Down With Fancy Book Learnin'

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Interesting points and a really good map. Across America, those of us who are most likely to be involved in a terrorist attack voted Kerry. Rural areas voted Bush.

After living through the worst terrorist attack in American history, Americans in major metropolitan areas recognized the reality of the situation.

Down With Fancy Book Learnin'
What's it mean that the big cities and college towns of America all voted blue?

By Mark Morford, SF Gate Columnist

Friday, November 12, 2004

Is this why everything's so mangled? Is this why we're so divided?

Is this why we're so damned confused and bothered and itchy and wondering why we are ever at each others' throats and ever snickering in each others' direction and ever sighing heavily and wishing we could somehow have a magic glimpse into the year 2104 to see how the hell we survive it all?

Because there remains this astonishing and yet ever present fact: all the major cities of America, the great cultural centers and the places with the most concentrated populations and the most extraordinary restaurants and the highest percentage of college graduates and the most progressive laws and the truest sense of the arts and food and sex and music and dance and money and technology and lubricant and drugs and porn and love and fashion and spirituality, well, it seems they all voted blue.

True. From terrorism-ravaged New York to Botox-ravaged Los Angeles, Chicago to San Francisco, Philly to Portland, Seattle and Miami and Boston and Minneapolis and Detroit -- blue as the sky, blue as the Danube, blue as the color of your soul-crushin' wine-slammin' I-need-a-bath-and-an-emetic postelection melancholy.

And what's so frighteningly cute in a slit-your-karmic-wrists sort of way about this whole election thing is how astoundingly vicious and ingrained and apparent the Great American Culture War has become, has evolved, has mutated and grown and smiled and is right now eating us alive and belching out a great cloud of regressive, conformist exhaust.

The stats bear it out. One look at this astounding 3-D map used by CBS News the day after the election (a.k.a.: "Black Wednesday") and you can see how the various cities and towns of America voted and you sit there and go oh my freaking God wouldja look at that, it's not blue state versus red state after all, but more like blue urban versus red rural, skyscraper versus church house, Chez Panisse versus Denny's.

That is to say, it's all about population density, cultural hub, all about the much-touted "redneck revenge" on the "liberal elite" for unleashing, I suppose, small European cars and artisan cheese and "Queer Eye" and "The West Wing" on them without their express written consent. It is, in short, all about Retro vs. Metro.

But wait, it wasn't just the big cities that went blue. It was also the tiny progressive oases, the small but potent gay-friendly intellectually curious America college towns -- almost anyplace, really, that possesses an above-average university -- that are stuck like glimmering gemstones in a sea of conservativism, that stick out like sore thumbs, like beacons, like hot blue tongues from the very mouth of regressive neocon red.

Kansas City and St. Louis and Iowa City and New Orleans, and Athens, Georgia, Austin, Texas, Durham, North Carolina, Buffalo, New York, and Madison, Wisconsin. All blue. All towns known to be relatively quirky and progressive and safe and kid friendly and beautiful and all-American and replete with big universities and mediocre Thai restaurants and underground music scenes and healthy smatterings of gay culture and lots of gul-dang book-learnin', and every single one of 'em seems to be right in line with the big cities in understanding that Bush is utter poison to anything resembling true juicy spiritual hope or intellectual progress or really exceptional semidrunken sex.

Is this really still the rule? The bigger and more vibrant and more vigorous and more culturally dynamic the city, or the more educated and progressive and literate the small town, the more likely they were to vote blue, Democrat, progressive, open minded, less fearful? Have we progressed almost not at all from the days prior to the Civil War, when the nation was split almost exactly as it is now? Verily, it would appear not, not so much. In fact, it's only getting worse.

Of course, there are plenty of exceptions, plenty of well-educated culturally astute people across the land who somehow still voted for Bush, often against their own interests or deeper conscience and often for antiquated "fiscally conservative" reasons or because it's just how they're wired or because they think Dubya's a "good Christian" and therefore are willing to overlook his mountain of policy failures, or because they just can't bring themselves, even in the face of astounding proofs of Bush's incompetence, to vote for the party of Hillary and Ted Kennedy and Michael Moore.

