DX10 video cards

Malak

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Dec 4, 2004
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I realize that DX10 will be Vista-only, but the video cards capable of DX10 specs could come out at any time, no? How soon do you suppose we'll see them? I'm hoping a couple months prior to Vista, so I have a chance at getting one when Vista comes out. Seems inevitable, you just have to switch to DX10 when it comes out.
 

Golgatha

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Jul 18, 2003
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Originally posted by: Malak
Originally posted by: ElFenix
when vista comes out. so early 2009.

Vista is coming out this fall/winter.

The sarcasm is lost on you. It might be early 2009 before it's patched with all the features they originally wanted to include though.
 

KeithTalent

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I'm pretty sure he was being sarcastic.

Anyway, check out the roadmap here:

Roadmap

This guy is usually spot on.

Edit: Cole's notes: Vista Nov. 15/06, R600 Oct/06, G80 sometime in the 2nd half of 06 (any time after June). Of course, everything is subject to change.
 

akugami

Diamond Member
Feb 14, 2005
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DX10. For the umpteenth time, who cares? Games taking full advantage of DX10 will not be around till 2007 or more likely 2008. There are many good reasons why you shouldn't wait for a DX10 part in 2006, just do a search.
 

Malak

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Dec 4, 2004
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Originally posted by: akugami
DX10. For the umpteenth time, who cares? Games taking full advantage of DX10 will not be around till 2007 or more likely 2008. There are many good reasons why you shouldn't wait for a DX10 part in 2006, just do a search.

Actually, I care. The game I am anticipating most this year will be using DX10. Take your ignorance else where.
 

KeithTalent

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I actually care too. The next card I buy will have to last me for quite a while, and I would like it to be able to at least play the DX10 games that come out over the next couple of years.
 

Nextman916

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Aug 2, 2005
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If your speaking of crysis, it hasnt been finalized to be DX10 compliant, many people speculate that its only a marketing scheme not yet proven. I for one sure hope it is however if it really does use DX10, there will probably have to be a way to run the game in DX9.
 

ArchAngel777

Diamond Member
Dec 24, 2000
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Malak... Why do you always treat others with such disrespect? I can't believe you get away with it.

But to answer your question, according to many knowledgable users on this forum, that DX10 is not yet finalized. That means, it would be impossible for a Video Card to be DX10 compliant if the DX10 features are not even finalized. Get my point? Therefore, until DX10 is finalized, it won't be possible for a Video Card to support DX10, unless they happen to get "lucky" with the specs and gamble on what they think will be DX10 compliant.
 

KeithTalent

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Please forgive my ignorance on these matters, but wouldn't Nvidia and ATI be a little more 'in the loop' as far as DX10 requirements go? If the timelines I have seen remain in place, I do not see why the R600 could not be DX10 ready/compliant, though if G80 comes out in June it may be a bit of a stretch.

All I know is I want to be able to play Halo2 as close to max everything as I can, and I am pretty sure I will need DX10 compliance on my video card in order to do so.
 

akugami

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Feb 14, 2005
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The only game known to even attempt to use DX10 is Crysis as Nextman916 stated. Most likely it will use a DX10 compatibility mode. There is zero confirmation that it will fully utilize DX10 and not just a couple of features. DX10 isn't even, at least to my knowledge, finalized yet. Many many games industry folks have stated it takes roughly 3 years to make a decent game.

Even if someone started a game using DX10 on non final API's on Jan 1, 2006 it would take them at least two years to make a game and likely 3 years for a decent one. Which would put it at 2008-2009 timeframe. Basically you're likely to not see a game truly utilize DX10 until mid 2008. We saw the same thing with DX7, DX8, and DX9 where it took a while before developers truly utilized the new version of DirectX in making their games.

