Does Windows 8 still stink?

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Maximilian

Lifer
Feb 8, 2004
12,604
15
81
Yep still sucks.

Actually IMO windows is just getting worse and worse over the years. I reinstalled 8.1 the other day and I had to:

- install network drivers (always fun)
- install sound drivers
- install a start menu
- setup the taskbar to not do that retarded combining stuff together
- setup the notification area not to hide stuff from me
- tell windows smartscreen to sod off
- change control panel to small icons instead of that crap it looks like by default
- oh and restart about a million fooking times to update the thing

All this before ive even installed a single program! I tried linux mint, it picks up everything from the word go, has an office suite, has all the stuff I would usually need to install myself, UI isnt crap/annoying by default, hardly ever restarts.

If only league of legends and company of heros ran on linux id jump ship :\
 

G73S

Senior member
Mar 14, 2012
635
0
0
Yep still sucks.

Actually IMO windows is just getting worse and worse over the years. I reinstalled 8.1 the other day and I had to:

- install network drivers (always fun)
- install sound drivers
- install a start menu
- setup the taskbar to not do that retarded combining stuff together
- setup the notification area not to hide stuff from me
- tell windows smartscreen to sod off
- change control panel to small icons instead of that crap it looks like by default
- oh and restart about a million fooking times to update the thing

All this before ive even installed a single program! I tried linux mint, it picks up everything from the word go, has an office suite, has all the stuff I would usually need to install myself, UI isnt crap/annoying by default, hardly ever restarts.

If only league of legends and company of heros ran on linux id jump ship :\

you forgot one thing...

In Windows 7 and earlier, if you wanted to change the icon spacing to allow more text to appear in an icon before the text is trunscated, you can simply do that from the personalization menu.



In 8, you have to do it from the registry. Why!! WHY WHY!! why must they make everything more complicated for a very commonly used setting!

now, here's how to do this simply setting change in Windows 8:

Here's How:

1. Press the Windows + R keys to open the Run dialog, type regedit, and click/tap on OK.

2. If prompted by UAC, then click/tap on Yes.

3. In regedit, navigate to the location below. (see screenshots below steps 4A and 5A)
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Control Panel\Desktop\WindowMetrics


4. To Change the Desktop Icon "Horizontal" Spacing

A) In the right pane of WindowMetrics, double click/tap on IconSpacing to modify it. (see screenshot below)



B) Type in a value between -480 to -2730, and click/tap on OK. (see screenshot below)
NOTE: The default setting is -1125. The minimum amount of space is -480, and the maximum is -2730.




5. To Change the Desktop Icon "Vertical" Spacing
A) In the right pane of WindowMetrics, double click/tap on IconVerticalSpacing to modify it. (see screenshot below)



B) Type in a value between -480 to -2730, and click/tap on OK. (see screenshot below)
NOTE: The default setting is -1125. The minimum amount of space is -480, and the maximum is -2730.



6. When finished, close regedit.

7. Sign out and in of your user account to apply.

8. You may need to repeat the tutorial a few times until you have each of the desktop icon horizontal and vertical spacing values set just how you like it.
 

S3trio64v2

Junior Member
Jun 11, 2014
13
0
0
Why do people keep denying it? Windows 8/8.1 is bad. Just plain bad. Much much worse than Vista and ME.
 

code65536

Golden Member
Mar 7, 2006
1,006
0
76
Why do people keep denying it? Windows 8/8.1 is bad. Just plain bad. Much much worse than Vista and ME.

Why do people keep denying it? Windows 8/8.1 is awesome. Just plain great. Much better than 7 and XP.

Anyone can make statements. But they're kinda pointless unless you elaborate and back them up with some specifics.
 

code65536

Golden Member
Mar 7, 2006
1,006
0
76
Yep still sucks.

Actually IMO windows is just getting worse and worse over the years. I reinstalled 8.1 the other day and I had to:

- install network drivers (always fun)
- install sound drivers
- install a start menu
- setup the taskbar to not do that retarded combining stuff together
- setup the notification area not to hide stuff from me
- tell windows smartscreen to sod off
- change control panel to small icons instead of that crap it looks like by default
- oh and restart about a million fooking times to update the thing

All this before ive even installed a single program! I tried linux mint, it picks up everything from the word go, has an office suite, has all the stuff I would usually need to install myself, UI isnt crap/annoying by default, hardly ever restarts.

If only league of legends and company of heros ran on linux id jump ship :\

And how is any of that unique to Windows 8? The Windows driver model (wherein drivers are separate modules loaded by the kernel, not built into the kernel) allows for a much more diverse device ecosystem, allows for a wider range of supported hardware, and allows for easier installation of devices and drivers (need to recompile the kernel? have fun!)

