Europe and America ...

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kami

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
17,627
5
81
Well, if Americans know absolutley nothing about their neighbour, Canada, do you really expect them to know anything about Europe?
 

Linflas

Lifer
Jan 30, 2001
15,395
78
91


<< Well, if Americans know absolutley nothing about their neighbour, Canada, do you really expect them to know anything about Europe? >>


That couldn't be because of the relative population differences could it? I expect the reason Canadians know so much about Americans is because they are inundated with American culture from media. There are 270 million Americans versus 33 million Canadians so why would it surprise you that this is the way it is? I suspect that Americans living in the same proximity to the border with Canada as most Canadians live have a bit of knowledge regarding Canada. The simple fact is that what the US does will affect Canadians far more than what Canada does will affect the US. This is not a slam against Canada just a fact given the differences in scale of population and economies.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
55,996
14,506
146


<< Not to mention, Hitler, being the arrogant idiot he was, made nearly all the same mistakes Napoleon did. >>




<< This just shows who is arrogant. >>



Oh boy! You sure told me!!!

1. Hitler did not prepare his troops for the Russian winter.

2. Hitler took over all command of the eastern front, and refused to change tactics when the Russians caught on and were effectively countering German tactics.

3. Hitler let his supply lines become WAY too long, and fell right into the same trap Napoleon did in that he did not properly plan for such long distance fighting by setting up manufacturing depots and plants along the way... Or by planning ahead for such an inevitable problem.

Moreover, Hitler's overconfidence had led him into a colossal error. He had been so sure of victory in 1941 that he had stopped most kinds of weapons and ammunition production for the army and shifted the industries to work for the air force and navy, with which he proposed to finish off the British. He had resumed production for the army in January 1942, but the flow would not reach the front until late summer. Soviet weapons output, on the other hand, after having dropped low in November and December 1941, had increased steadily since the turn of the year, and the Soviet industrial base also was larger than the German.

In contrast, the US was able to supply an army half a world away.

I could go on, but I don't have to.
 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
AmusedOne

When I wrote <<This just shows who is arrogant>> I was not pointing out how the US acts in war. I hope you can open your eyes and see what I meant.
 

kami

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
17,627
5
81
But Linflas, then explain why the same thing applies for the rest of the world. Americans are nice people, but it just seems that the majority either can't or won't accept that they aren't the center of this universe (or in this case, world ). Yes they are an economic power, but that's it. They are about the most uninteresting culture on this planet, IMO.
 

Aihyah

Banned
Apr 21, 2000
2,593
0
0
<< Well, if Americans know absolutley nothing about their neighbour, Canada, do you really expect them to know anything about Europe? >>

well many americans don't know much about some american states they aren't close to... esp smaller ones. so what do you expect about canada well i was a citizen of canada b4 i came here so i dont count
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
55,996
14,506
146


<< AmusedOne

When I wrote <<This just shows who is arrogant>> I was not pointing out how the US acts in war. I hope you can open your eyes and see what I meant.
>>



Ummm, I'm still not getting what you mean, Czar. Is that &quot;not&quot; supposed to be in your first sentence?

And, um, were you trying to say *I* am arrogant? If so, is simply proving myself correct arrogant?
 

kami

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
17,627
5
81


<< well many americans don't know much about some american states they aren't close to... esp smaller ones. so what do you expect about canada well i was a citizen of canada b4 i came here so i dont count >>


LOL....true, true...
 

Duckers

Platinum Member
Mar 30, 2000
2,089
1
0

Americans don't hate Europeans, they hate everyone equally; Cubans, Mexicans, Russians, Chinese, Japanese, Israelis, Palestinians, Iraqis, and of course, Canadians.

That's just to mention a few.
 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
AmusedOne

Your behavior here shows arrogance, that is one part that we Europeans dislike. I will not go into further discussions about this because it will only result in a pointless flamewar.
 

