Election Crisis in Iran! (ongoing thread)

[Acanthus]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/t...ast/article6531648.ece

This keeps getting worse and worse for the people of Iran.

Updates are at the end of the thread, to keep a stable time line.

 

[Kirby]

Yikes. This may get very nasty.

 

[alchemize]

I bet he (Mousavi) pusses out.

 

[GTaudiophile]

Time for the someone to assassinate the ayatollah?

Get him out of the picture, and I think you might have a successful chance at revolution in Iran.

 

[StageLeft]

Yikes. In other news the supreme leader has condemned foreign interference, including from England. Really there's been very little. It certainly seems like Obama was right not to give them any ammo to try and distract the pissed off people with and team them up against foreign interference.

 

[K1052]

Khamenei would have been better off letting this die on it's one time line.

Forcing Mousavi against the wall not knowing what he'll do is pretty risky. If he publicly defies the Ayatollah the country is going to explode.

 

[TechBoyJK]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Yikes. In other news the supreme leader has condemned foreign interference, including from England. Really there's been very little. It certainly seems like Obama was right not to give them any ammo to try and distract the pissed off people with and team them up against foreign interference.

It's going to go downhill, with or without US interference. I think POTUS knows this, so it's better for us to be able to say we didn't do jack one way or another and their own soverign nation is responsible for whatever outcome there is.

Exiling that guy will only piss the protesters off more.

 

[RyanPaulShaffer]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Yikes. In other news the supreme leader has condemned foreign interference, including from England. Really there's been very little. It certainly seems like Obama was right not to give them any ammo to try and distract the pissed off people with and team them up against foreign interference.

And yet, look at what the crowds are chanting, and what the Iranian regime is claiming we did to the election. Obama did everything he could to remain neutral and take the appeasement approach. It is abundantly clear that they just hate what the Western world stands for, regardless of who our president is or what policies he follows.

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: K1052
Khamenei would have been better off letting this die on it's one time line.

Forcing Mousavi against the wall not knowing what he'll do is pretty risky. If he publicly defies the Ayatollah the country is going to explode.

No matter what happens it good to see your enemies in turmoil.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Yikes. In other news the supreme leader has condemned foreign interference, including from England. Really there's been very little. It certainly seems like Obama was right not to give them any ammo to try and distract the pissed off people with and team them up against foreign interference.

And yet, look at what the crowds are chanting, and what the Iranian regime is claiming we did to the election. Obama did everything he could to remain neutral and take the appeasement approach. It is abundantly clear that they just hate what the Western world stands for, regardless of who our president is or what policies he follows.

I agree, but it's a weak swing right now since the rest of the world has been so impartial.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: techs

Originally posted by: K1052
Khamenei would have been better off letting this die on it's one time line.

Forcing Mousavi against the wall not knowing what he'll do is pretty risky. If he publicly defies the Ayatollah the country is going to explode.

No matter what happens it good to see your enemies in turmoil.

Yeah, until they lauch a missile at Israel in anger because they have nothing to lose.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Yikes. In other news the supreme leader has condemned foreign interference, including from England. Really there's been very little. It certainly seems like Obama was right not to give them any ammo to try and distract the pissed off people with and team them up against foreign interference.

And yet, look at what the crowds are chanting, and what the Iranian regime is claiming we did to the election. Obama did everything he could to remain neutral and take the appeasement approach. It is abundantly clear that they just hate what the Western world stands for, regardless of who our president is or what policies he follows.

That's only the pro-Ahmadinejad people trying desperately to change the subject.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: techs

Originally posted by: K1052
Khamenei would have been better off letting this die on it's one time line.

Forcing Mousavi against the wall not knowing what he'll do is pretty risky. If he publicly defies the Ayatollah the country is going to explode.

No matter what happens it good to see your enemies in turmoil.

Yeah, until they lauch a missile at Israel in anger because they have nothing to lose.

That makes absolutely no sense nor would it actually accomplish anything.

 

[Lemon law]

This is the third or fourth thread on the Iranian elections, and now that the supreme Ayatollah has resorted to authority, the die is cast, but there is a good chance the Ayatollah
will lose in the end. Nothing feeds a rebellion better than blind repression and there are many in Iran sick and tired of the irrationally large share of Iranian power held by by the religious authorities.

If the supreme Ayotollah wants to audition for the role once played by the Shah, he might think long and hard on how fast the Shah feel.

 

[Xellos2099]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Yikes. In other news the supreme leader has condemned foreign interference, including from England. Really there's been very little. It certainly seems like Obama was right not to give them any ammo to try and distract the pissed off people with and team them up against foreign interference.

And yet, look at what the crowds are chanting, and what the Iranian regime is claiming we did to the election. Obama did everything he could to remain neutral and take the appeasement approach. It is abundantly clear that they just hate what the Western world stands for, regardless of who our president is or what policies he follows.

I took you this long to figure out they hate us because of our freedom and way of life?

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: GTaudiophile
Time for the someone to assassinate the ayatollah?

Get him out of the picture, and I think you might have a successful chance at revolution in Iran.

Thank you for your moral advice, Reverend.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: alchemize
I bet he (Mousavi) pusses out.

What an odd phrase for not idiotically getting exiled.

