Difference between i7ee/i7/i5?

[jhbball]

So, I've narrowed down my processor choice to an i7/i5 for a new system. I have a couple questions.

What's the difference between the i7 and i7 extreme edition processors?

Also, for gaming, is it worth the price jump from an i5, to an i7?

Also, what are the benefits of socket 1156 vs 1366?


As usual, thanks for the help.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Extreme edition chips have unlocked cpu multipliers and are generally best-of-breed when it comes to binning. Usually they aren't worth the money unless you are seriously hardcore about getting the best Intel has to offer within a given generation of CPUs.

As far as gaming goes, it depends on which i5 and which i7 you are talking about here.

You should not even consider an i5 dual-core (Clarksdale)

Personally I do not think you should consider the LGA1156 i7s since all they really offer over i5 quads is hyperthreading, which will not help you in games.

So basically it's down to LGA1156 i5 quad (such as an i5-750) vs. LGA1366 i7 quad (i7-920 d0 stepping).

For single-GPU setups, i5-750 wins due to reduced PCI-e latency.

For multi-GPU setups (Crossfire, SLI), i7-920 d0 wins due to enhanced PCI-e bandwidth.

That should answer your question about the pros and cons of the respective LGA sockets as well.

 

[Ben90]

For single-GPU setups, i5-750 wins due to reduced PCI-e latency.

Do you have an apples to apples comparison of this? I remember a lot of hype pre-lynnfield about how it was going to be amazing for single GPU setups, but from what I've seen the difference seems to be immeasurable. Modern GPUs really don't care if they get a texture 10ns faster because rasterization is much much much more compute bound than IO.

This is not to say that Lynnfield doesn't have other advantages however. There really needs to be a sticky on this topic.

 

[aamsel]

...Personally I do not think you should consider the LGA1156 i7s since all they really offer over i5 quads is hyperthreading, which will not help you in games.

So basically it's down to LGA1156 i5 quad (such as an i5-750) vs. LGA1366 i7 quad (i7-920 d0 stepping).

For single-GPU setups, i5-750 wins due to reduced PCI-e latency.

For multi-GPU setups (Crossfire, SLI), i7-920 d0 wins due to enhanced PCI-e bandwidth.

That should answer your question about the pros and cons of the respective LGA sockets as well.

Several questions:

I picked up a $199 i7 860 last week at MC, and I have been setting up an overclock,
and it also seems that hyperthreading is the "deal killer" on really good overclocks with these chips. With this i7 860 and hyperthreading disabled, I can get 20 x 200 no problem, for 4GHz. With the hyperthreading turned on, the heat increases, and the overclock decreases.

1.) With the hyperthreading disabled, do I effectively have an i5 750 with a higher multiplier? Would there be any other difference between the chips?

I run single GPU only, no need for socket 1366 for me.

2.) Would I have the same PCI-e latency as the i5 750 running my i7 860 with hyperthreading disabled?

 

[Ben90]

1: yes
2: yes

 

[StrangerGuy]

It really depends on what you do with your PC and how much you are willing to spend.

If you are solely into gaming and to save some money, get the i5-750. If you wanna save even more, i3-530.
If you are media encoding/rendering junkie or don't mind spending somewhat more, get the i7-920.

i7s on the 1156 isn't as attractive because it hovers around the 1366 platform price point, and the latter generally overclocks better as it don't have all the useless integrated logic on the CPU.

Extreme Edition of anything Intel is a huge waste of money unless you feel spending a few hours overclocking is worth $600+ of your time.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Do you have an apples to apples comparison of this?

Yes:

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3634&p=16

That pretty much sums it up right there. i5-750 > i7-920 in gaming at the same clockspeed running the same card. Is this Lynnfield's turbo mode being more aggressive or is it PCI-e latency taking effect? I can't say for sure. Maybe it's both.

But if he wants to run games in a single-GPU configuration at stock clocks with turbo mode enabled, Lynnfield wins at the same clockspeed. I would be interested in seeing those tests re-run with turbo disabled, mind you . . .

(also, it is worth noting that a 920 d0 may smoke an i5-750 in terms of overclockability, making it a stronger contender in games once maximum OCs have been realized. There are also some games like MS Flight Simulator X and WoW that are rather CPU-bound that might perform better on the d0. For the OP's purposes, I was assuming that he was interested mostly in GPU-bound gaming).

1.) With the hyperthreading disabled, do I effectively have an i5 750 with a higher multiplier? Would there be any other difference between the chips?


2.) Would I have the same PCI-e latency as the i5 750 running my i7 860 with hyperthreading disabled?

Ben90 beat me to it on both counts, but yes to both questions. Your 860 may clock a bit higher than a 750 due to binning but I wouldn't bank on it. That's still not a bad price for the chip.

