Don't install nVidia's IDE drivers.

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Megatomic

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
20,128
6
81
Originally posted by: Megatomic
I've been a long time NV chipset user and I've always used their SW IDE drivers. Aside from the widely known problems with the 2.41 UDP, their drivers have worked great for me.

Epox 8RDA+
Abit NF7-S R2
MSI K7N2 Delta2-LSR
Soltek K8AN2E-GR
MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum

So as you can see, I've used many of their chipsets. I've not used NF4 yet, but I will soon. I hope to not have problems like some of you are reporting.
Ok, so add an EVGA NF4 SLI to the list of motherboards I've installed the SW IDE drivers on with no problems. Either I've got a lot of good Karma working for me or you all have some serious PEBKAC issues.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,453
10,121
126
This reminds me of what I thought when I was reading the TekRam IDE caching controller driver enginerring change notes - there's a LOT of niggling little incompatibilities between IDE controllers and IDE/ATAPI devices, and part of the maturity and stability of the drive involves working around these issues. MS's IDE/ATAPI driver stack is among the most-tested, most "mature" one available. It's not surprising that it would likewise display the least amount of issues. NV's and VIA's are a lot less mature. A lot of those anecdotal reports of large numbers of systems being built without compatibility issues - perhaps those whitebox systems were built using lines of components that didn't exhibit the compatibility issues that others are finding. That seems the most likely explanation to me.

(And from personal experience - VIA's IDE drivers are really pretty bad, lots of incompatibilities with optical writers, etc., along with other issues. Their later 4-in-1 driver sets actually just re-install the MS IDE driver binary, with a VIA name string on them.)
 

CP5670

Diamond Member
Jun 24, 2004
5,528
604
126
I used the IDE drivers on my old A7N8X nforce2 board for over a year and they worked fine, but after reading about all the problems people have been having I don't think I will be trying them again.

I should also stay from the Nvidia firewall/activearmor thing, right?
 

Megatomic

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
20,128
6
81
Originally posted by: CP5670
I used the IDE drivers on my old A7N8X nforce2 board for over a year and they worked fine, but after reading about all the problems people have been having I don't think I will be trying them again.

I should also stay from the Nvidia firewall/activearmor thing, right?
If you've had no problems with them thus far why would you stop using them now? I personally think more people should use them and provide feedback to NV on how they work with their particular system. I've personally used them on every generation of NV chipsets (except NF1 which I never tried) and had phenomenal success with them. All except the one that was included in NV UDP 2.41 which NV pulled the day it was released.
 

AndyD2k

Senior member
Feb 3, 2003
824
0
71
my plextor burning would not run correctly with nvidia's ide drivers - their tech support even suggest uninstalling them. I'll just use the standard ones.
 

CP5670

Diamond Member
Jun 24, 2004
5,528
604
126
If you've had no problems with them thus far why would you stop using them now? I personally think more people should use them and provide feedback to NV on how they work with their particular system. I've personally used them on every generation of NV chipsets (except NF1 which I never tried) and had phenomenal success with them. All except the one that was included in NV UDP 2.41 which NV pulled the day it was released.

I had no problems with them with my old nforce2 board, but I have been using a K8T800 based board for the last year and will be switching to an nforce4 board next week, so I have to decide whether to use them again or not. I would rather not take chances when it comes to the hard drive though. How much faster are they over the standard windows drivers, anyway?
 

VooDooAddict

Golden Member
Jun 4, 2004
1,057
0
0
Thanks for the post OP.

I haven't had any issues.

The only thing that I've kinda sworn off is the Nvidia Firewall. (Which has been a serious disapointment for me.)

 

pnyxxpress

Guest
Jan 12, 2005
53
0
0
I recently update my chipset drivers to accompany my ambition to upgrade to the most recent bios. Shortly after I get random blue screens. Before the upgrade I was stable as a rock. I finally had enough and went back to the bios that I had good luck with 1004 and back levelled the chipset drivers to those that were shipped with the board. But I'm still getting random blue screens. I'm using sata drives and not the ide mentioned throughout this thread. Can anyone explain what I need to do? Is it possible when installing the older chipset drivers it didn't do a complete removal of the new drivers? Any assiatnce would greatly be appreciated.

