DEAD - Radeon 9800NPs back @ NewEgg - $243!

[epointer]

I agree w/Lanyap. If they say "Powered By ATI Manufactured by Sapphire", and the card you got was made by Sapphire, how can you complain (not to mention the disclaimer)? If you wanted an ATI card, you should have gotten in on the CC or BB deal that many others, like myself did. Even then, I think returning a video card based on the mem manufacturer is wrong and leads to higher prices overall. But that's just me.
Sorry for the rant/crap, but I wish many would consider the fact that there is only ~$50 difference (online) to get a guaranteed pro (keeping retail store shelves and great online retailers like Newegg from pushing and re-shipping someone else's senseless return).

 

[nero2]

EVERYONE GROW THE **** UP!

Seriously, stop insulting each other and give reasonable responses.

etech, it's fine that you're going to get a full refund (and I don't condone flashbacck insulting you) but you're using pictures of Pro models to somehow prove that what you got isn't what they should have sent you. You ordered a 9800NP, not a pro. Just because XXX 9800 Pro is on a black PCB with cooler A doesn't mean that the non-pro version of the XXX 9800NP will be on the same PCB. It's a blessing Newegg even gives "real" photos of the item in question. Again, you're welcome to return it, but please explain where you get this notion of "bait and switch" from? Also, there is no gaurantee on what type of memory you would get anyway, so you could be SOL no matter what brand or batch you got.

 

[etech]

nero2

I've been researching which video card to buy for the last month. I know the difference.

Ask the people who ordered in Sept. what card they got.

I don't know yet that I will get a full refund. That is still up to Newegg and how they handle their mistake.
Bait and switch is the closest term I can come up with for advertising one product and shipping another. If you have a better term than please ,by all means, let us all know.

 

[nero2]

I just started reading up on the debate going on over @ amdforums. My resonable question is this: Exactly what card did you *expect*, and what card did they ship you? You used links to 9800 Pros in your examples, which have nothing to do with Non-pros, so I'm more than a bit confused, esspecially because they're both made by Sapphire, and Newegg posts a dislaimer. Despite the great photos, you're still ordering by the title and by the specs. Please LMK what the difference is between the two cards is *ignoring the photos*, because lets face it, they don't need to post such photos, nor are they legally obligated to ship something that *looks* like the product in the photo, as long as they shipped something that matches the description and features (which is AFAIK what they did).

 

[fustercluck]

People seem to be real mad when people have arguments with Newegg =p

They sold an item under a false description, people paid for one item, and received another. Simple as that. Yes the performance may not be a whole lot different, but it IS a different card all together. Newegg made a mistake, they admit that, otherwise they wouldn't be letting everyone get refunded on a non refundable item.

$50-$60 extra is a lot for minimally better performance. Unless cash isn't a big issue for you. Though cash is a big issue for pretty much everybody.

 

[nero2]

This is my first, and last hot deal. I don't regret posting this deal, but it's not worth it to spread joy when the joy for the majority has turned into a huge headache for a few. Terrible, and a bit childish of me, isn't it? Good luck to all on both resolving their issues, and a happy overclocking future to all!

 

[Blooz1]

I installed the card this evening without a hitch. Omega 2.6.18 reported it as a 9800 Pro, stock speeds came up as 324/283.

I ran some benches without turning off any background apps or OCing. I recently installed XP Pro on this system, and, as I'm a noob to XP, I'm sure the OS isn't optimized as well as it could be.

The system used is as follows:

Epox 8RDA+ w/2500 Barton @1.65V, 11x200
512Mb Twinmos/Winbond PC3200 (2-2-2-11@2.9V)

3DMark2001SE = 15,812

3DMark2003 = 4,756


Aquamark = (GFX) 4,794 / (CPU) 7,865 / Aquamark 36,758

This represents significant increases over my 9600 Pro, more than I expected, and this is without overclocking. (I'll do more testing tomorrow when I have time.) This card will be fine for me!

 

[kza]

That's practically the exact same number as my ATI Radeon 9800np not overclocked and I'm only running a P4 2.4ghz. Man....people are getting upset over the color of the board when performance wise, it's identical to the ATI made cards? What did you expect? You ordered a 9800np and that's what you got.

 

[Medicated858]

Not trying to flame but how exactly did Newegg advertise the card? Any saved web pages?

 

[etech]

Medicated858
As of the time of this posting Newegg has not changed the description on their page. They still show it as the [ATI] OEM card.

nero2
I ordered and expected the ATI OEM card. THAT is what is in the description. ATI comes first and according to Newegg practices as seen on the 9800 pro cards when ATI comes first than you get an ATI branded card.