And what about all the annoyances in setting up Linux? I was installing Mint on a new computer the other day. Printer installation hanged for no apparent reason and had to be killed. Lots of password prompts for what seemed like every bloody thing--I was this close to temporarily changing my password to a 1-character thing because I was so annoyed--at least with Windows UAC, you don't need a password if your user has admin privs.

Taskbar combination started over a decade ago in XP. Notification hiding started over a decade ago in XP. Control panel has been using those big category icons since... you got it, XP. And, really, it's literally two clicks to switch the CP to the classic pre-XP style, and once switched over, it will remain switched over indefinitely. So it's two clicks for the entire life of this OS installation.

You're asked about Smart Screen during the initial setup (and is answering one question really so bad, especially since SmartScreen is probably a good idea for vast majority of users?) Look, the default setting for Windows has to cater to the average Joe because the average Joe isn't likely to change the defaults or even understand the options being offered. Power users can change all the settings around to their delight, which they probably will anyway because every one of us has our own idea of what the ideal settings are.

In Windows 7 and earlier, if you wanted to change the icon spacing
The metrics configuration has been slowly pared down ever since XP. With the loss of Classic Mode in 7, we also lost the settings to change the classic mode UI colors (even though some legacy interfaces still used them). So even in 7, I had to edit the registry to make certain changes (specifically, change the beveling light color, which Microsoft messed up in 2000 and has remained messed-up since--it's one of my personal peeves). Frankly, these old metric settings are things that 99.9% of people don't need or want to change. And it's also a setting that you change once and leave it alone forever. (And you can turn it into a reg file to deploy that setting quickly the next time you set up the OS.)




Which brings me to another point. These complaints are all about the initial setup. Getting settled into the OS. And I'll admit when I first tried Windows 8, I hated it for many of these same reasons--so many things that annoyed me out of the box, like file associations defaulting to Metro apps (thankfully they changed that in U1). But these are all one-time issues. A few extra minutes the first time you use a new OS installation. These complaints are like the complaints made against UAC when Vista first launched--you'll likely see lots of UAC prompts when you first set up the computer, but once everything is settled, they should become rare.

But the benefits of the OS are usually the kind that you experience again and again.

* Switching between thumbnail and detail view. 1-click in Windows 8. Two clicks and extra mouse maneuvers in Windows 7.

* Switching on and off hidden files. 2 clicks in Windows 8. Lots of clicks, along with menu digging and dialog navigation in Windows 7.

* Turning off the WiFi in Windows 8 if your computer doesn't have a physical switch: 2 clicks. You have to dig out that Mobility Center crap in 7.

* Opening elevated command prompt: just 2 clicks in 8.

* And more!

Seriously, if given a choice between saving a few clicks the first time I use the OS or saving a few clicks each and every day for the life of the OS, I think the choice is a pretty clear one, don't you?
 
Last edited:

Hugh Jass

Golden Member
Nov 17, 2011
1,537
23
81
Why do people keep denying it? Windows 8/8.1 is bad. Just plain bad. Much much worse than Vista and ME.

And any credibility you may have had just went right out the door with that overblown hyperbolic nonsense.

Congrats.
 

escrow4

Diamond Member
Feb 4, 2013
3,339
122
106
Yep still sucks.

Actually IMO windows is just getting worse and worse over the years. I reinstalled 8.1 the other day and I had to:

- install network drivers (always fun)
- install sound drivers
- install a start menu
- setup the taskbar to not do that retarded combining stuff together
- setup the notification area not to hide stuff from me
- tell windows smartscreen to sod off
- change control panel to small icons instead of that crap it looks like by default
- oh and restart about a million fooking times to update the thing

All this before ive even installed a single program! I tried linux mint, it picks up everything from the word go, has an office suite, has all the stuff I would usually need to install myself, UI isnt crap/annoying by default, hardly ever restarts.

If only league of legends and company of heros ran on linux id jump ship :\

Linux picks everything from the word go except when it doesn't and decides to half die, whereupon you leap into the command line and start fiddling around with modules, drivers and blacklists, before remembering that this isn't 1995 and why am I still doing this? Windows with modern hardware is click and go on an .exe. That is it.

When was the last time you cracked a cmd prompt and had at it? And Linux will always restart for key services or kernel updates. I run it on a server but I would never ever ever go back to it on a desktop.
 

G73S

Senior member
Mar 14, 2012
635
0
0
Right, I have no issues with adapting to new things like Windows 8's interface. Really, I think if someone cannot adapt to a new OS then they cannot adapt to many things in life which are far more complicated.