For Crysis to use DX10 it will most likely only use a few features of DX10 that won't enhance the game by much. Think of it as the difference between the early DX9 games and DX8. Some games ran in both modes depending on your hardware. When screencaps were taken between both games the graphical difference (aside from water effects) was remarkably small. Which, I'm betting, is the case with Crytek's new game. DX9 had a pretty big efficiency advantage over DX8 but I'm not so sure that DX10 will add as much as far as efficiency goes but be more along the lines of adding effects and increasing the versatililty of the API's.

In late 2002 and early 2003, we were only just starting to see more than a handful of games utilizing DX8 and DX9 was released in Dec 2002. It wasn't until 2004 that we really saw any signs of life from DX9. Nearly two years after the release of DX9. Why shouldn't DX10 be any different than DX8 and DX9?

Not only does the timing of things make it highly highly unlikely for a game that truly utilizes DX10 to come out, the economics of it don't make sense either. Vista will have an extremely small installed user base compared to WinXP and it would be financial suicide to make a game that is optimized for DX10 and not one optimized for DX9 at this time that will be released in 2006 or well into 2007.

I think if you want a good look at what DX10 will bring to the table you should look at Xbox360 games. The GPU was developed by ATI and contains unified shaders. The graphical effects available on 360 are what I'm expecting on the new R600 and G80 GPU's. They're good, especially for a console, but hardly heads and tales above games we've seen before.

Either way, the demo reel of Crysis did not reveal anything that wasn't possible in DX9. If you are talking about a different game that's going to be out sooner, please state it.

I stand by my original statement, there is no sense waiting for DX10 in 2006. I think mid 2007 is when one should seriously start looking towards DX10 parts. I think my reasoning is pretty sound as to why one shouldn't wait for DX10 and not based on ignorance as you claim. And if you bothered to do a search, this question has been asked more than once. Offhand, I remember at least 3 threads on it in the last couple of months alone.

So if it's time for you to upgrade now then do so now. As I will as soon as I find out which comes out on top between the X1900 and 7900GTX. If your normal upgrade cycle happens to coincide with the release of DX10 compliant parts, then good for you. But I wouldn't hold off on upgrading just to wait for DX10 as no games will make use of it for close to 2+ years.
 

Jeffreyg4

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Dec 29, 2005
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Noob question, Why wont the newest cards of today (X1900XTX ext) be able to be software updated to DX10, my Geforce FX5200 (crap card) is running DX 9.0c (or whatever the newest one is called)
 

Acanthus

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Aug 28, 2001
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Originally posted by: KeithTalent
Please forgive my ignorance on these matters, but wouldn't Nvidia and ATI be a little more 'in the loop' as far as DX10 requirements go? If the timelines I have seen remain in place, I do not see why the R600 could not be DX10 ready/compliant, though if G80 comes out in June it may be a bit of a stretch.

All I know is I want to be able to play Halo2 as close to max everything as I can, and I am pretty sure I will need DX10 compliance on my video card in order to do so.

You know that the xbox is barely DX8 right?

and if history repeats itself, itll run like garbage on even the best hardware, because they will port it like crap.
 

thebigdude

Senior member
Apr 27, 2005
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Originally posted by: Acanthus
Originally posted by: KeithTalent
Please forgive my ignorance on these matters, but wouldn't Nvidia and ATI be a little more 'in the loop' as far as DX10 requirements go? If the timelines I have seen remain in place, I do not see why the R600 could not be DX10 ready/compliant, though if G80 comes out in June it may be a bit of a stretch.

All I know is I want to be able to play Halo2 as close to max everything as I can, and I am pretty sure I will need DX10 compliance on my video card in order to do so.

You know that the xbox is barely DX8 right?

and if history repeats itself, itll run like garbage on even the best hardware, because they will port it like crap.




im agreeing that halo 2 will probably be another crappy port
 

jiffylube1024

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Feb 17, 2002
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Originally posted by: Golgatha
Originally posted by: Malak
Originally posted by: ElFenix
when vista comes out. so early 2009.

Vista is coming out this fall/winter.

