Driving BMW after minimum oil level warning light (yellow) comes on

[Railgun]

Why companies do this? Because they think their customers do not want a dipstick or gauge that in 99% is stuck in the middle and doesn't even move (not counting the warm-up phase when it comes from zero to ... the ideal temperature) or maybe they even want these cars to brake - we live in a world where consumption fuels or economies.

Has nothing to do with customer demand. There's zero reason to add the necessary electronics AND maintain a zero cost dipstick. It's technology for the sake of technology. It's also due to the reason that most consumers are lazy and either 1) don't know how to check it, 2) can't be bothered to check it, 3) are too naive to check it, or 4) forget to check it.

The fact that it warns you well ahead of time from the perspective that there's still enough oil, just needs a little more should be sufficient. However, there should still be a manual way to do it since we all know German cars love their electrical bugs.

Also, the more performance oriented cars DO have a temp gauge. Whatever28s, no. Whatever35, M whatever, yes.

 

[LTC8K6]

A lot of modern cars (including Beamers) do not even have a temperature gauge or any other mean how to read out the engine temperature, only an "Oh, oh something went bad" checklight, but unfortunately when this lights comes on, you're probably in some traffic jam or somewhere where in 95% of cases you cannot do anything to avert major engine damage.

Why companies do this? Because they think their customers do not want a dipstick or gauge that in 99% is stuck in the middle and doesn't even move (not counting the warm-up phase when it comes from zero to ... the ideal temperature) or maybe they even want these cars to brake - we live in a world where consumption fuels or economies.

The day I will start driving a car without a temperature gauge or a dipstick is the day I had bought an EV.

I think only a few modern cars are without some sort of temperature gauge.

BMW's have an oil temperature gauge, which is a better indicator of a hot engine.

 

[SilthDraeth]

Heh, this is the same 4.6 that was driven 8 miles twice a day for a week with no coolant circulating past the level of the cracked thermostat housing, had no choice so I topped it off with water and drove it to and from work, that was almost a year ago, finally got the intake replaced.

My 2005 Crown Vic has a 4.6...

I love that car.

 

[Zenmervolt]

A lot of modern cars (including Beamers) do not even have a temperature gauge or any other mean how to read out the engine temperature, only an "Oh, oh something went bad" checklight, but unfortunately when this lights comes on, you're probably in some traffic jam or somewhere where in 95% of cases you cannot do anything to avert major engine damage.

Why companies do this? Because they think their customers do not want a dipstick or gauge that in 99% is stuck in the middle and doesn't even move (not counting the warm-up phase when it comes from zero to ... the ideal temperature) or maybe they even want these cars to brake - we live in a world where consumption fuels or economies.

The day I will start driving a car without a temperature gauge or a dipstick is the day I had bought an EV.

They do it because idiots buy cars. At least, that's the reason behind the "dummy" gauges that sit at the midpoint and never move unless there's a huge change in their readings.

What was happening was that people would bring their car into the dealer and make complaints like, "My neighbor/aunt/cousin/dad/great uncle/parole officer/whatever has the same car but his temperature gauge shows 5 degrees cooler all the time! WHY IS MY CAR RUNNING HOT?! FIX IT!!" People didn't understand the concept of tolerances and production variances.

I see this on motorcycle forums a lot with people who buy oil temperature gauges for air-cooled bikes. Everyone wants to know what "the" correct oil temperature is. The answer is that there isn't one specific temperature, but if you tell people that "depending on the ambient temperature and the type of riding and the individual variances from production anything from about 175 degrees to 225 degrees in the holding tank" they don't believe you and instead listen to the one guy who claims that his oil temp is never above 195 degrees and that if the oil temp hits 200 degrees something must be wrong with the bike.

True gearheads are getting shortchanged because the vast majority of car owners essentially became the boy who cried wolf.

ZV

 

[SpatiallyAware]

They do it because idiots buy cars. At least, that's the reason behind the "dummy" gauges that sit at the midpoint and never move unless there's a huge change in their readings.

