Do you think there is a plan for humanity?

[BudAshes2]

Originally posted by: DainBramaged

Originally posted by: AbAbber2k

Originally posted by: DainBramaged

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: DainBramaged
I believe there is a specific plan for humanity, but most people here don't believe in God much less my particular beliefs.

please im curious, fill me in if you got the time.

I believe that the sole purpose of mankind is for the greater glory of God. Starting from the Garden of Eden when the first humans were created in the image of God, He desired companionship and a creature that would love and respect Him. According to the way that the Bible proceeds, humankind did not follow this plan, choosing instead to rebel against the simple rules that were placed for them.

Sounds like God done fvcked up.

That's the beauty of free will, God wanted us to do things one way but we have the free choice to choose not to do it that way.

The free will defense is so easily countered. If you raise a pit bull and it mauls some kid arent you responsible? This counts even more so in gods case since he would know everything humanity would do before he created it, being omniscient and all.

 

[Caveman]

BudAshes, your logic is flawed.

You would be correct IF humans weren't supplied with all the tools they need to overcome themselves, and transcend their carnality.

We all will have access to the tools at one point in our lives or another. We can use them or throw them away.

The choice is ours.

 

[thecrecarc]

me being a agnostic athesit, i say.. i dunno.

 

[Baked]

Humans living on earth serve zero purpose. When the time comes, a giant meteor that size of moon will hit earth and that will be the end of everything. No heaven or hell, no reincarnation, no Jesus, no variations of gods created by the human imagination.

And when that time comes, the cockroaches will reign supreme over all creatures on earth.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: Vic
Why are the only choices for "plans" either doomsday or doomsday?

Nothing lasts forever right?

You mean YOU don't last forever. Seriously, you have that same "all humanity is evil" mentality as a Catholic or a communist. In truth, humans are just as good as they are evil. If you want justification for your existence, then start looking at the good instead of the evil, and then apply that good within your own life and personal circle of influence.

 

[DainBramaged]

Originally posted by: BudAshes

The free will defense is so easily countered. If you raise a pit bull and it mauls some kid arent you responsible? This counts even more so in gods case since he would know everything humanity would do before he created it, being omniscient and all.

The pit bull is a horrible example since pit bulls are stupid and trained to act a certain way. God created his people to have the ability to make the right choices but it's already been fvcked up so now the best we can do is to take advantage of the free gift that God has provided to those who realize their need.

As long as we have the ability to make the right decisions, God is abolved of any responsibility. Anyway, I'd much rather not have to be a robot.

 

[Miramonti]

There shouldn't be such a problem with a christian stating his beliefs.

However the irony lies in the fact that christians (which I am arguably one) believe there is a way out through Christ, while at the same time are unconscionable co-conspirators to the viral destruction of the earth and its humanity. From one's insatiable appetite for the earth's precious resources to supporting and exercising selfish policies and actions that directly and indirectly lead to destruction of ones fellow inhabitants, including but not limited to humans.

Its as if to say, 'who cares about the sh!thole that I'm thoughtlessly helping to create, I got a free ticket out when the cops come.'

And personally I find that disgusting.

 

[BudAshes2]

Originally posted by: Caveman
BudAshes, your logic is flawed.

You would be correct IF humans weren't supplied with all the tools they need to overcome themselves, and transcend their carnality.

We all will have access to the tools at one point in our lives or another. We can use them or throw them away.

The choice is ours.

You're right my analogy is slightly off, i forgot to mention that you stand there and watch while it mauls the kids.

Doesnt matter which way your trained it, or what tricks you taught it. Its still your own responsibility.

Free will doesnt work with christianity, period. You cant have it both ways. God cant be all powerful while at the same time not be responsible for everything we do.

 

[PrinceofWands]

I don't think there's any kind of grand set plan (like christian or other religious mumbo-jumbo), but I think indifviduals can certainly have purpose. As a race we need to develop a goal of off-wold exploration and settlement, if just for self-preservation.

 

[BudAshes2]

Originally posted by: DainBramaged

Originally posted by: BudAshes

The free will defense is so easily countered. If you raise a pit bull and it mauls some kid arent you responsible? This counts even more so in gods case since he would know everything humanity would do before he created it, being omniscient and all.