As to why it makes a difference. The resale value of a ATI branded card will be higher. The ATI OEM card comes with the later revision pcb and better heatsink. The Sapphire card comes on the old 9700 pro pcb. If someone wanted to flash to a pro than the bios is available, I'm not sure if one is for the Sapphire card.

Some people want and pay for the name. I might want to sell this card next spring while it still has some value rather than keeping it forever as I do most of my hardware. The Sapphire card is less valuable on the resale market than the ATI branded card.

Those are my main objections. Newegg did not ship what they advertised.

 

[salsa086]

etech, can you try benchmarking with the latest omega drivers.... I'd like to see if you card performs better.

omega 2.4.9.6b found here

 

[fustercluck]

Any more Entron Tech Ram'd 9800 NP test results would be much appreciated, i'm seeing some OC pretty good, but some doing real bad.

 

[waxking1]

I am new to OC video cards and I didn't do any testing before other than playing a game. Testing with 3DMark03 it is much easier to see artifacts. I had to back the clock down to around 380/325 to be artifact free. My total score at this speed was just a bit over 7200 but I'm not really sure what that means. With the card at 389/340 the score was 7300 plus so it doesn't seem to make that big a difference. I will probably keep the card.

 

[fustercluck]

Your 9800 NP has the Entrontech ram right, waxking?

 

[Convert]

ATI OEM SAPPHIRE RADEON 9800 128MB Non Pro: Black PCB, E-tech 2.8ns, Crappy Sapphire Fan. Results:

3DMark2001SE @ 381/342 = 15,269 on M7NCD-Pro, Mushkin Blue 3200, Barton 2500+. Ram & Barton set at 166FSB

3DMark2001SE @ 381/342 = 17,107 on M7NCD-Pro, Same Hdwe set @ 200FSB effectively Barton 3200+ (11*200)

This is pretty much the highest I can go without seeing artifacts, looping 3DMark01SE for 2hrs. and then running BF1942
for a couple hours. Seems stable for me at these settings and the game plays great. My BBA 9800NP w/Inferior ram 3.3ns
can hit 405 on the core but only 317 on the memory before artifacts and the 3DMark01SE scores are within 200/300 using the same setup, tests and gaming.

I think the memory timings for E-tech are slower which is probably why the scores are so close, and the Sapphire HSF is underpar (junk). I took the HSF off which has more ripples than a Ruffles potato chip and applied some AS3. One interesting thing to note was the thermal goop that was on there looked like a silver paste but it had a flakey like consistancy when I was cleaning it off, kinda makes me think someone else had this card and returned it, then Sapphire underclocked it with a one of a kind bios and resold it as a 9800NP, hence the black PCB used on their OEM Sapphire 9700Pro/9800Pro, JMHO.

Anyways I tried a couple different BIOS's from 3DChipset one was a Pro SS 2.8 mem. and the other was a NP Inf. 3.3 mem. neither worked because there was corruption at boot up during the XP loading screen, so I reflashed to the original bios and here I am.

Edit: Omega Cats 3.8/3.9ish b revision.

 

[Lanyap]

etech, you're way off base. This is not an ATI branded card, it's clearly made by a company called Sapphire based on the ATI GPU chip. Apparently everyone knows this except you. That's why you are having such a hard time convincing people. If you look at all of the Sapphire made cards you will find ATI in the description. See this LIST. As a matter of fact every other 3rd part manufacturer selling ATI based cards has ATI listed in the description. HERE are the cards actually made by ATI. But then I think you know all this and you are just trying to build a case to return your card.

All that being said Newegg will probably refund you money since it is pretty good about that type of thing.

Originally posted by: etech
Medicated858
As of the time of this posting Newegg has not changed the description on their page. They still show it as the [ATI] OEM card.

nero2
I ordered and expected the ATI OEM card. THAT is what is in the description. ATI comes first and according to Newegg practices as seen on the 9800 pro cards when ATI comes first than you get an ATI branded card.

As to why it makes a difference. The resale value of a ATI branded card will be higher. The ATI OEM card comes with the later revision pcb and better heatsink. The Sapphire card comes on the old 9700 pro pcb. If someone wanted to flash to a pro than the bios is available, I'm not sure if one is for the Sapphire card.

Some people want and pay for the name. I might want to sell this card next spring while it still has some value rather than keeping it forever as I do most of my hardware. The Sapphire card is less valuable on the resale market than the ATI branded card.