NPR had a good guest explaining some of this, incuding that Mousavi is a long-time rival to the current leader, is the richest man in Iran, and greatly outranks the 'Supreme Leader' in religion, as a 'Grand Ayatollah', of which there are not many. He said to watch the 'mourning days' - the same device used to overthrow the Shah. They call for mourning days, which are used for massive rallies that result in violence and casualties and more mourning days. He said this is just getting started.

He also indicated the same people who overthroew the Shah are now in the position to do the same thing to this government.

 

[MovingTarget]

This is gonna get interesting real quick. I know Mousavi is not by any means pro-western, but the Iranian people deserve to have their elections counted properly. He may still lose when this is all over with, but I think that Iran will still change due to the experience. Civil disobedience will only grow bolder over time.

 

[jman19]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: techs

Originally posted by: K1052
Khamenei would have been better off letting this die on it's one time line.

Forcing Mousavi against the wall not knowing what he'll do is pretty risky. If he publicly defies the Ayatollah the country is going to explode.

No matter what happens it good to see your enemies in turmoil.

Yeah, until they lauch a missile at Israel in anger because they have nothing to lose.

Please, they are not going to launch a missile at Israel over this :roll:

 

[Patranus]

I watched the speech live on CNN.

Mr. Supreme Leader is pretty scary. He makes good points but uses "facts" to prove his points. An example of this would be a Waco Texas reference. Mr. Supreme Leader said it was Ms. Clinton and the Democrat's fault and then went onto say that it was a human rights issue and don't lecture Iran on Human rights issues. While Waco Texas did happen under President Clinton and Democrat control I would hardly call the deaths the fault of the Democrats. You *might* be able to make an argument that the standoff was the fault of the Democrats but I really don't think ANYONE wanted 50 people to die. Not to mention that it happened 15+ years ago.

I wish that I knew if the people of Iran actually believe Mr. Supreme Leader. Without access to any other news source other than the state run media it troubles me that the "revolutionists" are able to get the real news.

Obama made a BIG mistake in handling Iran. The ENTIRE POINT of Obama's stance, or lack there of, was to not give a hint the the USA is "meddling" in the election. Mr. Supreme Leader blamed the west/USA anyways, despite Obama's lack of taking a position. He just made it all up. Now, not only has Mr. Supreme Leader accused the USA of "meddling" but Obama has also alienated the "revolutionists" by not even taking stance against the human rights abuses.

 

[sciwizam]

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: alchemize
I bet he (Mousavi) pusses out.

What an odd phrase for not idiotically getting exiled.

NPR had a good guest explaining some of this, incuding that Mousavi is a long-time rival to the current leader, is the richest man in Iran, and greatly outranks the 'Supreme Leader' in religion, as a 'Grand Ayatollah', of which there are not many. He said to watch the 'mourning days' - the same device used to overthrow the Shah. They call for mourning days, which are used for massive rallies that result in violence and casualties and more mourning days. He said this is just getting started.

He also indicated the same people who overthroew the Shah are now in the position to do the same thing to this government.

Some Corrections: Mousavi is neither one of those.

The richest man mentioned was Ayatollah Rafsanjani, and the Grand Ayatollah mentioned was Grand Ayatollah Hossein-Ali Montazeri

 

[surfsatwerk]

Originally posted by: Patranus

Obama made a BIG mistake in handling Iran. The ENTIRE POINT of Obama's stance, or lack there of, was to not give a hint the the USA is "meddling" in the election. Mr. Supreme Leader blamed the west/USA anyways, despite Obama's lack of taking a position. He just made it all up. Now, not only has Mr. Supreme Leader accused the USA of "meddling" but Obama has also alienated the "revolutionists" by not even taking stance against the human rights abuses.

Seriously, do we really need to be invading another Muslim nation for the sake of "democracy" right now?

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: jman19

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: techs

Originally posted by: K1052
Khamenei would have been better off letting this die on it's one time line.

Forcing Mousavi against the wall not knowing what he'll do is pretty risky. If he publicly defies the Ayatollah the country is going to explode.

No matter what happens it good to see your enemies in turmoil.

Yeah, until they lauch a missile at Israel in anger because they have nothing to lose.

Please, they are not going to launch a missile at Israel over this :roll:

Really? Willing to bet YOUR life on that? If the current regime is about to be overthrown, why not take a few of their hated neighbors with them? I'd say its unlikely - But the more chaos in the country the more likely something like that could happen. I am challenging Techs' statement that its good to see your enemies in turmoil.. thats true to an extent, but also risky because you don't know what they will do when backed into a corner.

Of course, nobody thought anyone would fly planes into the WTC either before 9/11..

Again, I am not saying its GOING to happen.. I'm saying its possible, and you don't want your enemies so out of control that they could act irrationally.

 

[piasabird]

I think we should offer him refuge in Afghanistan, and offer to help train his army and supply them with special forces help so he can overthrow the Mulla's. Anything that can disrupt the power structure in Iran would help Iraq and Iran and Afghanistan. They wont have time to interfere in Afghanistan if we can keep their military busy.

 

[CanOWorms]

He also claimed that the UK was the most evil government. It really shows Obama's awareness of the situation all over the world of the hatred of the UK. Obama's destruction of the ridiculous special relationship with the UK is the thing to improve US relations in the world.