The pit bull is a horrible example since pit bulls are stupid and trained to act a certain way. God created his people to have the ability to make the right choices but it's already been fvcked up so now the best we can do is to take advantage of the free gift that God has provided to those who realize their need.

As long as we have the ability to make the right decisions, God is abolved of any responsibility. Anyway, I'd much rather not have to be a robot.

The irony is by accepting christianity you are using some wackos writings from thousands of years ago to program your mind. By accepting christianity and the bible you are becoming like the automaton you despise. The trick has always been never let the programmed realize they are programmed. Because then they just arent nearly as productive.

 

[CKent]

Lol, no.

 

[Blazin Trav]

Our purose is to create things.

And maybe populate a few other planets in the process. I am hoping that someone finds it their purpose to make me live for a very long time.

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: DainBramaged

Originally posted by: BudAshes

The free will defense is so easily countered. If you raise a pit bull and it mauls some kid arent you responsible? This counts even more so in gods case since he would know everything humanity would do before he created it, being omniscient and all.

The pit bull is a horrible example since pit bulls are stupid and trained to act a certain way. God created his people to have the ability to make the right choices but it's already been fvcked up so now the best we can do is to take advantage of the free gift that God has provided to those who realize their need.

As long as we have the ability to make the right decisions, God is abolved of any responsibility. Anyway, I'd much rather not have to be a robot.

The irony is by accepting christianity you are using some wackos writings from thousands of years ago to program your mind. By accepting christianity and the bible you are becoming like the automaton you despise. The trick has always been never let the programmed realize they are programmed. Because then they just arent nearly as productive.

Jackasses come in all shapes, sizes, colors and belief systems. Same with intelligent people. Labelling all christians as you have is every bit as ignorant as you claim them to be. I'm an atheist, btw.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands
I don't think there's any kind of grand set plan (like christian or other religious mumbo-jumbo), but I think indifviduals can certainly have purpose. As a race we need to develop a goal of off-wold exploration and settlement, if just for self-preservation.

I won't disagree with this, but unfortunately it is not feasible given our current level of technology. Consider that the Space Shuttle burns more than half a million gallons of fuel generating over 35 million horsepower just to get into orbit around the earth. Cost is more than $1 billion dollars per launch. And that's just to travel an average of rougly 3,750,000 miles per flight (including orbits, info shamelessly ripped from wiki). Now consider that the one-way distance to Alpha Centauri, the closest solar system to our own, is more than 60,000 times the distance traveled by all the space shuttle flights combined. And yet that's next-door by interstellar standards.

We've got a long, long ways to go. My personal belief is that space travel will not become feasible for humans until we learn how to control and manipulate gravity, or essentially until we can easily and efficiently bend space-time, which may not even be possible.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: DainBramaged

Originally posted by: BudAshes

The free will defense is so easily countered. If you raise a pit bull and it mauls some kid arent you responsible? This counts even more so in gods case since he would know everything humanity would do before he created it, being omniscient and all.

The pit bull is a horrible example since pit bulls are stupid and trained to act a certain way. God created his people to have the ability to make the right choices but it's already been fvcked up so now the best we can do is to take advantage of the free gift that God has provided to those who realize their need.

As long as we have the ability to make the right decisions, God is abolved of any responsibility. Anyway, I'd much rather not have to be a robot.

The irony is by accepting christianity you are using some wackos writings from thousands of years ago to program your mind. By accepting christianity and the bible you are becoming like the automaton you despise. The trick has always been never let the programmed realize they are programmed. Because then they just arent nearly as productive.

You mean as opposed to accepting wacko writings from recent years designed to program your mind?

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands
I don't think there's any kind of grand set plan (like christian or other religious mumbo-jumbo), but I think indifviduals can certainly have purpose. As a race we need to develop a goal of off-wold exploration and settlement, if just for self-preservation.

I won't disagree with this, but unfortunately it is not feasible given our current level of technology. Consider that the Space Shuttle burns more than half a million gallons of fuel generating over 35 million horsepower just to get into orbit around the earth. Cost is more than $1 billion dollars per launch. And that's just to travel an average of rougly 3,750,000 miles per flight (including orbits, info shamelessly ripped from wiki). Now consider that the one-way distance to Alpha Centauri, the closest solar system to our own, is more than 60,000 times the distance traveled by all the space shuttle flights combined. And yet that's next-door by interstellar standards.