Those are my main objections. Newegg did not ship what they advertised.

 

[etech]

Originally posted by: Lanyap
etech, you're way off base. This is not an ATI branded card, it's clearly made by a company called Sapphire based on the ATI GPU chip. Apparently everyone knows this except you. That's why you are having such a hard time convincing people. If you look at all of the Sapphire made cards you will find ATI in the description. See this LIST. As a matter of fact every other 3rd part manufacturer selling ATI based cards has ATI listed in the description. HERE are the cards actually made by ATI. But then I think you know all this and you are just trying to build a case to return your card.

All that being said Newegg will probably refund you money since it is pretty good about that type of thing.

Originally posted by: etech
Medicated858
As of the time of this posting Newegg has not changed the description on their page. They still show it as the [ATI] OEM card.

nero2
I ordered and expected the ATI OEM card. THAT is what is in the description. ATI comes first and according to Newegg practices as seen on the 9800 pro cards when ATI comes first than you get an ATI branded card.

As to why it makes a difference. The resale value of a ATI branded card will be higher. The ATI OEM card comes with the later revision pcb and better heatsink. The Sapphire card comes on the old 9700 pro pcb. If someone wanted to flash to a pro than the bios is available, I'm not sure if one is for the Sapphire card.

Some people want and pay for the name. I might want to sell this card next spring while it still has some value rather than keeping it forever as I do most of my hardware. The Sapphire card is less valuable on the resale market than the ATI branded card.

Those are my main objections. Newegg did not ship what they advertised.

ah heck off punk. You don't know what you are talking about.

 

[nero2]

Those are good results Convert, esspecially for not flashing the card. Mine only did 340 before flashing, and I had 3.3ns samsung chips. It kinda sucks that you haven't been able to find the right BIOS for it yet, but there are a bunch of them out there to try (though I know the hassle of trying to re-flash your card). What is imprtant now is that you've basically got yourself a 9800Pro

etech: That was uncalled for. Honestly, you don't have to keep justifying yourself to everyone if you don't want to, as you 've made your case before, but if you choose to, don't start insulting other people. Whether your right or wrong, or feel insulted, you don't name-call. End of story. You've got 9K posts, now is not the time.

 

[etech]

nero2


No it was explicitly called for. He insulted me and started with the flames. I just called it as I see it and him.

Now unless you are a mod of this forum don't tell me what to do.

I and many other people understand the situation and have researched the cards enough to know that they are different cards, if some little punk wants to come in and show how ignorant he is than so be it. I won't waste my time reexplaining the obvious and will just answer his ignorance with a little flame.

I'm old enough and grouchy enough not to put up with bs like this from either newegg or little punks like that.

That is all.

 

[Blooz1]

I did some OCing with mine tonight, also played a couple of hours of IL2. (Clouds and ground detail were absolutely fantastic!)

Cranked it up to 370 GPU/330 RAM with the following results:

3DMark2001 - 16,992 (Clean test)

3DMark2003 - 5392 (Clean test)

Aquamark - (GFX) 5475
(CPU) 7799
(Total) 40,525 (I started to get minor artifacts about 1/2 way through, some tearing on last test)
(Avg. FPS) 40.53

 

[waxking1]

"Your 9800 NP has the Entrontech ram right, waxking? "
Yes it has the Entrontech. I thought it was running well at 389/342 until I ran the 3DMark03. The Nature scenes with the water are tough to get by without seeing something that looks like bubbles in the water. To get all the bubbles out I had to back off these settings to 380/325. Anybody tried flashing one of these cards yet?

 

[xhoangx]

so are you still getting 7000+ in 3dmark03 waxking1? by the way, what are your system specs? i wanna see what i can expect out of mine when i get it on monday.

 

[waxking1]

My computer is a 2.4C Pentium but I am running a 3.3. Motherboard is an ABIT Max3.

 

[Lanyap]

For those planning to return their card but still want a 9800, BB has the real ATI 9800 PRO retail on sale for $299 ($349.99 - $50 MIR). Here's the Thread. Might be a good deal for those who don't want to take chances.


I think etech needs a name change. May I suggest: OldAndGrouchy

BTW, I'm not little, I'm not a punk and I've been playing with computers, big and small, since the early 80's.

That is all.

 

[rickon66]

This is a great little soap opera being played out here. It has all the elements of great trashy drama, name calling, crying and suspense.

I bought one of the Newegg Sapphires 9800np's from an earlier batch and it has been great. I did know what I was buying- I fully read the product description(Powered by ATI manufactured by Sapphire).