Downgraded to a Celeron

[escrow4]

Pentium G3258 overclockable up to 4.30GHz max can be had for $24 more than Celeron.

G3258 is over $30 more here and I have zero interest in overclocking a basic box. Point is to have something quiet that sips power. And the G3258 doesn't support Clear Video for some reason.

 

[B-Riz]

I recently helped a friend of a friend with a new budget computer; I could not justify the Intel tax for the low end.

Got them an A6 7400k, Asus A78 board, 4GB mem, 120GB SSD, DVD drive and case for ~$255. And set the CPU parameters properly on the mobo.

Because I still do not like integrated Intel graphics.

 

[waltchan]

Today only, Fry's Electronics is offering the Celeron G1850 for $29 after promo code. Will be picking one up today (this will be my forth). Please use store locater to find one closest in your area, if any. Limit 1 per customer.

 

[crashtech]

I remember living within miles of a Fry's. Ah, those were the days. Now all my toys are delivered by the "men in brown."

 

[escrow4]

I recently helped a friend of a friend with a new budget computer; I could not justify the Intel tax for the low end.

Got them an A6 7400k, Asus A78 board, 4GB mem, 120GB SSD, DVD drive and case for ~$255. And set the CPU parameters properly on the mobo.

Because I still do not like integrated Intel graphics.

What tax? The Celeron is as fast if not faster in single threaded tasks and H81 is sufficient for a basic box plus the H81 board I went with is pretty full featured for H81. Plus way way less power usage.

 

[coolpurplefan]

lol I downgraded from my OC'd i7 3770K to i3 4160, actually haven't noticed that much of a difference in everyday use.

That's good to know. In Canada, the i3-4170 is $140 CAD.

 

[B-Riz]

What tax? The Celeron is as fast if not faster in single threaded tasks and H81 is sufficient for a basic box plus the H81 board I went with is pretty full featured for H81. Plus way way less power usage.

Srsly?

Thanks for using the same sorry and tired argument to justify getting a Celeron with janky graphics.

Importance in a budget box:

#1 --> SSD
#2 --> Good Graphics

never considered --> power usage.

I want to rant so hard on this power usage argument; it really does not matter to most people, especially to the average user living in the United States that auto-pays the electric bill every month.

And yes, the box was for someone that is not splitting hairs over a few cents of electricity every month.

Amortize the cost savings for the life of the two systems if it is so important to point out.

http://www.aqua-calc.com/calculate/electricity-cost

 

[ArisVer]

never considered --> power usage.

That is something you should always consider especially if you think globally. Time to change the way you think.

 

[B-Riz]

That is something you should always consider especially if you think globally. Time to change the way you think.

Getting my abacus out and and telling work to do the same.

Digital computers, who needs em! :hmm:

 

[crashtech]

Well that went downhill fast. The thing about APUs is that the extra GPU power isn't utilized in a general purpose machine, but in a gaming machine they are inadequate. That's why the Intel dual cores get the win, they put the computational power where it makes the most difference, which in a general purpose machine is ST performance.

 

[escrow4]

Srsly?

Thanks for using the same sorry and tired argument to justify getting a Celeron with janky graphics.

Importance in a budget box:

#1 --> SSD
#2 --> Good Graphics

never considered --> power usage.

I want to rant so hard on this power usage argument; it really does not matter to most people, especially to the average user living in the United States that auto-pays the electric bill every month.

And yes, the box was for someone that is not splitting hairs over a few cents of electricity every month.

Amortize the cost savings for the life of the two systems if it is so important to point out.

http://www.aqua-calc.com/calculate/electricity-cost

Janky? Laughable. This isn't a P4. You don't need more than an iGPU for desktop work. And that iGPU can do 4K. Which A6s/A8s can't always do:

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/amd_a8_7600_apu_review,18.html

"We also tested Ultra HD video acceleration. Above the 4K resolution Elysium Trailer, here we have an MP4 H.264 file and you can see that the CPU load is 52% with one core topping out performance. Unfortunately Ultra HD videoplayback resulted into stuttering. For both content we have additional shaders enabled like image sharpening and darkened black levels. "

And I'd take single threaded performance everyday in a desktop box over an iGPU that you'll barely use.

And not everyone is in the US. Power costs here are 3x minimum what you in the US pays. MINIMUM.

 

[ninaholic37]

I guess one way to sum up this thread is: Different CPUs work for different people.

OP would rather have a $700-1000 i7-5930k than a $200-250 i5-4690k for gaming, but would rather get a Celeron (but not Bay Trail) than Pentium or i3 to save a few bucks for... whatever he needs a second computer for. :awe:

It is amusing that name Celeron still exists after all these years because of how bad they actually were in the beginning though. I dunno, whenever I think of the name Celeron I think of gimped Pentiums with stuff defective or purposefully burned off that everyone tried to avoid in the olden days.