Linflas

Lifer
Jan 30, 2001
15,395
78
91
Kami I suspect you might be surprised at how much the average American knows about the rest of the world if you were to look a bit beyond the stereotype. I suspect that you do not want to look past that stereotype since you made the boring culture statement. I now feel it necessary to point out that it is Canada that has laws mandating a percentage of Canadian content on television and radio because they feel that &quot;the most uninteresting culture on this planet&quot; would otherwise overwhelm the local product. Other countries assume that because we do not always do what they feel we should do it somehow means we think we are the &quot;center of this universe&quot;. We are no different than any other country on this planet in that we are looking out for ourselves first. Since the current European obsession is the Kyoto treaty why is it that not one of them has ratified this treaty yet? Sure they have all made noises that they intend to but actions speak far louder than words. No doubt you use the offhand, flip comments made in response to threads like this to validate your feelings regarding Americans since they meet the stereotype you view us through.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
55,996
14,506
146


<< AmusedOne

Your behavior here shows arrogance, that is one part that we Europeans dislike. I will not go into further discussions about this because it will only result in a pointless flamewar.
>>



Translation: &quot;I can't counter your facts with anything even resembling a fact of my own, so I'm going to bow out by calling you arrogant.&quot;

Excuse the hell out of me, Czar. I had no idea that stating facts was considered arrogant.
 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
AmusedOne

Its not stating the facts, its how you state them and how you respond to other arguments.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
55,996
14,506
146


<< AmusedOne

Its not stating the facts, its how you state them and how you respond to other arguments.
>>



Czar, no, it's because I don't talk out of my @ss and can back up what I say.

I don't make blatantly absurd statements like, &quot;If you would know anything about the German army you would know that the US alone would not have had a chance against it.&quot; without at least being able to back it up with evidence.

You on the other hand make these statements, expect everyone to accept them as gospel, and whine like some bitch slapped teenage princess when someone not only calls you on it, but provides factual evidence to the contrary.
 

glenn1

Lifer
Sep 6, 2000
25,383
1,013
126


<< If you would know anything about the German army you would know that the US alone would not have had a chance against it. >>



Ya know, it's not too late for us to change our minds, and let the Germans take, say, Iceland.... i mean, after all, we're no match for the mighty German colossus, beside the fact that we 'shouldn't stick our noses in other countries' business.'

So which is it Europeans, do you truly want an isolationist United States, and to be left to your own devices (not to mention defenses), or do you want an engaged U.S., maintaining the current Pax Americana which has enabled a higher level of prosperity than the world has ever seen in its history? The U.S. will do fine either way...
 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
AmusedOne,
Sure I did not provied statistics because I cant remember everything, and what I dont know I dont make up. I could provide some bogus numbers to back me up and alot of people would belive it to be true.

But I´m out of this argument because it serves no purpose.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
55,996
14,506
146


<< AmusedOne,
Sure I did not provied statistics because I cant remember everything, and what I dont know I dont make up. I could provide some bogus numbers to back me up and alot of people would belive it to be true.

But I´m out of this argument because it serves no purpose.
>>



Gee, would it kill you to research it and back it up?

Debates serve a purpose: To learn. Obviously, you've had the wrong impression about WWII, Germany and the US if you thought we couldn't stand a chance. The US could have lost two out of every three battles, and STILL won the war through shear attrition. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand the very simple fact that Germany's resources were a tiny fraction of the US's resources.
 

Mem

Lifer
Apr 23, 2000
21,476
13
81


<< So which is it Europeans, do you truly want an isolationist United States, and to be left to your own devices (not to mention defenses), or do you want an engaged U.S., maintaining the current Pax Americana which has enabled a higher level of prosperity than the world has ever seen in its history? The U.S. will do fine either way... >>



Big words!.. USA has not been around that long,while I`ve no dislike of any nation including Russia since we all live on the same planet &quot;EARTH&quot; ,anyway not wanting to start a flaming thread my opinion on this is us Europeans can take care of ourselves we have been around for along time, wars come and go do you really think if there was nuclear war any country would survive?

I`m very happy living in Europe(UK)and what makes me sad is seeing other poor countries where people are starving,I could not give a damn about who has the biggest gun etc,it`s about time we helped the poorer countries out,I wonder how many more have died since I posted this?

