Ethereum GPU mining?

[Madpacket]

Yeah sure, everyone can also look at OpenSSL source code and yet not even Google manages to find all bugs or takes a very long time.

That argument doesn't count, as I don't have the time or expertise to do it. You need to trust them and their disclaimer makes that very hard.

Would you give your money to a bank that says "And maybe our code has security issues and if we lose your money it's totally your fault".

Valid concern and that's why Slock.it hired a third party company to vet the DAO contract code. This is more than what most private companies do with closed source software.

https://blog.slock.it/deja-vu-dao-smart-contracts-audit-results-d26bc088e32e#.pwwnib8a5

Remember once The DAO is launched there is no changing it (that would require a new contract). That's the immutable part but the flip side of the immutability is 100% trust that the code won't be changed (cough back-door'd). And yes it is open source for all to see and given the context of the application (people dumping real money into it) the number of eyes on the code should be plenty. Nothing is 100% bug free but I think Slock.It did enough due diligence given the resources at their disposal prior to the launch.

If the Slock.It's universal sharing network proposal is accepted you can be darn sure the code behind it will also be audited with the reports made available.

 

[poofyhairguy]

That argument doesn't count, as I don't have the time or expertise to do it.

Me either, but you have to figure those people who invested millions in the DAO did at least a little due diligence. Maybe not, which is why I am not dumping in my life savings.

You need to trust them and their disclaimer makes that very hard.

I see it the other way- I would be less apt to trust them if they pretended their code was infallible. As you say even Apple and Google make mistakes, I think the disclaimer is exactly what we should expect. The guys behind this are very transparent, very brilliant and motivated by vision. They might not succeed, but they are the kinds of people who change the word.

Would you give your money to a bank that says "And maybe our code has security issues and if we lose your money it's totally your fault".

First of all, a bank isn't going to let me look at their code nor will they admit to me if they DID have a problem. The FDIC is what makes my money (up to a certain amount) safe in a bank, not their promises.

Secondly I assume that "the bank" (any bank) has security issues and people on the payroll working to fix those issues. Just because they call themselves a bank doesn't mean their security is perfect. Exhibit A:

http://mashable.com/2015/11/10/bank-data-breach-100-million/#NHxMrLqcqOq7

Exhibit B:

https://www.wired.com/2016/05/insane-81m-bangladesh-bank-heist-heres-know

Finally I don't think the DAO's website or the team behind it implies that it's a safe place for your money like a bank is. In fact it states the opposite- this is a brand new entity with possible buggy code that will have to work through a lot of issues early on.

They way I see it the DAO is a Kickstarter that gives me more back for my "investment" than some t shirt, you get a portion of control like a real venture capital fund. I don't know about you, but I am not a "qualified investor" nor have I ever been asked to be part of a venture capital fund. Investing in the DAO is a way for a little guy like me to be apart of the kind of high upside project that only shark-tank style millionaires ever get a chance at investing in.

I am only putting a couple hundred $ worth of ETH in it, "money" that won't hurt me to lose, partially for the potential upside and partially to be a part of history. 10-20 years from now I see DAOs as the best-case scenario for all types of current organizations that are less efficient. For example, once the code and concept is proven I would MUCH rather donate money to a "charity DAO" than to a organized real world charity that will use a good chunk of my money to pay executives and to throw parties. This DAO might be the Netscape of DAOs, it might fail based on code or based on governance or based on legal ramifications, or it could be the next big thing. But just like Netscape kicked off the internet revolution, this could revolutionize how startup projects get funded even if it fails longterm. It is exciting to be a part of it.

 

[MrTeal]

With the DAO, are you not essentially buying a part of the company as an investment? If so, if they have buggy software and you lose your investment, it doesn't seem much different than if you invested in any other software startup (or any startup) and they lost your money.

It would be a bit different than if you started using a new Bitcoin or Ethereum wallet, and then due to bugs in the program it lost all your private keys.

 

[Madpacket]

With the DAO, are you not essentially buying a part of the company as an investment? If so, if they have buggy software and you lose your investment, it doesn't seem much different than if you invested in any other software startup (or any startup) and they lost your money.