We've got a long, long ways to go. My personal belief is that space travel will not become feasible for humans until we learn how to control and manipulate gravity, or essentially until we can easily and efficiently bend space-time, which may not even be possible.

Oh yeah, it's not something coming around the corner. But it has to transcend such limited concepts as money and nationality. Unless we learn to live in balance within our limited resources we'll quickly be in trouble stuck with no where else to go. Having studied human tendancies I'd say we have much more chance of developing off-world colonies than we do of living in peace and harmony in balance with nature.

 

[electrosoccertux]

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor
As a Christian, we read the "plan" in Revelations and, although it's seen through the eyes of a man living 2,000 years ago it sounds pretty damn rough.

Unfortunately self delusion is not one of my virtues.


edit* neither is spelling, in fact im not even sure if i spelled neither right.

No need to troll to satisfy your personal agenda.

 

[BudAshes2]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: DainBramaged

Originally posted by: BudAshes

The free will defense is so easily countered. If you raise a pit bull and it mauls some kid arent you responsible? This counts even more so in gods case since he would know everything humanity would do before he created it, being omniscient and all.

The pit bull is a horrible example since pit bulls are stupid and trained to act a certain way. God created his people to have the ability to make the right choices but it's already been fvcked up so now the best we can do is to take advantage of the free gift that God has provided to those who realize their need.

As long as we have the ability to make the right decisions, God is abolved of any responsibility. Anyway, I'd much rather not have to be a robot.

The irony is by accepting christianity you are using some wackos writings from thousands of years ago to program your mind. By accepting christianity and the bible you are becoming like the automaton you despise. The trick has always been never let the programmed realize they are programmed. Because then they just arent nearly as productive.

You mean as opposed to accepting wacko writings from recent years designed to program your mind?

Like Scientology? Sometimes i think L Ron made scientology up just to mock organised religion.

 

[BudAshes2]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands
I don't think there's any kind of grand set plan (like christian or other religious mumbo-jumbo), but I think indifviduals can certainly have purpose. As a race we need to develop a goal of off-wold exploration and settlement, if just for self-preservation.

I won't disagree with this, but unfortunately it is not feasible given our current level of technology. Consider that the Space Shuttle burns more than half a million gallons of fuel generating over 35 million horsepower just to get into orbit around the earth. Cost is more than $1 billion dollars per launch. And that's just to travel an average of rougly 3,750,000 miles per flight (including orbits, info shamelessly ripped from wiki). Now consider that the one-way distance to Alpha Centauri, the closest solar system to our own, is more than 60,000 times the distance traveled by all the space shuttle flights combined. And yet that's next-door by interstellar standards.

We've got a long, long ways to go. My personal belief is that space travel will not become feasible for humans until we learn how to control and manipulate gravity, or essentially until we can easily and efficiently bend space-time, which may not even be possible.

Oh yeah, it's not something coming around the corner. But it has to transcend such limited concepts as money and nationality. Unless we learn to live in balance within our limited resources we'll quickly be in trouble stuck with no where else to go. Having studied human tendancies I'd say we have much more chance of developing off-world colonies than we do of living in peace and harmony in balance with nature.

Yeah I hope we make it off this rock, cause I dont see us leaving much left behind. Hopefully there will be enough resources to give us the time to devolope the technology we need.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: DainBramaged

Originally posted by: BudAshes

The free will defense is so easily countered. If you raise a pit bull and it mauls some kid arent you responsible? This counts even more so in gods case since he would know everything humanity would do before he created it, being omniscient and all.

The pit bull is a horrible example since pit bulls are stupid and trained to act a certain way. God created his people to have the ability to make the right choices but it's already been fvcked up so now the best we can do is to take advantage of the free gift that God has provided to those who realize their need.

As long as we have the ability to make the right decisions, God is abolved of any responsibility. Anyway, I'd much rather not have to be a robot.

The irony is by accepting christianity you are using some wackos writings from thousands of years ago to program your mind. By accepting christianity and the bible you are becoming like the automaton you despise. The trick has always been never let the programmed realize they are programmed. Because then they just arent nearly as productive.

You mean as opposed to accepting wacko writings from recent years designed to program your mind?

Like Scientology? Sometimes i think L Ron made scientology up just to mock organised religion.

No, like ANYTHING you accept without understanding.