 

[teddyv]

If the price were the same for the 860 and 750, is there any real reason to get one over the other? I ask because I am getting ready to do an Intel build (and have a MC nearby) - the price point for the 1156 is about $75 or so cheaper than the 1356 given the cost of motherboards with similar features (sata/USB3, firewire, etc) so I figured I'd go with that. I'd be using it with single gpu, 4 gigs for occasional light gaming, MS Office, some web dev/photoshop 6.0, and some minor-league video and audio transcribing.

Oh, and price the same on the CPU because I was sick last night and had to cancel dinner and a movie date so I figured I saved $50 or so right there ;-)

 

[BeatCrazy]

teddyv, I was in the same boat as you last week. I had even gotten a great price on a EVGA LGA1156 mobo that was already at home. I was waiting for the 860 to maybe go down to $199 at MC.

I ultimately decided 'to heck with it' and went i7-920 with EVGA 1366 board. The increase in price worked out to $85 total. I figured that was worth it to me to possibly (!) upgrade to a hex-core in 12-18 months.

If you stay with LGA1156, go with the 860 for hyperthreading on your video encoding.

 

[aamsel]

teddyv, I was in the same boat as you last week. I had even gotten a great price on a EVGA LGA1156 mobo that was already at home. I was waiting for the 860 to maybe go down to $199 at MC.

I ultimately decided 'to heck with it' and went i7-920 with EVGA 1366 board. The increase in price worked out to $85 total. I figured that was worth it to me to possibly (!) upgrade to a hex-core in 12-18 months.

If you stay with LGA1156, go with the 860 for hyperthreading on your video encoding.

And as you read, I am already in one of those boats. I got the $199 860 at MC the last day of "President's Day" sale week, but already wonder if I should have got the 920. I effectively have a really good 750, since it runs 4.0 at decent temps/voltage without hyperthreading. With the 920 CPU at the same price, it is a tough call, but I will probably hang onto the 1156 rig.

...
Ben90 beat me to it on both counts, but yes to both questions. Your 860 may clock a bit higher than a 750 due to binning but I wouldn't bank on it. That's still not a bad price for the chip.

Also, I get a 21 multiplier with the 860 instead of a 20 with the 750.
However, this chip is rock solid at 20 x 200 @ 1.3v with hyperthreading off.
Turn HT on and it fails OCCT or PRIME quickly.
So, a very "funny" 860, masquerading as a fast 750.

To OP:

My take on the 860 vs 920 is that it seems that 860 owners are in the vast minority.
I don't know if this is a bad thing.
There is also the whole "burn up the socket" thing with 1156 and I am running at 4.0!
It also seems that almost everyone running a P55 board wants a cheap board with a 750.

I have (this moment) a P7P55D Deluxe and an 860 and Corsair XMS, which is more money than
most will put into an 1156 setup. Need to reconsider.

Also, there are few P55 tweakers , that's why they built the "instant overclock" features into them.
The P7P55D Deluxe has a "Crazy OC" setting of 3.08GHz built into it. Ridiculous since I am sitting a 4.0GHz
right now.

 

[Ben90]

That pretty much sums it up right there. i5-750 > i7-920 in gaming at the same clockspeed running the same card. Is this Lynnfield's turbo mode being more aggressive or is it PCI-e latency taking effect? I can't say for sure. Maybe it's both.

But if he wants to run games in a single-GPU configuration at stock clocks with turbo mode enabled, Lynnfield wins at the same clockspeed. I would be interested in seeing those tests re-run with turbo disabled, mind you

Its because of turbo mode. This is what happens when you disable turbo, however it still doesn't show how much the PCI-e latency helps because the Bloomfield has a faster uncore and an extra channel of memory. I doubt we will ever know exact numbers to answer this debate unfortunately. For now all we have is Lynnfield is faster stock/stock, while Bloomfield is faster when manually setting clockspeeds and utilizing triple channel memory.

*edit*
If gaming is the only concern, the i5-750 is still a better bang for your buck most of the time.

 

[biostud]

if you only game and do normal office/web programs -> i5-750
if you do lot of video/picture/3d rendering -> i7
if you want a SLI/CF setup -> i7 socket 1366

it seems that it's easier to overclock processors with HT disabled, so if you're not going to us HT why pay for it?

I've just bought the i5-750 because I don't work with video or heavy photo editing.

 

[n7]

For gaming, i suggest i5 750 unless you want CF/SLI.

i5 750 will OC higher than the HT-enabled chips on average, & will be cheaper than the s1366 platform while offering the same performance.

Don't spend excessive $$$ on the CPU; games will not benefit.
Spend as much as you can on the GPU (e.g., HD 5870 ).