No, not all city dwellers voted blue. The metropolises are, of course, teeming with conservatives and lib-haters and homophobes, Republican CEOs and phallically challenged Hummer owners and decent Christian folk who don't read the newspaper. And it's also true that liberals and lesbians, tofu eaters and tree huggers, dot the country's rural burgs like sparkles on a heifer, like nails in the tire of the great conservative SUV. The divide is never, despite BushCo's insistence, that clean cut, or that obvious.

The cultural war has always raged on one level or another, has always been a part of the blotchy American complexion. But it has never, until now, penetrated the highest positions of the land. It has never, until now, become the defining element of our society. It has never, sadly, dominated our Congress, our houses of law, our White House, our position in the world.

But there's more to it than that, more to it than the conservative Right's hatred of same-sex marriage or French restaurants or fancy book learnin'. What to make of the astounding fact, for example, that the very places that are most in danger of attack from terrorism -- that is, places like New York, D.C., Los Angeles -- all went overwhelmingly blue?

Put another way, if terrorism was, for the fear-drunk red states, indeed the most galvanizing issue this election, why did those places most susceptible to attack (or, in New York's case, still reeling from one) vote for Kerry in such astounding numbers? What do they know that, say, Kentucky doesn't?

Could it be they understand that Bush has, by way of some of the most irresponsible and violent and disastrous foreign policy in American history, actually increased the chances of another terrorist attack in these places? Or that his policies will transform the current anti-Bush sentiment now raging across Europe into full-blown anti-Americanism? Or that there is more to the world than swearwords on prime-time TV or gay men sharing a wedding cake or Janet Jackson's nipple?

Yes indeed, the Culture War has now penetrated the highest corridors of power, and the red tide has stormed in, taken control, entrenched itself, demanded regression and rollbacks and a return to old-fashioned American values, the ones that demand you read the Bible and fear foreigners and keep your damn legs closed and your mouth shut and quit asking so many prickly questions that make the president blink all confused-like.

Yessir, I guess they showed those goddamn liberals. Guess they showed those damn college boys who's boss. Guess they showed those of us who are most at risk of terror attack and most open to change and most welcoming to the various variations of love and marriage and art and culture in this country who really owns the big stick.

How very unfortunate, then, that we are all to be beaten with it.

 

whalehead

Junior Member
Oct 6, 2004
6
0
0
That is the most pathetic thing I've ever read. I'm sorry that you can't come to grips with losing, but if this is the lesson you take from this election, you are in for many more election night disappointments.



 

CycloWizard

Lifer
Sep 10, 2001
12,348
1
81
It tells me that people with rich parents who pay for their schooling are used to getting handouts and would like to keep it that way. Further, it's a lot easier to hold the liberal viewpoint when you're not concerned with making money to keep yourself alive.

As for being socially liberal, it's been my experience that it's because 99% of the kids in college haven't thought twice about these issues. Since they're in college and financially liberal for the aforementioned reasons, they just go along with all liberal points of view.
 

klah

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2002
7,070
1
0
What to make of the astounding fact, for example, that the very places that are most in danger of attack from terrorism -- that is, places like New York, D.C., Los Angeles -- all went overwhelmingly blue?

They voted for the liberal candidate in every election in the past 50 years, even for McGovern. Correlation != Causation.

 

miketheidiot

Lifer
Sep 3, 2004
11,060
1
0
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
It tells me that people with rich parents who pay for their schooling are used to getting handouts and would like to keep it that way. Further, it's a lot easier to hold the liberal viewpoint when you're not concerned with making money to keep yourself alive.

As for being socially liberal, it's been my experience that it's because 99% of the kids in college haven't thought twice about these issues. Since they're in college and financially liberal for the aforementioned reasons, they just go along with all liberal points of view.

hahahah whatever.

Come back when you have a clue.
 

OneOfTheseDays

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2000
7,052
0
0
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
It tells me that people with rich parents who pay for their schooling are used to getting handouts and would like to keep it that way. Further, it's a lot easier to hold the liberal viewpoint when you're not concerned with making money to keep yourself alive.

As for being socially liberal, it's been my experience that it's because 99% of the kids in college haven't thought twice about these issues. Since they're in college and financially liberal for the aforementioned reasons, they just go along with all liberal points of view.

Seriously, Cyclo thinks he has the whole world and liberal ideology figured out after to talking to 3 or 4 people.
 

