Election 2004

cwjerome

Diamond Member
Sep 30, 2004
4,346
26
81
Polls showed that many people thought Iraq was going badly. Polls showed Americans were concerned with education, jobs, healthcare, and security. Polls showed a small majority believing that America was heading in the wrong direction! Yet amazingly, Bush was still elected.... why?? Some people around here have a clue, but they don't have a remedy. The overriding factor comes down to a very simple concept: morals and attitude.

Since 1980, conservative values have been marching steadily forward. Conservatism has deep roots and a powerful base. Even the anomaly of Clinton is explained by the fact that he was a very moderate centrist who never received more that 50% of the vote. The grip of conservatism is evidenced by the Reps holding both houses of Congress, the majority of governorships, and especially by Bush's re-election. As demonstrated by polls, people did not vote so much on issues... they voted for Bush the man.

This is because the Democratic Party may have legitimate ideas, but they are damaged goods. The Dems align themselves with Al Sharpton, Michael Moore, and Hollywood. The Dems embrace creepy websites like MoveOn.Org. The Dems are doomed to failure and are basically rudderless because of the vocal minority within their party that repulses moderate Americans. This dramatic shift to the left -while America remains basically conservative- is killing their chances at connecting with people and spreading their ideals. It's almost like how some radical extremists have hijacked moderate Islam, and taints any goodness that it has to offer. And like with that example, the reasonable Muslims are almost complicit in allowing for the dangerous fringe to fester and hurt the cause... such is the position of the Democratic Party. I call these extremists the arrogant elitists.

They think middle America is stupid. They think our flag-waving is stupid and our churchgoing is stupid. They think having more than 2 kids is stupid and driving SUVs is stupid. They think where we live is stupid, our guns are stupid, and our undying belief in America's goodness is stupid. They think our beliefs are stupid, they think our votes are stupid, and they definately think GWB is stupid. Welcome to the land of the arrogant elites.

The elites are defined by a general outlook and supreme arrogance. They believe they are superior to others. They babble about "cultural centers" and studies about post-bac degrees. They know better. They are way ahead of us, and view the masses as primitive animals that they must sheperd. Our stupidity and vast numbers make us dangerous.

They can label tens of millions of Americans as racist with the drop of a hat. They malign and impune 100+ million Americans as fundamentalist nuts without blinking. They demean our most basic foundations and institutions by saying they allow for Nazi leaders. They show contempt for the people by labeling whole populations fascist. They corrupt our history by viewing it as one American atrocity or failure after another. They are doom and gloom pessimists, and cynical to the core. Their hand-wringing, conceited, negative, "can't do" attitude is fundamentally un-American. They brains are too big for America... they have outgrown her and are ashamed of her.

THIS is what the American voice was saying on November 2nd. Bush was weak and easily defeatable. The fact that he passed while losing on the issues is a slap in the face and complete rejection of the values and morals eminating from the arrogant elites withing the Democratic Party. Until the Dems reform, they will be marginalized. They are lossing touch and failing to connect to mainstream America because of the hate and arrogance from the elites.

Many at this website will reactively attacked my words, not even realizing I am the one who is trying to help the Dems get with the program. Sometimes it takes a political outsider to provide a perspective that can't develop within the box. Take it for what it's worth.





 

bdude

Golden Member
Feb 9, 2004
1,645
0
76
Meh, this sort of de-construction of the left based on Bush's reelection is laughable at best. It was a mandate of law, not a mandate of the people.
 

OneOfTheseDays

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2000
7,052
0
0
Bush = wartime president, immense popularity amongst base, and religious wedge issues. Those things all benefited him immensely.

49% of this country still voted for Kerry, I wouldn't say that the left is declining at all. To assert that is absolutely ridiculous in my opinion. What is happening is that the conservative states are becoming more conservative and the mid-west states are tilting towards the Republican party. What the Democrats need to do is to bring those mid-west states back to the Democratic party.
 

PsharkJF

Senior member
Jul 12, 2004
653
0
0
And I suppose there aren't people so far right in the Republican Party?
Watch for the two new republican senators - I believe one is from OK and I forget what the other is from - but he said that unmarried women should not be teachers, gays should not be teachers, all sorts of utterly ridiculous beliefs.

Using them as examples, the same logic applies to both sides.
 

351Cleveland

Golden Member
Apr 14, 2001
1,381
6
81
Originally posted by: bdude
Meh, this sort of de-construction of the left based on Bush's reelection is laughable at best. It was a mandate of law, not a mandate of the people.

