does not even claim to protect from typically destructive surges. Read its numbers to discover it is only near zero protection.

Your computer does not power on. What controls power on? What monitors the power switch? What keeps a CPU from executing even the BIOS (CMOS) until the controller decides to let the CPU execute? What is not affected by memory? A power controller. One part of the power supply system. Anyone who knows how a computer works would not waste time with those other suspects.

A multimeter (ie from Kmart or Wal-Mart) and one minute means numbers from seven wires. Either know what has failed before disconnecting even one wire. Or you post those numbers here to learn what is suspect or exonerated.

Either learn what has failed (and why)? Or use wild speculation to keep replacing parts until something works (and learn nothing). Those are your two choices.

Either buy or borrow that meter and follow simple directions. Then have an immediate solution and learn something. Or replace perfectly good parts until something works. Decide which you want to do.
 
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Addikt

Senior member
Apr 26, 2004
242
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Davidh373: I didn't even consider that the graphics card could be an issue. I will have to give that a shot, I do have another video card I can test with to eliminate it as the point of failure.

mfenn & westom: I realize that surge protectors are not the wisest investment in terms of actual protection, but I figure that it's better than nothing. What is the alternative? A UPS? Regardless, from what I've heard and read, any actual power surge is not going to be prevented by using a consumer marketed surge protector.

westom: I appreciate the response, but I don't appreciate the ascerbic manner in which it was delivered. Or perhaps I'm just being overtly sensitive.

A power strip protector that costs $150 is equivalent to the protector circuit also selling for $7 in the grocery store. Or read its numeric specs to learn it does not even claim to protect from typically destructive surges. Read its numbers to discover it is only near zero protection.

Again, I have heard this argument, but I imagine it's better than nothing. Also, as you suggest, both accomplish the same task. The only difference is price.

Your computer does not power on. What controls power on? What monitors the power switch? What keeps a CPU from executing even the BIOS (CMOS) until the controller decides to let the CPU execute? What is not affected by memory? A power controller. One part of the power supply system. Anyone who knows how a computer works would not waste time with those other suspects.

You make it sound as though I consider myself a expert. I never made such a claim. What I DO know, however, is that I did not say that the computer doesn't power on, I said that it will not POST. I have heard of a computer not POSTing due to faulty memory, thus I checked the memory. I have also heard of this being caused by a faulty power supply, and so I focused on that next. Finally, if I'm not mistaken, the power button on the case is connected to the motherboard, which is in turn connected to the PSU. Considering that, and the fact that my friend's functioning power supply did not fix the problem, I gather this is enough evidence to rule out a problem there.

A multimeter (ie from Kmart or Wal-Mart) and one minute means numbers from seven wires. Either know what has failed before disconnecting even one wire. Or you post those numbers here to learn what is suspect or exonerated.

One minute, considering you know what you are doing. I don't have a multimeter, and I don't know what parts of the board, or connections I would be testing. I would have to consult a guide on how to do this. In the time it would take to go to the store, buy the device, as well as find and read a reliable guide on how to do this, I could have already installed and tested the system with a working alternative PSU. Hell, I would probably even have time left over to watch the newest episode of the Jersey Shore.

I am not a computer tech. This knowledge is literally worthless to me, bar personal interest, especially when there are cheaper, and less time-consuming alternatives. I somewhat understand your concern, but it's not like I'm wasting your or other users' time. Regardless of the method I use to test the device, the result ends up being the same. I acknowledge that there is a slim possiblity that both PSUs could be defective.

Either learn what has failed (and why)? Or use wild speculation to keep replacing parts until something works (and learn nothing). Those are your two choices.

Either buy or borrow that meter and follow simple directions. Then have an immediate solution and learn something. Or replace perfectly good parts until something works. Decide which you want to do.

I outlined my entire thought process in my original post; I wouldn't consider this wild speculation. Also, consider I did use a multimeter and knew how to test all the pins/connections. What happens when I find out that my power supply is working properly? What's to prevent wild speculation at that point?

Your post assumes that I understand everything involved in troubleshooting my problem. If I did, why would I be posting here? How do I go about learning what has failed (and why) without knowing where to start? Your comment doesn't make any sense. I am simply looking for a solution, not to be chastised for my meagre level of technical understanding.

Based on your comment, what would I expect of my doctor when asking why I am experiencing chest pains? Is he going to point to the door and tell me to figure out what went wrong? Finally, in reference to following "simple directions," I don't even know what you are referencing.