 

[crashtech]

Hmm, I think of the Celeron 300A that was an overclocking champ!

 

[VirtualLarry]

It is amusing that name Celeron still exists after all these years because of how bad they actually were in the beginning though. I dunno, whenever I think of the name Celeron I think of gimped Pentiums with stuff defective or purposefully burned off that everyone tried to avoid in the olden days.

Yes, Netburst Celerons were real dogs. Handily outrun by Athlon XP CPUs. Yet, most OEM budget rigs (Sold at Walmart, etc.) were Celerons, rather than Athlons.

 

[B-Riz]

Janky? Laughable. This isn't a P4. You don't need more than an iGPU for desktop work. And that iGPU can do 4K. Which A6s/A8s can't always do:

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/amd_a8_7600_apu_review,18.html

"We also tested Ultra HD video acceleration. Above the 4K resolution Elysium Trailer, here we have an MP4 H.264 file and you can see that the CPU load is 52% with one core topping out performance. Unfortunately Ultra HD videoplayback resulted into stuttering. For both content we have additional shaders enabled like image sharpening and darkened black levels. "

And I'd take single threaded performance everyday in a desktop box over an iGPU that you'll barely use.

And not everyone is in the US. Power costs here are 3x minimum what you in the US pays. MINIMUM.

Ok, nitpick mcgee, this was not my first rodeo.

I ran the numbers; I did not have the physical time to drive to Micro Center and get an Intel setup.

The total dollar cost was cheaper to order everything for an AMD box from Newegg than an Intel one.

And no, I do not like integrated Intel graphics, so what ever, deal with it.

 

[crashtech]

Office app benchmarks for the A6-7400K:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9287/the-amd-a10-7700k-and-amd-a6-7400k-cpu-review/2

It's not a bad CPU, but I don't think I see any convincing wins there against the G3258, which is not indicated as running at anything past 3.2GHz, and therefore is representative of normal Intel dual cores.

And as far as the graphics side goes, with iGPU gaming neither the A6 nor its "janky" competition can manage to post playable frame rates without a dGPU. If you want playable APU gaming on AMD, it's clear that an A10 is needed:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9287/the-amd-a10-7700k-and-amd-a6-7400k-cpu-review/3

So basically choosing an A6 is choosing the worst of both worlds, sacrificing CPU and GPU performance in search of what, I guess a more "balanced" rig that does nothing at all as well as its competitors. I hate to say it, but one's 1000th rodeo can have the same poor results as the 1st, if nothing gets learned along the way.

 

[B-Riz]

Office app benchmarks for the A6-7400K:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9287/the-amd-a10-7700k-and-amd-a6-7400k-cpu-review/2

It's not a bad CPU, but I don't think I see any convincing wins there against the G3258, which is not indicated as running at anything past 3.2GHz, and therefore is representative of normal Intel dual cores.

And as far as the graphics side goes, with iGPU gaming neither the A6 nor its "janky" competition can manage to post playable frame rates without a dGPU. If you want playable APU gaming on AMD, it's clear that an A10 is needed:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9287/the-amd-a10-7700k-and-amd-a6-7400k-cpu-review/3

So basically choosing an A6 is choosing the worst of both worlds, sacrificing CPU and GPU performance in search of what, I guess a more "balanced" rig that does nothing at all as well as its competitors. I hate to say it, but one's 1000th rodeo can have the same poor results as the 1st, if nothing gets learned along the way.

I hate to burst the smug bubble, but no.

An H81 is a janky platform comparted to the A78, again, not my first rodeo; I am looking at the whole system here.

2 x RAM slots???? Oh joy, so nice.

All the H81 boards have 2 x RAM slots.

Asus A78 board used, very nice.

https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/A78MA/

And going H87 blows the budget.

Just checked, $9 dollars cheaper at the 'Egg to get an inferior H81 board and G3258.

So no, A6 7400k with A78 board is not teh suck.

And, in this price bracket, I don't really care about "wins" anymore.

 

[crashtech]

I hate to burst the smug bubble, but no.

An H81 is a janky platform comparted to the A78, again, not my first rodeo; I am looking at the whole system here.

2 x RAM slots???? Oh joy, so nice.

All the H81 boards have 2 x RAM slots.

Asus A78 board used, very nice.

https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/A78MA/

And going H87 blows the budget.

Just checked, $9 dollars cheaper at the 'Egg to get an inferior H81 board and G3258.

So no, A6 7400k with A78 board is not teh suck.

And, in this price bracket, I don't really care about "wins" anymore.