 

Uriel

Junior Member
May 21, 2001
7
0
0
Well AmusedOne
I did some reaserch on the war D-day specificly.
1. The U.S.A was only 2/5 of the force initial strike on mainland europe.
2. They needed the help of the royal navy to get its suplies and men to europe. (nasty u-boats)
3. Thanks to the brits again we could decode the german comunications.
4. casualties were.
U.S.A 29000 Dead
Britain 11000 Dead
Canada 5000 Dead

Acording to those numbers we could say that the usa forces werent up to par
with the rest of the force
 

shiner

Lifer
Jul 18, 2000
17,116
1
0


<< I'm glad to live in Europe with its low crime-rates, no school-shootings and better politics. >>

Don't forget the staggering tax rates.
 

Doboji

Diamond Member
May 18, 2001
7,912
0
76
The hatred towards americans is a natural phenomenon. Yes it is a form of Jealousy.... In all world economies... hell in all economies in general... there is a natural pull towards balancing power. The United States and before USSR have maintained far more power than the rest of the world for over 50 years. This means that essentially everyone else is under our thumb, and at our mercy. Noone likes to be under someones thumb and at someones mercy... this is the source of the international hatred.

Lets try and end the flame fest over which nation is better... because I don't believe that a nation is better by virtue of power alone... certainly the united states isn't the best... but the WORLD is better because of the United States... one could argue that a nation like Canada is &quot;better&quot; than the united states in it's &quot;good will&quot; etc. But the United states allows for Canada to have that good will. If Canada were in power, it would be too busy maintaining the power to be as &quot;good willed&quot; as it is now.

I know I babbled a bit there but you guys get the idea.

-Max
 

AndrewR

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
11,157
0
0
Well, gee, Uriel, could the casualty numbers have anything to do with the DIFFERENT BEACHES THAT WERE LANDED ON? Ever hear of Darby's Rangers? If you want to question the efficacy of American troops, you might want to read up on their performance.

BTW, all the troops on D-Day were riding in an American invention, the Higgins boat. All those Allied troops returning to France after their glorious retreat from Dunkirk wouldn't have made it across the Channel without American help. Plus, the convoy support the Brits gave to American merchant ships also involved another American item -- Lend-Lease destroyers. Remember those ships that were given to the Brits when they were losing so many of their own? Nasty U-boats.

Oh, and that's right, the Americans were at the same time almost singlehandedly retaking the entire Pacific Ocean. Minor feat.


<< Recent tests with Patriot (?) missiles showed that the number of intercepted missiles was extremely low, less than a 1% successrate. >>


Would you care to cite a source for this information? Last news I read had two out of three missiles being intercepted. I am not sure if it was the Patriot system or if it was a new system. Nevertheless, the Patriot was not originally designed as a theater missile defense system (it's not BMD -- ballistic missile defense) but was shoe-horned into that mission during the Gulf War.


<< The used technology is already obsolete and with the development of new missiles (missiles that travel in the water and will leave the water just before it reaches the coast-line. No current detection technology is capable of detecting such missiles and destroying it before it's too late) >>


Ok, now you've said this in a couple threads, and it was pointless then and now. Even if a country were able to field a credible attack weapon that used the high speed cavitation technology (it's not new), the range of such a weapon would be fairly short since the weapon would have to continually burn fuel to reach the target, rather than relying on momentum and gravity to take it to target (free fall through the atmosphere). Since that's the case, the launch vehicle (presumably a submarine) would have to approach the US coast against an enormous submerged listening net and against the world's most advanced navy. There isn't a single country or GROUP of countries that even REMOTELY challenge the United States Navy for dominance of the world's oceans. In particular, the US sub fleet so far outdistances its potential adversaries that it's almost embarrassing. The US sub fleet, through the Los Angeles and Sea Wolf classes, is MORE than capable of defending the US against a submerged attack.


<< And Bush wants to get rid of this treaty which ended the Cold War. >>


The Cold War ended because the Soviet Union's economy died and the Warsaw Pact collapsed. Hate to burst your little bubble, but no treaty ended the Cold War.


<< There'll come a day when violence and technology will fail and only counseling will offer a way out. >>


LMAO!! Spoken like a true believer in the Munich Accords. So, is Chamberlain your personal hero?


<< China has no intention to attack the US at the moment >>

No, but they do have the intention to dominate the politics of Asia. Believe it or not, there are countries in Asia that do not want that to happen. Could it be because China is a terribly oppressive regime that runs tanks over its own people when they express their discontent?

No, that can't be it. Must be something else. The food -- they don't like the food. Yes, that's it.
 
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