Do you think we will finally see a 35W APU only laptop when AMD Raven Ridge launches?

[cbn]

I think this would be a great competitor to a Kaby lake Core i5 + MX150 (Nvidia GP 108) laptop particularly for video editing and/or Blender*

*This if Blender 2.79 brings the touted Open CL improvements---> https://www.blendernation.com/2017/04/12/blender-cycles-opencl-now-par-cuda/

P.S. According to APU silicon Bristol Ridge finally got a 35W APU, but it also came with dGPU:

http://apusilicon.com (its the fifth article down....Dell Inspiron 5576)

 

[insertcarehere]

I don't see why not, AMD sort of need the 35W APU market to prove that it can replace a Kaby Lake-U + dGPU solution running the same ballpark of power consumption, it has far less of a USP down in the ULV lineups...

 

[vinhom]

But can a 35W APU really compete against a 15W CPU + 20W dGPU? GP108 is reaaaaaally power efficient and has more bandwidth with 64bit GDDR5.

 

[Bouowmx]

No, because the only processors that would be released in meaningful quantity would be the performance-restricted 15-W editions, based on history. (not actual info, but some food for thought)

 

[cbn]

No, because the only processors that would be released in meaningful quantity would be the performance-restricted 15-W editions, based on history. (not actual info, but some food for thought)

With Carrizo, they actually released the APU with configurable TDP (it could be either 15W or 35W.....but the manufacturers ended up all going 15W* though because of the DDR3 1600).

*Exception being one Lenovo laptop which has 35W APU, DDR3 1600 and dGPU.

Buy yeah, with Bristol Ridge there were separate 15W and 35W models.

Maybe eventually AMD could get back to one set of models with configurable TDP (like Carrizo), but have the OEMs label it as model [insert name here] if configured as 15W and model [insert name here] if configured as 35W?

 

[cbn]

But can a 35W APU really compete against a 15W CPU + 20W dGPU? GP108 is reaaaaaally power efficient and has more bandwidth with 64bit GDDR5.

Regarding the bandwidth difference (128 bit DDR4 shared between APU's CPU and iGPU vs. 64 bit GDDR5 6000 dedicated to just the MX150) it depends on what the OEMs put in the APU notebooks.

Dual channel DDR4 2400 or DDR4 2667? Or faster? (faster RAM possible with aftermarket SO-DIMMs?)

With that mentioned, the APU should definitely be better for Blender due to the iGPU using system RAM (typically 8GB to 16GB) whereas the MX150 is limited to the 2GB of GDDR5 VRAM.

P.S. MX150 is actually 25W TDP according to the link I have in the OP.

 

[amd6502]

15W should be fine for mainstream. Even 28nm BR APU is performing very well on that power budget; https://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-A10-9620P-SoC-Benchmarks-and-Specs.234384.0.html .

i expect the somewhat pricier models and gaming laptops to be offered at 35W.

If RR'S cTDP's are like the BR A series 9x30p's 25w-45w cTDP's then the mobile RR's should make it into quite a few All-in-one's that should be fairly gaming capable at 45W, exceeding BR desktop as long as OEM's don't put junky 2133 memory in it (or worse, single channel setups). The speed of the memory that OEM's put in there is going to be the limiting factor for performance.

Laptop RAM speed tend to be lower to save energy; I'm guessing 2133 for mainstream and 2400 for enthusiast and gaming laptops; higher end gaming laptops may even come with 2667, which would let RR's iGPU perform pretty well (900p gaming?).

 

[cbn]

Current listings for MX150 laptop at Newegg:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod...ription=MX150&bop=And&Order=PRICE&PageSize=36

Two Youtube reviews on the Acer Aspire 5 (15.6" 1080p LCD, Core i5 7200U, MX150 dGPU, 8GB (4GB RAM soldered on motherboard and one DIMM slot with 4GB SO-DIMM), 256GB SATA M.2 SSD) currently listed at $699.99 Free shipping at Newegg:

And one written review on the Acer Aspire 5 with MX150 from Notebookcheck:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Acer-Aspire-5-A515-51G-7200U-MX150-FHD-Laptop-Review.240090.0.html

P.S. Eventually we should also see MX150 laptops with the 8th Generation Intel laptop processors as well.