Thanks
 

CraigRT

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
31,440
5
0
Originally posted by: Evan Lieb
Originally posted by: doc2345
Originally posted by: John
I've built hundreds of systems using the nForce 2,3,4 chipsets and always install the NVIDIA SW IDE Driver. I have had a couple of them develop an issue when installing the IDE driver, and this was during a clean Windows XP installation. I'm sure that if there was a 'major' problem NVIDIA would have yanked them a long time ago.

I am not disputing the fact that some people have problems, but please understand that a large percentage of the system builder community does not. I've also had my fair share of Via 4-in-1 headaches.
I understand, I've also built hundreds of systems using the nForce 2,3,4 chipsets and the NVIDIA SW IDE Driver has screwed everyone one of them if I chose to install it. Of course, now I don't....

^ Not possible. Seriously.

It's a really bad driver, seriously.. I've seen my fair share of problems installing this driver. Rule of thumb, just don't use it. The systems always work fine without it, and normally bench even better without the NV driver.
 

Cisco2

Member
Nov 15, 2005
26
0
0
For whatever it's worth... I benched the latest nf4 IDE drivers vs. the MS drivers last night with my WD2500KS SATA 2 HD.

HDtach reported 100% identical burst and sustained performances but the MS driver had slightly better CPU utilization (1% vs. 4%) I'll try a "real world" benchmark tonight like the HD part of PCMark '05 and see what happens.

If the results are the same, I'll switch to the MS drivers and future nVidia RAID-0 be damned
 

GadgetBuilder

Member
Dec 28, 2004
148
0
0
Originally posted by: Megatomic
Originally posted by: CP5670
I used the IDE drivers on my old A7N8X nforce2 board for over a year and they worked fine, but after reading about all the problems people have been having I don't think I will be trying them again.

I should also stay from the Nvidia firewall/activearmor thing, right?
If you've had no problems with them thus far why would you stop using them now? I personally think more people should use them and provide feedback to NV on how they work with their particular system. I've personally used them on every generation of NV chipsets (except NF1 which I never tried) and had phenomenal success with them. All except the one that was included in NV UDP 2.41 which NV pulled the day it was released.



I've not seen a way to provide feedback to NV -- perhaps you could provide info on how one gets nVidia's attention?
 

Zap

Elite Member
Oct 13, 1999
22,377
2
81
Here's my story...

I decided to try them out and everything seemed fine. One day I go to use my old CDROM and it doesn't work - with a disc in the system seemed to hang until I removed disc. I wrote it off as a failing part because it was just some old drive I had laying around. Well, turns out it was the Nvidia IDE drivers. I'm guessing it had to do with the drive being old and using PIO mode. My newer drive, an "old" NEC 8X DVDR worked fine with the Nvidia IDE drivers.
 

opuntia

Member
Aug 5, 2004
74
0
0
I?m building my first system soon (ASUS a8n premium and AMD x2 4400+) and I want to make sure I understand the IDE issue.
1. If I?m installing SATA hard drives, do I even need to install an IDE driver?
2. Do the optical and floppy drives require the driver?
3. If I don?t install the driver, will MS XP automatically recognize the hardware (floppy & optical) and install the driver?
4. When installing the NVIDIA drivers, does it even give you the option of not installing the IDE driver?

Thanks in advance for your answers!
 

Zap

Elite Member
Oct 13, 1999
22,377
2
81
1) If you aren't using RAID and are using the ports linked to the nForce chipset, then no. If you are using RAID or are using the separate onboard controller for your boot drive, then you'll need the drivers on a floppy disk to use during Windows setup.

2) No and no.

3) Yes. CD is automatic, as are hard drives hooked up to EIDE and nForce SATA (non RAID). Floppy is not an IDE device so it doesn't need didly squat.