The sarcasm is lost on you. It might be early 2009 before it's patched with all the features they originally wanted to include though.

Heh, yup.

At times I think to myself "whoah Vista is coming out this year!" But then I come back down to earth and realize it won't be until next year (at the earliest) that it gets its first service pack and gets all/most of the bugs ironed out. Plus DX10 games are still a ways off...
 

Acanthus

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Aug 28, 2001
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They dropped pretty much every useful feature they were adding to vista over XP.

Its basically windows 2000 3.0 until they add them.
 

Matthias99

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Oct 7, 2003
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Originally posted by: Jeffreyg4
Noob question, Why wont the newest cards of today (X1900XTX ext) be able to be software updated to DX10

Um... because you can't add hardware features in software (unless you use emulation, which is slow; see GMA900 and anything running vertex shaders).

my Geforce FX5200 (crap card) is running DX 9.0c (or whatever the newest one is called)

Having DX9.0c installed != able to use SM3.0.
 

Reznick

Junior Member
Jan 26, 2006
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Actually, I care. The game I am anticipating most this year will be using DX10. Take your ignorance else where.

DX10 only runs on Vista, and the decision to move to Vista will be based on whether your current software, including games, will even run on it. I have no confidence in compatibility with these OS changes, given my experience

Also, DX10 is not really an officially finished product right now. CryTek did a DX10 demo back in Sept. '05 of its new game engine, so the basics are there and some developers are looking at it. But until the market more fully embraces Vista as an OS, and that the other factors such as compatability between XP and Vista games and other applications are resolved, then at that point I think DX10 video cards will be really needed. Up until that point, though, I am personally willing to live with a DX9 card, and buying one now still seems to make sense since my current video needs, such as games, really need the improvement.
 

KeithTalent

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Nov 30, 2005
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Originally posted by: thebigdude
Originally posted by: Acanthus
Originally posted by: KeithTalent
Please forgive my ignorance on these matters, but wouldn't Nvidia and ATI be a little more 'in the loop' as far as DX10 requirements go? If the timelines I have seen remain in place, I do not see why the R600 could not be DX10 ready/compliant, though if G80 comes out in June it may be a bit of a stretch.

All I know is I want to be able to play Halo2 as close to max everything as I can, and I am pretty sure I will need DX10 compliance on my video card in order to do so.

You know that the xbox is barely DX8 right?

and if history repeats itself, itll run like garbage on even the best hardware, because they will port it like crap.




im agreeing that halo 2 will probably be another crappy port


Well I am holding out hope that they have learned their lesson and they do a better job of porting Halo2 (though I still play the multiplayer of HaloPC all the time).

I inferred from the Moneysoft news about H2 only being on Vista that it will be using DX10, but maybe not, I mean what the heck do I know....
 

Jeffreyg4

Member
Dec 29, 2005
79
0
0
Originally posted by: Matthias99
Originally posted by: Jeffreyg4
Noob question, Why wont the newest cards of today (X1900XTX ext) be able to be software updated to DX10

Um... because you can't add hardware features in software (unless you use emulation, which is slow; see GMA900 and anything running vertex shaders).

my Geforce FX5200 (crap card) is running DX 9.0c (or whatever the newest one is called)

Having DX9.0c installed != able to use SM3.0.


But wait, when my card came out dx 9 wasent out, yet i could still upgrade.... so why wouldent a X1900XTX be able to upgrade to dx 10 (wich isent out when its released)
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: akugami
DX10. For the umpteenth time, who cares? Games taking full advantage of DX10 will not be around till 2007 or more likely 2008. There are many good reasons why you shouldn't wait for a DX10 part in 2006, just do a search.

the games that will be "full DX10 games" aren't in development yet.

Assume they get their finalized Spec from M$ and their Dev kit tomorrow . . . assume the financing is already there and the team is assembled . . .

it will be March 2009 before the game is released

so who cares about DX 10?
:roll:
 
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