Diablo 3 Sucks

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Dkcode

Senior member
May 1, 2005
995
0
0
I foolishly preorderd from Amazon UK knowing I would hardly play it, I put in half an hour on release to then leave it for three weeks before selling my account to my boss for £25.
 

darkewaffle

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2005
8,152
1
81
Again, I feel that I spent my money and got value for it, but I acknowledge that it is not the game Diablo 2 was. And not from a nostalgic perspective, but from a quantitative point of view. more strategy, more flexible gaming options and more fulfilling game play on the whole.

And I think that they "Streamlined" a bit too much (which boggles the mind. It's DIABLO!!! How much more dumbed down can it get?)

Say what?

If anything, I find D3 to be noticeably more complex and deeper than D2. D2 was brainless, anyone who could click on the enemy could play it and do fine. Admittedly D3 is the same for Normal/NM at least.

But D3 is also far more interactive and dangerous. You have to actually care about positioning and managing the usage of your abilities and cooldowns (rather than spam until zero mana, TP/pot, repeat). You can't just spam pots that restore 100% of your health and resource anytime you need them and the player power:monster power ratio is finally not so absurdly in the player's favor. Enemies now try to surround you, some will lead their shots, some buff their allies. They're 'smarter' and thanks to Inferno you finally can't completely trivialize them simply with gear.

Further, the skills in D3 are far far more balanced. There is no Hammer, there is no Frozen Orb, there is no Hurricane; the "I win" buttons that were so prolific in D2. How you play is in your control more now than ever before because you aren't defaulted to underperforming when you choose to use anything other than the 'good' skills; for the most part, almost all the skills are good and you can build around nearly any of them.

And the skills are far more varied. In D2, almost every defensive ability was a simple, one-cast shield. Holy Shield, Energy Shield, Frozen/Shiver/Chilling Armor, Cyclone Armor, Bone Armor, Blade Shield; it was bland and they were boring abilities to use. Now each class has multiple defensive abilities and many of them are unique and more engaging. Barbs get the best mitigation CDs, DH gets vanish/invuln, WD can phase out and CC extremely well, Monk can debuff enemies interrupting their attacks and preventing damage, Wizards can blink and create decoys and absorb flat damage.

For the first time since the honeymoon period of D2, I think it's actually fun to play Diablo, rather than fun to just find items.
 

HybridSquirrel

Diamond Member
Nov 20, 2005
6,161
2
81
Say what?

If anything, I find D3 to be noticeably more complex and deeper than D2. D2 was brainless, anyone who could click on the enemy could play it and do fine. Admittedly D3 is the same for Normal/NM at least.

But D3 is also far more interactive and dangerous. You have to actually care about positioning and managing the usage of your abilities and cooldowns (rather than spam until zero mana, TP/pot, repeat). You can't just spam pots that restore 100% of your health and resource anytime you need them and the player power:monster power ratio is finally not so absurdly in the player's favor. Enemies now try to surround you, some will lead their shots, some buff their allies. They're 'smarter' and thanks to Inferno you finally can't completely trivialize them simply with gear.

Further, the skills in D3 are far far more balanced. There is no Hammer, there is no Frozen Orb, there is no Hurricane; the "I win" buttons that were so prolific in D2. How you play is in your control more now than ever before because you aren't defaulted to underperforming when you choose to use anything other than the 'good' skills; for the most part, almost all the skills are good and you can build around nearly any of them.

And the skills are far more varied. In D2, almost every defensive ability was a simple, one-cast shield. Holy Shield, Energy Shield, Frozen/Shiver/Chilling Armor, Cyclone Armor, Bone Armor, Blade Shield; it was bland and they were boring abilities to use. Now each class has multiple defensive abilities and many of them are unique and more engaging. Barbs get the best mitigation CDs, DH gets vanish/invuln, WD can phase out and CC extremely well, Monk can debuff enemies interrupting their attacks and preventing damage, Wizards can blink and create decoys and absorb flat damage.