CycloWizard

Lifer
Sep 10, 2001
12,348
1
81
Originally posted by: Sudheer Anne
Seriously, Cyclo thinks he has the whole world and liberal ideology figured out after to talking to 3 or 4 people.
Shouldn't you be making more dramatic election predictions? I've attended colleges in several states for the last 5+ years. Amazingly, I've only interacted with 3 or 4 people during that entire time. Your logic is astounding.
 

miketheidiot

Lifer
Sep 3, 2004
11,060
1
0
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
Originally posted by: Sudheer Anne
Seriously, Cyclo thinks he has the whole world and liberal ideology figured out after to talking to 3 or 4 people.
Shouldn't you be making more dramatic election predictions? I've attended colleges in several states for the last 5+ years. Amazingly, I've only interacted with 3 or 4 people during that entire time. Your logic is astounding.

I wouldn't be surprised.
 

Orsorum

Lifer
Dec 26, 2001
27,631
5
81
While I see his point, I find his stigmatization of conservatives to be pointless, offensive, and demeaning.
 

Mookow

Lifer
Apr 24, 2001
10,162
0
0
What it shows is that bribing the electorate still works. And that goes for both parties.

Seriously now, can I get some of whatever that author has been smoking? It's not that the cities voted Kerry, the cities voted Democrat. Just like in 2000. 1996. 1992. 1988. Etc. I guess he has not paid attention to past elections.

That article is just as stupid as if some small town writer decided to make a comparison, slanted the other way, between red and blue counties. And yes, you could make an argument for the red areas (crime rates, for example). And you could mock all the Kerry supporters as either ghetto trash looking for a handout or liberal elitists... but like I said, that would put you on the same level as the guy who wrote this. And that level is known as "dumber than dog shit".
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: BBond
Interesting points and a really good map. Across America, those of us who are most likely to be involved in a terrorist attack voted Kerry. Rural areas voted Bush.

After living through the worst terrorist attack in American history, Americans in major metropolitan areas recognized the reality of the situation.

Down With Fancy Book Learnin'
What's it mean that the big cities and college towns of America all voted blue?

By Mark Morford, SF Gate Columnist

Friday, November 12, 2004


But wait, it wasn't just the big cities that went blue. It was also the tiny progressive oases, the small but potent gay-friendly intellectually curious America college towns -- almost anyplace, really, that possesses an above-average university -- that are stuck like glimmering gemstones in a sea of conservativism, that stick out like sore thumbs, like beacons, like hot blue tongues from the very mouth of regressive neoconred.

Kansas City and St. Louis and Iowa City and New Orleans, and Athens, Georgia, Austin, Texas, Durham, North Carolina, Buffalo, New York, and Madison, Wisconsin. All blue.

:shocked: The Journalist used the "N" word. :shocked:
 

XMan

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
12,513
49
91
I'd be interested to see how many people work in blue areas but live in red ones. The majority of the people I encounter in the city tend to commute in from the suburbs or rural areas.
 

GroundedSailor

Platinum Member
Feb 18, 2001
2,502
0
76
The point here is that even though those places voted blue in past elections, if terrorism was the issue then they should have gone further red, or at least less blue. But in this election they remained blue and the 2 places actually affected by 9/11, NYC & Wash DC, voted overwhelmingly blue.

 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,297
6,355
126
High population density creates brains that function at a much more sophisticated level of social interaction and require a constantly expanding tool set. Socialism is a natural development of socialization. Democracy is a function of socialism and socialization and the progressive needs they foster. High population exposure requires adaptability and low population density requires and promotes conformity to existing norms. We have dynamism in population centers and stasis where populations are thin. When dynamism is thrust on people in stasis they rebel because they don't sense or have any need to evolve and they don't have the neural net to comprehend or keep up. They are basically clueless as to what is going on.
 

bozack

Diamond Member
Jan 14, 2000
7,913
12
81
and this is why many people feel liberal democrats have an elitist complex....this guy needs to get off himself and his compadres.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,297
6,355
126
Originally posted by: bozack
and this is why many people feel liberal democrats have an elitist complex....this guy needs to get off himself and his compadres.

