Do you think pedophilia is always wrong?

[OutHouse]

isnt pedophilia sex with prepubesent kids?

I read this thread last night and it got me thinking. with the way your society is today, and the sexual maturity of teenagers, i have a hard time calling a 40 year old who falls in love with a 16 or 17 year old a Pedo. but if the same 40 year old does it to a 8 year old, yea now that is totally different.

but what do i know.

 

[Bumrush99]

I could give a rats ass about what people think about, however, I would hate to know my kids were around a sicko pedophile, regardless of whether he ever acted on it.

 

[bleeb]

Originally posted by: Bumrush99
I could give a rats ass about what people think about, however, I would hate to know my kids were around a sicko pedolphile, regardless of whether he ever acted on it.

agreed. pedophile is wrong.

 

[GTaudiophile]

Originally posted by: AgaBooga
As long as they keep it to themselves and don't let anyone know about it, it shouldn't be a problem

I'm sure that's what everyone was telling homos 50 years ago! Now there is something called, "coming out of the closet."

How the times change!

 

[GTaudiophile]

And to the OP: We all know the Internet is big, big enough to have forums that cater to EVERY school of thought. I bet if you used Google wise enough, you could even find forums where pedophiles legally gather to discuss both legal and illegal things. Why don't you go ask them how they feel?

 

[Isla]

Originally posted by: candicec
I'm really glad someone posed this question. I feel it is a definite gray area...

Pedophilia is only as wrong as the society in which it exists, deems it so. In other words, if pedophilia existed in a world (perhaps in the middle ages..etc when it was not uncommon to marry 12 year olds etc.) where the norms allowed for such behavior, then it would not be seen as a vile/disgusting/wrong thing.



As time progressed to the present day we find ourselves in, we have been socialized to see pedophilia as wrong because it is seen as a skew from the norm...an outlier...something which society has deemed unacceptable/illegal...(and implicitly...immoral).

I think the law becomes a slippery slope at times. Someone brought up the example: can cops prosecute someone who had thoughts of molesting little kids and wrote it in a diary? I personally, think not.

I say what people think, fantasize, do in the privacy of their own homes...is fine by me. As long as they are not ACTING out these urges on children. I think pedophilia is illegal with good reason. The simple fact remains that it is unfair for an adult to manipulate a child which is incapable of fully consenting because their mind is still developing, their norms are still being established...they do not possess the full cognitive development adults do. They lack the cognizance to decide yes/no to a sexual act.

Pedophilia in many ways is a matter of control. The law tries to even the playing ground.

candicec

Here's the thing... you are ABSOLUTELY RIGHT about the quote I bolded. Which is ALSO why having those thoughts do suggest that the people who have them need to look inside. We all have less than honorable thoughts at times... but if these thoughts begin to be a sexual habit (and looking at kiddie porn DOES create victims) then the law is justified in calling you out. It almost sounds like you don't think child pornorgraphy is a bad thing. *I say what people think, fantasize, etc... is fine by me* You don't include viewing child porn in that, do you?

 

[Isla]

Originally posted by: candicec
I'm really glad someone posed this question. I feel it is a definite gray area...

Pedophilia is only as wrong as the society in which it exists, deems it so. In other words, if pedophilia existed in a world (perhaps in the middle ages..etc when it was not uncommon to marry 12 year olds etc.) where the norms allowed for such behavior, then it would not be seen as a vile/disgusting/wrong thing.

As time progressed to the present day we find ourselves in, we have been socialized to see pedophilia as wrong because it is seen as a skew from the norm...an outlier...something which society has deemed unacceptable/illegal...(and implicitly...immoral).

I think the law becomes a slippery slope at times. Someone brought up the example: can cops prosecute someone who had thoughts of molesting little kids and wrote it in a diary? I personally, think not.

I say what people think, fantasize, do in the privacy of their own homes...is fine by me. As long as they are not ACTING out these urges on children. I think pedophilia is illegal with good reason. The simple fact remains that it is unfair for an adult to manipulate a child which is incapable of fully consenting because their mind is still developing, their norms are still being established...they do not possess the full cognitive development adults do. They lack the cognizance to decide yes/no to a sexual act.

Pedophilia in many ways is a matter of control. The law tries to even the playing ground.

candicec

 

[JEDI]

Originally posted by: fredtam
Above 13 (below that you are just kind of sick) it is society that deems you a pedophile but not really nature.

wait, girls as young as 9 can have children. so why the 13 cut off if you're judging by biology?

 

[DurocShark]

Wow. Only one person mentioned the key to this discussion.