 

[cbn]

An article on the 8th generation Intel Core i5 8250U (which I also expect to be paired with MX150):

https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/intel-core-i5-leak-kaby-lake-r/

But this new i5-8250U has not only four physical cores, but it also has hyperthreading. That makes it unlike any other U-series processor on the market today.

After doing some digging, PC Perspective found a number of results in the Geekbench database for the i5-8250U, from upcoming laptops like the Dell XPS 139360. According to the Geekbench results, the quad-core i5-8520U with hyperthreading is capable of outperforming a current generation i5-7200U in multi-core performance by about 54 percent.

Its single-core performance is about the same, though, so it’s a boost you’ll only notice when you’re doing some serious multi-tasking or running processor-intensive applications.

So 15W and 4C/8T with about the same single thread as the Core i5 7200U found in the MX150 equipped Acer laptop of the previous post....but 54% more multi-thread,

With that noted, I do think it will be very interesting to see how the Zen 4C/8T in Raven Ridge compares considering the AMD CPU is very power efficient at low wattage.

 

[cbn]

But can a 35W APU really compete against a 15W CPU + 20W dGPU? GP108 is reaaaaaally power efficient and has more bandwidth with 64bit GDDR5.

Based on the info I put in this post, it might be that the 940MX (GM108) is a competitor as well. (In fact, right now at Newegg there are only 2 laptops (so far) with MX150.....but 19 laptops with 940MX)

So 940MX's 64 bit GDDR5 5000 rather than MX150's 64 bit GDDR5 6000 (which in addition to the 20% higher clockspeed (6000 vs. 5000) also has 20% more delta color compression, see graph below comparing Pascal to Maxwell 2).

 

[cbn]

Any updated info on the progress of 35W?

 

[Shivansps]

If the ZEN APU is using the same chassis and cooling than a MX150+15W intel CPU you can petty much assume that APU is running at 40W TDP. No matter what it says "on the box".

 

[cbn]

If the ZEN APU is using the same chassis and cooling than a MX150+15W intel CPU you can petty much assume that APU is running at 40W TDP. No matter what it says "on the box".

I believe 25W is the max we have seen for so far. This via Mobile XFR.

But I would imagine a 35W APU in one of those chassis would run at least 40W as you are predicting.

 

[cbn]

Speaking of what it says on the box, I am concerned that the specs for 15W (25W XFR) APUs and 35W (?? XFR) APUs won't look much different on paper (See history of specs in post #5 to see what I am talking about).....even though the real world performance would be quite different.

 

[Thunder 57]

If the ZEN APU is using the same chassis and cooling than a MX150+15W intel CPU you can petty much assume that APU is running at 40W TDP. No matter what it says "on the box".

Or, maybe they don't want to have to make a separate chassis and just use one regardless of TDP?

 

[Abwx]

If the ZEN APU is using the same chassis and cooling than a MX150+15W intel CPU you can petty much assume that APU is running at 40W TDP. No matter what it says "on the box".

And no matter what is measured at the wall, i mean if the laptop as a whole use 43W with all things pushed to the max then the APU would still use 40W ?

What kind of math is this ? Viral maths ??

 

[Shivansps]

And no matter what is measured at the wall, i mean if the laptop as a whole use 43W with all things pushed to the max then the APU would still use 40W ?

What kind of math is this ? Viral maths ??

maths that are related to dissipated temperature, you know, TDP = Thermal Design Power. What means if there are 2 CPUs with 80W cooler, they can both boost to 80W TDP = meaning they boost should dissipate the same 80W of heat. Power comsuption should be always higher than TDP, it depends on the CPU power efficiency how much of that power is converted to heat(TDP).