For the first time since the honeymoon period of D2, I think it's actually fun to play Diablo, rather than fun to just find items.


People like mindless clicking and enemies dying. People don't like complex scenarios. Look at COD...
 

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
561
126
One thing I don't like about D3 is the mandatory quest/storyline. I wish they would just give an option to disable it and let you wander around the world freely.

At least make it possible to really skip the cut-scenes as they occur. Cut-scene starts, I hit ESC, see the first 3 seconds anyway, prompt comes up "ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO SKIP THIS LAME ASS BORING CUT-SCENE?" I click "yes", and then it still shows me another 6 seconds of the cut scene before "skipping" it. Every time.

WTB option menu check-box for "always skip cut-scenes".

Is that a load issue on your end? Outside of bosses who have "introduction" sequences (ex: "I'm a kill you LOL!!!!11!!!" then they are attackable). I usually see the start of the cutscene (screen fades) hit ESC, get prompt instantly, hit Yes, cutscene ends. There are some dialogue sequences I wish I could skip, for example saving Adria I have to wait for her and Leah to get all cozy before the wench opens up the portal.

You can always just load in, take the teleporter, and have at it. No cutscenes involved.
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
People like mindless clicking and enemies dying. People don't like complex scenarios. Look at COD...

I hate CoD, let alone almost all FPS games. Going from my Goldeneye (N64) to CoD and such, nothing has really changed with FPS games, besides story and graphics/physics.

1. Grab Gun.
2. Shoot enemies, vital areas do more damage/instant kill
3. Find ammo for said gun
4. Find better gun to kill things faster/easier
5. Shoot enemies again
6. Find ammo
7. OOO A GRENADE! (Add in other small power ups like shields in Halo or air strikes / recons in CoD)
8. and so on...

Yet I swear there is 3-4 FPS games for every 1 decent game out there.
 

Goothry

Member
Oct 25, 2011
69
0
61
I can't stand when people argue on Blizzard's behalf regarding the launch of d2 and how it was just as terrible as d3, and that we should accept the failures of the d3 launch just because d2 had a bad one as well. When did it become acceptable to not learn from one's own mistakes? Blizzard had one failed launch so is it ok for them to continue the trend?

Additionally, I dislike that people defend d3 for not retaining defining features from d2/LoD, such as runewords, jewels, sockets, charms, imbued items, etc. The argument used being that d2 without LoD wasn't much better than d3 in it's current state, and only after LoD did it become the game that is known today. It isn't that I want those exact features, although I wouldn't mind, but that I would rather have them improved, combined, or discarded in place of a newer/better feature. It is comparable to, lets say, if I manufactured cars without AC. Then at some point I start to put AC in all the cars I make, but when I roll out the new model of cars I don't put AC in them anymore. People would start asking where the AC went, and I might respond that I'll either add it later, or that I didn't think it appropriate for the new model. I have a lurking feeling that most of the features from d2/LoD that people liked will find their way into the first d3 $60.00 expansion. When did it become acceptable to release an unfinished product, and then gouge the customer for more money in order to add the features they have been robbed of at a later date?
 

HybridSquirrel

Diamond Member
Nov 20, 2005
6,161
2
81
I hate CoD, let alone almost all FPS games. Going from my Goldeneye (N64) to CoD and such, nothing has really changed with FPS games, besides story and graphics/physics.

1. Grab Gun.
2. Shoot enemies, vital areas do more damage/instant kill
3. Find ammo for said gun
4. Find better gun to kill things faster/easier
5. Shoot enemies again
6. Find ammo
7. OOO A GRENADE! (Add in other small power ups like shields in Halo or air strikes / recons in CoD)
8. and so on...

Yet I swear there is 3-4 FPS games for every 1 decent game out there.

People like that style of game because its easy to play. Point, click, die.
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
I can't stand when people argue on Blizzard's behalf regarding the launch of d2 and how it was just as terrible as d3, and that we should accept the failures of the d3 launch just because d2 had a bad one as well. When did it become acceptable to not learn from one's own mistakes? Blizzard had one failed launch so is it ok for them to continue the trend?