Drag a thousand pound anchor around for a few years and see how you like it.
 

phillyTIM

Golden Member
Jan 12, 2001
1,942
10
81
Moonbeam has a very intelligent, articulate message that proves true from my experience. I grew up in rural America, as a proud, conservative Republican in the 80s-mid-90s. Then I moved to a major metro area and caught the vibe of cultural awareness and projectionism to others thoughts, and quickly found myself to be a supporter of liberal, democratic values...a Democrat.

I hope to God that the proliferation of the Internet leads red-area-America to view things in a bigger, more educated way...with a savvy of those in high-density areas...and have some consideration for others, and identify the need for social progression in order to institute the true American nature in order to compete with the rest of the World.

We had a setback, with the continued broken Regime of Bush/Republicans, for now. And hopefully, again with the Internet and heightened opportunities of awareness, we will learn from the error of our ways (51% of us, that is) and resign conservatism to financial matters, rather than the undercurrent of Soviet-era propoganda and suppressionism that is now sweeping our Nation here in the US.
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
It tells me that people with rich parents who pay for their schooling are used to getting handouts and would like to keep it that way. Further, it's a lot easier to hold the liberal viewpoint when you're not concerned with making money to keep yourself alive.

As for being socially liberal, it's been my experience that it's because 99% of the kids in college haven't thought twice about these issues. Since they're in college and financially liberal for the aforementioned reasons, they just go along with all liberal points of view.

People with rich parents who pay for their schooling = George W. Bush.

And on the subject of handouts, please, you don't want to go there.

Check this out:

Red States Feed at Federal Trough, Blue States Supply the Feed

And the so-called fiscal conservatives who live in the red states have the nerve to complain about people in cities on welfare, when in reality the welfare train starts in the blue states and stops right at their door.

 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
59
86
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
High population density creates brains that function at a much more sophisticated level of social interaction and require a constantly expanding tool set. Socialism is a natural development of socialization. Democracy is a function of socialism and socialization and the progressive needs they foster. High population exposure requires adaptability and low population density requires and promotes conformity to existing norms. We have dynamism in population centers and stasis where populations are thin. When dynamism is thrust on people in stasis they rebel because they don't sense or have any need to evolve and they don't have the neural net to comprehend or keep up. They are basically clueless as to what is going on.
Statements like the one above proves it's much easier to brainwash a group of people when they're all densely packed together in one locale.

 

alchemize

Lifer
Mar 24, 2000
11,486
0
0
Originally posted by: BBond

great cultural centers...most extraordinary restaurants...highest percentage of college graduates ... most progressive laws ... truest sense of the arts and food and sex and music and dance and money and technology and lubricant and drugs and porn and love and fashion and spirituality


...intellectually curious America college towns -- ...an above-average university -- ...glimmering gemstones in a sea of conservativism, ...regressive neocon red.

...bigger and more vibrant and more vigorous and more culturally dynamic the city, ...more educated and progressive and literate the small town, ..., Democrat, progressive, open minded, less fearful?

..."good Christian" ...mountain of policy failures, ...astounding proofs of Bush's incompetence

...teeming with conservatives and lib-haters and homophobes, Republican CEOs and phallically challenged Hummer owners and decent Christian folk who don't read the newspaper.

...conservative Right's hatred of same-sex marriage ...fancy book learnin'.

Bush ...most irresponsible and violent and disastrous foreign policy in American history, increased the chances of another terrorist attack... ...full-blown anti-Americanism?

...read the Bible and fear foreigners and keep your damn legs closed and your mouth shut and quit asking so many prickly questions that make the president blink all confused-like.
Distilled it down.

Democrats intelligent and elite. Republicans ignorant bible thumpers. Gee, never seen this theme before, have we?
 

Tarpon6

Member
May 22, 2002
144
0
0
Originally posted by: phillyTIM
Moonbeam has a very intelligent, articulate message that proves true from my experience. I grew up in rural America, as a proud, conservative Republican in the 80s-mid-90s. Then I moved to a major metro area and caught the vibe of cultural awareness and projectionism to others thoughts, and quickly found myself to be a supporter of liberal, democratic values...a Democrat.

I hope to God that the proliferation of the Internet leads red-area-America to view things in a bigger, more educated way...with a savvy of those in high-density areas...and have some consideration for others, and identify the need for social progression in order to institute the true American nature in order to compete with the rest of the World.