Leaving that aside, I just want to know why on earth does Windows 7 win in every benchmark starting from PassMark, 3DMark, AS SSD, etc. over windows 8.1

Whatever happened to Windows 8.1 being more optimized for newer hardware? Either that's a marketing lie, OR maybe Metro running in the background even though we have uninstalled all the apps (that are possible to uninstall anyway) causing some slight CPU usage that hurts the performance?

I wish that would be fixed then I have no issue going back to 8 simply to enjoy the UEFI boot. nothing more nothing less. I am forced to switched to legacy mode to run Windows 7 which takes 3 seconds more on my Alienware 18.
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
31,444
9,348
136
Win 8 doesnt suck, but I'd give it a Meh.

Theres a bunch of stuff in it that seem superfluous (The pre installed Metro apps are truly rubbish on a desktop PC. I dont like the word bloat but the OS is well bloated with a bunch of rubbish) and it shows microsoft going in a direction I dont particularly like (the whole app store and trying to grow an "ecosystem") but doing it in a spectacularly ham fisted way (the app store really, really sucks).

The start screen isn't great and if you're used to, and like, the old start menu and working on the desktop you are probably going to hate it. That said its easy to install one of a multitude of start menu replacements (which goes to show the general, widspread distaste for the start screen).

Some of the improvements people tote are very exaggerated. The start up speed improvements (as someone mentioned earlier) dont really exist, yes you get to see your desktop a bit quicker than before but it takes just as long for it to be usable. Frankly its more annoying this way, you end up franticly clicking on things trying to get them to start up while the OS is busy loading things in the background. The search and launching things using the win key and typing dont really seem to be any different to how they worked in win 7 TBH.

The Task Manager is a lot better, so its your decision if you want to pay however many $s Microsoft is charging for that. You'll have to pay extra if you want to use Windows Media Centre though.

In short if you already have win7 I really wouldnt bother to get win8, if youre on winXP then for the love of bob upgrade to something!
 

RampantAndroid

Diamond Member
Jun 27, 2004
6,591
3
81
See inline for my comments.

Yep still sucks.

Actually IMO windows is just getting worse and worse over the years. I reinstalled 8.1 the other day and I had to:

- install network drivers (always fun) This is a function of the hardware manufacturer not having the default network driver work for them. If windows were to have drivers installed for all possible pieces of hardware, the install base would be massive (it's what, 15GB right now?) If you want things to work out of the box, buy NICs that can run with the built in generic NIC driver. TONS of NICs fit this category right now, actually.
- install sound drivers See above
- install a start menu Personal preference; I suggest you look up Microsoft's announcements on a new start menu
- setup the taskbar to not do that retarded combining stuff together This should be a set once and forget item, if you create a Microsoft account and log in to it during the setup process - settings such as this will then follow your account around as long as you select to set up the machine the same way as your previous machine, and not to set it up as a new machine.
- setup the notification area not to hide stuff from me
- tell windows smartscreen to sod off This, along with the similar feature from Google that's in both the search engine and in Chrome, can save many people from clicking links that would otherwise be trouble. This is great for the average user, less great for power users, I suspect.
- change control panel to small icons instead of that crap it looks like by default
- oh and restart about a million fooking times to update the thing A workaround here could be to download an up to date 8.1 image. Additionally, you could look into hooking up the reset/refresh functionality in Windows 8.x so that the next time you wish to reinstall, you need only hit reset, instead of go through the actual installer.

the only reason I stick to 7 is my benchmarks are 15% in every single benchmark in Windows 7. Why is it that Windows 8.1 is more optimized for newer hardware and SSDs but sucks so much in AS SSD and 3DMark gets m 200 points less in Windows 8.1?????????? how can a dinosaur OS such as Windows 7 perform much better?

8 boots faster? WRONG, it gets u to the desktop faster but then as it starts to load things, they balance each other out. Windows 7 may boot a few seconds slower but the desktop is immediately usable the moment you see the desktop screen.

What are you loading at start time? Turn on time for Windows 8.x for me is pretty instantaneous, but I don't have many programs that run at start time (spotify, lync, onenote, trillian.) You can configure this in the new task manager.

As for SSD performance, everything I've seen puts 8.1 as being faster, or equal (in SSDs and gaming.) In some searching, I found an answers thread that some guy said long file transfers were slower using explorer, but using another file copy program was faster (meaning explorer is at fault, not the lower level mechanics of Windows); he later stated that the June 2014 updates sped things up for him.

http://static.myce.com/images_posts/2013/11/myce-reality-win8.1-vs-win7.png


As for Passmark and other futuremark benches, who cares? It's a synthetic benchmark. Some people still use Win8 for their benches. Some use XP. If you look here, you will actually find a number of Win8 machines (9200 or 9600) in the top scores: http://www.3dmark.com/hall-of-fame-2/ - if Win8 is truly so bad, why is it in the top score listing at all?
 