Additionally, I dislike that people defend d3 for not retaining defining features from d2/LoD, such as runewords, jewels, sockets, charms, imbued items, etc. The argument used being that d2 without LoD wasn't much better than d3 in it's current state, and only after LoD did it become the game that is known today. It isn't that I want those exact features, although I wouldn't mind, but that I would rather have them improved, combined, or discarded in place of a newer/better feature. It is comparable to, lets say, if I manufactured cars without AC. Then at some point I start to put AC in all the cars I make, but when I roll out the new model of cars I don't put AC in them anymore. People would start asking where the AC went, and I might respond that I'll either add it later, or that I didn't think it appropriate for the new model. I have a lurking feeling that most of the features from d2/LoD that people liked will find their way into the first d3 $60.00 expansion. When did it become acceptable to release an unfinished product, and then gouge the customer for more money in order to add the features they have been robbed of at a later date?

Actually you should accept the failures of the launch for D3, because of the online technology they use being almost identical to MMOs. And anyone who plays an MMO knows every new one, or every expansion has major hiccups first few weeks.

Also Blizzard didn't stress test it near as hard as they should have, to ensure less server problems (there would have still been some). However, considering they were already beyond 6 months from first scheduled release date, they pushed it, and just fixed it on the fly.

And maybe the features you want are not what majority wanted? Or what fit in the NEW game they were making?

Diablo 3 is a new game, not an expansion. Same as EQ2 is different from EQ1 (and so on).
 

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
561
126
Diablo 3 is a new game, not an expansion. Same as EQ2 is different from EQ1 (and so on).

Bam! There you go. Good response.

That interview madcow posted is interesting. Seems even the original Diablo designer is enjoying the game. He even points out "they shouldn’t just try to make Diablo 2 again.

EDIT:

http://eat-games.tumblr.com/
Wow, you know, it’s weird, I’m not going to lie. It’s kind of cool! First of all I’m thrilled it do not suck. They did a good job and it does the franchise justice, so that’s a big relief. I’m kind of glad they did it, and we didn’t have to do it. Mainly because its impossible to beat the expectations of the people who were anticipating a Diablo sequel. I think they really did such a remarkably good job..."
 
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Goothry

Member
Oct 25, 2011
69
0
61
Actually you should accept the failures of the launch for D3, because of the online technology they use being almost identical to MMOs. And anyone who plays an MMO knows every new one, or every expansion has major hiccups first few weeks.

Well, as I see it, that would be part of the problem. Diablo didn't used to be MMO, but now is now some kind of MMO hybrid, and I find it very disappointing.

I quit EQ because I was sick of MMOs, and in anticipation of d3. Not that d3 wasn't fun at all, but that it wasn't very "diablo" for me.

Lineage 3 looks to be doing the exact opposite, MMO to ARPG. Maybe that's what I want. :hmm:
 

diesbudt

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2012
3,393
0
0
Not that d3 wasn't fun at all, but that it wasn't very "diablo" for me.

That is probably because you were expecting the same thing as D2 only bigger/more. (Nothing wrong with that)

They could easily make D4, revenge of the cows. And have it soley based on the Cows getting revenge on humans for mass slaying them in their parallel universe in D2. And it could have rainbows, and raining skittles, and use Laser beams as weapons.

Yet, as long as it fits somewhere into the story of diablo, it is a diablo game. So as I said, what you wanted/expected was not where the 'new' developers of diablo wanted to take it. (And a lot of the additions in D3 were suggestions brought to them by players of D2, so its not like they just changed things with reckless abandon)
 

DrunkenSano

Diamond Member
Aug 8, 2008
3,892
490
126
There is no way anyone can expect a Diablo 2 clone with updated graphics after all the years that have passed. That is just unrealistic and not something everyone would want, including the new generation of players. The developers are not creating a game for just you. They are creating a game that will sell well in this current market.
 

thespyder

Golden Member
Aug 31, 2006
1,979
0
0
Say what?