Once a child reaches puberty, it's our soceity that decides what is pedophilia. Every other animal mates at the first chance. (So do most boys after puberty. )

There are still cultures in this world that don't consider it wrong to marry (or engage in sex) as soon as puberty is reached.

Personally I'm pretty disgusted by the thought of being even with a 20 year old unless she was REALLY mentally and emotionally mature. But that's because most younger women bore me to tears. There sexy women or girls of all ages. But I'm rarely attracted to them. They like have to talk and stuff. Ewww.

 

[djheater]

Originally posted by: vi_edit
Conjecture on my part -

Pedophilia is a disease or a mental disorder.

Homosexuality is not with no bond between the two.

Consentual sex between adults is fine. There is a serious mental breakdown going on when an adult is trying to solicit sexual services from a child. And I'm not talking about a 20 year old going after a 16 or 17 year old. We're talking full grown adults going after children that are unable to comprehend what exactly is going on.

As far as not acting on it, is it illegal, no. Is it unhealthy, yes.

I agree completely.

The idea of 18 being an age at which sexuality is mature is silly but useful.
Sexuality is biological, once the hormones start flowing it's ON.
Any person who has passed through puberty and is sexually attracted to someone who has not passed through puberty is a pedophile and should seek counseling.

Homosexuality is a completely and I mean COMPLETELY different subject.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: JEDI

Originally posted by: fredtam
Above 13 (below that you are just kind of sick) it is society that deems you a pedophile but not really nature.

wait, girls as young as 9 can have children. so why the 13 cut off if you're judging by biology?

Girls theoretically can have children that early because they begin ovulating, but biology also takes into account what age is best for the health of the mother and child during pregnancy and birth.

A nine year old getting pregnant could have major complications during pregnancy and child birth. A thirteen year old would have significantly less complications. It is nature to reproduce at an age that will produce the healthiest offpsring with the least risk.

 

[obiwaynekenobi]

Originally posted by: thirtythree
Say a person is attracted to kids, but he doesn't know why, and he doesn't act on his impulses... would you consider him a pervert? The reason I ask is because I wonder how one becomes a pedophile. Is it just the way a person is, like homosexuals for example?

you are one sick monkey.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: bleeb
Yes. Pedophile is ALWAYS wrong.

Agreed.

 

[Isla]

Originally posted by: DurocShark
Wow. Only one person mentioned the key to this discussion.

Once a child reaches puberty, it's our soceity that decides what is pedophilia. Every other animal mates at the first chance. (So do most boys after puberty. )

There are still cultures in this world that don't consider it wrong to marry (or engage in sex) as soon as puberty is reached.

Personally I'm pretty disgusted by the thought of being even with a 20 year old unless she was REALLY mentally and emotionally mature. But that's because most younger women bore me to tears. There sexy women or girls of all ages. But I'm rarely attracted to them. They like have to talk and stuff. Ewww.

It's like comparing apples to oranges. In cultures where people mostly live in tribes and 3rd world type conditions, it's the norm for a reason. In our 'modern' societies, there is no longer any need to mate and reproduce at an early age.

Research Papua New Guinea. Tribes there have boys fellate the men so that they can ingest the sperm that will make them men. The women also sexual molest and abuse the children. It's the norm for them. They are also very dysfunctional and suffer from a lot of anger and violence within their ranks.

 

[polm]

Originally posted by: Rage187

Originally posted by: thirtythree


Uhh... so if you're attracted to men throughout your whole life but never court men, you're not gay?

Unless you commit a physical act of homosexuality, no you would not be gay.

thats the most rediculous thing I have ever heard. Do you live in Louisiana ?

 

[GTaudiophile]

Originally posted by: candicec
I'm really glad someone posed this question. I feel it is a definite gray area...

Pedophilia is only as wrong as the society in which it exists, deems it so. In other words, if pedophilia existed in a world (perhaps in the middle ages..etc when it was not uncommon to marry 12 year olds etc.) where the norms allowed for such behavior, then it would not be seen as a vile/disgusting/wrong thing.

As time progressed to the present day we find ourselves in, we have been socialized to see pedophilia as wrong because it is seen as a skew from the norm...an outlier...something which society has deemed unacceptable/illegal...(and implicitly...immoral).

I think the law becomes a slippery slope at times. Someone brought up the example: can cops prosecute someone who had thoughts of molesting little kids and wrote it in a diary? I personally, think not.

I say what people think, fantasize, do in the privacy of their own homes...is fine by me. As long as they are not ACTING out these urges on children. I think pedophilia is illegal with good reason. The simple fact remains that it is unfair for an adult to manipulate a child which is incapable of fully consenting because their mind is still developing, their norms are still being established...they do not possess the full cognitive development adults do. They lack the cognizance to decide yes/no to a sexual act.