I don't think you realized it, but in being derogatory of ancient human knowledge (and the manner in which you were derogatory), your argument implied that the "authorities" among the human race today are closer to understanding the truth of the human condition than they were thousands of years ago. That is not true.

Whenever you accept what others would teach you without understanding it, you are letting yourself be programmed like an automaton (as you would say). It doesn't matter if it's religion, law, custom, or science.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands
I don't think there's any kind of grand set plan (like christian or other religious mumbo-jumbo), but I think indifviduals can certainly have purpose. As a race we need to develop a goal of off-wold exploration and settlement, if just for self-preservation.

I won't disagree with this, but unfortunately it is not feasible given our current level of technology. Consider that the Space Shuttle burns more than half a million gallons of fuel generating over 35 million horsepower just to get into orbit around the earth. Cost is more than $1 billion dollars per launch. And that's just to travel an average of rougly 3,750,000 miles per flight (including orbits, info shamelessly ripped from wiki). Now consider that the one-way distance to Alpha Centauri, the closest solar system to our own, is more than 60,000 times the distance traveled by all the space shuttle flights combined. And yet that's next-door by interstellar standards.

We've got a long, long ways to go. My personal belief is that space travel will not become feasible for humans until we learn how to control and manipulate gravity, or essentially until we can easily and efficiently bend space-time, which may not even be possible.

Oh yeah, it's not something coming around the corner. But it has to transcend such limited concepts as money and nationality. Unless we learn to live in balance within our limited resources we'll quickly be in trouble stuck with no where else to go. Having studied human tendancies I'd say we have much more chance of developing off-world colonies than we do of living in peace and harmony in balance with nature.

Yeah I hope we make it off this rock, cause I dont see us leaving much left behind. Hopefully there will be enough resources to give us the time to devolope the technology we need.

Case in point. The amount of resources available to the human race are infinite so long as the energy from the sun remains constant. Matter and energy are interchangable and cannot be destroyed. All that we require in order to manipulate matter to our liking is a constant powerful energy source, i.e. the Sun (which is already the source of all energy on earth).
You have accepted the dogma that resources are limited apparently without understanding it (or even questioning it). I think you came to this conclusion because you began with the premise of doomsday or doomsday. I nickname this the "Donnie Darko" phenomenon, where it's easier to accept your own end when you're convinced the whole world is going to end too. I admit it's very appealing.

 

[BudAshes2]

Originally posted by: electrosoccertux

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor
As a Christian, we read the "plan" in Revelations and, although it's seen through the eyes of a man living 2,000 years ago it sounds pretty damn rough.

Unfortunately self delusion is not one of my virtues.


edit* neither is spelling, in fact im not even sure if i spelled neither right.

No need to troll to satisfy your personal agenda.

I really had no agenda here. I just hate christians blathering the same old crap all the time. I cant help but be a d!ck. Its like this friend i have that is a little "special" and he deems it necessary to bring every conversation to magic cards because he loves magic cards. Eventually you just get fed up and every time he mentions magic cards I rag on him so hell learn to just stfu about magic cards. Hes just alienating himself from people by blathering on about some lame game. When he takes his mind off games for a moment he is a nice interesting guy. Hes just afraid to broaden his interests because games are what he knows and his learning disabilties make new things hard.

I didnt ask in this thread to hear what poeple "believe" will happen. I asked what they THINK. That implies using the logic and pattern recognition skills we have as human beings.

 

[BudAshes2]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands
I don't think there's any kind of grand set plan (like christian or other religious mumbo-jumbo), but I think indifviduals can certainly have purpose. As a race we need to develop a goal of off-wold exploration and settlement, if just for self-preservation.

I won't disagree with this, but unfortunately it is not feasible given our current level of technology. Consider that the Space Shuttle burns more than half a million gallons of fuel generating over 35 million horsepower just to get into orbit around the earth. Cost is more than $1 billion dollars per launch. And that's just to travel an average of rougly 3,750,000 miles per flight (including orbits, info shamelessly ripped from wiki). Now consider that the one-way distance to Alpha Centauri, the closest solar system to our own, is more than 60,000 times the distance traveled by all the space shuttle flights combined. And yet that's next-door by interstellar standards.

We've got a long, long ways to go. My personal belief is that space travel will not become feasible for humans until we learn how to control and manipulate gravity, or essentially until we can easily and efficiently bend space-time, which may not even be possible.