Last edited:

G73S

Senior member
Mar 14, 2012
635
0
0
See inline for my comments.





What are you loading at start time? Turn on time for Windows 8.x for me is pretty instantaneous, but I don't have many programs that run at start time (spotify, lync, onenote, trillian.) You can configure this in the new task manager.

As for SSD performance, everything I've seen puts 8.1 as being faster, or equal (in SSDs and gaming.) In some searching, I found an answers thread that some guy said long file transfers were slower using explorer, but using another file copy program was faster (meaning explorer is at fault, not the lower level mechanics of Windows); he later stated that the June 2014 updates sped things up for him.

http://static.myce.com/images_posts/2013/11/myce-reality-win8.1-vs-win7.png


As for Passmark and other futuremark benches, who cares? It's a synthetic benchmark. Some people still use Win8 for their benches. Some use XP. If you look here, you will actually find a number of Win8 machines (9200 or 9600) in the top scores: http://www.3dmark.com/hall-of-fame-2/ - if Win8 is truly so bad, why is it in the top score listing at all?

you have just converted me to a Windows 8.1 user with this post.

I hate the Windows Fily Cop Progess Bar in Windows 7 it is so messed up, like I would copy a file of around 4 GB from my SSD to my HDD, and the MB/S would always show 0 in Windows 7 until suddenly the file is copied! that didn't happen in 8.1

I also like the task manager in Windows 8.1

as I said, my only reason to use 7 was the benchmarks but with your post I'll switch back to 8
 

Maximilian

Lifer
Feb 8, 2004
12,604
15
81
Linux picks everything from the word go except when it doesn't and decides to half die, whereupon you leap into the command line and start fiddling around with modules, drivers and blacklists, before remembering that this isn't 1995 and why am I still doing this? Windows with modern hardware is click and go on an .exe. That is it.

When was the last time you cracked a cmd prompt and had at it? And Linux will always restart for key services or kernel updates. I run it on a server but I would never ever ever go back to it on a desktop.

Man I hate the command line, its a bad UI to be forced to use. Yeah Linux has its issues, I managed to wreck a mint install by installing the AMD 14.4 driver from AMD's website, this apparently isnt what im supposed to do to update the drivers :\ Sucks, but to be fair when I was new to windows I hosed it a good few times as well. Ive also got mint on my server, just a few games keeping me from giving it a shot as a daily driver. Im ready for something new :awe:

Issues aside, for something with like 1.5% of the desktop market share that's also free... its pretty goddamn good.
 

Chiefcrowe

Diamond Member
Sep 15, 2008
5,044
184
116
I've been using it for a couple of months and after the initial time getting used to it, it is really nice. The bootup speed is pretty amazing, it's about 10 seconds from power on to opening programs.
 

blankslate

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2008
8,705
507
126
This is a good way for Microsoft to loose the enterprise.

Enterprise is notoriously slow to update. A lot of businesses have just now finished or are finishing a move to windows 7. They totally skipped Vista in a lot of cases.

Windows 9 will be out for a few years and perhaps Widows 10 will be out before businesses see the end of the line for 7.

Win 8 is very good under the hood. Most complaints have been pretty much about the UI and 8.1 has brought many tweaks options that probably would satisfy many of the critics of the 8.0 release if they could be persuaded to give it a chance... but first impressions and all that.


...
 

Torn Mind

Lifer
Nov 25, 2012
11,899
2,716
136
Yep still sucks.

Actually IMO windows is just getting worse and worse over the years. I reinstalled 8.1 the other day and I had to:

- install network drivers (always fun)
- install sound drivers
- install a start menu
- setup the taskbar to not do that retarded combining stuff together
- setup the notification area not to hide stuff from me
- tell windows smartscreen to sod off
- change control panel to small icons instead of that crap it looks like by default
- oh and restart about a million fooking times to update the thing

All this before ive even installed a single program! I tried linux mint, it picks up everything from the word go, has an office suite, has all the stuff I would usually need to install myself, UI isnt crap/annoying by default, hardly ever restarts.

If only league of legends and company of heros ran on linux id jump ship :\
Linux is a time-consuming bitch. I tried to setup zoneminder on Fedora via a VM just to see how it rolls. The wiki documentation was insufficient as a some module was there.
On another computer, SAMBA was a bitch to set up and I still have haven't set it up.