Pedophilia in many ways is a matter of control. The law tries to even the playing ground.

candicec

Very good response.

We ALL know this forum has a fair share of people who have decent pr0n collections! I also think it's safe to assume, that if you REALLY want to find kiddie pr0n on the Internet, you can find it almost as easily as any other form of pr0n.

What do you think about a pedophile whose ONLY sexual outlet EVER, because his or her ONLY sexual attraction is to children, has been to gratify himself or herself while looking at kiddie pr0n? He or she has never distributed it. He or she has never produced it. He or she has never downloaded it from the workplace. He or she has ONLY kept that material in the privacy of his or her own home. What do you think about them?

I ask because I bet the above encompasses the majority of pedophiles. There are many people who think about killing someone but very few who actually go through with it.

Put yourself in their shoes for a moment: Suppose in society "X", sex with adult women was deemed illegal. In fact, if even caught with pictures of naked women, you could be sent to prison, possibly killed while there (even though not given the dealth penalty) and upon your return to "freedom" after having done the "time" mandated by a jury of your peers, you are forced to put your name on a list designed to inhibit your public freedoms for the rest of your life. If that were to happen to me in society "X", I would wonder what happened to the 8th Amendment!


Edit: My personal response would be, that even looking at KP, creates a demand for it somewhere, which in turn causes someone to produce it. So no matter how private someone keeps it, they are contributing to the production somewhere along the line.

 

[candicec]

Originally posted by: Isla

Originally posted by: candicec
I'm really glad someone posed this question. I feel it is a definite gray area...

Pedophilia is only as wrong as the society in which it exists, deems it so. In other words, if pedophilia existed in a world (perhaps in the middle ages..etc when it was not uncommon to marry 12 year olds etc.) where the norms allowed for such behavior, then it would not be seen as a vile/disgusting/wrong thing.



As time progressed to the present day we find ourselves in, we have been socialized to see pedophilia as wrong because it is seen as a skew from the norm...an outlier...something which society has deemed unacceptable/illegal...(and implicitly...immoral).

I think the law becomes a slippery slope at times. Someone brought up the example: can cops prosecute someone who had thoughts of molesting little kids and wrote it in a diary? I personally, think not.

I say what people think, fantasize, do in the privacy of their own homes...is fine by me. As long as they are not ACTING out these urges on children. I think pedophilia is illegal with good reason. The simple fact remains that it is unfair for an adult to manipulate a child which is incapable of fully consenting because their mind is still developing, their norms are still being established...they do not possess the full cognitive development adults do. They lack the cognizance to decide yes/no to a sexual act.

Pedophilia in many ways is a matter of control. The law tries to even the playing ground.

candicec

Here's the thing... you are ABSOLUTELY RIGHT about the quote I bolded. Which is ALSO why having those thoughts do suggest that the people who have them need to look inside. We all have less than honorable thoughts at times... but if these thoughts begin to be a sexual habit (and looking at kiddie porn DOES create victims) then the law is justified in calling you out. It almost sounds like you don't think child pornorgraphy is a bad thing. *I say what people think, fantasize, etc... is fine by me* You don't include viewing child porn in that, do you?

I'm glad you brought that up. This is a very hard question for me to answer. My bf and I were discussing this just lastnight! I was commenting on how that 71 year old man got prosecuted for possession of child pornography after sending in his laptop to be fixed....This fact kind of scares me...Why?

Because the law defines child pornography as pictures/video/material of a sexual nature where the person involved is under the age of 18. That means....any person with a video of traci lords besides (i love you tracy..and a few others) is in posession of child pornography.

It would surprise you the number of videos traci lords has out there..and the availability of them on the net for dl is amazing. Do the people downloading her movies see it as child pornography? Many would say no!! (you can even see some of the responses from anandtech...they say if she looks above 16..13 etc..it's okay..but if she's 7 or 8..then YOU ARE A PERVERT!!)

This just drives home my point that it is a GRAY AREA..maybe not to the LAW...but to many people out there including myself. And if the repairmen had found some traci lords porn (which, im sure many atoter's have)...would they be dragged in for questioning/prosecuted? probably not.

That old man got busted cause the pics on his computer were of 8 year olds etc. They violated those computer repairmen's norms..and so, the guy was reported.

It is hard for me to say I would persecute those who are looking at c.p. and are NOT harming anyone..just fantasizing..But at the same time, they are in way contributing to the manipulation/harm of children by supporting the industry/demand for it.