Oh yeah, it's not something coming around the corner. But it has to transcend such limited concepts as money and nationality. Unless we learn to live in balance within our limited resources we'll quickly be in trouble stuck with no where else to go. Having studied human tendancies I'd say we have much more chance of developing off-world colonies than we do of living in peace and harmony in balance with nature.

Yeah I hope we make it off this rock, cause I dont see us leaving much left behind. Hopefully there will be enough resources to give us the time to devolope the technology we need.

Case in point. The amount of resources available to the human race are infinite so long as the energy from the sun remains constant. Matter and energy are interchangable and cannot be destroyed. All that we require in order to manipulate matter to our liking is a constant powerful energy source, i.e. the Sun (which is already the source of all energy on earth).
You have accepted the dogma that resources are limited apparently without understanding it (or even questioning it). I think you came to this conclusion because you began with the premise of doomsday or doomsday. I nickname this the "Donnie Darko" phenomenon, where it's easier to accept your own end when you're convinced the whole world is going to end too. I admit it's very appealing.

We need air to breathe, food to eat and a decent size population to continue to reproduce. Resources are only resources if humanity can take advantage of them. Im looking long term here, the world has very likely ended before, so it would be pure folly to say it wont happen again.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: BudAshes

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands
I don't think there's any kind of grand set plan (like christian or other religious mumbo-jumbo), but I think indifviduals can certainly have purpose. As a race we need to develop a goal of off-wold exploration and settlement, if just for self-preservation.

I won't disagree with this, but unfortunately it is not feasible given our current level of technology. Consider that the Space Shuttle burns more than half a million gallons of fuel generating over 35 million horsepower just to get into orbit around the earth. Cost is more than $1 billion dollars per launch. And that's just to travel an average of rougly 3,750,000 miles per flight (including orbits, info shamelessly ripped from wiki). Now consider that the one-way distance to Alpha Centauri, the closest solar system to our own, is more than 60,000 times the distance traveled by all the space shuttle flights combined. And yet that's next-door by interstellar standards.

We've got a long, long ways to go. My personal belief is that space travel will not become feasible for humans until we learn how to control and manipulate gravity, or essentially until we can easily and efficiently bend space-time, which may not even be possible.

Oh yeah, it's not something coming around the corner. But it has to transcend such limited concepts as money and nationality. Unless we learn to live in balance within our limited resources we'll quickly be in trouble stuck with no where else to go. Having studied human tendancies I'd say we have much more chance of developing off-world colonies than we do of living in peace and harmony in balance with nature.

Yeah I hope we make it off this rock, cause I dont see us leaving much left behind. Hopefully there will be enough resources to give us the time to devolope the technology we need.

Case in point. The amount of resources available to the human race are infinite so long as the energy from the sun remains constant. Matter and energy are interchangable and cannot be destroyed. All that we require in order to manipulate matter to our liking is a constant powerful energy source, i.e. the Sun (which is already the source of all energy on earth).
You have accepted the dogma that resources are limited apparently without understanding it (or even questioning it). I think you came to this conclusion because you began with the premise of doomsday or doomsday. I nickname this the "Donnie Darko" phenomenon, where it's easier to accept your own end when you're convinced the whole world is going to end too. I admit it's very appealing.

Resources are most definitely limited. There is certainly a maximum sustainable limit to the Earth. Only so many plants can grow, only so much oxygen can be contained, only so much oil is ready for use, etc. The more human settlement, the less animal and plant habitat. These things are fairly simple and obvious.

Now, if we choose to switch to fully renewable sources, and choose to limit our expansion as a species so that we quit reducing those things which sustain us - then we could survive for a very long time here.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands
Resources are most definitely limited. There is certainly a maximum sustainable limit to the Earth. Only so many plants can grow, only so much oxygen can be contained, only so much oil is ready for use, etc. The more human settlement, the less animal and plant habitat. These things are fairly simple and obvious.

Now, if we choose to switch to fully renewable sources, and choose to limit our expansion as a species so that we quit reducing those things which sustain us - then we could survive for a very long time here.

You seem to do this often: call me wrong with one breath and then right with the next.

Define "fully renewable." All things are essentially the same in nature, and exist in unending cycles of transformation from one state to the next. What we see as waste or "non-renewable" is simply a lack of conservation and/or efficiency on our part, not a representation of finite resources.