E6600 lapping results

[Shimmishim]

wow. glad i read this thread.

since I have an ES processor, i thought I might as well give it a try (since I have no warranty)

i got the same results as you! 10C drop on load.

i don't know if it'll help with o/c yet but let me tell ya it was a pain getting it flat.

my IHS was also concave like yours and the edges were the only parts touching the waterblock.

i had to sand down the edges more than the middle and after 2 days of sanding, i am now getting the middle of the IHS to touch the block.

i still have some work to do since the middle is now slightly higher than the edges (oops)

but even at that i got a 10C drop.

good read. glad i did it!

 

[ingenue007]

are you guys sanding your hsf too?

i get my zalman monday. i don't know how flat those are. my arctic freezer wasn't smooth at all

 

[Raider1284]

my zalman 9500 was incredibly flat and glassy, wouldnt recommend lapping that. does the "nickel bond" reduced the thermal transfer by alot? why would they cover it in nickel as opposed to just the copper that is below it?

 

[Baked]

Originally posted by: Raider1284
my zalman 9500 was incredibly flat and glassy, wouldnt recommend lapping that. does the "nickel bond" reduced the thermal transfer by alot? why would they cover it in nickel as opposed to just the copper that is below it?

Nickel plating the copper prevents oxidation of the heatsink.

 

[Blain]

Originally posted by: CCityInstaller

Originally posted by: keeleysam

Originally posted by: cmdrdredd

Originally posted by: Soul Colossus

Originally posted by: lopri
I'd call that mirror finish. Geez.. How long did it take? Beautiful job!

It's reflective like a mirror, but as you can see in the later pics there are still a lot of scratches on it. I've seen a lot of lapped chips that literally look like Windex'd glass mirrors. Pretty irrelevant to performance though.

It took about two hours, listening to loud music helps . It took longer than it should have though since I started with 800 grit and should have done so with 400.

Originally posted by: Raider1284

The only thing that concerns me is ruining the warranty and possibly damaging the cpu. Is there much danger in doing this? I seem to have lost that black plastic back plate so I don't know what I should use to cover it, if/when I decide to lap it.

Don't you void the warranty by overclocking?

If you're not careless about it and take the right steps, it's pretty safe and easy. If you don't have that plastic piece, you should see about borrowing one from someone you know or something like that. I don't know if you can safely tape up the bare back of the chip with the gold contacts. Perhaps you can use a little piece of paper as a substitute and then go liberal with the tape to get it sealed.

The warranty issue with overclocking is that if a chip fails and you only adjust your FSB to get the CPU clock up, then it's likely that nobody will know that you overclocked it at all.

It's still fraud.

Indeed it is, however I'm willing to bet that 85-90% of the member's here wouldn't think twice about RMA'ing a processor they knowingly o/c'ed.

Count me in your 10-15% that WOULDN'T RMA. :laugh:


BTW, Copper has much better thermal conductivity than Nickel. :roll:

 

[Raider1284]

My guess then is the destruction of the nickel is defineately contributing to the big drop in temps. According to that link copper is more then 4 times more thermally conductive. So if you had a flat IHS I'm guessing lapping would still help a great deal.

What is the best way to check if your IHS is flat? I have heard using a razor to the light or something is how to do it? How are you supposed to hold the razor to it?

I don't see why they are so worried about oxidation... copper heatsinks have been exposed to the elements for years and they have never had a problem. Does AMD nickel bond their IHS as well?

 

[Shimmishim]

Originally posted by: Raider1284
My guess then is the destruction of the nickel is defineately contributing to the big drop in temps. According to that link copper is more then 4 times more thermally conductive. So if you had a flat IHS I'm guessing lapping would still help a great deal.

What is the best way to check if your IHS is flat? I have heard using a razor to the light or something is how to do it? How are you supposed to hold the razor to it?