We had a setback, with the continued broken Regime of Bush/Republicans, for now. And hopefully, again with the Internet and heightened opportunities of awareness, we will learn from the error of our ways (51% of us, that is) and resign conservatism to financial matters, rather than the undercurrent of Soviet-era propoganda and suppressionism that is now sweeping our Nation here in the US.


Sounds like you are easlily influenced by those around you. Hey it's cool to be liberal in the big city, so I will be too!
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Originally posted by: alchemize
Originally posted by: BBond

great cultural centers...most extraordinary restaurants...highest percentage of college graduates ... most progressive laws ... truest sense of the arts and food and sex and music and dance and money and technology and lubricant and drugs and porn and love and fashion and spirituality


...intellectually curious America college towns -- ...an above-average university -- ...glimmering gemstones in a sea of conservativism, ...regressive neocon red.

...bigger and more vibrant and more vigorous and more culturally dynamic the city, ...more educated and progressive and literate the small town, ..., Democrat, progressive, open minded, less fearful?

..."good Christian" ...mountain of policy failures, ...astounding proofs of Bush's incompetence

...teeming with conservatives and lib-haters and homophobes, Republican CEOs and phallically challenged Hummer owners and decent Christian folk who don't read the newspaper.

...conservative Right's hatred of same-sex marriage ...fancy book learnin'.

Bush ...most irresponsible and violent and disastrous foreign policy in American history, increased the chances of another terrorist attack... ...full-blown anti-Americanism?

...read the Bible and fear foreigners and keep your damn legs closed and your mouth shut and quit asking so many prickly questions that make the president blink all confused-like.
Distilled it down.

Democrats intelligent and elite. Republicans ignorant bible thumpers. Gee, never seen this theme before, have we?

We saw it on election day.

 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Originally posted by: Tarpon6
Originally posted by: phillyTIM
Moonbeam has a very intelligent, articulate message that proves true from my experience. I grew up in rural America, as a proud, conservative Republican in the 80s-mid-90s. Then I moved to a major metro area and caught the vibe of cultural awareness and projectionism to others thoughts, and quickly found myself to be a supporter of liberal, democratic values...a Democrat.

I hope to God that the proliferation of the Internet leads red-area-America to view things in a bigger, more educated way...with a savvy of those in high-density areas...and have some consideration for others, and identify the need for social progression in order to institute the true American nature in order to compete with the rest of the World.

We had a setback, with the continued broken Regime of Bush/Republicans, for now. And hopefully, again with the Internet and heightened opportunities of awareness, we will learn from the error of our ways (51% of us, that is) and resign conservatism to financial matters, rather than the undercurrent of Soviet-era propoganda and suppressionism that is now sweeping our Nation here in the US.


Sounds like you are easlily influenced by those around you.

You confuse being influenced with learning to live with people in a diverse environment.

Hey it's cool to be liberal in the big city, so I will be too!

The reverse is also true. Hey, it's stupifying to be a neocon in Bumdoodle, living off of the taxes those city folks pay, so I will too.
 

Tarpon6

Member
May 22, 2002
144
0
0
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: Tarpon6
Originally posted by: phillyTIM
Moonbeam has a very intelligent, articulate message that proves true from my experience. I grew up in rural America, as a proud, conservative Republican in the 80s-mid-90s. Then I moved to a major metro area and caught the vibe of cultural awareness and projectionism to others thoughts, and quickly found myself to be a supporter of liberal, democratic values...a Democrat.

I hope to God that the proliferation of the Internet leads red-area-America to view things in a bigger, more educated way...with a savvy of those in high-density areas...and have some consideration for others, and identify the need for social progression in order to institute the true American nature in order to compete with the rest of the World.

We had a setback, with the continued broken Regime of Bush/Republicans, for now. And hopefully, again with the Internet and heightened opportunities of awareness, we will learn from the error of our ways (51% of us, that is) and resign conservatism to financial matters, rather than the undercurrent of Soviet-era propoganda and suppressionism that is now sweeping our Nation here in the US.


Sounds like you are easlily influenced by those around you.

You confuse being influenced with learning to live with people in a diverse environment.

Hey it's cool to be liberal in the big city, so I will be too!

The reverse is also true. Hey, it's stupifying to be a neocon in Bumdoodle, living off of the taxes those city folks pay, so I will too.

Another example of why you guys lost and why you will continue to lose. Please keep it up at least until the mid terms.
 
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