*Walking in a Corky Wonderland*

Majority of the vote nationwide. Let's TOSS the electoral college for this conversation. Even going by the PRECIOUS popular vote, Kerry still gets beat.
 

351Cleveland

Golden Member
Apr 14, 2001
1,381
6
81
Originally posted by: PsharkJF
And I suppose there aren't people so far right in the Republican Party?
Watch for the two new republican senators - I believe one is from OK and I forget what the other is from - but he said that unmarried women should not be teachers, gays should not be teachers, all sorts of utterly ridiculous beliefs.

Using them as examples, the same logic applies to both sides.

Would LOVE to see a link or reference where I can read this outside the forum.
 

Forsythe

Platinum Member
May 2, 2004
2,825
0
0
Being completely objective: the rest of the world agrees with the american democrats, don't you think there's a slight possibility for you to be the "brainwashed" one?

Being subjective: Dude... I'm gonna save what you just wrote, and post it on a forum i know. I'll post some replies in here. And that political force outside? ... You need it dude, seriously!
 

bdude

Golden Member
Feb 9, 2004
1,645
0
76
Originally posted by: 351Cleveland
Originally posted by: bdude
Meh, this sort of de-construction of the left based on Bush's reelection is laughable at best. It was a mandate of law, not a mandate of the people.

*Walking in a Corky Wonderland*

Majority of the vote nationwide. Let's TOSS the electoral college for this conversation. Even going by the PRECIOUS popular vote, Kerry still gets beat.

My point is, just like the early to mid 90's when the repubs were flailing around in Clinton's bask, there isn't anything for the left to fear. Just the swing of the pendulum.
 

OneOfTheseDays

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2000
7,052
0
0
Keep in mind the fact that the Democrats actually won in 2000, and had Gore been given the presidency your argument for the destruction of the left would be moot. I for one am never going to join the party of the brainwashed where its own members are encouraged not to think or to question the actions of the president. A thinking man's party is not the current Republican party. Give me the Rep. party of old, fiscal responsibility and a conservative approach to foreign policy.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,894
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: cwjerome

Many at this website will reactively attacked my words, not even realizing I am the one who is trying to help the Dems get with the program.

Become a Bible Thumping Brainwashed Sheep ........ No Thanks, you can keep that program.
 

Mill

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
28,558
3
81
Originally posted by: Forsythe
Being completely objective: the rest of the world agrees with the american democrats, don't you think there's a slight possibility for you to be the "brainwashed" one?

Being subjective: Dude... I'm gonna save what you just wrote, and post it on a forum i know. I'll post some replies in here. And that political force outside? ... You need it dude, seriously!

Why does the rest of the world matter when it comes to picking our president. Do you think Americans worry about the election in Denmark? Do you think we should try to influence who you vote for, in your elections there?
 

kranky

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
21,014
137
106
If you want to see proof of the attitude that the OP is talking about, check this thread.

Originally posted by: 351Cleveland
Originally posted by: PsharkJF
And I suppose there aren't people so far right in the Republican Party?
Watch for the two new republican senators - I believe one is from OK and I forget what the other is from - but he said that unmarried women should not be teachers, gays should not be teachers, all sorts of utterly ridiculous beliefs.

Using them as examples, the same logic applies to both sides.

Would LOVE to see a link or reference where I can read this outside the forum.

If you're talking about the guy who said openly gay people should not be teachers, it's DeMent from SC.

 

sixone

Lifer
May 3, 2004
25,162
4
61
Originally posted by: Sudheer Anne
Bush = wartime president, immense popularity amongst base, and religious wedge issues. Those things all benefited him immensely.

49% of this country still voted for Kerry, I wouldn't say that the left is declining at all. To assert that is absolutely ridiculous in my opinion. What is happening is that the conservative states are becoming more conservative and the mid-west states are tilting towards the Republican party. What the Democrats need to do is to bring those mid-west states back to the Democratic party.


I think you're misoverestimating Bush's popularity among his base - he was simply the less unpalatable candidate to a considerable number of voters who chose him.

I think you meant to say that 49% of voters went for Kerry - 40% of the country didn't vote for anyone. 29% of the country went to Kerry, 31% to Bush. Nothing to brag about for either one.

The Democratic party is going to have to take a step back towards the center to increase support. Kerry had to go left to get the nomination, then back to the right afterwards. But not far enough to win.
 