4) Yes. On the current drivers (IIRC) at one point you are given a screen with four check boxes. I think they are:

SM Bus
Network
IDE
Sound

Just uncheck the ones you don't want - in my case IDE and Sound (using PCI card, sound disabled in BIOS). Also, during installation a message popped up asking if I wanted to use nForce network firewall and something-or-other, to which I said no. Some people have problems with that as well.
 

opuntia

Member
Aug 5, 2004
74
0
0
Thanks for the quick reply. I did forget to mention that I do plan on setting up a RAID 1, for which I knew that I had to install the Nvidia SATA RAID controller drive, but is that then the same thing as the IDE driver?

I was also going to install a Western Digital raptor as my main os drive.

Thanks!
 

Alex42471

Member
Sep 7, 2005
28
0
0
I had to re-format/install WinXP a couple of days ago and, man I had such a hard time with this Nvidia IDE drivers. My sata drive wouldn't read or play anything. It was recognized in BIOS and in Windows, but it just wouldn't read or play anything. When I put a cd or dvd into my sata drive after a while, the pc would crash and I would get the BSOD.

I re-installed twice, till I found this thread.

Uninstalled all IDE drivers from Device Manager - re-booted... everything is fine now.

Also, I must say that when I first built my pc, I never had any problems with Nvidia IDE drivers.


 

DasFox

Diamond Member
Sep 4, 2003
4,668
46
91
This is really WAY WRONG for people to tell everyone as a WHOLE to not install the nForce SATA drivers. I've been into computing for many years. I am far from being a newbie and there is one fact I know in computing, that each and everyones hardware configuration will give the end user different results.

With this in mind each person must experiement for themselves what works best, unless there is some proven fact without a doubt across a wide range of platforms, hardware, etc.. that the software/firmware is dangerous, then yes, this is a different story. With the nForce drivers being this way, it is far from the truth.


Without the nForce IDE drivers installed you will loose a very big CHUNK of performance and I do mean a BIG CHUNK. How about in the area of around 25%, I'll call it that and I'll give you a example that I tested and you can see if your performance loss was as big as mine. This is the whole point of these drivers to bring compatibility and performance to the system and if you are not getting it then this is a problem. So what do we do blame the software or blame the hardware, personally I see more people always leaning towards putting blame on software/firmware/drivers, etc...

But one thing is true there is no perfect anything out there. But the better you get at building the better chances you'll have to start making that box trouble free.

One thing to remember here is NOTHING is perfect, so stop blaming everything and everyone and start trying to figure a way to make it work, because of the majority it does and if you are the minority then you have to start looking at why.

Here are the specs on the test machine:
---------------------------------------------
AMD X2 3800+
OCZ OCZ EL DDR PC-3200 Dual Channel Platinum
2 evga 7800 GT CO 256-P2-N516-AX Nvidia
WD Raptor 150 (ADFD)
XP Pro/SP2
Antec Neo HE 550W PSU
------------------------------------------------

I used Winrar to unrar a 4.6GB ISO. With the Windows IDE drivers I ran this and the time for this was 10mins. Now wait a sec, 10 mins on these system specs? Yes that's correct, is your hardware ok, yes, it's in perfect working order. Plus all the while this was going on the Raptor was making some pretty bad grinding sounds like it was really working for this. Given these system specs you'd think that is very odd and it is, truth is my nForce4 system did not like running on Windows's IDE drivers.

Now with the latest nForce AMD drivers 6.70 and with the same 4.6GB ISO the speed increase went to a WHOPPING 2min 30secs, and the drive hardly, this time was making any noise.

Now if you don't think this was a major increase, then I'm not sure what you would consider. This actually happens to be a very worthy way in which to test your systems speed using a very large file to Unrar/Unzip with.

Now you might think who is this clown, well this clown is as good as anyone out there, professionally speaking in the industry to tell you it is a FACT that using the nForce drivers will give you a MAJOR boost in performance. Just play around with a few versions to find one that works for you and if none of them do, then you really need to look at your hardware and ask, WHY?