If anything, I find D3 to be noticeably more complex and deeper than D2. D2 was brainless, anyone who could click on the enemy could play it and do fine. Admittedly D3 is the same for Normal/NM at least.

But D3 is also far more interactive and dangerous. You have to actually care about positioning and managing the usage of your abilities and cooldowns (rather than spam until zero mana, TP/pot, repeat). You can't just spam pots that restore 100% of your health and resource anytime you need them and the player power:monster power ratio is finally not so absurdly in the player's favor. Enemies now try to surround you, some will lead their shots, some buff their allies. They're 'smarter' and thanks to Inferno you finally can't completely trivialize them simply with gear.

Further, the skills in D3 are far far more balanced. There is no Hammer, there is no Frozen Orb, there is no Hurricane; the "I win" buttons that were so prolific in D2. How you play is in your control more now than ever before because you aren't defaulted to underperforming when you choose to use anything other than the 'good' skills; for the most part, almost all the skills are good and you can build around nearly any of them.

And the skills are far more varied. In D2, almost every defensive ability was a simple, one-cast shield. Holy Shield, Energy Shield, Frozen/Shiver/Chilling Armor, Cyclone Armor, Bone Armor, Blade Shield; it was bland and they were boring abilities to use. Now each class has multiple defensive abilities and many of them are unique and more engaging. Barbs get the best mitigation CDs, DH gets vanish/invuln, WD can phase out and CC extremely well, Monk can debuff enemies interrupting their attacks and preventing damage, Wizards can blink and create decoys and absorb flat damage.

For the first time since the honeymoon period of D2, I think it's actually fun to play Diablo, rather than fun to just find items.

This coming from someone who thought that both DA2 and Dungeon Siege 3 were good games. Nuff said.

In Diablo 3, you aren't underpowered if you use the wrong skills. You are Underpowered if you use any of the skills. And I am not really sure how you can say that there is any depth or strategy to a game. The "Whole" strategy to Diablo 3 is Kite opponents, run away. Kite opponents, run away. If you are a tank, go high vitality and resistances. If you are a caster, go high damage and run like hell. Really in depth strategy there. Also, your choice of abilities is limited to 6, none of which combine or overlap to any degree what so ever. In Diablo 2 you could select from any of your abilities at a moment's notice. Not this 'Click the skills window. Select the Skills 'Group' that you want. Select the Skill that you want. select the 'Rune' that you want to use. Then "Ok", then "Ok" then cool down time. Then cast/use the ability". and there was a fair amount of overlap and cohesion to them such that you could make sub-classes within the classes. Not so in Diablo 3.

Additionally, as has been stated, in diablo 2, you had to plan out your character. You didn't all of the sudden get all of the abilities. You could make mistakes, but at least you were invested in YOUR character, not the generic toon you get in Diablo 3.

The skill "Tree" isn't a tree at all. It's a sapling. with ONE branch. The items are SIGNIFICANTLY less complex and the drops are eminently less rewarding. There is no variability in your class what so ever. And there is almost no variability between classes (each class has some variant on slow down or trap or hinder opponent. Each class has some variant on multiple hit attacks against multiple opponents, etc...).

In Diablo 2, for a smaller game on the whole, the game play took longer. There was more reason to get to the next level or the next chapter. There was overall more reward for playing the game.

Yeah, if you think that Diablo 3 is 'More complex' a game than Diablo 2, I am thinking you need a dictionary.

Again, Diablo 3 was a above average game. But nothing more. Trying to sell yourself (and others) on it's GREATNESS is just foolishness.
 
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PowerYoga

Diamond Member
Nov 6, 2001
4,603
0
0
d3 at launch was more fun than d2 at launch.

People forgot D2 was refined over the course of 10 years and one expansion pack added runewords.
 