But you cant understand that TDP is not power comsumption of anything because you dont want to undertand.

 

[Abwx]

When i use the term TDP i mean total dissipated power, i know that there are thermal design considerations, but in a tech oriented forum i would imagine that we are talking of the power that is actually consumed by a CPU/SoC/APU or whatever other device under test.

If we are to stick to your definition then all debate is useless since it will revolve around numbers without real dimension, for instance both the FX8350 and FX4350 have a 125W thermal design power but when it comes to power actually consumed under heavy loading the numbers are 105W and 65W respectively, that s more indicative than a TDP that has no meaning, even when it comes to the thermal design itself if we are to look at real numbers..

 

[cbn]

35W Desktop chips arrive:

https://www.anandtech.com/show/12675/amd-launches-ryzen-3-2200ge-ryzen-5-2400ge-35-w-apus

(These should give a good approximation of what a 35W Raven Ridge laptop could do.)

P.S. Poll votes were 13: "Yes" and 0: "No" up until I bumped thread on Feb 9 2018. Now votes are 17: "Yes" and 4: "No".

 

[cbn]

Two SKUs arrive (both 45W with cTDP of 35W to 54W):

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13373/amd-launches-ryzen-7-2800h-ryzen-5-2600h-apus

Specs look good (base clock is substantially higher than the 15W models). Glad to see the DDR4 3200 support.

We have a winner.

 

[amd6502]

The base clocks look nice but I wish they'd have pushed the boost 100+Mhz to ~3.95. Does FP5 have XFR? I guess people will need to wait for 12nm Picasso for 4ghz mobile boosts.

I like the flexibility of these. They should make some excellent top end all-in-ones and a few niche laptops.

 

[frozentundra123456]

Two SKUs arrive (both 45W with cTDP of 35W to 54W):

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13373/amd-launches-ryzen-7-2800h-ryzen-5-2600h-apus

Specs look good (base clock is substantially higher than the 15W models). Glad to see the DDR4 3200 support.

We have a winner.

Those frequencies dont actually look that impressive to me. KL 45W mobile all turbo to at least 4ghz or (considerably) higher, although base clocks are lower, so hard to say how the actual performance will match up.

 

[cbn]

Two SKUs arrive (both 45W with cTDP of 35W to 54W):

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13373/amd-launches-ryzen-7-2800h-ryzen-5-2600h-apus

Specs look good (base clock is substantially higher than the 15W models). Glad to see the DDR4 3200 support.

We have a winner.

Those frequencies dont actually look that impressive to me. KL 45W mobile all turbo to at least 4ghz or (considerably) higher, although base clocks are lower, so hard to say how the actual performance will match up.

One thing to consider when comparing to 45W KL like i7-7920HQ (4C/8T with 3.1 Base and 4.1 Turbo) is that the 45W Raven Ridge also has a bigger iGPU....

.....though the Raven Ridge base clock may be a CPU only clock.

 

[amd6502]

One thing to consider when comparing to 45W KL like i7-7920HQ (4C/8T with 3.1 Base and 4.1 Turbo) is that the 45W Raven Ridge also has a bigger iGPU....

.....though the Raven Ridge base clock may be a CPU only clock.

Seem pretty much like 2400ge that's repackaged and has nice flexible cTDP options. The boost frequencies aren't bad but not the most impressive; it shows how nice an improvement 12nm (pinnacles) is. So for any higher end mobile they'll have to do with a discrete GPU and repackage something like a 2600e or maybe even an 8 core pinnacles. Surely they must be working on lower wattage pinnacles already. Or just wait for Picasso (12nm Zen2 APU) to come out next year.

 

[Mr Evil]

maths that are related to dissipated temperature...

Not sure what this is supposed to mean, as temperature is not something that can be "dissipated".

...Power comsuption should be always higher than TDP...

That entirely depends on how the manufacturer has defined TDP.

... how much of that power is converted to heat...

The amount of power converted to heat by a CPU is always as close to 100% as makes no difference.