The facts are that maybe this rig that you think is all to perfect is not and that there is possibly something wrong with it. Lets REMEMBER one thing, let's not go around making false claims over something like nForce firmware, making it out as a evil for all, because this is just down right not true.

And if you never seem to get something like this ever working correct for you, then that motherboard from that particular manufacturer that you seem loyal to, I would start beginning to question and next time look to another board for your next build.

The actual truth is, there are so many board makers out there, that on the overall are not that good, but do ok with a few models they produce. And I find now for many people that it is hard for them to really truly tell.

If you are one of them out there, that gets blue screens of death, system lockups, crashes playing games and crashes in general and freezing, video screen goes nuts, etc.. etc.. and on and on, then don't keep blaming the programs, or software. Chances are you have a overclocked unstable system, or for those that just run stock, then you just have flaky hardware, especially if you experience this often, or from time to time, when the truth is you should never be experiencing this at all, or ever.

Just to give you a idea of what I'm talking here. I have run Windows since 1986 and in that time, I can just about count all my problems, because that is how few they have been.

In 20 years I have probably only had a little over 12-20 problems like this. Why because you have to know your system and hardware and how to make it run properly.

Learn to really know who makes great hardware and who doesn't and in time you too can run smooth and trouble free. And if you think you know it all, guess again you don't and neither do I, but I know enough to tell you what I am right now over this matter and that it is correct!

Remember we never stop learning and if that system of yours just doesn't seem to run as nice as everyone elses, then start looking to some other motherboard and hardware next time you build again.

ALOHA
 

John

Moderator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
33,944
1
0
Originally posted by: Evan Lieb
Originally posted by: doc2345
Originally posted by: John
I've built hundreds of systems using the nForce 2,3,4 chipsets and always install the NVIDIA SW IDE Driver. I have had a couple of them develop an issue when installing the IDE driver, and this was during a clean Windows XP installation. I'm sure that if there was a 'major' problem NVIDIA would have yanked them a long time ago.

I am not disputing the fact that some people have problems, but please understand that a large percentage of the system builder community does not. I've also had my fair share of Via 4-in-1 headaches.
I understand, I've also built hundreds of systems using the nForce 2,3,4 chipsets and the NVIDIA SW IDE Driver has screwed everyone one of them if I chose to install it. Of course, now I don't....

^ Not possible. Seriously.

I agree, it's just not possible. IMHO it appears that the PEBKAC. :Q

DasFox, that was an excellent post. :thumbsup:
 

Megatomic

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
20,128
6
81
I've installed the SW IDE drivers on yet another nForce mobo and still no problems. I can burn on my CD and DVD burner and my CPU usage is low in every disk intensive application I throw at my system.

I look forward to yet another refinement of the SW IDE package.
 

StrangerGuy

Diamond Member
May 9, 2004
8,443
124
106
My NF2 board always worked perfectly fine with the SW IDE drivers. As a side note, I never experienced any problems with any VIA boards and its drivers that I have used.
 

Madwand1

Diamond Member
Jan 23, 2006
3,309
0
76
Originally posted by: opuntia
I do plan on setting up a RAID 1, for which I knew that I had to install the Nvidia SATA RAID controller drive, but is that then the same thing as the IDE driver?

The nVIDIA driver contains a warning and an option to back out of the IDE drivers, so the signs are that nVIDIA doesn't really mind if you don't install their IDE drivers as per the OP.

You do however have to install their IDE drivers if you want to use nVIDIA RAID (you have to install both their IDE driver and their RAID driver). However, it's possible to have the non-RAID'd drives running under the Microsoft drivers while the RAID'd drives are running under nVIDIA drivers.
 

Losty

Golden Member
Oct 23, 2000
1,136
0
0
I haven't had a problem with the nvidia ide drivers ... but i did notice that my computer slows insanely when i burn dvds ... i'm not sure if this is normal, but it takes forever to open internet explorer or any folders when burning dvds.

How do i go about intalling the MS drivers? I tried uninstalling and letting it auto detect, but it installs the last drivers.

-Thanks
 
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