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
561
126
In Diablo 3, you aren't underpowered if you use the wrong skills. You are Underpowered if you use any of the skills. And I am not really sure how you can say that there is any depth or strategy to a game. The "Whole" strategy to Diablo 3 is Kite opponents, run away. Kite opponents, run away. If you are a tank, go high vitality and resistances. If you are a caster, go high damage and run like hell. Really in depth strategy there. Also, your choice of abilities is limited to 6, none of which combine or overlap to any degree what so ever. In Diablo 2 you could select from any of your abilities at a moment's notice. Not this 'Click the skills window. Select the Skills 'Group' that you want. Select the Skill that you want. select the 'Rune' that you want to use. Then "Ok", then "Ok" then cool down time. Then cast/use the ability". and there was a fair amount of overlap and cohesion to them such that you could make sub-classes within the classes. Not so in Diablo 3.

Huh? I found a decent combo with my monk that requires me to kite only when I'm taking too much DMG and my abilities are on cool down.

Dash, get the 20% Dodge Buff behidn the target pop Regeneration, deliver a few hits to regen life, target turns around, dash behind him, pop him a few times.

If I get surrounded use the kick + further knock back + slow rune, dash to primary target, recast ally so he's on it with me (who knows where my companion went), 20% dodge buff (sitting at 85% dodge now for about 10 seconds) punch punch, if targets are coming back, kick, dash, punch punch, need health, dash behind, pop regen, if I take a big spike potion + heal, dash. If I need to kite kick, dash and then run away for CDs to restore.

As a melee class, I really don't have a kite option, I have to separate the group, my templar is geared with good tanking stuff so after kicking they often focus on him for a bit while I whiddle down a specific target with my ally.

Sad I don't even know the names of the skills I use haha. I know one is called Boon or something, the rune for the regen matra that lets you get life on hit.
 

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
561
126
Haters gonna hate. End of thread.

Seems like. I'm starting to think Spyder is just looking for things to complain about. At this point, we get it - you don't like D3, just go back to D2:LoD, at least then you might find some happiness.
 

bonkers325

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
13,076
1
0
This coming from someone who thought that both DA2 and Dungeon Siege 3 were good games. Nuff said.

In Diablo 3, you aren't underpowered if you use the wrong skills. You are Underpowered if you use any of the skills. And I am not really sure how you can say that there is any depth or strategy to a game. The "Whole" strategy to Diablo 3 is Kite opponents, run away. Kite opponents, run away. If you are a tank, go high vitality and resistances. If you are a caster, go high damage and run like hell. Really in depth strategy there. Also, your choice of abilities is limited to 6, none of which combine or overlap to any degree what so ever. In Diablo 2 you could select from any of your abilities at a moment's notice. Not this 'Click the skills window. Select the Skills 'Group' that you want. Select the Skill that you want. select the 'Rune' that you want to use. Then "Ok", then "Ok" then cool down time. Then cast/use the ability". and there was a fair amount of overlap and cohesion to them such that you could make sub-classes within the classes. Not so in Diablo 3.

Additionally, as has been stated, in diablo 2, you had to plan out your character. You didn't all of the sudden get all of the abilities. You could make mistakes, but at least you were invested in YOUR character, not the generic toon you get in Diablo 3.

The skill "Tree" isn't a tree at all. It's a sapling. with ONE branch. The items are SIGNIFICANTLY less complex and the drops are eminently less rewarding. There is no variability in your class what so ever. And there is almost no variability between classes (each class has some variant on slow down or trap or hinder opponent. Each class has some variant on multiple hit attacks against multiple opponents, etc...).

In Diablo 2, for a smaller game on the whole, the game play took longer. There was more reason to get to the next level or the next chapter. There was overall more reward for playing the game.

Yeah, if you think that Diablo 3 is 'More complex' a game than Diablo 2, I am thinking you need a dictionary.