I never said the A6 sucked, but its performance is inferior, and you've done nothing at all to refute that save mentioning the two RAM slots which are a virtual non-issue at this price level. You might want to provide evidence that H81 boards are "janky," so readers can better understand your dubious claim. Certainly there are some suspect brands that use H81, but the same can be said about any chipset. Stick to a good brand that isn't in the bargain basement for even a budget build and problems will be few. But your last sentence says it all, you don't care about winning performance, or apparently any performance metrics at all, since you haven't linked to anything to back up your claims. This indicates your decisions are based on emotion, and there isn't anything left to say. Hopefully readers of this thread will find your positions as much without merit as I do.

 

[exar333]

Switched to a gen-5 i3 NUC last week and just mounted it right on the back of my display. Was inexpensive and threw a 512GB M2 drive + 8GB DDR3 in it. Re-building my gaming rig to be more portable so I can use that when Oculus arrives...

It works fantastic and Intel displays wake-up from sleep on DP so much better than NV.

 

[B-Riz]

I never said the A6 sucked, but its performance is inferior, and you've done nothing at all to refute that save mentioning the two RAM slots which are a virtual non-issue at this price level. You might want to provide evidence that H81 boards are "janky," so readers can better understand your dubious claim. Certainly there are some suspect brands that use H81, but the same can be said about any chipset. Stick to a good brand that isn't in the bargain basement for even a budget build and problems will be few. But your last sentence says it all, you don't care about winning performance, or apparently any performance metrics at all, since you haven't linked to anything to back up your claims. This indicates your decisions are based on emotion, and there isn't anything left to say. Hopefully readers of this thread will find your positions as much without merit as I do.

H81 lacks features, so yeah, not using one if I positively do not have to.

I'm not bench-marking the effing thing all day, crap on stick, what is it about beating down any budget AMD build?

Edit: I *did* price out systems, AMD was a better deal for board features and the given budget, so srsly, stop; I gave an anecdote for one persons new computer.

 

[crashtech]

H81 lacks features, so yeah, not using one if I positively do not have to.

I'm not bench-marking the effing thing all day, crap on stick, what is it about beating down any budget AMD build?

If something is not quantifiably better, but is instead actually worse than similarly priced alternatives, rational people can't recommend it. It's nothing personal, for instance I have an R9 290 because it was the best performer for the price when I bought it. So it's not an anti-AMD thing on my part, its a pro-performance thing.

 

[B-Riz]

If something is not quantifiably better, but is instead actually worse than similarly priced alternatives, rational people can't recommend it. It's nothing personal, for instance I have an R9 290 because it was the best performer for the price when I bought it. So it's not an anti-AMD thing on my part, its a pro-performance thing.

In this instance, it was a better overall system to get and use the A6 7400k / A78 board.

That is all.

I am not splitting hairs for a budget computer and pouring over bench-marks; if I could have gotten (built) a Celeron / H87 with a discrete vid card for the same money, I would have.

 

[crashtech]

The reason to buy an A6 is pretty obviously not for CPU power, it features a 1M/2T configuration that has ST performance below similarly priced offerings. But the A6 has a much more powerful iGPU than the competition, this is a given. So what does it bring to the table? Here are some graphs from the Anandtech review:

So the A6 beats the G3258 in iGPU gaming. That's a given. But the problem is that it doesn't matter, because the A6 doesn't post playable framerates anyway. Low to high twenties on average is not going to be an acceptable experience because minimums will be much lower. So a GPU will be necessary at some point if a satisfactory experience is to be had. But then what happens:

The A6 can't keep up.

 

[TeknoBug]

Srsly?

Thanks for using the same sorry and tired argument to justify getting a Celeron with janky graphics.

Importance in a budget box:

#1 --> SSD
#2 --> Good Graphics

never considered --> power usage.

I want to rant so hard on this power usage argument; it really does not matter to most people, especially to the average user living in the United States that auto-pays the electric bill every month.

And yes, the box was for someone that is not splitting hairs over a few cents of electricity every month.

Amortize the cost savings for the life of the two systems if it is so important to point out.

http://www.aqua-calc.com/calculate/electricity-cost

Power usage matters to A LOT of people, it may not matter to you but it sures does to me.

 

[B-Riz]

The reason to buy an A6 is pretty obviously not for CPU power, it features a 1M/2T configuration that has ST performance below similarly priced offerings. But the A6 has a much more powerful iGPU than the competition, this is a given. So what does it bring to the table? Here are some graphs from the Anandtech review:

So the A6 beats the G3258 in iGPU gaming. That's a given. But the problem is that it doesn't matter, because the A6 doesn't post playable framerates anyway. Low to high twenties on average is not going to be an acceptable experience because minimums will be much lower. So a GPU will be necessary at some point if a satisfactory experience is to be had. But then what happens:

The A6 can't keep up.

It's not a gaming computer; they had an Athlon 64 3200+ and 320gb hdd, anything was an upgrade from that; this was the best f**kin deal I could put together that week for what was on sale and the time I had to help.

I do not like Intel's inegreated graphics / H81 combo.

Give it a rest, this is just beating a dead horse.