I don't know if the perception is correct or not, but I think Optimus is seen as a much better solution than amd's switching technology also. Has a catchy name and was first to market.
Sorry for such a SNIP
GCN work well with notebooks, but that doesn't negate the point that GCN is not optimized for notebooks. No one needs so much compute performance on a mobile device. Bitcoin mobile mining is not a real thing, is it? Kepler is striped from this YET useless when it comes to gaming fat. That give a little edge over GCN in power consumption and thermals
Sorry for such a SNIP
GCN work well with notebooks, but that doesn't negate the point that GCN is not optimized for notebooks. No one needs so much compute performance on a mobile device. Bitcoin mobile mining is not a real thing, is it? Kepler is striped from this YET useless when it comes to gaming fat. That give a little edge over GCN in power consumption and thermals
When I've recently registered here at Anandtech forum I was hoping to avoid seeing stupid/idiotic fans' (more precisely fanboys) wars that I see so often on Polish forums (I'm from Poland).
Looks like I was wrong, maybe not completely but at least partially: many people here behave exactly this way.
http://translate.google.de/translat...ri-at-2015-and-scoping-ddr4-07262013/&act=urlKaveri determine postponed until after the second quarter of 2014, ASUS has just released A88X motherboards will continue to use until 2015.
The paper noted that in accordance with our hands, AMD is expected to release in 2013, the Kaveri APU determined from the roadmap postponed until the second quarter of 2014, as the launch date, and is currently unable to confirm.
Whatever is causing this delay. Design? It's similar technology that is going in to the 2 unreleased new consoles? I expect, tech sites to publicly wonder this,soon, for the 'news'.
Whatever is causing this delay. Design? It's similar technology that is going in to the 2 unreleased new consoles? I expect, tech sites to publicly wonder this,soon, for the 'news'.
When I've recently registered here at Anandtech forum I was hoping to avoid seeing stupid/idiotic fans' (more precisely fanboys) wars that I see so often on Polish forums (I'm from Poland).
Looks like I was wrong, maybe not completely but at least partially: many people here behave exactly this way.
Jvroig, I can say only: it's a great post and I fully agree with you.
AMD is a technology company not a company that exists to make shareholders money.
No it was a necessity [to pay $5.5 billion USD for ATI]
I think (know for a fact) that AMD looked at alternatives, including a merger with Nvidia. That didn't work out. Back in 2006, who else was making graphics good enough except ATI?
ATI remained competitive with Nvidia but never had anything like the money.
I'm sure you'll be amazed to learn that Tegra has lost Nvidia ~$1/2 billion in the past 4 years, with the worst loss of $208 million coming last year
Yep...just like Nvidia. Now compare Nvidia's staff numbers from 6 years ago vs today, compare their ballooning opex to revenue over the same time-frame. Such green grass on the other side!
A delay might be worth it if we get ddr4, pcie 3.0, sata express, etc.
I'm sorry, but this statement is completely inane. All publically traded companies have an obligation to maximize shareholder value, irrespective of what industry they serve.
Having no GPU technology would have had a significant impact on AMD's future chipmaking. This was not something that was to be left to doubt, or licensed. It made ZERO difference to their upcoming fab problem. Do you know how much 22nm and below costs?No, it was most certainly not a necessity for AMD to purchase ATI at that time, and it was most certainly not a necessity to pay $5.5 billion USD either. As has been explained many times already, AMD financed the purchase of ATI in part through a large amount of debt. Taking on a large amount of debt will always have a significant impact on what future investments a company can make. And at that time, SoC technology was in it's very nascent stages.
Why not? So they could continue to fight Intel at a fab disadvantage and have nothing at all as a differentiator? AMD's integrated graphics are what is keeping it in the game with a garbage CPU core, do you have any idea how bad it would be if they were licensing tech? Do you realise how much more difficult it is to develop the internal bus (onion and garlic, the upcoming hUMA changes) without having this in-house?At that time, all AMD really needed was graphics IP that was good enough to compete against Intel integrated graphics. They most certainly did not need nor require very high end discrete graphics technology at that time.
No that is incorrect.This is incorrect. The operating loss for Tegra was $49.2 million in Fiscal Year 2011, $60.4 million in Fiscal Year 2013, and $157.9 million in Fiscal Year 2013 (with a large portion of the FY2013 operating loss due to costs related in bringing up T4 and T4i with integrated baseband modem at a time when revenue on these products had yet to be realized). Tegra during most of this time period was still a nascent business. Moving forward, Tegra will be profitable because NVIDIA will heavily leverage their existing modern-day GPU architecture.
Yes as I noted, Nvidia opex is ballooning faster than their revenue is increasing as they throw more people into their sinking ship "USS Tegra".At the same time that AMD has been dramatically reducing their workforce, NVIDIA has been increasing their workforce. NVIDIA is building a larger facility to accomodate their expanding workforce. AMD, on the other hand, is hiring a few "high profile" managers plucked from companies such as Apple and NVIDIA, but the general trend in recent years has been a serious reduction in workforce for AMD.