If the pics some guys get off on are the kind sold in a hallmark card store, with the little girls and boys naked in the bathtub...(the pics taken during the time were not harming the kids)..and the guy can get off on it..Then that does not bother me. I say let him fantasize..he is not harming anyone.

If the pics are sexually explicit..and had to harm a child in taking the photo..then yes, i feel the possession of that kind of material is wrong.

Hope that clarified things!!

candicec

 

[0roo0roo]

pedo is when the kids so young they have no sexual development. rest is jailbait.

 

[HardcoreRobot]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
pedo is when the kids so young they have no sexual development. rest is jailbait.

This guy is right. Also, the 71 yr old man referenced above had pics of kids 3 - 6 (not 8). This clearly falls into the former category. candicec is right in her assertion that people should be able to do what they want as long as it doesnt harm people. Like someone else mentioned though, acquiring and viewing pedophilac material does create the demand and further stimulate the exploitation of the children (the REAL reason why any of it is wrong at all). So, I think this is where the line should be drawn. Being attracted to little kids (not jailbait) in and of itself is not "wrong" - as long as it stays fantasy and in the head. But, actively pursuing material (or even physically acting it out) should be considered wrong.

All of this stuff is rehashed from stuff already written, I just wanted to pull it together in my own words.

 

[candicec]

Originally posted by: HardcoreRobot

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
pedo is when the kids so young they have no sexual development. rest is jailbait.

This guy is right. Also, the 71 yr old man referenced above had pics of kids 3 - 6 (not 8). This clearly falls into the former category. candicec is right in her assertion that people should be able to do what they want as long as it doesnt harm people. Like someone else mentioned though, acquiring and viewing pedophilac material does create the demand and further stimulate the exploitation of the children (the REAL reason why any of it is wrong at all). So, I think this is where the line should be drawn. Being attracted to little kids (not jailbait) in and of itself is not "wrong" - as long as it stays fantasy and in the head. But, actively pursuing material (or even physically acting it out) should be considered wrong.

All of this stuff is rehashed from stuff already written, I just wanted to pull it together in my own words.

..do I hear an echo??? ha ha ha!

 

[JEDI]

here's an interesting thought...do laws against pedo create a market for pedo?

ie: govt says you cant have it. people have a tendancy to rebel against constraints. thus you want it

 

[waggy]

hmm good question

by definition if you have sex with a 17 year old you are a pedophile (how many are going to say that it is wrong!? besides skywalker and a few other nutcase's).

Now the problem is girls young as 12 are developing and having bodies and feeling that 17 year old girls have. Not to mention as stated in history 12 years was a the time many got married. Once a female starts her period she was not considered a child anymore.

I really can't blame people for being attracted to younger girls. Heck there have been a few i even thought to myself how hot they were. Today's clothing aimed at young girls does look good if they have the body and many do. Granted as a parent i do not like the "little hooker" look but as a man i do enjoy it.


Problem is it is starting to go to really young girls. My wife's aunt has a 11 year old daughter. She has been dressing her in that style for the last 3 years! this poor girl looks like a tramp. Even when she was 9 she was wearing low cut shirts and tight hip hugger. heck there were times she had a camel toe. WTF is a 10 year old doing with a frickin camel toe!?

Now as a parent If i found a guy looking at my 12 year old daughter (she will NOT have the little hooker clothing) i would be upset. sigh such a cath 22 eh?


hmm i just read what i wrote. it makes no sense..I guess i really don't know where i stand on this.

 

[compudog]

Grrrr. Until you have your own children molested by a pedophile. I'm told that there is a propensity for pedophilia, whether trhough biological or learned. Once a pedophile, always a pedophile. Is it wrong? Hell yes, it's wrong. I don't want my kids used to fulfill a pedophile's desires.

 

[Isla]

Waggy,

I know you are a good dad, so I suspect that the longer you are a parent, the more you will want the world to see your daughter for who she is on the inside, and not what she may be worth sexually. I'm sure you already do now, but the feeling grows even stronger with time. You will want to make sure that no one ever takes advantage of her for their own selfish pleasure or gain. As you encounter more and more situations where you realize that the world views your daughter as something to consume (if she is sexually desirable) or something to reject (if she isn't desirable), you'll lean more and more towards wanting to protect ALL children (boys and girls) from being seen this way. There won't be any intellectualizing the matter, you'll just know that all children, every where, deserve to be respected and cherished both physically *and* mentally, and not sexually objectified.

 

[nan0bug]

That's what I love about these high school girls, man. I get older, they stay the same age.