Software development must be pretty easy since thousands of people do it. There is no reason for them to beta test according to your posts logic. Hop off the amd hate train and at least be rational when you post.
I was actually under the impression that mantle is alpha software with beta drivers. I thought at GPU 14 they said mantle us alpha currently and sometime late 2014 or 2015 it will go beta and be opened up for other developers who want to try it.
This isn't a Mantle thread guys.
DX 12? DX11.2 is the big leap. DX works fine for me. There is a slim chance I would ever try Mantle for BF4 again, it looked terrible and stuttered.
Mutant - stands to reason that if devs are currently willing to code specifically for Mantle *now*, then more devs would be more willing to when half the job (CPU multi-threading) is already done in DX12.
That assumes that their Mantle strategy isn't to cause exactly this sort of development, which to me seems entirely possible.
That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. If they get multi-threading and lower level draw calls from DX, so that their game is never CPU bottlenecked, why would they bother also adding Mantle support? It seems if DX were made to be good enough, there would be no need to bother coding for another API.
DX 12? DX11.2 is the big leap. DX works fine for me. There is a slim chance I would ever try Mantle for BF4 again, it looked terrible and stuttered.
Mantle is more than just CPU multi-threading support.
The vast majority of which we haven't seen yet. If the CPU multi-threading is mostly a copy/paste job, the devs will have more time to do the GPU stuff above.
- Reduction of command buffers submissions
- Explicit control of resource compression, expands and synchronizations
- Asynchronous DMA queue for data uploads independent from the graphics engine
- Asynchronous compute queue for overlapping of compute and graphics workloads
- Data formats optimizations via flexible buffer/image access
- Advanced Anti-Aliasing features for MSAA/EQAA optimizations
Edit - I should add that a lot of this is the "fun" stuff that the devs would actually want to do.
The problem is the game will still have to be coded to work with both API's, so it is highly unlikely they'd really go too far into using special Mantle features, unless both can achieve the same. At least in BF4, the only notable improvements with Mantle is reducing the CPU bottlenecks. Which is a big deal, but if that can be done through DX, then Mantle won't be needed.
Unless they plan to do PhysX like fluff, Mantle wouldn't be that appealing. The heart of the game still has to work for both Mantle and DX.
That's because too many people only see the nVidia and Microsoft mindset of making everything exclusive and locking out other venders. They don't actually pay any attention to the way AMD conducts business. AMD prefers open standards whenever possible. When they introduce a new feature they don't eliminate the competition from using it. This helps the adoption and expansion of the feature, which is their goal.
You know, most of today's safety features that are incorporated into automobiles were pioneered by Volvo. They have never tried to monopolize them and lock them out from free use by other manufacturers. Not all companies do business the same way.
That assumes that their Mantle strategy isn't to cause exactly this sort of development, which to me seems entirely possible.
Not to mention it would help their lacky APUs foward to remove some of the CPU bottleneck where they falled behind Intel.
AMD is nothing but depressed now that Microsoft acted so quick on the matter. And they should be, not just because they don`t have Mantle to lure people in with, but because DirectX is universal while Mantle only works on GCN GPUs. DirectX is not brand specific. It does not try to favour any system.
To this day I have yet to see Mantle provide something that could even be remotely considered "gotta-have."
http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showpost.php?p=25925026&postcount=1So after not much luck with the previous beta version I was unsure what to expect but have to say I am impressed. FPS is massively improved, 90-120 FPS constant (capped at 120) on a 64 player map, and the release is now stable with no crashes for me. There was a bit of a blip when I first launched BF4 as it started full screen with a border and didn't like being changed to full screen borderless; game hung for a while but then recovered and I was able to make / reverse the change numerous times without further issues.
Video memory use increased by about 600-800 MB but that might be what has contributed to the improved FPS, maybe the driver is utilising the video memory better?
I did think it had caused an issue with throttling the CPU, which I haven't suffered with, but then realised one of the fans on my MSI Gaming R9 290 was stuck again (a different fan to last time this happened). I will have to keep an eye on this but it is easy to detect via the GPU temp in MSI Afterburner and fan speed (when the fan speed is hitting 90% I know there is an issue!)
Andy
Maybe AMD will lose money and Mantle will die off prematurely,
There are a lot oftricksoptimizations that are done purely to limit cpu overhead that effect the artists.
Mantle, despite the vague promises to make it open and that it will run on other hardware, is right now the *epitome* of a closed system. Not only do other vendors not have access to the API, it only will run on AMD hardware.
exactly. because their APUs have problem with CPU performance and could benefit most from lower overhead.
That's because too many people only see the nVidia and Microsoft mindset of making everything exclusive and locking out other venders. They don't actually pay any attention to the way AMD conducts business. AMD prefers open standards whenever possible. When they introduce a new feature they don't eliminate the competition from using it. This helps the adoption and expansion of the feature, which is their goal.
You know, most of today's safety features that are incorporated into automobiles were pioneered by Volvo. They have never tried to monopolize them and lock them out from free use by other manufacturers. Not all companies do business the same way.
How many times has AMD taken the initiative, pioneered a new feature first, by themselves and ultimately kept it open? I can only think of a few cases. AMD very rarely has the appropriate leverage or market share to provide a successful proprietary feature.
Any company that actively supports open standards should be commended but in AMD's case I doubt they actually prefer it, they simply have no other choice.
Tiled resources.in 11.2 were announced months before Mantle.
Mantle can be universal since its not tied to Windows. What about Mantle on SteamOS/Linux/PS4/Xone/Windows7/Windows8...?
Well considering the sdk hasn't been released yet and it's still beta software, it's asking a bit much. I don't see why AMD should detail how Nvidia can make use of it anyway?
All of the devs who have access to it so far have said that there is nothing inherently preventing Nvidia from using Mantle though. It's not hard-wired to GCN. Why not believe them?