Draft...Would you serve or run?

[Mill]

Originally posted by: BentValve

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: BentValve

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: BentValve

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt
I would serve. Anyone who ran whom I know, I would turn in or shoot them myself. Stupid bastards. :|

God Bless you, I would do the same thing.

Now that is just a fvcking stupid thing to say. That is all we need. People who try to dramatize and browbeat others just for a personal satisfaction all regarding something very unlikely to happen(the draft). Both of you grow the hell up. There is no personal gain in shooting someone who refuses to serve. People like you are what cause problems to begin with. Regardless if you are sarcastic or not it doesn't blunt your underlying message one bit. You think that somehow in the unlikely event of a draft you would watch someone get drafted and they would say "welp moving to Canada see you later Nik or BentValve." You think they will tell some rabid conservative that already beats his own chest about how much he would kill people like that? What if you got drafted before them? Would you go AWOL to go back and shoot them?

Please all that BS rhetoric about shooting someone because they dodged the draft is asinine. I have no problem with someone who says that someone is a pussy if they run soley because are scared or because they like to priss around. As for those who have moral or religous objections that is all handled under the Classifications given to people during the lottery. So the only real ones left are those that have politcal reasons or are scared. Neither is an acceptable excuse to dodge the draft and nor should it be unpunishable. What you two are advocating is shooting the sons of bitches. WTF is wrong with you two? Critisizing those who choose not to serve is totally different than wishing them personal harm in the form of violence. Like I said grow up.

Thank God that patriotic people like Nik and myself are still very plentiful in this country. Odviously we would first try and arrest the citizen who will not fight , only as a last resort would he be shot.
I meant what I said and nothing will ever change that.

God Bless America

Why would you shoot them? There are plenty of people like me who would serve if drafted. It doesn't matter because the draft isn't going to happen anyway. I just get tired of childish antics. I could understand if you thought they would be a pussy(which I do). But shooting them? This isn't a movie bud.

I am not going to argue with you, its saddening to hear your words. I am getting out of this thread.

Considering I am totally against anyone dodging the draft I almost laugh at what you are saying. I guess you just don't get it.

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: Jellomancer

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: Jellomancer

Originally posted by: Evadman
I would gladly lay down my life for my Country.

This is what I'm talking about. Laying down your life for a country that started an unecessary war... brainwashing.

Trollomancer, why do you live in the United States?

Because it's a damn good country.

So fight for it. Period.

No... I'd rather not. Bush isn't our king.

The very idea of a nation is fictional. The only thing making up a nation are the people that live in it. I will not fight for the nation. I will fight for the people. When you can show me that Americans are threatened by Iraq, I will fight.

 

[Apathetic]

Though I'm a bit softer around the middle nowadays, I'd still gladly serve.

Dave

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: Jellomancer

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: Jellomancer

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: Jellomancer

Originally posted by: Evadman
I would gladly lay down my life for my Country.

This is what I'm talking about. Laying down your life for a country that started an unecessary war... brainwashing.

Trollomancer, why do you live in the United States?

Because it's a damn good country.

So fight for it. Period.

No... I'd rather not. Bush isn't our king.

The very idea of a nation is fictional. The only thing making up a nation are the people that live in it. I will not fight for the nation. I will fight for the people. When you can show me that Americans are threatened by Iraq, I will fight.

I agreed with you once, but I don't agree with you here. Do what you want, but could I kindly ask you to stop using my country if you don't give two sh!ts about it? You know I am not blindly following anyone here or toeing a party line. I simply believe that Iraq will be a threat to our national security. Bin Laden lived in a cesspool and was able to kill 3000 people in one day. You think I trust Saddam who is developing more WoMD and who has used them in the past on the Kurds and the Iranians? There has been evidence in the past and there will be more evidence forth coming from the inspectors. Until then you don't know anymore that I do, but what we do know is that Saddam is a liar and has used them in the past. You are almost as blind as Nik and BentValve.

 

[BoberFett]

ffmcobalt

You can try to sound all tough and righteous, but how much time have you put in the military?

I spent a few years there, and I'd still not fight if I were recalled for a war that I wouldn't volunteer for. If I can't be bothered to VOLUNTEER for a war, then I'm not going to stand for being ORDERED to fight in one.

And if you think you could hunt me down and kill me, think again you weasally little punk.

 

[pac1085]

I'd be stuck in fat boy camp throughout the war

 

[OutHouse]

Originally posted by: Rilescat
Just a question on the draft....I am the sole supporter for my family. I am 24 years old, so right prime for draft age (as I gather). If I were to be drafted, would the government subsidize my income to my family, or am I supposed to let them starve until I return?

I am just looking to understand....

Thanks

ummm no. The government does not subsidize you for what you make on the outside if you are drafted. Ask any person in the Guards or Reserves. If they get called up and have a 60K a year job, during their time that they are active they are paid according to their rank. A lot of Guard and Reservist got into trouble during the gulf war because they were active for 6+ months and couldnt pay thier bills.