It would be a bit different than if you started using a new Bitcoin or Ethereum wallet, and then due to bugs in the program it lost all your private keys.

There's plenty of misconceptions about The DAO. You are not really buying a part of a company. Don't think of it as a separate thing. If you invest ether and hold at least one token you are effectively the company or The DAO. Now the amount you put in is directly proportional to the percentage of ownership and voting power. But you only need one token to be able to vote on proposals and the direction you think The DAO should move towards.

The confusion comes with the company that launched The DAO. Developers at Slock.It created the framework and publicly released the code so anyone can create a Distributed Anonymous Organization. Slock.it released the framework which happens to be the same as the The DAO because well, they invented it so naturally they would release the same version.

It should be noted and understood that the company Slock.it does not own The DAO, they simply released it publicly and let anyone who wants to invest, do so. This is unlike a traditional kickstarter or VC and where some of the major differences are.

That aside yes bugs exist in all but the most simple of programs. Should you stop doing internet banking altogether because you rely on TLS (Transport Layer Security, or SSL as it's incorrectly still referred to) 1.1 or above? Attackers are constantly looking at ways to break this security. If you think the banks would reimburse you for stolen funds out of your account think again. Most attacks happen client side (i.e your web browser becomes compromised or you click on a malicious link) where the funds are stolen through your own browser via CSRF (cross-site request forgery).

Good luck proving to a bank that you should be reimbursed for stolen funds if this happens to you

There are no guarantees in any type of investment but The DAO is very transparent but very experimental so it's natural to be skeptical about something like this. Many of the rules and regulations will have to be created as The DAO evolves and hits roadblocks but the potential for real change here needs to be looked at.

I like Poofhair's analogy to Netscape from a maturity and opportunity perspective but the difference with The DAO is it's not controlled by a single entity or corporation, nor does it have a small board of directors so the outcome of this experiment will be something interesting to watch as it unfolds.

It could be a complete disaster or this could be exactly what Blockchain technology needs to move itself forward.

 

[reb0rn]

Who control the ethereum or DAO all the same, tell me who has 70 million ehereum which was never mined???
How can miners be distributed network if they do not have more the few % of all ethereum!!!

is there any difference to ripple at all in the way of distribution?

 

[DrMrLordX]

Warning: the $199 r9 290 cards on NewEgg are NOT Tri-X cards. They are reference cards as shown in the picture. The item number listed in the item specs is false, and the Sapphire item number (11227-97-90G) is not correct. This item is 100362SR.

 

[Elfear]

Warning: the $199 r9 290 cards on NewEgg are NOT Tri-X cards. They are reference cards as shown in the picture. The item number listed in the item specs is false, and the Sapphire item number (11227-97-90G) is not correct. This item is 100362SR.

This is correct. Just got my cards in the mail and they are the reference blower version. Chatting with Newegg right now to see what they'll do.

 

[RussianSensation]

$13.64 ether

Wow, at current rates the 280X produces almost $70 USD profit, while dual stock 290Xs = $170 USD a month.

https://www.cryptocompare.com/mining/gpushack/gpushack-r9-280x/
https://www.cryptocompare.com/mining/sapphire/radeon-r9-295x2-ethereum-mining/

AMD added Total War Warhammer game bundle to their cards. The game launches May 24th. Should be easy to resell this game for $30 USD at least. By the time GTX1070/1080 launch, fire-sale R9 390 with Warhammer should drop to $225-250 with rebates. It'll be possible to buy almost 3x R9 390s and earn ~$240 a month after electricity for the price of a single GTX1080.

Polaris 10 cannot get here fast enough.

 

[Feld]

Has anyone seen any indication yet if the 1080 is any good for mining eth? It's reportedly better than Fury X for mining bitcoin, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's a great ethereum miner.

 

[DrMrLordX]

This is correct. Just got my cards in the mail and they are the reference blower version. Chatting with Newegg right now to see what they'll do.

They've also bumped the price up to $209.

There are two possibilities I see here: either NewEgg got some cards with bad TRI-X coolers and replaced them with reference as a part of the refurb, or they are full reference cards. Either way they don't match the listed item/sku # so the sales entry is entirely deceptive.