Regarding Tegra:
You have to spend money to make money. To tout "sinking ship" is nonsensical. Nvidia started from scratch, these things take time. If they don't have success with their first mobile Kepler GPU, THEN they should be worried.
And you can get there short term, long term or not at all. The ATI acquisition was a long term play - I realise that to most people this is a bizarre thing to do, but some companies do actually have vision to understand why short term pain is necessary for long term gain.
Having no GPU technology would have had a significant impact on AMD's future chipmaking. This was not something that was to be left to doubt, or licensed. It made ZERO difference to their upcoming fab problem. Do you know how much 22nm and below costs?
Maybe you should read Ruiz's book. He is not so laudatory about the ATI acquisition and strongly hints that a cash buyout wasn't their first choice to engineer the transaction.
When not even Hector Ruiz is willing to defend something, this must be something very fishy or very stupid.
As you noted from JV's post for which you posted the following:
This should not come as a surprise to anyone, but if it needs to be stated in factual manner then so be it - Anand straight-up wants this place to be a comfortable hangout place for fanboys and fangirls of all companies.
Just as Nascar and F1 racing has their fans who like to cheer, get drunk and rowdy, and cheer some more at races. Just as World Cup fans have their favorite teams that they like to go to the pubs and cheer on during the games. Just as the Super Bowl draws football fans, not exactly people who are trained to be professional coaches or quarterbacks but who like to talk like they are all the same...this is exactly what Anand wants in his forums.
I'm not making that up, that isn't some interpretation of my perception. It is the reality.
This isn't meant to be some stoic technical forum the likes of EETimes where everyone carries themselves as if they have a PhD in Electrical Engineering or Physics, where there is no such thing as passions running high because everyone is expected to be reserved and a polished professional.
Those forums exist, and if you need to be in that kind of environment then that is the place to go to. This forum exists for the both, but not to the exclusion of either one.
If you are a fanboy then you are welcome here, just don't become a troll. Trolls and fanboys are difficult to tell apart at times because a fanboy can be as obstinate as a troll, but the difference lies in motivation. A troll's motivation to post is to whip up a flamewar, to bait and goad other's into fighting. A fanboy doesn't operate that way, they just like to celebrate how well their favorite company/product/team is doing.
Anand doesn't want trolls here, and fanboys who act like trolls do so at the risk of getting taken out with the trash.
I write this just to set your personal expectations. You are going to find fanboys and fangirls here at the AnandTech forums, we invite them here and we want them to be comfortable here just like they are invited and are comfortable at their local pub on the eve of the next big race or game.
What we don't want are the hooligans, the trolls. And it is our job (the moderators) to figure out who is the hooligan that needs to be thrown out before the bar-fights break out, versus who is just a fanboy/girl out having a good time with their friends who are also fanboys/girls.
(and yes, mixed into the background are a few folks who also happen to be the stoic PhD types who like to post here and interact in a less-than-professional business setting because it is still fun and relaxing to "talk shop" even when you are away from the shop)
I don't really mind fanboys who 'cheer' something.
OTOH, posting non-stop negative/attack posts/threads against the 'enemy' of your favorite 'team' seems to be almost entirely acceptable here. Non-stop 'pro' threads don't bother me much. Non-stop 'bash' threads just seem like a negative environment to me personally, and this is a relatively new development in the years that I've been here (I'm a relative newcomer, visited since '03, member since '06).
I'm not questioning the policies, but I think that many would agree that this incessant negativity and hostility is not a fun or valuable part of the forums, and in fact is a bane against both common sense and the reasonable exchange of thoughts and ideas.
I'm a big fan of AMD GPUs, and some of their CPUs. I'm a big fan of certain Intel processors, while I think many of them are poor and/or overpriced. I currently own a mix of AMD/NV/Intel/Apple/etc products, and they all work fine for what I expect of them. I find myself defending the forum against trolls here constantly who love to bash some company over and over, but it seems to be a losing war. Just look at the state of this forum now. Virtually every thread derails into flaming, hostility, and mean-spirited sniping. Half the threads start out with that very intention. You can ding me for that if you wish, but I am starting to feel like the effort to wade through the fanboys, shills, and above all, the incessant negative/attack poster is just not worth it.
I'll leave Ruiz's motivations to you mrmt, you sure seem an awful lot interested in him than most people are.
And you can get there short term, long term or not at all. The ATI acquisition was a long term play - I realise that to most people this is a bizarre thing to do, but some companies do actually have vision to understand why short term pain is necessary for long term gain.
Having no GPU technology would have had a significant impact on AMD's future chipmaking.
There is no way AMD could ever afford this. Only Intel, TSMC and GF will be able to afford this kind of outlay.
Why not? So they could continue to fight Intel at a fab disadvantage and have nothing at all as a differentiator? AMD's integrated graphics are what is keeping it in the game with a garbage CPU core
No that is incorrect.
Yes as I noted, Nvidia opex is ballooning faster than their revenue is increasing as they throw more people into their sinking ship "USS Tegra".