And your list can apply to 7, sans the start menu installation. All your complaints were around during the 7 era and the Vista era.
 

Maximilian

Lifer
Feb 8, 2004
12,604
15
81
Linux is a time-consuming bitch. I tried to setup zoneminder on Fedora via a VM just to see how it rolls. The wiki documentation was insufficient as a some module was there.
On another computer, SAMBA was a bitch to set up and I still have haven't set it up.

And your list can apply to 7, sans the start menu installation. All your complaints were around during the 7 era and the Vista era.

Yeah well my complaints were levvied at windows in general not just 8. Each subsequent iteration of the OS should improve what came before but it dosent, it gets worse.

As for linux, you should have picked something Debian based, preferably some *buntu derivative. Veer from that and yeah it will be difficult.
 

postmortemIA

Diamond Member
Jul 11, 2006
7,721
40
91
so there are improvements in Windows 8 but they are overshadowed by issues introduced. Pure desktop mode with Start replacement and optionally disabled corner actions is OK.

If you are younger and can tolerate mind rape that 8 is - good for you, bent over and take it.
But for most, and that is what statistics are showing ( increase in Macintosh share, decrease of number of PCs bought, etc.) Windows 8 sucks.
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,986
3,320
126
the only reason I stick to 7 is my benchmarks are 15% in every single benchmark in Windows 7. Why is it that Windows 8.1 is more optimized for newer hardware and SSDs but sucks so much in AS SSD and 3DMark gets m 200 points less in Windows 8.1?????????? how can a dinosaur OS such as Windows 7 perform much better?

8 boots faster? WRONG, it gets u to the desktop faster but then as it starts to load things, they balance each other out. Windows 7 may boot a few seconds slower but the desktop is immediately usable the moment you see the desktop screen.
benchmarks mean nothing truthfully.......
 

Mem

Lifer
Apr 23, 2000
21,476
13
81
so there are improvements in Windows 8 but they are overshadowed by issues introduced. Pure desktop mode with Start replacement and optionally disabled corner actions is OK.

If you are younger and can tolerate mind rape that 8 is - good for you, bent over and take it.
But for most, and that is what statistics are showing ( increase in Macintosh share, decrease of number of PCs bought, etc.) Windows 8 sucks.


It's not an issue since Win8 is designed that way,so more of an issue with some users which can be too damn choosey/picky or don't want to adapt to a different or new OS.

How do you think I have moved on since DOS days to modern Windows and Linux distros?..Yes by adapting and learning every new OS that I use including Vista,Win7,8 etc,yes I have seen bigger changes(good and bad) then what some users moan about from 7 to 8 which I consider minor compared to operating systems over the decades.

PCs have been in decline due to other reasons ie competition with other types of hardware,remember years ago PC had no competition but now that's a whole different story.
You want a pure desktop then look at Linux distros since they do it better then any Windows OS you can name.


Regardless got my front seat booked for Win9,can't wait to see what some users moan about with that OS.
Tantrum number nine coming our way .
 
Last edited:

Torn Mind

Lifer
Nov 25, 2012
11,899
2,716
136
Yeah well my complaints were levvied at windows in general not just 8. Each subsequent iteration of the OS should improve what came before but it dosent, it gets worse.

As for linux, you should have picked something Debian based, preferably some *buntu derivative. Veer from that and yeah it will be difficult.

I've been using mostly Debian or Mint the whole time I've used Linux. Fedora was my first venture out of that paradigm. My complaints stem also from the Debian/Ubuntu distros. Firing up Google, searching for a fix, and finally coming across it on a some forum somewhere has been a routine.
 

bbhaag

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2011
6,902
2,264
146
I've been using mostly Debian or Mint the whole time I've used Linux. Fedora was my first venture out of that paradigm. My complaints stem also from the Debian/Ubuntu distros. Firing up Google, searching for a fix, and finally coming across it on a some forum somewhere has been a routine.
This has been my experience as well. I started out using Peppermint OS 3 for a couple years and then recently moved to Mint 17.

I hate to complain but sometimes it can be frustrating. Like when I moved over to Mint 17 I couldn't get Amazon Instant Video to work. So I Googled it and found out I need to install a package called Hal. I found out though that the Hal package has been deprecated for one reason or another. Likely due to DRM. I found a work around by adding a PPA from a guy who is hosting the Hal package. HOLY SHIT....all this just to get Amazon Instant Video to work.
I still can't get Amazon Video to work in Chrome though only Firefox. Apparently Chrome uses PepperFlash not Adobe Flash.....sigh...such is Linux I suppose. Still Googling to figure it out.
 
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