Drones around the White House

[Raizinman]

Just wondering how the White House and other secure sites deal with remote control airplanes and drones? I know the payload on even some of the biggest remote control airplanes can be as much as 15 pounds, but 15 pounds of explosives can be quite deadly. How come there has not been any terrorist attacks using remote control airplanes or drones? Both are easy to purchase and fly? Just wondering what type of high level electronics they use to thwart these type of attacks.

 

[Uppsala9496]

Just wondering how the White House and other secure sites deal with remote control airplanes and drones? I know the payload on even some of the biggest remote control airplanes can be as much as 15 pounds, but 15 pounds of explosives can be quite deadly. How come there has not been any terrorist attacks using remote control airplanes or drones? Both are easy to purchase and fly? Just wondering what type of high level electronics they use to thwart these type of attacks.

The kind they are not going to release to the public for obvious reasons.

 

[cronos]

I'm pretty sure drones are banned in the DC area.

 

[BarkingGhostar]

I'm pretty sure drones are banned in the DC area.

Why would anyone in this conversation assume the discussion was strictly for legal use? Based on the OP's explosive comment I would have guessed he was chatting about illegal activities.

You don't have to step outside of the box, but peak over the edge once in a while.

 

[cronos]

Why would anyone in this conversation assume the discussion was strictly for legal use? Based on the OP's explosive comment I would have guessed he was chatting about illegal activities.

You don't have to step outside of the box, but peak over the edge once in a while.

The implication of my statement was that of course there's a method of enforcement that will catch any of these activities quickly.

I didn't think I had to spell it out.

 

[Jaskalas]

How come there has not been any terrorist attacks using remote control airplanes or drones?

I suspect no world leader will ever set foot outdoors again, the day present technology is realized. Lucky for us, most terrorists are too stupid, or too busy killing each other, to concern themselves with such damaging plots.

There is no defense.

 

[moonbogg]

There is no defense for that. Hell, some random guy was able to run INTO the white house. You think they can stop an R/C plane from hitting the building? Nope.

 

[Malak]

There is no defense for that. Hell, some random guy was able to run INTO the white house. You think they can stop an R/C plane from hitting the building? Nope.

That's a valid point.

But flying a drone into a building, even with a payload, isn't really going to do what a terrorist wants.

 

[moonbogg]

That's a valid point.

But flying a drone into a building, even with a payload, isn't really going to do what a terrorist wants.

If I were to put my terrorist hat on and give it a go (which to be clear, I won't), I wouldn't target a building. You see, R/C sail planes can loiter high above a target for a long time, with no engine noise. You have a small explosive with shrapnel attached, and when your human target is visible, you dive in at about 120mph, using onboard video to aim the plane, and detonate above target or have it explode on impact.

EDIT: If NSA picks this up, I suggest you promptly fuck off.

Also, this probably wouldn't be very effective, BUT you could have like TWENTY of them, right?

 

[Brovane]

There is no defense for that. Hell, some random guy was able to run INTO the white house. You think they can stop an R/C plane from hitting the building? Nope.

You have a good point. If the guy was actually visibily armed I would assume lethal force would have been authorized to shoot him. For R/C planes/Drones I would assume the guards would go weapons free much quicker. Their also might be some type of jammers since any appearance of a drone is illegal action would be taken as soon as it appeared in the airspace.

 

[Brovane]

Why would anyone in this conversation assume the discussion was strictly for legal use? Based on the OP's explosive comment I would have guessed he was chatting about illegal activities.

You don't have to step outside of the box, but peak over the edge once in a while.

FAA regulations. The appearance of a drone/RC plane in the airspace would immediatelly raise suspicion and action would be taken fairly quickly to deal with it.

http://tfr.faa.gov/save_pages/detail_0_8326.html

 

[Brovane]

If I were to put my terrorist hat on and give it a go (which to be clear, I won't), I wouldn't target a building. You see, R/C sail planes can loiter high above a target for a long time, with no engine noise. You have a small explosive with shrapnel attached, and when your human target is visible, you dive in at about 120mph, using onboard video to aim the plane, and detonate above target or have it explode on impact.

EDIT: If NSA picks this up, I suggest you promptly fuck off.

Also, this probably wouldn't be very effective, BUT you could have like TWENTY of them, right?

I have thought about a drone swarm before being used for something like this. So many drones, one will get through.

 

[Jaskalas]

Their also might be some type of jammers...

That'd prevent RC, but any intelligent person would target the podium. A fixed destination. Cannot jam a signal that is not present or required.