What was happening was that people would bring their car into the dealer and make complaints like, "My neighbor/aunt/cousin/dad/great uncle/parole officer/whatever has the same car but his temperature gauge shows 5 degrees cooler all the time! WHY IS MY CAR RUNNING HOT?! FIX IT!!" People didn't understand the concept of tolerances and production variances.

I see this on motorcycle forums a lot with people who buy oil temperature gauges for air-cooled bikes. Everyone wants to know what "the" correct oil temperature is. The answer is that there isn't one specific temperature, but if you tell people that "depending on the ambient temperature and the type of riding and the individual variances from production anything from about 175 degrees to 225 degrees in the holding tank" they don't believe you and instead listen to the one guy who claims that his oil temp is never above 195 degrees and that if the oil temp hits 200 degrees something must be wrong with the bike.

True gearheads are getting shortchanged because the vast majority of car owners essentially became the boy who cried wolf.

ZV

FWIW... I have had major major cooling issues on two bikes. I had a tl1000 that had the temp sensor in the radiator (rather than right next to the tstat), and long story short it would always read 30f cooler than actual motor temps. This caused the bike to run rich ALL the time.. It was a huge huge pain. I ended up retrofitting a tstat housing with embedded temp sensor and installing a tstat that waited 10f extra before opening which fixed all of the issues.

On my 1098 the temp sensor read 20f too cool even when brand new. I had some issues with stuttering/stalling until replacing the sensor and it fixed everything.

I'm mainly pointing out that with a small FI engines these temp differences become hugely important. I do agree that 90% of people with these oil temp gauges are idiots and it dilutes the people with actual problems..... But they do exist. And even with tolerance variances it's still very important for FI bikes to read the correct temperature, particular if water-cooled. (yes yes, you are talking air/oil cooled, I'm just being argumentative here)

 

[Zenmervolt]

FWIW... I have had major major cooling issues on two bikes. I had a tl1000 that had the temp sensor in the radiator (rather than right next to the tstat), and long story short it would always read 30f cooler than actual motor temps. This caused the bike to run rich ALL the time.. It was a huge huge pain. I ended up retrofitting a tstat housing with embedded temp sensor and installing a tstat that waited 10f extra before opening which fixed all of the issues.

On my 1098 the temp sensor read 20f too cool even when brand new. I had some issues with stuttering/stalling until replacing the sensor and it fixed everything.

I'm mainly pointing out that with a small FI engines these temp differences become hugely important. I do agree that 90% of people with these oil temp gauges are idiots and it dilutes the people with actual problems..... But they do exist. And even with tolerance variances it's still very important for FI bikes to read the correct temperature, particular if water-cooled. (yes yes, you are talking air/oil cooled, I'm just being argumentative here)

Even with air-cooled EFI bikes the actual sensors themselves need to read correctly for the EFI to function properly (for air-cooled bikes they're usually CHT sensors and not coolant temp). Though in the case of your TL1000 that sounds more like a poorly-calibrated EFI setup because the EFI tables should have been adjusted to use the radiator temps and not expect the temps at the thermostat housing.

In any case, there's a difference between sensors used by the EFI system to determine fuel and spark and the often more simplistic sensors used to drive gauges (as well as the fact that the analogue gauges themselves introduce reading variance even if the sensors are reading correctly, a very slight difference in needle alignment can make a gauge read slightly different).

ZV

 

[rh71]

I think only a few modern cars are without some sort of temperature gauge.

BMW's have an oil temperature gauge, which is a better indicator of a hot engine.

<-- no oil temp gauge and no dipstick. Oil level only on the idrive (useful), but still no temp. I would trade the wasteful reminder that is the mpg meter for anything else, to be honest.

E70 X5.

 

[LTC8K6]

<-- no oil temp gauge and no dipstick. Oil level only on the idrive (useful), but still no temp. I would trade the wasteful reminder that is the mpg meter for anything else, to be honest.

E70 X5.

Yeah, no idea why they put an mpg meter on the X5 where there's normally an oil temp gauge. D:

 

[pauldun170]

While I like the "idea" of an oil level gauge, I wouldn't want any car missing a dipstick past the warranty period. I'd feel more comfortable with an old dipstick than an old oil level sensor. Especially with the wide range of oil consumption characteristics across automotive landscape. That and

I'm not a "gotta have a new car\keep up with the Jones" type person. Motorcycles are my thing.