I got one on a lark and I'm contemplating what to do with it. I may boot it and look at its performance to see whether or not I can make it work for my purposes, but if you were planning to mass-buy these things for a mining farm . . . get your earplugs.

btw I don't expect prices on 390s to drop by that much due to upward demand from the price of ETH rising the way it is. They may tank anyway if Polaris 10 turns out to be a great mining card, assuming there are enough supplies for it to be disruptive.

 

[Madpacket]

The Sapphire Tri-X's are only $249 CAD here:

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202208

I'm tempted to buy some but don't have any more motherboards and power supplies. Even if I did I have nowhere left to plug them in lol. Perhaps I could build another milk crate miner and outsource to my brother

Good price even for a refurb.

 

[Madpacket]

Who control the ethereum or DAO all the same, tell me who has 70 million ehereum which was never mined???
How can miners be distributed network if they do not have more the few % of all ethereum!!!

is there any difference to ripple at all in the way of distribution?

I'm not sure I understand this question. Can you please clarify what you're saying here?

 

[DrMrLordX]

The Sapphire Tri-X's are only $249 CAD here:

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202208

I'm tempted to buy some but don't have any more motherboards and power supplies. Good price even for a refurb.

Listed as out-of-stock on the US site:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202208

Also, I'm confused: what's the official Sapphire item # for the Tri-X? Is it 11227-13-CPO or 11227-97-90G? Both turn up the Tri-X in Google searches.

 

[RussianSensation]

Has anyone seen any indication yet if the 1080 is any good for mining eth? It's reportedly better than Fury X for mining bitcoin, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's a great ethereum miner.

Do you have a source for that? From what I've read 980Ti max overclocked hits 23-24MH/sec vs. 33-34MH/sec for the Fury X and about 30-31MH/sec for a 390 OC. Max overclocked 1080 is 30% faster than a 980Ti OC, which on paper seems to be barely enough to reach a single 390 OC. It'll be possible to purchase almost 3x 390s for the price of a single 1080. I doubt the 1080 will be worth it for mining, maybe the 1070 has a chance but then we'll have Polaris 10 and fire-sale 390s.

 

[Madpacket]

Listed as out-of-stock on the US site:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202208

Also, I'm confused: what's the official Sapphire item # for the Tri-X? Is it 11227-13-CPO or 11227-97-90G? Both turn up the Tri-X in Google searches.

Weird. Usually the other way around stock wise. The card appears to have a standard return policy so I don't see the risk in ordering one.

 

[Madpacket]

Do you have a source for that? From what I've read 980Ti max overclocked hits 23-24MH/sec vs. 33-34MH/sec for the Fury X and about 30-31MH/sec for a 390 OC. Max overclocked 1080 is 30% faster than a 980Ti OC, which on paper seems to be barely enough to reach a single 390 OC. It'll be possible to purchase almost 3x 390s for the price of a single 1080. I doubt the 1080 will be worth it for mining, maybe the 1070 has a chance but then we'll have Polaris 10 and fire-sale 390s.

Quick Google search brings up the following:


http://videocardz.com/59951/nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-opencl-performance-leaked

I call BS on those results for mining as well.

 

[techie81]

I'm kind of bummed about the videocards having the blower style fans. Has anyone been able to talk to newegg and see what they have to say?

Running two of those is going to be a little too loud.

 

[thilanliyan]

Hey anyone use Mist wallet for any transaction?
I tried using it to send some Eth for the DAO, and at first the transaction was listed at the bottom of the gui and said 0 confirmations. Now that transaction is gone completely...nothing listed there anymore. My Eth balance stayed the same throughout the whole process however.

What does this mean? Did the transaction get cancelled?

EDIT: NVM, I tried again and it seemed to work...weird it didn't the first time. Maybe because I lowered that transaction fee?

 

[Elfear]

I'm kind of bummed about the videocards having the blower style fans. Has anyone been able to talk to newegg and see what they have to say?

Running two of those is going to be a little too loud.