 

[dougp]

This was actually a plot on Legends this summer ...

 

[blinblue]

I think the moral of the story is that it actually not that difficult to do a lot of damage. Thankfully most people are sane and thus don't want to. Those that are insane often aren't smart enough to do it without being caught.

 

[Brian Stirling]

Pretty much all DC is restricted airspace and even the planes taking off from Reagan airport near the Pentagon must fly a contorted route on takeoff and landing to avoid straying into restricted airspace.

I believe it's possible to get a permit to do this but it won't be easy getting it and expect company if you do.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure they are aware of the threat and have plans/contingencies in place.

I drone is not invisible from radar though they can operate low enough that you'd need a radar system close enough to see it. The White House has, or is reported to have, anti-aircraft weapons, though the reaction time to use them might well be too long to be effective.


Brian

 

[Brovane]

That'd prevent RC, but any intelligent person would target the podium. A fixed destination. Cannot jam a signal that is not present or required.

Program in a fixed destination? That is harder than it looks and usually they use GPS for guidance, since GPS makes it fairly simple. When the President is outdoors the Secret Service has marksman on the roof of the White House or at any outdoor venue, IE the president making a speech. Also as soon as the drone was spotted a Secret Service agent(s) would be moving the president to safety.

 

[moonbogg]

Oh! What about RC cars! I swear you could swarm anyone with about 10 RC cars with dynOmight attached.

Program in a fixed destination? That is harder than it looks and usually they use GPS for guidance, since GPS makes it fairly simple. When the President is outdoors the Secret Service has marksman on the roof of the White House or at any outdoor venue, IE the president making a speech. Also as soon as the drone was spotted a Secret Service agent(s) would be moving the president to safety.

You paint that sail plane light bluish gray, take it up to 800ft before approaching the target and I guarantee they won't see it unless they get lucky with binoculars or something. Even you, being the pilot, would not see that up there. You'd have to rely on the camera vision (which works BTW, I've used it)
Besides, it would happen so fast. I used to fly these things a lot. I had a red and white one, painted for visibility and at 800 ft I damn near lost the thing so many times. They dive lightning fast and they wouldn't see it in time.

 

[Phoenix86]

FAA regulations. The appearance of a drone/RC plane in the airspace would immediatelly raise suspicion and action would be taken fairly quickly to deal with it.

http://tfr.faa.gov/save_pages/detail_0_8326.html

Because you could launch it from the fence or anything, giving seconds to react.

 

[Phoenix86]

Oh! What about RC cars! I swear you could swarm anyone with about 10 RC cars with dynOmight attached.

Drones would be a much better platform, no bumpy ground, less visible...

 

[Brovane]

Because you could launch it from the fence or anything, giving seconds to react.

You mean the fence line immediately around the White House?

 

[gorcorps]

They can't even stop PEOPLE from getting in anymore, and your question is if they have a way to stop tiny flying machines from spying?

LOL

 

[moonbogg]

They can't shoot down an r/c sail plane. What, snipe it? Fucking AA missile? No, if its not being signal jammed, it will work. However, I have a better idea. Wait until your human target is ANYWHERE near the ocean, and then release a group of these:

 

[Brovane]

They can't even stop PEOPLE from getting in anymore, and your question is if they have a way to stop tiny flying machines from spying?

LOL

Are we talking about spying or attacking the President? When the President is actually outside at the White House the level of security is completely different and how the Social Security would react to someone/something breaching the perimeter. The level of agents even changes when the President is in residence.

 

[Brovane]

Oh! What about RC cars! I swear you could swarm anyone with about 10 RC cars with dynOmight attached.



You paint that sail plane light bluish gray, take it up to 800ft before approaching the target and I guarantee they won't see it unless they get lucky with binoculars or something. Even you, being the pilot, would not see that up there. You'd have to rely on the camera vision (which works BTW, I've used it)
Besides, it would happen so fast. I used to fly these things a lot. I had a red and white one, painted for visibility and at 800 ft I damn near lost the thing so many times. They dive lightning fast and they wouldn't see it in time.

You have a good point. A RC sail plane versus a quad copter would be hard to spot. Realistically we don't know the complete security measures in place. I read somewhere even when the Presidental motorcade travels a vehicle has a jammer inside of it so the motorcade creates essentially a rolling jamming zone around the President.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USSS_Electronic_Countermeasures_Suburban

Exact details are not listed but I suspect that some confidental documents discuss possible drone attack scenarios.