To answer the thread question, If i was 18 again i would sign up and serve before i got drafted. But I have already done 10 years and have had enough people taking shots at me.

 

[JellyBaby]

I spent a few years there, and I'd still not fight if I were recalled for a war that I wouldn't volunteer for. If I can't be bothered to VOLUNTEER for a war, then I'm not going to stand for being ORDERED to fight in one.

This just makes sense. Our government is supposed to act in accordance with the consent of the governed. If the threat is there you likely won't find a shortage of recruits even to this MTV-cheesburger-Xbox generation. Besides, mandatory service is slavery.

 

[EndGame]

When you can show me that Americans are threatened by Iraq, I will fight.

Oh, now it's so clear! So basicly when a Nuclear warhead hits somewhere inside the US, or any WMD for that matter, THEN you'll be rip roaring and ready to go! So what you're saying is, you want 10 or 20 million citizens to die first, then, if it's agreeable to you, and you have the time, you might go do what you can to help defend the people of our great nation.

Well, how considerate of you!

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: BoberFett
ffmcobalt

You can try to sound all tough and righteous, but how much time have you put in the military?

I spent a few years there, and I'd still not fight if I were recalled for a war that I wouldn't volunteer for. If I can't be bothered to VOLUNTEER for a war, then I'm not going to stand for being ORDERED to fight in one.

And if you think you could hunt me down and kill me, think again you weasally little punk.

Don't play that crap either Bober. Regardless of the military experience you have, the draft made it possible to keep Europe from being all German. Besides, the 1980 selective service reinstated by Carter is way different than the Vietnam Draft or the WW2 draft.

You are arguing a moot point anyway. There will be no draft. I am curious anyhow as to why you think a war that you wouldn't volunteer for wouldn't be worth fighting? Should all wars be Bober approved? Now I am not saying you don't have valid points but you are acting as if you wouldn't go if you were drafted to any fight unless it had your stamp of approval. Who decides if a war is good enough for you? Popular sentiment(which rarely supports ANY war) or you?

 

[m2kewl]

this country is worth fighting for - so i'd serve.

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: JellyBaby

I spent a few years there, and I'd still not fight if I were recalled for a war that I wouldn't volunteer for. If I can't be bothered to VOLUNTEER for a war, then I'm not going to stand for being ORDERED to fight in one.

This just makes sense. Our government is supposed to act in accordance with the consent of the governed. If the threat is there you likely won't find a shortage of recruits even to this MTV-cheesburger-Xbox generation. Besides, mandatory service is slavery.

Go here and read some. Please.

Your current idea of a draft is not how it is these days.

 

[ianbergman]

I'm not too worried about a draft being reinstated anytime soon, but I'll definitely say that should it happen, i'd give serious thought before showing up to serve - unless US territories were in imminent danger or there was a cause I truly believed in. In 20th century history, WWII would probably have been the only war I'd have been willing to fight in. Iraq? No way. I can't stand the idea of using our military to force our ideologies on other nations, no matter how screwed up I think those other nations might be.

 

[Soybomb]

If you're drafted, you step up and do your duty without asking questions. Who knows. Maybe the service will crush that rebellious attitude and give you a better direction in life.

Think what you prefer, but as a human being I feel as though its a duty to think before you agree to kill people. The government can be wrong and if so its just as much your duty to oppose them. The rebellious attitude is whats make a person a free thinking human and not a drone. My direction in life is determined by the concept of freedom that you claim to want to uphold so badly.

Some people seem to think that war would be a glorious thing and you would be doing your nation a great service by fighting if you were drafted. Sometimes thats true, other times your cannon fodder without a point. Mistakes happen and the government is fallible, blindy obeying them is foolish. Be a free thinking human and question what you're doing first.

To the poster that said you could get a job behind the lines. If it ever came to a draft your chances of being an expendable body would be higher due to the situation but no matter its not that some would be afraid of combat, but simply don't believe in taking another life without a very good reason.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: EndGame

When you can show me that Americans are threatened by Iraq, I will fight.

Oh, now it's so clear! So basicly when a Nuclear warhead hits somewhere inside the US, or any WMD for that matter, THEN you'll be rip roaring and ready to go! So what you're saying is, you want 10 or 20 million citizens to die first, then, if it's agreeable to you, and you have the time, you might go do what you can to help defend the people of our great nation.

Well, how considerate of you!

Maybe we should just kill all Muslims everywhere, terrorist or not? I mean, there's always the possibility that some innocent woman will give birth to the next Bin Laden, and we can't take any chances.

It's called NATIONAL DEFENSE for a reason. If you make the first strike, it's not defense, it's offense.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: BoberFett
ffmcobalt

You can try to sound all tough and righteous, but how much time have you put in the military?

I spent a few years there, and I'd still not fight if I were recalled for a war that I wouldn't volunteer for. If I can't be bothered to VOLUNTEER for a war, then I'm not going to stand for being ORDERED to fight in one.

And if you think you could hunt me down and kill me, think again you weasally little punk.