Again, Diablo 3 was a above average game. But nothing more. Trying to sell yourself (and others) on it's GREATNESS is just foolishness.

the diablo 3 skill tree is less complex than the diablo 2 skill tree... which had a TON of useless skills and pre-requisites. this is how it went in diablo 2 - 20 skill points in NUKE#1, 20 skill points in NUKE#2, 20 skill points in NUKE#3, 20 skill points in NUKE#4, and pre-reqs and random 1-point talents for utility. pump into enough vitality to not get one-shot, and the rest into your main stat. done.

in diablo 3, all that customization is done through items. all the skills scale off gear, of which you can choose to equip in whichever fashion you want. want a tanky sorc? buy +armor gear, spec into tanky skills, wear a shield, and stack life-on-hit. want to go glass cannon, forego all stats except int and just blow through enemies before they get to you.

the point of such a small skill tree that you can constantly re-spec is this: you can only respec if you arent farming. if you're farming and re-spec, your MF buff gets wiped. want to farm efficiently? pick a spec that is good for farming in whatever act you like to farm. if you feel underpowered, its because you picked the wrong spec that does not work with the gear that you currently own.
 

Wyndru

Diamond Member
Apr 9, 2009
7,318
4
76
Diablo 2 was fun and Diablo 3 is fun.

This.

The only thing I don't like about D3 is the high graphic requirements...which is normal for any new game, but alienates a couple of older laptops I have that play almost any other new game fairly well.

And I don't like the always online requirement, since I travel a lot.
 

Chiropteran

Diamond Member
Nov 14, 2003
9,811
110
106
Is that a load issue on your end? Outside of bosses who have "introduction" sequences (ex: "I'm a kill you LOL!!!!11!!!" then they are attackable). I usually see the start of the cutscene (screen fades) hit ESC, get prompt instantly, hit Yes, cutscene ends. There are some dialogue sequences I wish I could skip, for example saving Adria I have to wait for her and Leah to get all cozy before the wench opens up the portal.

You can always just load in, take the teleporter, and have at it. No cutscenes involved.

I doubt it, playing from an SSD. Also seen it playing multiplayer, with all of us trying to skip the cut-scene, so it's not just me. Perhaps 3 seconds is an exaggeration, but the point is there was always some time before you could skip the cut-scene, and after you choose to skip it it inexplicably waits another couple of seconds before doing so. I am talking about the boss introduction scenes.

Particularly annoying is diablo, where you have to deal with multiple cut-scenes each fight as the phases transition. WHY. Just give me the fight, I watch the cut scenes in normal nightmare and hell do you really think I want to see them every time on inferno also?
 

thespyder

Golden Member
Aug 31, 2006
1,979
0
0
Seems like. I'm starting to think Spyder is just looking for things to complain about. At this point, we get it - you don't like D3, just go back to D2:LoD, at least then you might find some happiness.

I love people who don't know how to read. How many times have I said I like Diablo 3. I just don't sleep with it at night instead of my wife like you guys do.

the diablo 3 skill tree is less complex than the diablo 2 skill tree... which had a TON of useless skills and pre-requisites. this is how it went in diablo 2 - 20 skill points in NUKE#1, 20 skill points in NUKE#2, 20 skill points in NUKE#3, 20 skill points in NUKE#4, and pre-reqs and random 1-point talents for utility. pump into enough vitality to not get one-shot, and the rest into your main stat. done.

in diablo 3, all that customization is done through items. all the skills scale off gear, of which you can choose to equip in whichever fashion you want. want a tanky sorc? buy +armor gear, spec into tanky skills, wear a shield, and stack life-on-hit. want to go glass cannon, forego all stats except int and just blow through enemies before they get to you.

the point of such a small skill tree that you can constantly re-spec is this: you can only respec if you arent farming. if you're farming and re-spec, your MF buff gets wiped. want to farm efficiently? pick a spec that is good for farming in whatever act you like to farm. if you feel underpowered, its because you picked the wrong spec that does not work with the gear that you currently own.

I get that is the way YOU play. Not everyone does. And the problem that people have is there is no investment. You are basically a jack of all trades in Diablo 3 (within class). And you don't have to grow up and make choices that might have consequences. Everything is spoon fed to you such that no decision that you make in the game means anything at all. Diablo 3 is creamed corn.
 
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