Dell or Cisco managed switches

halve

Member
Aug 1, 2002
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The company I work for is looking to redo our entire network backbone. We are currently looking at Cisco Catalyst 3750 and 3550 switches and Dell Powerconnect 5524 and 3324. We where going to order 4 3750's or 5524's and 8 3550's or 3324's. The quotes we have recieved have shown Dell to be about half the price of Cisco switches, I like the price obviously but I am also alittle worried that the Dell switches not of the same quality. Does anyone have any expierence with either of these switches?

Halve
 

cmetz

Platinum Member
Nov 13, 2001
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I'm sure I'm not telling you anything you don't already know here, but the Cisco switches are much higher design and build quality than the Dell switches. Similarly, a Sun (SPARC) server is a much higher design and build quality than a PC. You're talking about much more expensive equipment in pretty much a different class.

The Dell managed switches are on par with Linksys and D-Link managed switches.
 
Aug 27, 2002
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for a back bone of the size you're talking about, personally I'd go with the Cisco stuff, if you were just wanting to connect your local area workgroups to a closet with little/no management needed, go with something cheaper.
 

ScottMac

Moderator<br>Networking<br>Elite member
Mar 19, 2001
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...And don't forget to add funding for software (upgrades and updates) and TAC support. Cisco has around the world ("Follow the sun") 7X24 support. Dell has 7X24 support as well.....ever called 'em? Make suere you have a book or magazine and coffee handy when you call ...

You may want to get a quote on Cisco stuff from a Cisco VAR / partner / reseller as well. The pricing may improve some. This is a small order for Cisco, but for a smaller reseller, this is a more substantial order and they'd be more likely to swing on the price a little.

Good Luck

Scott
 

halve

Member
Aug 1, 2002
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Thanks for the replies guys, makes me feel alot better. I figured the dell was just to good to be true, we use alot of cisco routers now and have never had a problem. I guess why brake a good thing?

Thanks much

Halve
 

cmetz

Platinum Member
Nov 13, 2001
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halve, I haven't used the Dell managed switches, but I'm sure they work. They're just probably made in China (maybe if you're lucky, Taiwan or Malaysia) by some company you've never heard of and then OEMed by Dell - that's the way Dell does business. If what you're really looking for is just some functional L2 switches that work, the Dells will work. And they'll be dramatically cheaper. The probability of failure will be higher than Cisco, but you can easily buy spares of the Dell switches and still come out cheaper than Cisco.

It really comes down to the age old balancing act of IT: do you buy the more expensive better quality / more reliable box, or the cheaper one? That in turn depends on your needs and your budget.
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
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Or do you need the extra features of a cisco/foundry/extreme switch?

You'd be surprised at what they can do.
 

ScottMac

Moderator<br>Networking<br>Elite member
Mar 19, 2001
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Oh yeah, no kidding. With the choices of Dell and Cisco ... I'd vote for Cisco; mostly because of the service and support organization. The Hardware is really nothing special. Cisco's other strong point is the BROAD scope of products. You can have an all-Cisco network ... no matter what you're trying to do, and still be covered by one organization's service and support.

If you're looking for Cisco alternatives, Extreme or Foundry would be excellent choices.

Extreme is the fastest switch we ever tested. It's rock solid, and probably the best L3 switching on the market. The service and support are excellent as well. Extreme is big enough that you know they'll be around next year (they're global), but still small enough to be competitive (read "cheaper, and bend-over-backwards-to-keep-the-customer-happy"). A very nice feature of Exteme is that the command set is the same across the entire line. If you know the commands for the 24 port workgroup switch, you know the command set for the 1500 port 10/100 chassis (it's the size of a small 'fridge). All Extreme infrastructure switches are 100% non-blocking, unless you specifically choose to oversubscribe the backplane.

Foundry is also an excellent switch, their command set is 99.9 percent "Cisco compatible".... if you know Cisco, you know Foundry (and vice versa). They're very competitive (see above) as well. Other than some proof-of-concept testing for a couple customers, I haven't had much exposure to their service and support. I do know some folks that went to work for Foundry and all that I've heard indicates they are very customer-support oriented.

Generally speaking, for a buisness, hardware reliability is "fer sher" a Good Thing, behind that, you have to be able to rely on the vendor and/or manufacturer to back the hardware up with assistance when things go wrong (forums are nice, but it's no way to support a corporate network), and to get replacements when something dies. Behind THAT you should be looking at the manageability of the active infrastructure. Moves/Adds/Changes/Deletes (MACD) consume most of the IS/IT person's time. Manageability also include proactive monitoring and trend analysis. It's nice to catch something failing BEFORE it fails - it gives you some breathing room, and greatly reduces the Midnight Paging / Vacation Paging syndrome.