So, back to square one.
 

mfenn

Elite Member
Jan 17, 2010
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mfenn & westom: I realize that surge protectors are not the wisest investment in terms of actual protection, but I figure that it's better than nothing. What is the alternative? A UPS? Regardless, from what I've heard and read, any actual power surge is not going to be prevented by using a consumer marketed surge protector.

I'm not saying that a power strip surge protector is a bad thing to have, I'm just saying not to rely on it. Oh and you have a PM.
 

Addikt

Senior member
Apr 26, 2004
242
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Is there an alternative that can provide better protection though? A UPS perhaps?
 

westom

Senior member
Apr 25, 2009
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westom: I appreciate the response, but I don't appreciate the ascerbic manner in which it was delivered.
My post was 100% technical. If you see any tone, well, I waste no time with political correctness, tone, emotions, or anything else irrelevant. Provided was a 100% technical reply. That is all I posted. To recommend something that even 13 years olds can do (and have done).

You need not own a multimeter. The tool is so ridiculously cheap as to sell for less than a good hammer. Sold in most any store that sells hammers - or Wal-Mart, Kmart, Radio Shack, Harbor Freight, etc. Or borrow one even from any auto mechanic. The tool is that ubiquitous.

Other things suggested by others are not permitted to operate until the power controller decides when each can operate. Is a power controller defective? Or something else? Every question answered immediately - but only if you first post those numbers. That means one minute and a multimeter. Obviously not acerbic. Posted is honest, plain, simple reality. A task that any layman - even a 13 years old - can do. And an opportunity for you to learn how a computer really works. Did you even know a power controller exists? Most don't.

It does not post. That implies a long list of suspects. A perfectly good supply in one system can fail in an otherwise perfectly good second system. A defective supply can still boot one computer; fail in another. Both are examples of why swapping creates confusion. A second supply can even mask an existing problem that returns later as strange intermittents. All do not happen by doing a minute of labor with a meter.

Nobody using a meter need be an expert. A minute to collect numbers. Then five minutes to learn reams of information in those numbers. Oh. And also have a solution in the very next post. You were expected to start with zero knowledge . Everyone does. Touch each of seven wires with a probe, read a number, and post it. Ask and instructions are provided. But you must first ignore your posted fears.

Did you know about a power controller? Did you know that a power supply, BIOS, and CPU each can do nothing without permission from that controller? Most don’t. You would if "following the evidence". In your case, 60 seconds using a meter from Kmart. Sold in Kmart because a meter is intended even for a 13 year old. Please do not fear it. Ask what to do. Post the numbers. Then have a reply without 'it could be this' or 'might be that' answers.
 

westom

Senior member
Apr 25, 2009
517
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71
Is there an alternative that can provide better protection though? A UPS perhaps?
The power strip has near zero joules. Does not claim any protection. And sometimes makes damage to nearby appliances easier.

A UPS typically has a similar circuit that is even tinier. Read its specs. It contains hundreds of joules. Surges that tiny are made irrelevant by protection already inside every appliance.

Undersized so that it will fail on a surge too tiny to even harm any appliance. That gets many to recommend it. But sometimes a protector does not disconnect fast enough. These scary pictures result including the Boston fire. Even a fire marshal described how failure happens:
http://www.hanford.gov/rl/?page=556&parent=554
http://www.ddxg.net/old/surge_protectors.htm
http://www.zerosurge.com/HTML/movs.html
http://************/3x73ol where *** is t i n y u r l and is entitled "Surge Protector Fires"
http://www3.cw56.com/news/articles/local/BO63312/
http://www.nmsu.edu/~safety/news/lesson-learned/surgeprotectorfire.htm
http://www.pennsburgfireco.com/fullstory.php?58339

Surges that can overwhelm appliances typically occur once every seven years. You are assuming a power strip protector does any protection. It does. From a type of surge that typically causes no damage. A surge every seven years (or less)? In many venues, no protector works just fine because all electronics already contain protection.

Also defined were other solutions including a kludge. Unfortunately you assumed a 'tone' rather than read what was posted.

Better than an adjacent protector is no protector - in many cases. We even traced surge damage through electronics because that protector earthed a surge destructively through those electronics. Best protector is located distant from electronics. Attempt to do what a 'whole house' protector might do.
 
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Davidh373

Platinum Member
Jun 20, 2009
2,428
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71
ooo "shock" and awe . Surge protectors have gone bad, yes... but c'mon dude... this is conspiracy theory level stuff here...
 
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