Don't play that crap either Bober. Regardless of the military experience you have, the draft made it possible to keep Europe from being all German. Besides, the 1980 selective service reinstated by Carter is way different than the Vietnam Draft or the WW2 draft.

You are arguing a moot point anyway. There will be no draft. I am curious anyhow as to why you think a war that you wouldn't volunteer for wouldn't be worth fighting? Should all wars be Bober approved? Now I am not saying you don't have valid points but you are acting as if you wouldn't go if you were drafted to any fight unless it had your stamp of approval. Who decides if a war is good enough for you? Popular sentiment(which rarely supports ANY war) or you?

All I'm saying is that those who want to fight in a war will fight regardless of a draft. If the government who was elected BY THE PEOPLE, can't get those same people to volunteer when it comes to to fight, then that's THE PEOPLE telling the ELECTED that the war is unwanted.

 

[EndGame]

Well, this is getting kind of redundant and nobies minds will change because of this, so, I'll just finalize my thoughts by saying this:

If by some remote chance a draft would come to pass, and those of you whom say "I'd run" aren't just all mouth, you'd be giving up a lot of what your excuse for not going seems to be, freedom and the freedom to choose! Why? Well, because runing to whatever remote country you choose will enable you to avoid serving, but, will also leave you no choice but to basicly give up your life as you know it, family, friends, job, retirement, home, etc.. You would be a fugative of the US from the point you leave on, or until you surrender to the governement. So yeah, say and claimwhat you will but when push comes to shove, you better consider exactly what "fredoms" you would be giving up by dodging the request of your country to serve.

Of course, as I said, this is all more than likely a mute point at any rate, but, I suppose one can never know for sure.

 

[BurnItDwn]

I'd serve. This country is worth fighting for.

 

[acidvoodoo]

if our country was attacked, as in an attempt to take it over and enslave our people, i would fight and be willing to die rather then live under a foreign dictator.

If the cause for drafting was completly rediculous, like bush saying "china is a threat, they are plotting to take over the world, we must go on the offensive", i'd object, but i guess if everyone else is being forced to go over and fight, i should have to also.

both my comments i admit are hypocritical, as the actuall circumstances would have to take place to get a true answer

Let's put another Situation into perspective, If the Country Became vastly Overcrowded and Food Short, OR, If Global warming or whatever causes land to be scarce, would you be willing to fight to gain territory like in ancient times?

 

[Descartes]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt
I would serve. Anyone who ran whom I know, I would turn in or shoot them myself. Stupid bastards. :|

We understand you're xenophobic, but must you constantly chastise those have the fortunate ability to actually think for themselves rather than regurgitate all the self-righteous ideologies you so happily consumed all your life?

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: EndGame

When you can show me that Americans are threatened by Iraq, I will fight.

Oh, now it's so clear! So basicly when a Nuclear warhead hits somewhere inside the US, or any WMD for that matter, THEN you'll be rip roaring and ready to go! So what you're saying is, you want 10 or 20 million citizens to die first, then, if it's agreeable to you, and you have the time, you might go do what you can to help defend the people of our great nation.

Well, how considerate of you!

Well with your logic, we should be killing everyone, because everyone *may* attack us and kill 20 million citizens.

But no, let's attack Iraq, even thought here is no chance that they have nuclear weapons, according to military advisors and generals all over the world. Their 20 million citizens are worth less than our 20 million citizens who have no chance of being killed by an Iraqi nuclear weapon.

 

[YNos]

you can get anything you want, at alice's restaraunt.....

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: EndGame

When you can show me that Americans are threatened by Iraq, I will fight.

Oh, now it's so clear! So basicly when a Nuclear warhead hits somewhere inside the US, or any WMD for that matter, THEN you'll be rip roaring and ready to go! So what you're saying is, you want 10 or 20 million citizens to die first, then, if it's agreeable to you, and you have the time, you might go do what you can to help defend the people of our great nation.

Well, how considerate of you!

Maybe we should just kill all Muslims everywhere, terrorist or not? I mean, there's always the possibility that some innocent woman will give birth to the next Bin Laden, and we can't take any chances.

It's called NATIONAL DEFENSE for a reason. If you make the first strike, it's not defense, it's offense.

Exactly. You can't argue "oh so you want to wait until after 20 million people die", because with that kind of thinking, we should always be at war because there is always a chance of people dying.

 

[joohang]

Originally posted by: SnapIT
I assume this is only for Americans....

Here in Sweden it is mandatory, or rather, you can choose not to serve and spend the same amount of time in jail... peaceniks usually choose the easy way out... jail...

I know a Catholic pacificist professor who refused to serve in Vietnam so he worked at a mental hospital instead.

 

[Stratum9]

I wouldn't serve. I'd make a lousy soldier anyway. I suck at most things that don't fall into the catagory of "creative art". So the military would be better off without me.

As for my son: he's only six right now, but if there were a draft when he came of age it would have to be his decision. Although, by that time I would have influenced his mind to be totally against war and would give him money to run if that's what he wanted.

I didn't have children just so they could grow up and be cannon fodder!!