I don't see why they are so worried about oxidation... copper heatsinks have been exposed to the elements for years and they have never had a problem. Does AMD nickel bond their IHS as well?

the best way to test it is to take your cpu, cover it with a thin layer of cheap thermal paste (not AS5 or AS5 if that's all you have) and then stick it to your heatsink or waterblock.

you shouldn't need to put a lot of pressure on the cpu when you push it onto the heatsink/block.

after that pull the cpu off and you'll see an imprint of the IHS on the heatsink/block.

what i saw was thermal paste in a square along the edge and no thermal paste on the middle section.

after sanding it down, i saw a nice imprint in the middle (and none on the edge).

ideally you'll want to see a nice imprint of the whole IHS on the heatsink.

 

[ingenue007]

i just spent 1.5 hours lapping mine from 220->1500.

yeah my temps dropped a WHOPPING 1 degree C. my stock intel HSF is on tight; checked it a couple times to make sure. my zalman comes sometime this week. i hope it offers better temps.

 

[Shimmishim]

Originally posted by: ingenue007
i just spent 1.5 hours lapping mine from 220->1500.

yeah my temps dropped a WHOPPING 1 degree C. my stock intel HSF is on tight; checked it a couple times to make sure. my zalman comes sometime this week. i hope it offers better temps.

sanding is ineffective unless you test the flatness.

are you sure that the whole IHS is touching the HSF?

if it's not, you won't see a change.

the first round i did it, i didn't see any improvement.

it wasn't until i made sure at least the middle of the IHS was touching the HSF that i saw a drastic change.

refer to my post above about testing for flatness

 

[joebjoe]

I have my e6400 OC'd at 3.2Ghz. My normal temps are 46c. Load about 58c, thats running blend on orthos.

I'm stable. My voltage is 1.38.

HD temp is 32c and system temp is 35c. Overall decent temps.

Im using a thermaltake blueorb cpu fan. A 120MM fan in front and rear of case. A Kama bay fan in upright position taking up 3 drive bays. And I also have a system blower loaded in a PCI slot.

Maybe that will give some people ideas.

My 7600GT GPU is at 45c also. And thats OC'd some as well.

Getting close to 36000 on 3dmark01 and about 4500 on 3dmark06

 

[Rubycon]

Good results! 10°C is a lot especially if you're overclocking.

Has anyone tried removing the heat spreader and replacing it with a precision machined copper plate? :Q

 

[ingenue007]

maybe my temps aren't monitored correctly. i dropped voltages from 1.435 to 1.4 and my temp apps (asus prob, intel TAT) show no change. maybe i have bad luck with asus mobos (my current one is on RMA)

also i have a l629b chip. aren't these reported to run hotter?

 

[SteveOCZ]

I lapped my E6300 and E6600 last week. It took 12C off the 6600 at 1.425V and about 7C off the 6300

 

[CupCak3]

here is another lapping guide for those who want a 2nd opinion...

http://forum.overclock3d.net/showthread.php?t=4735


nice lap btw op. i'm going to lap my 6300 as soon as i can get my hands on a rd600 board

 

[blurredvision]

Well sh|t guys, now I'm going to have to try this. After getting my E6600 and Zalman 9500 last week, I noticed my temps were higher than I liked. I originally put AS5 on with a random card from my wallet, which is how a friend showed me to do it. When I took the 9500 off a couple days later to see if there was something I could do to get lower temps, there was hardly any AS5 on the underside of the Zalman, just a touch around the edges, and that's it. I'm surprised the thing didn't overheat. I figured I just didn't put enough, and put a little more, which did result in lower temps. I think I may try lapping this weekend, though. I'm not scared of any warranty .

EDIT: Is the piece of glass simply used as a type of sanding block? I'm not getting what the glass is for....

 

[ingenue007]

glass is to keep the surface as flat as possible

 

[Soul Colossus]

Originally posted by: Shimmishim
wow. glad i read this thread.

since I have an ES processor, i thought I might as well give it a try (since I have no warranty)

i got the same results as you! 10C drop on load.

i don't know if it'll help with o/c yet but let me tell ya it was a pain getting it flat.

my IHS was also concave like yours and the edges were the only parts touching the waterblock.

i had to sand down the edges more than the middle and after 2 days of sanding, i am now getting the middle of the IHS to touch the block.

i still have some work to do since the middle is now slightly higher than the edges (oops)

but even at that i got a 10C drop.

good read. glad i did it!