I don't see the point of BMW putting any gauges in the car since owners don't read the manual to see what they mean. Most owners just need MPH and fuel level. Maybe another gauge that indicate miles until lease ends or yearly mileage restriction.
They should just have some sort of voice alert that interrupts phone call the driver is likely on or maybe cut off the music.
"Attention!! Attention!! Engine Service required!!"
Have the nav system automatically bring up a route to the nearest BMW dealership.

Then you can have BMW provide you a loaner vehicle and a starbucks gift card for you to use while they add a quart of oil and reset the Oil level warning system with the factory rest tool.
The factory reset tool should also enable the display to show trade-in value and make recommendations for what to trade it in for.

I'm going to write a letter to BMW.

 

[satyajitmenon]

While I like the "idea" of an oil level gauge, I wouldn't want any car missing a dipstick past the warranty period. I'd feel more comfortable with an old dipstick than an old oil level sensor. Especially with the wide range of oil consumption characteristics across automotive landscape. That and

I'm not a "gotta have a new car\keep up with the Jones" type person. Motorcycles are my thing.


I don't see the point of BMW putting any gauges in the car since owners don't read the manual to see what they mean. Most owners just need MPH and fuel level. Maybe another gauge that indicate miles until lease ends or yearly mileage restriction.
They should just have some sort of voice alert that interrupts phone call the driver is likely on or maybe cut off the music.
"Attention!! Attention!! Engine Service required!!"
Have the nav system automatically bring up a route to the nearest BMW dealership.

Then you can have BMW provide you a loaner vehicle and a starbucks gift card for you to use while they add a quart of oil and reset the Oil level warning system with the factory rest tool.
The factory reset tool should also enable the display to show trade-in value and make recommendations for what to trade it in for.

I'm going to write a letter to BMW.

 

[rh71]

^ BMWs are often leased and with the 4-year full coverage (including maintenance) they are set for their entire lease term. Also a good reason they are good lease candidates. Return and get a new one and you would have paid $0 to maintain it.

And if that's the case, why wouldn't they go back to the dealer for work? Do indys give loaners? It's all taken care of. Hell I'm in year 5 of ownership and have an extended warranty so I went back to the dealer for a mechatronic sleeve which is no walk in the park so I went with who I could trust and who could back their work since they have the mothership to answer to. I got a brand new '13 X3 as a loaner... first driver. BTW, that auto start/stop is for the birds.

 

[pauldun170]

^ BMWs are often leased and with the 4-year full coverage (including maintenance) they are set for their entire lease term. Also a good reason they are good lease candidates. Return and get a new one and you would have paid $0 to maintain it.

And if that's the case, why wouldn't they go back to the dealer for work? Do indys give loaners? It's all taken care of. Hell I'm in year 5 of ownership and have an extended warranty so I went back to the dealer for a mechatronic sleeve which is no walk in the park so I went with who I could trust and who could back their work since they have the mothership to answer to. I got a brand new '13 X3 as a loaner... first driver. BTW, that auto start/stop is for the birds.

After careful analysis, I've come to the conclusion that our two posts live in absolute harmony.

 

[pauldun170]

slightly off topic

What happens to 4-5 year old BMW's?
Wait a minute, they go into the CPO pool.

I wonder what happens to 7 year BMW's?
Do they juts kind of ship them off to eastern Europe? Turn them all into cabs?
Maybe they just end up in the south with bald tires and big rims.
Its all so mysterious

 

[satyajitmenon]

slightly off topic

What happens to 4-5 year old BMW's?
Wait a minute, they go into the CPO pool.

I wonder what happens to 7 year BMW's?
Do they juts kind of ship them off to eastern Europe? Turn them all into cabs?
Maybe they just end up in the south with bald tires and big rims.
Its all so mysterious

I've got a 10 yr old BMW. And I'm not in Eastern Europe.


Or am I? :hmm:

 

[rh71]

After careful analysis, I've come to the conclusion that our two posts live in absolute harmony.

yup so there's method to the madness.