Newegg was pretty unhelpful. First they tried to convince me I had received the correct cards which was easily proven wrong from the product description. Then they offered a $10 refund per card to keep them. For $50 I would have done it, but there's no way I'd put up with the reference cooler for $10. :thumbsdown:

 

[RussianSensation]

Quick Google search brings up the following:


http://videocardz.com/59951/nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-opencl-performance-leaked

I call BS on those results for mining as well.

Even if 1080 could beat the Fury X for eth mining, the Fury X itself will probably be worse value than 2x $299 Polaris 10 cards, unless AMD reduces the price of the Fury X to $399 or lower. Assuming Polaris has 2304 shaders clocked at 1250mhz and 150W TDP, it's possible to put 6 of those on a single 1000W Platinum PSU with a rather affordable Gigabyte Z170X-Gaming 3. 1080 uses 180W and costs $599 US minimum. Unless 1080 has at least double the throughput of a 150W Polaris 10, the upfront cost would be double and to run 6 cards off the same board would likely call for a 1200-1300W unit.

I wonder how low Fury X will fall in price. With 1070 150W power usage, 8GB of memory, updates features, and GP104's overclocking headroom, Fury X will need a price drop to $300 US, maybe even lower. This of course means it may become worthwhile to get the discounted Fury X for mining should it drop that low since the AIO CLC will ensure it remains cool and quiet throughout the entire summer of mining. This is why the match up of Polaris 10 vs. 1070 vs. discounted Fury X could become very interesting for miners.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Newegg was pretty unhelpful. First they tried to convince me I had received the correct cards which was easily proven wrong from the product description. Then they offered a $10 refund per card to keep them. For $50 I would have done it, but there's no way I'd put up with the reference cooler for $10. :thumbsdown:

So RMA or bust? That's pretty disappointing. They clearly advertised a card with a base clockspeed of 1000 MHz and the same sku as a Tri-X, even though the pic was a mismatch. I called a rep about it over the weekend and they promised me I'd get an email response within 3-7 business days . . . yay?

 

[Elfear]

So RMA or bust? That's pretty disappointing. They clearly advertised a card with a base clockspeed of 1000 MHz and the same sku as a Tri-X, even though the pic was a mismatch. I called a rep about it over the weekend and they promised me I'd get an email response within 3-7 business days . . . yay?

Yup. Sending the cards back tomorrow. I picked a couple 390's instead. They should hold their value better and they'll end up costing me ~$250 each after I sell the free games and the discount Newegg gave me for the hassle.

Hopefully Newegg will accommodate you somehow. Disappointing to find out they're selling reference cards.

 

[Shmee]

Hmm that is disappointing about the newegg thing. False advertising ftl.

 

[Feld]

Do you have a source for that? From what I've read 980Ti max overclocked hits 23-24MH/sec vs. 33-34MH/sec for the Fury X and about 30-31MH/sec for a 390 OC. Max overclocked 1080 is 30% faster than a 980Ti OC, which on paper seems to be barely enough to reach a single 390 OC. It'll be possible to purchase almost 3x 390s for the price of a single 1080. I doubt the 1080 will be worth it for mining, maybe the 1070 has a chance but then we'll have Polaris 10 and fire-sale 390s.

Yeah that videocardz link is what I was referring to for bitcoin mining rates. I think you're right that 1080 is unlikely to make economic sense for mining vs. 390, Fury X, or possibly 1070. But I'm still curious what the 1080's hashrate will be, even though I don't plan to buy one. If it's a 40 MH card that could help ease the pain of Nvidia's price gouging for anyone looking to buy primarily for gaming.

 

[SK10H]

Hey anyone use Mist wallet for any transaction?
I tried using it to send some Eth for the DAO, and at first the transaction was listed at the bottom of the gui and said 0 confirmations. Now that transaction is gone completely...nothing listed there anymore. My Eth balance stayed the same throughout the whole process however.

What does this mean? Did the transaction get cancelled?

EDIT: NVM, I tried again and it seemed to work...weird it didn't the first time. Maybe because I lowered that transaction fee?

I lower the fee to lowest the first time. No transaction confirmation seen but the balance is still there. Second tries, stop being cheap and did not adjust the transaction fee, went through just fine.