Europeon Left vs. American Left

[sdifox]

Do you consider the puritianical nanny-statism that's commonly deployed by American Democratic party as being a left-wing phenomenom? If so then the U.S. left is actually far outpacing their European counterparts.

I don't think "puritanical" means what you think it means.

 

[realibrad]

I don't think "puritanical" means what you think it means.

Um, it seems to fit well.

puritanical - practicing or affecting strict religious or moral behavior.

I suppose the question is, what do you think the word means?

 

[sdifox]

Um, it seems to fit well.

puritanical - practicing or affecting strict religious or moral behavior.

I suppose the question is, what do you think the word means?

That is mostly a right wing conservative thing no? He is calling left wingers puritanical while it is the right wing harping about pro-life, anti other religion.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puritans

Puritans left Europe because it was too liberal.

 

[ch33zw1z]

That is mostly a right wing conservative thing no? He is calling left wingers puritanical while it is the right wing harping about pro-life, anti other religion.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puritans

Puritans left Europe because it was too liberal.

Yea, they cray. Puritan is not a liberal or Dem trend

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/puritan

American conservatives continue to redfine words to fit their needs....so awesome. Guess that's what happens when reading dictionary.com becomes difficult.

 

[darkswordsman17]

Yea, they cray. Puritan is not a liberal or Dem trend

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/puritan

American conservatives continue to redfine words to fit their needs....so awesome. Guess that's what happens when reading dictionary.com becomes difficult.

Ding, ding, ding. Unfortunately for them anyone that isn't an ignorant 13 year old (or mentally equal to that as so many 20 and 30 something arrested development persons) hearing a lot of phrases for the first time, generally can see through their bullshit (let alone if they spend literally any amount of time researching).

I'd say its flabbergasting how truly stupid they show themselves to be with almost every single post they make, but it no longer is. Nor is their hypocrisy. They harp on about how its liberals and dems playing "team sports" and defending their side and act like they're neutral independents and just pointing out "truth" yet they constantly show how untrue it is by constantly trying to defend Republican stances. Its all the same bullshit, them trying desperately to go "see they did the same thing" as though people weren't aware of it. Let alone how often their claim ends up being not true or not remotely close to being equal, because they simply are too stupid to understand nuance while decrying that people won't have "discussions" with them on topics whilst ignoring that they've shown themselves to not be capable of such at every turn.

The silliest part is they genuinely think they're being exceedingly clever in their attempts.

 

[Victorian Gray]

I don't think "puritanical" means what you think it means.

But it's a word that reactionaries just love to throw at anyone somewhere to the left of, say, a Mussolini. Doesn't matter if it's accurate as it "makes a good point".

 

[realibrad]

Yea, they cray. Puritan is not a liberal or Dem trend

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/puritan

American conservatives continue to redfine words to fit their needs....so awesome. Guess that's what happens when reading dictionary.com becomes difficult.

How is he redefining the word? He is saying there are people that have a strict moral behavior toward nanny-statism. I even posted the definition. Hell, your definition even clearly says this.

(lowercase) of, relating to, or characteristic of a moral puritan;

His usage fits perfectly. How do you not get this?

 

[ch33zw1z]

How is he redefining the word? He is saying there are people that have a strict moral behavior toward nanny-statism. I even posted the definition. Hell, your definition even clearly says this.

(lowercase) of, relating to, or characteristic of a moral puritan;

His usage fits perfectly. How do you not get this?

Explain how it fits perfectly.

 

[Jaskalas]

The character assassination of Aziz Ansari is more than enough evidence that America, is so tilted right, that many who identify as Democrat have rather regressive and puritanical tendencies for moral absolutism and burning down non conformity no matter how many innocents get wrapped up as collateral damage.

What, can't you believe that your party isn't all sunshine and roses? Get a grip on reality, they're only human. Any large group is going to incorporate some who are... dangerous. The real trouble is if one is so blinded by partisanship that the enemy within cannot be seen. We always run the risk of our progressive moral character, seeking peace through diversity, being replaced by a false moral character, acting in vengeance seeking conformity.

There is a lot of angst out there with the intent to sow division. A progressive character would not be a political body sowing racial divisions, not creating platforms exclusively for one group or another. It would be all inclusive and something that is blinded to the color of one's skin. It would be openly favoring all people. This collage campus trend of creating "non white" spaces is regressive racism in spades. But they still vote Democrat. They have leaders who do not condemn them.