 

[aamsel]

if you only game and do normal office/web programs -> i5-750
if you do lot of video/picture/3d rendering -> i7
if you want a SLI/CF setup -> i7 socket 1366

it seems that it's easier to overclock processors with HT disabled, so if you're not going to us HT why pay for it?

I've just bought the i5-750 because I don't work with video or heavy photo editing.

Well, since I got the 860 for $199 and it is at 4.0GHz with HT off, I would have saved $20 getting the 750 for $179, so I have a 750 with a 21 multiplier. (I have said that several times in case anyone sees another difference). Overall, a fine deal, since it seems that most 750's effectively max out at around 3.8GHz at any tolerable voltage.

So, I paid $20 for HT.

I assume that HT adds more heat to any CPU, including the 920's?

 

[2March]

Well, since I got the 860 for $199 and it is at 4.0GHz with HT off, I would have saved $20 getting the 750 for $179, so I have a 750 with a 21 multiplier. (I have said that several times in case anyone sees another difference). Overall, a fine deal, since it seems that most 750's effectively max out at around 3.8GHz at any tolerable voltage.

So, I paid $20 for HT.

I assume that HT adds more heat to any CPU, including the 920's?

D0's do so at numerous occasions.

 

[aigomorla]

The Big difference with recient EE processors is..

i got six cores while all you guys have 2-4.

Thats what a EE processor is now.

 

[aamsel]

D0's do so at numerous occasions.

A D0 "doing so" doesn't really provide much information.

At what peak temps and voltages, compared to i7-860?

This 860 starts out under 70 degrees peak at 20 x 200, runs a few
minutes, then temps go through the roof after 3-5 minutes or so.

 

[aigomorla]

A D0 "doing so" doesn't really provide much information.

At what peak temps and voltages, compared to i7-860?

This 860 starts out under 70 degrees peak at 20 x 200, runs a few
minutes, then temps go through the roof after 3-5 minutes or so.

each processor will behave differently so you cant really use a basis on judgement like that.

but on a lot of 100 per say you'll have better luck at overclocking on a 920 then you will on a 870.

 

[aamsel]

each processor will behave differently so you cant really use a basis on judgement like that.

but on a lot of 100 per say you'll have better luck at overclocking on a 920 then you will on a 870.

I am never willing to try more than 2 or 3 CPU's.

My decision now is whether 4.0 without HT is worth keeping an 860, or whether to try one or two more 860's or 920's. Even getting them cheap, by the time the used ones are sold and shipped some money will be lost.

 

[Ben90]

The Big difference with recient EE processors is..

i got six cores while all you guys have 2-4.

Thats what a EE processor is now.

No, what you have is an annoying as fuck edition. Do you need to crap on every single thread?

Can someone explain CAS latency to me? I see RAM rated at DDR3-1600@8s vs DDR3-1660@7s. Whats the difference?

Who cares about CAS, as I have a gulftown thats going to be faster than whatever CPU you have, and no matter how low your CAS gets, my computer will be faster

My microwave broke, can I fix it?

I have a 6 core/12 thread CPU thats not released yet!!! im the coolest guy ever, screw your microwave!!!

 

[aigomorla]

No, what you have is an annoying as fuck edition. Do you need to crap on every single thread?

he asked whats the difference between a i7EE vs a regular i7 vs a regular i5.

How am i crapping on the thread?

the i7 980X is a hexcore, while the rest of the i7's are quadcores, and i5 is a dual core.

I am never willing to try more than 2 or 3 CPU's.

My decision now is whether 4.0 without HT is worth keeping an 860, or whether to try one or two more 860's or 920's. Even getting them cheap, by the time the used ones are sold and shipped some money will be lost.

Not unless you want to go hexcore.

I wouldnt change it... its not worth its merit unless you want hexcore.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Its because of turbo mode.

Yeah, figures. The world may never know how PCI-e latency affects anything. I guess if it's that subtle of an effect, it's hardly worth noting . . . but it is a cool factoid.

i5-750 is still a better gaming bargain, in my opinion, especially since you can put one on an h55 board and do okay.

The Big difference with recient EE processors is..

i got six cores while all you guys have 2-4.

Thats what a EE processor is now.

aw cmon, that wasn't even true when the OP asked his question. It is now, of course . . .

 

[Gillbot]

No, what you have is an annoying as fuck edition. Do you need to crap on every single thread?

Calm down. No need to drive this off topic and turn it into a name sling fest.
AT Mod
Gillbot

 

[KamiXkaze]

Just what has already been said
I7EE besides being over clocker heaven un-lockable multiplier, and very soon 6 cores (980X) downside very pricey.
I7 3D rendering CF/Tri SLI triple channel memory plus HT
I5 dual channel ram low PCI-e latency single graphics card use with a few exception (EVGA Classified P55 for example)
I3 mainstream user surfer of the net besides regular use.

kXk