As mentioned, for a smaller network, the Dell stuff is probably OK. For critical systems (they're all critical, right?) you have to look beyond the hardware at how easy it's going to be live with the hardware once it's in. Cisco, Extreme, and Foundry would be better choices (IMHO). "But, this is cheaper" should not really be part of the conversation. Get the best stuff the budget can afford. There's more to the cost of a network than the hardware.

FWIW

Scott
 

nightowl

Golden Member
Oct 12, 2000
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After dealing with Dell tech support, I would not even give Dell a thought. It is a pain to try and call them to get even the most basic things replaced. Cisco, from my experience has great tech support. You open up a TAC case and you get support almost immediately. At work we are moving to an all Cisco network with 6509s as the core connected at 10Gbit.
 

kt

Diamond Member
Apr 1, 2000
6,031
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Originally posted by: SaigonK
Umm...yeah!
I just bought two gigabit Passport Switches from them...cos me a wonderful $20000 but it will be worth it!

You or the company you work for? Because $200K is a lot to spend on a home network. :Q
 

PowerMacG5

Diamond Member
Apr 14, 2002
7,701
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Originally posted by: kt
Originally posted by: SaigonK Umm...yeah! I just bought two gigabit Passport Switches from them...cos me a wonderful $20000 but it will be worth it!
You or the company you work for? Because $200K is a lot to spend on a home network. :Q

I think you read an extra zero. He said 20K. They're are onle 4 zeroes.
 

PowerMacG5

Diamond Member
Apr 14, 2002
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Originally posted by: spidey07
Just keep in mind that large networks cost 10s of millions of dollars.

Exactly. Last summer, my school was overhauled (Oceanside High School). I was one of the people setting up this network. Our boss told us, that in total, it was about 10 million dollars of equipment. If we were to have had Cisco do a certified install, it would have been 7 million more. This includes, router's, switches, fibre, everything. Think of it this way, one of our Catalyst level 3 switches cost about $60,000. It was about three feet tall, and had (I think) 5 48-Port 10/100 modules, and 1 48 port Gigabit module. Reliable network equipment is not cheap in any sense.
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
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Originally posted by: azev
What kind of high school do you go to? jesus

No kidding man, I want to know what school you go to? and what is the network used for ?

You wouldn't believe the networks I've built for public schools, governments generally spare no expense when it comes to IT.

that and the discount freaking rock. 60+% off retail
 

PowerMacG5

Diamond Member
Apr 14, 2002
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Originally posted by: azev
What kind of high school do you go to? jesus
No kidding man, I want to know what school you go to? and what is the network used for ?

I stated in my post, Oceanside High School. This is the first Network overhaul in about 10 years. Before this, it was an all Token Ring Network. Believe me, the network needed to be redone. They are also future proofing it for more years (dedicated VoIP switches). This is probably going to be the last overhaul in 10-15 more years.
 

cmetz

Platinum Member
Nov 13, 2001
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spidey07, "governments generally spare no expense when it comes to IT" interesting that you say that. Governments (in particular, school districts) I have experience with use their money nearly pessimally - they spend huge amounts of money on stupid stuff and then cost-optimize the important stuff. Like one county near me floated a big county-wide bond to run fiber throughout every school, but didn't budget anything for, say, equipment to go on the ends of it.
 

TMPadmin

Golden Member
Jul 23, 2001
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We re-did our entire network here a year or so ago and went with 3com gigabit switches and some 10/100's. Haven't had a problem and performance increased dramatically over our linksys hubs. Who knew? You need to take into account the size and demand on your network. Cisco may be overkill, in my case I couldn't justify the cost for our size of company and the bandwidth. By far Cisco is the leader overall and dell, like it's been said already, is re-marketed technology. Nothing special just a cheep switch in a dark Dell case. Dell sent me 4 free 10/100/1000 switches already for buying workstations. I put them on the shelf still in the box. I have no use for them.

TMP
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
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Originally posted by: cmetz
spidey07, "governments generally spare no expense when it comes to IT" interesting that you say that. Governments (in particular, school districts) I have experience with use their money nearly pessimally - they spend huge amounts of money on stupid stuff and then cost-optimize the important stuff. Like one county near me floated a big county-wide bond to run fiber throughout every school, but didn't budget anything for, say, equipment to go on the ends of it.

I guess I should have included "spend money like it is going out of style on stupid stuff, but nickle and dime on bare necessities".

Oh like any kind of security or filtering at all?

Kentucky state network used for porn and distruting movies, games:
http://www.courier-journal.com/localnews/2003/08/02ky/wir-front-porn0802-6458.html

-excerpt-
Hatchett said a more thorough examination of Internet activity at the cabinet by his experts has shown that 212 computers within the cabinet were used to access at least 22,237 pornographic images during 24 days that were examined.
 

cmetz

Platinum Member
Nov 13, 2001
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spidey07, exactly. All the counties near me are obsessed over the whole Internet censorship filtering thing, but they can't spend money on real security. Or keeping the network actually running.
 
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