Are you only sanding certain spots at a time? That's the most difficult way to go about it. You're supposed tape your sandpaper over a piece of flat glass on a table, that way the paper will be flat, then hold your CPU in your hand and rub it across the paper on the glass. As it grinds down, the whole thing will end up flat.

 

[Shimmishim]

maybe it is a more difficult way but it worked for me!

i'll try your method as i still need to sand it down in the middle now since the edges aren't making complete contact

 

[ingenue007]

ok new zalman came. new p5b deluxe came too. cleaned NB/SB and applied arctic silver for 12c mobo temp drop. lapped CPU +Zalman =20 C temp drop. my load temp with orthos is equal to my previous idle temps with stock HSF. i get higher overclock too!

 

[bjp999]

OP (Soul Colossus) - Nice job! I also lapped mine along with my Scythe Infinity and dropped my temps 11C. Very worthwhile. Although I'd probably not do this with a $1000 CPU, at $300 the risk of losing the warranty is a risk I was willing to take.

The only thing I see that may be a problem is that the amount of AS5 you used in this pic.

Originally posted by: Soul Colossus
http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/8268/r0010046wv1.jpg

The core isn't really that that tall. Look at this link and you'll see some extreme OCers that removed the IHS on the CPU. It will give you an idea of how big the core underneath actually is. Remember the AS5 spreads in 360 degrees. Also, the AS5 looks to be thicker than you want. I used about 1/4 this much, maybe less. Too much AS5 will create a layer between the HSF and CPU. That's not optimal. All you really want is enough to fill in the the micro-crevices in the already extremely flat CPU and HSF. If you're not lapped, you need extra to fill the gaps, cause air is much worse than AS5. But when lapped, a little goes a VERY long way. The directions I read suggest a grain of rice size, and using a twisting action on the HSF back a forth a couple times under some moderate pressure to grind the AS5 into the crevices and cause it to spread out optimally. You then want to tighten down the the HSF without lifting it (so you don't get air bubbles). I find doing it once for practice is a good idea. Then you can see how well it spread. Of course you have to clean up and do it again for real, but at least you know how much to use!

Also, see this <a target=_blank class=ftalternatingbar...org/forums/showthread.php?t=117054</a>">link</a> for some directions on modding the mount of the Scythe Infinity. Worked for me and now taking the thing apart is not nearly the headache it was before. It also creates a very good tight fit! Just don't overcrank as the MB will start to bend.

Good luck!

 

[Raider1284]

On a scale of 1-10, 1 being: lapping is incredibly risky/cpu death is almost guaranteed, 10 being: It would almost be impossible to mess up a lap job/you have to be an "idiot" to break the cpu.

How would you guys rate the lapping process? I'm really interested in doing this, just crazy scarred to do so.

 

[ingenue007]

id say it is a 7-8. as long as you cover the backside you are fine. you can't mess it up really. but you do void your warranty when you start.

 

[bjp999]

Originally posted by: Raider1284
On a scale of 1-10, 1 being: lapping is incredibly risky/cpu death is almost guaranteed, 10 being: It would almost be impossible to mess up a lap job/you have to be an "idiot" to break the cpu.

How would you guys rate the lapping process? I'm really interested in doing this, just crazy scarred to do so.

10 - it would be almost impossible to break the CPU by lapping it, unless you tried to lap the wrong side :laugh:. Only negative is losing warranty, so if it breaks a year from now you're on your own. CPU is actually very easy to lap compared to monster heatsinks.

 

[nealh]

On these C2D..what is the best way to apply AS5...small dab in the center or a thin line across the cpu in horz. fashion to cover the cores

I am not going to spread AS5 in my previous testing this did nothing....

 

[Kwint Sommer]

Originally posted by: Raider1284
On a scale of 1-10, 1 being: lapping is incredibly risky/cpu death is almost guaranteed, 10 being: It would almost be impossible to mess up a lap job/you have to be an "idiot" to break the cpu.

How would you guys rate the lapping process? I'm really interested in doing this, just crazy scarred to do so.

I would say 9 on the off chance that you do something like drop your CPU and then step on it, though the lapping itself is perfectly safe.