Forsythe

Platinum Member
May 2, 2004
2,825
0
0
Originally posted by: Mill
Originally posted by: Forsythe
Being completely objective: the rest of the world agrees with the american democrats, don't you think there's a slight possibility for you to be the "brainwashed" one?

Being subjective: Dude... I'm gonna save what you just wrote, and post it on a forum i know. I'll post some replies in here. And that political force outside? ... You need it dude, seriously!

Why does the rest of the world matter when it comes to picking our president. Do you think Americans worry about the election in Denmark? Do you think we should try to influence who you vote for, in your elections there?

Whenever america has a vote, european polls (they're allways there in some sort) show the same fallout as expected in america, only a bit more libby. Here we have 86% democratic support, and about 6-7% bush support...
You can try, sure, i dont mind.

[edit]
Edit for nonsense
 

illustri

Golden Member
Mar 14, 2001
1,490
0
0
Americans said conservativism was dead in the 60's with watergate, again when lyndon johnson lost in the 70's but here it is still. Don't be too quick to write off a movement thats probably been with humanity as long as politics itself. Stupid
 

Rainsford

Lifer
Apr 25, 2001
17,515
0
0
Originally posted by: illustri
Americans said conservativism was dead in the 60's with watergate, again when lyndon johnson lost in the 70's but here it is still. Don't be too quick to write off a movement thats probably been with humanity as long as politics itself. Stupid

They're just still drunk from the election parties, it will wear off in about 4 years
 

r0tt3n1

Golden Member
Oct 16, 2001
1,086
0
0
The newly elected Senator of Oklahoma, Tom Coburn the Republican, is utterly anti-abortion and has actually said doctors who perform them should be given the death penalty. He also held a rally in a rural county school district and opined about the `rampant lesbianism` in the small town high school. spooky.........
 

PsharkJF

Senior member
Jul 12, 2004
653
0
0
Originally posted by: r0tt3n1
The newly elected Senator of Oklahoma, Tom Coburn the Republican, is utterly anti-abortion and has actually said doctors who perform them should be given the death penalty. He also held a rally in a rural county school district and opined about the `rampant lesbianism` in the small town high school. spooky.........
Yeah, that guy and Dement. That's who I was referring to. Are they the voice of the Republican party as you claim Sharpton and Moore are the voice of the Dems?

 

Robor

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
16,979
0
76
Originally posted by: cwjerome
Polls showed that many people thought Iraq was going badly. Polls showed Americans were concerned with education, jobs, healthcare, and security. Polls showed a small majority believing that America was heading in the wrong direction! Yet amazingly, Bush was still elected.... why?? Some people around here have a clue, but they don't have a remedy. The overriding factor comes down to a very simple concept: morals and attitude...(snipped)
Maybe those of us who voted for Kerry are still scratching our head as to why people like *you* ignored the important issues in favor of morality. Same sex marriage, abortion, stem cell research - all issues of morality that don't directly affect you. The economy, foreign policy, healthcare, the war in Iraq - all important issues that affect everyone and areas where the Bush administration was (according to many) not doing well. Why again did you choose to give him another 4 years? Oh yeah, well at least you still have your bible and your morality...

 

sixone

Lifer
May 3, 2004
25,162
4
61
Originally posted by: Robor
Originally posted by: cwjerome
Polls showed that many people thought Iraq was going badly. Polls showed Americans were concerned with education, jobs, healthcare, and security. Polls showed a small majority believing that America was heading in the wrong direction! Yet amazingly, Bush was still elected.... why?? Some people around here have a clue, but they don't have a remedy. The overriding factor comes down to a very simple concept: morals and attitude...
Maybe those of us who voted for Kerry are still scratching our head as to why people like *you* ignored the important issues in favor of morality. Same sex marriage, abortion, stem cell research - all issues of morality that don't directly affect you. The economy, foreign policy, healthcare, the war in Iraq - all important issues that affect everyone and areas where the Bush administration was (according to many) not doing well. Why again did you choose to give him another 4 years? Oh yeah, well at least you still have your bible and your morality...

Don't forget to include the moral issues surrounding the candidates themselves. The doubts about Kerry's Viet Nam service and subsequent actions vs. questions about Bush's Guard Service. Kerry's attempts to use the draft and social security vs. Bush's claims of future terror attacks. Kerry's "flip-flops" vs. Bush's "lies" about Iraq.
 
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