Does "Right Turn Signal" imply "No right turn on red"?

[mwtgg]

Originally posted by: EyeMWing
Furthermore, are there any DOT regulations that prevent a township from using what appear to be pink/orange/teal traffic lights as opposed to red/yellow/green? Because those things really make me angry whenever I drive through Dover, PA (yes, the "Intelligent Design" Dover, PA)

Those traffic lights were Intelligently Designed, so unless you want God to set your car on fire, I'd suggest that you never bring it up ever again.

 

[mwtgg]

It is my understanding that in Pennsylvania one can make a right turn on red, unless there is a "No Turn on Red" sign saying otherwise.

 

[EyeMWing]

Originally posted by: mwtgg

Originally posted by: EyeMWing
Furthermore, are there any DOT regulations that prevent a township from using what appear to be pink/orange/teal traffic lights as opposed to red/yellow/green? Because those things really make me angry whenever I drive through Dover, PA (yes, the "Intelligent Design" Dover, PA)

Those traffic lights were Intelligently Designed, so unless you want God to set your car on fire, I'd suggest that you never bring it up ever again.

Did a little further research, and indeed, those are not legal traffic signals. However, there's also precedence that says that the legality of the traffic signal means jack if you're caught running it, it's all based on, and I quote, "what the law enforcement officer believes the signal to mean." Weak.

 

[imported_Baloo]

Traffic laws are explicit, not implied. If your state allows right turn on red, the only time that is not applicable is when there is a sign that explicitely states "No Turn on Red." The sign would be there if a right turn on red was not allowed, since a red arrow would be confusing.

 

[spidey07]

I believe if it is a right turn signal (arrow) you may not turn when red. If you can there is a sign saying you can do so.

Similar to "no left turn on red" or "left turn on red permitted"

-edit- as others have said...probably state dependant.

 

[EyeMWing]

Originally posted by: Baloo
Traffic laws are explicit, not implied. If your state allows right turn on red, the only time that is not applicable is when there is a sign that explicitely states "No Turn on Red." The sign would be there if a right turn on red was not allowed, since a red arrow would be confusing.

Funny thing here is that the cops in the area that I'm talking about believe the opposite (more up in Dover, with their pastel-colored traffic lights than in York, with their silly right turn signal), and have seen fit to tell me so on a few occasions. Never actually ticketed me, though.

 

[xanis]

If there is nothing specifically telling you not to turn on red, then you can do it. The "Right turn signal" sign is more of a suggestion to wait for the turn signal.

 

[DVK916]

Originally posted by: Bahamut1701

Originally posted by: DVK916
In California it means no turn on red, but different states have different laws. But in California you would be ticketed for running a red light.

No...

I think what it means is that there is a right turn signal (ie green arrow) but you can still turn right on a red light. The only time you can't is if there is a RED RIGHT arrow. Least that's how it works here.

That is what I ment. A right turn signal, which is a red arrow pointing to the right.

 

[Kelemvor]

Red Right Arrow just means you have to stop first. It does NOT mean No Turn on Red.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: FrankyJunior
Red Right Arrow just means you have to stop first. It does NOT mean No Turn on Red.

If that were the case why the arrow anyway? If it worked as you described then a normal red light would be correct.

the whole purpose of a right turn light (a red arrow pointing to the right) is saying "you must stop and cannot turn"

 

[drinkmorejava]

Unless it's explicitly stated, except there might randomly be a state or two where you never can, you can always turn on red. Of course, not taking the little ramp turn thingy onto a highway and just turning right at the light itself might not be the best idea.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: Baloo
Traffic laws are explicit, not implied. If your state allows right turn on red, the only time that is not applicable is when there is a sign that explicitely states "No Turn on Red." The sign would be there if a right turn on red was not allowed, since a red arrow would be confusing.

Some people would say that if there's a sign that says Right Turn Signal and it's red, that is explicit - it means you can't turn right when that signal is red. Red means stop.

 

[Jzero]

If it doesn't say "No Turn On Red," I go.

Although I have trouble reconciling this with the "Left Turn Yield on Green" and "Left Turn Signal" signs, the latter meaning you can't go unless you've got a green arrow.

 

[DVK916]

Originally posted by: FrankyJunior
Red Right Arrow just means you have to stop first. It does NOT mean No Turn on Red.

No in California. It means stop and DO NOT GO.

 

[DVK916]

Originally posted by: drinkmorejava
Unless it's explicitly stated, except there might randomly be a state or two where you never can, you can always turn on red. Of course, not taking the little ramp turn thingy onto a highway and just turning right at the light itself might not be the best idea.

I know for a fact that in most states you can notturn against a red arrow pointing to the right.

 

[morkus64]

Yeah, you can turn on red unless there is a sign specifically prohibiting it. Even if you got a ticket, a court would wasily toss it out unless it's explicitly stated. There are some places around here where they have a light even if you can turn on red just because the road is so busy that they need that light to give people a chance to turn right during rush hour.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Unless posted, Right on Red is allowed.
However you must stop before making the turn; you do not have the right of way.
The Right turn signal is for your benifit and safety.
If posted No Right Turn, you are a candiate for a valid ticket.

Also, if you see a place that is marked for No Right On Red and you feel that it is in error, you can notfiy the Federal Highway Admin and they will order the state to look at the intersection.

Notifying the state will not get anything done.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: morkus64
Yeah, you can turn on red unless there is a sign specifically prohibiting it. Even if you got a ticket, a court would wasily toss it out unless it's explicitly stated. There are some places around here where they have a light even if you can turn on red just because the road is so busy that they need that light to give people a chance to turn right during rush hour.

If that is the case then there is no need for a right arrow and a red light will do. Right arrow means "stop, do not go"

It just doesn't follow logic.

the only places I see right arrows are where the crossing left turn traffic needs to move without interruption (or for visibility safety) from people making right turns (read opposing left turn traffic have green arrows to move traffic"

oh well, guess it depends on state.
you can draw the same conclusion when turning left on red/red arrow when two one way streets meet.

turn on normal red light = stop, and then turn if you can proceed safely unless otherwise posted
red right arrow = stop, do not turn.

go figure. my butt isn't turning on a right red arrow unless I have a green light or a green arrow.

 

[EyeMWing]

Shouldn't this be something that's, you know, standardized? Justified with something about inhibiting interstate commerce, perhaps?

 

[Wahsapa]

i thought when it was red right turns are the only ones your allowed to make?

 

[RandomCoil]

In Washington State, this is the law for red arrows: (RCW 46.16.055)
-----------
Vehicle operators facing a steady red arrow indication may not enter the intersection control area to make the movement indicated by such arrow, and unless entering the intersection control area to make such other movement as is permitted by other indications shown at the same time, shall stop at a clearly marked stop line, but if none, before entering a crosswalk on the near side of the intersection control area, or if none, then before entering the intersection control area and shall remain standing until an indication to make the movement indicated by such arrow is shown. However, the vehicle operators facing a steady red arrow indication may, after stopping proceed to make a right turn from a one-way or two-way street into a two-way street or into a one-way street carrying traffic in the direction of the right turn; or a left turn from a one-way street or two-way street into a one-way street carrying traffic in the direction of the left turn; unless a sign posted by competent authority prohibits such movement. Vehicle operators planning to make such turns shall remain stopped to allow other vehicles lawfully within or approaching the intersection control area to complete their movements. Vehicle operators planning to make such turns shall also remain stopped for pedestrians who are lawfully within the intersection control area as required by RCW 46.61.235(1).
-----------
After reading the text, I'm still not sure.

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: Wahsapa
i thought when it was red right turns are the only ones your allowed to make?

Believe it or not, there's a couple LEFT turn lanes here in Seattle, with red arrows, and a sign saying "left turn permitted on red after stopping." They're...nice.

Originally posted by: RandomCoil
In Washington State, this is the law for red arrows: (RCW 46.16.055)
-----------
Vehicle operators facing a steady red arrow indication may not enter the intersection control area to make the movement indicated by such arrow, and unless entering the intersection control area to make such other movement as is permitted by other indications shown at the same time, shall stop at a clearly marked stop line, but if none, before entering a crosswalk on the near side of the intersection control area, or if none, then before entering the intersection control area and shall remain standing until an indication to make the movement indicated by such arrow is shown. However, the vehicle operators facing a steady red arrow indication may, after stopping proceed to make a right turn from a one-way or two-way street into a two-way street or into a one-way street carrying traffic in the direction of the right turn; or a left turn from a one-way street or two-way street into a one-way street carrying traffic in the direction of the left turn; unless a sign posted by competent authority prohibits such movement. Vehicle operators planning to make such turns shall remain stopped to allow other vehicles lawfully within or approaching the intersection control area to complete their movements. Vehicle operators planning to make such turns shall also remain stopped for pedestrians who are lawfully within the intersection control area as required by RCW 46.61.235(1).
-----------
After reading the text, I'm still not sure.

That says that you can't just breeze through a red arrow and make your turn, but you CAN stop, check for traffic, and make the turn.

What gets me is this:

unless a sign posted by competent authority prohibits such movement.

Oh good, there are no restrictions then...

 

[talyn00]

Originally posted by: morkus64
Yeah, you can turn on red unless there is a sign specifically prohibiting it. Even if you got a ticket, a court would wasily toss it out unless it's explicitly stated. There are some places around here where they have a light even if you can turn on red just because the road is so busy that they need that light to give people a chance to turn right during rush hour.

not true for NYC, there are no signs specifically restricting right turns on red within NYC however it is still illegal.

 

[DVK916]

From the California Vehical Code

(c) A driver facing a steady red arrow signal shall not enter the intersection to make the movement indicated by the arrow and, unless entering the intersection to make a movement permitted by another signal, shall stop at a clearly marked limit line, but if none, before entering the crosswalk on the near side of the intersection, or if none, then before entering the intersection, and shall remain stopped until an indication permitting movement is shown.

Thus you cannot turn right on a red arrow.

 

[talyn00]

Originally posted by: DVK916
From the California Vehical Code

(c) A driver facing a steady red arrow signal shall not enter the intersection to make the movement indicated by the arrow and, unless entering the intersection to make a movement permitted by another signal, shall stop at a clearly marked limit line, but if none, before entering the crosswalk on the near side of the intersection, or if none, then before entering the intersection, and shall remain stopped until an indication permitting movement is shown.

Thus you cannot turn right on a red arrow.

perphaps you mean Vehicle ?? there's actually a sign outside a county building in my neighborhood that says Vehical, pretty sad.