When the GOP ultimately falls under the crime of trickle down economics, the barometer of American politics will indubitably shift leaving room for a bigger DNC. The choice will fall to us whether to follow enlightenment. Whether we work together for a better America, or instead focus on furthering divisions. When we have the power to raise our arm in victory, let us hope it is with an open hand and not a clenched fist. History warns us where the latter will lead.

 

[realibrad]

Explain how it fits perfectly.

Its literally in the reply post and in the quote you responded to in your post.

Ok, ill try again.


Puritanical, adjective
- practicing or affecting strict religious or moral behavior.

Statism, noun
- a political system in which the state has substantial centralized control over social and economic affairs.

Nanny, noun (in this context).
- a person, typically a woman, employed to care for a child in its own home.

nanny-statism is used as a compound noun here.

So, you have an adjective that is used to modify or describe a noun (compound noun).

So, he is saying that there is a group of political people that are trying to tell people what to do in a strong (forced) moral way. Do you not get how an adjective is used, or do you not understand the definition of the word? I hope its not the 2nd as you have literally linked to the definition of the word. The fact that others stupidly jump in is also troubling and makes all of you look stupid.

 

[ch33zw1z]

@Jaskalas

I can agree with much of that, except the Aziz piece. That one seemed to backfire on the accuser from my point of view.

As a country, we've overall dissented from earlier Puritan views. Like women's roles changing, view of other races changing. Of course, like all change...there's holdouts.

I think overall we're still moving forward socially, as it's getting tougher politically to persecute others for behavior that would've been easily attacked in the past.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Its literally in the reply post and in the quote you responded to in your post.

Ok, ill try again.


Puritanical, adjective
- practicing or affecting strict religious or moral behavior.

Statism, noun
- a political system in which the state has substantial centralized control over social and economic affairs.

Nanny, noun (in this context).
- a person, typically a woman, employed to care for a child in its own home.

nanny-statism is used as a compound noun here.

So, you have an adjective that is used to modify or describe a noun (compound noun).

So, he is saying that there is a group of political people that are trying to tell people what to do in a strong (forced) moral way. Do you not get how an adjective is used, or do you not understand the definition of the word? I hope its not the 2nd as you have literally linked to the definition of the word. The fact that others stupidly jump in is also troubling and makes all of you look stupid.

And you just labeled and described Conservatives, which reading his post he indicated this would be a liberal stance.

Since I don't see liberals or Dems trying to push through Puritan laws....then how should I interpret the post in question? Is this Glenn's roundabout way to saying conservatives push their moral superiority and Puritan views? If so, then we can agree

 

[Black Octagon]

The American Left still supports/endures Capitalism.

The European Left, on the otherhand, is, like, actually Left.

/thread

 

[realibrad]

And you just labeled and described Conservatives, which reading his post he indicated this would be a liberal stance.

Since I don't see liberals or Dems trying to push through Puritan laws....then how should I interpret the post in question? Is this Glenn's roundabout way to saying conservatives push their moral superiority and Puritan views? If so, then we can agree

Lol what? Multiple words were used in the sentence, so are you saying all words are now inherently part of a political party?

Conservatives and Liberals could push through "puritanical laws" as it simply means laws that are affecting moral behavior. What he did to denote Liberal was "Nanny". The word Puritanical was not used to denote which political side. Its really simple.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Lol what? Multiple words were used in the sentence, so are you saying all words are now inherently part of a political party?

Conservatives and Liberals could push through "puritanical laws" as it simply means laws that are affecting moral behavior. What he did to denote Liberal was "Nanny". The word Puritanical was not used to denote which political side. Its really simple.

Do you consider the puritianical nanny-statism that's commonly deployed by American Democratic party as being a left-wing phenomenom? If so then the U.S. left is actually far outpacing their European counterparts.

There it is, plain as day.

Not sure exactly what your going for here, you won't find liberals, aka left wingers, pushing puritanical nanny-statism.

So, continue splitting it up however you like, in the USA....Conservatives is where you will find claims of puritanical values. That's not to say they adhere to them when it doesn't suit their desires, but they'll still expect others to keep to it.

 

[jackstar7]

Lol what? Multiple words were used in the sentence, so are you saying all words are now inherently part of a political party?

Conservatives and Liberals could push through "puritanical laws" as it simply means laws that are affecting moral behavior. What he did to denote Liberal was "Nanny". The word Puritanical was not used to denote which political side. Its really simple.

What ARE words anyways? amirite, brosephalops?

 

[realibrad]

There it is, plain as day.

Not sure exactly what your going for here, you won't find liberals, aka left wingers, pushing puritanical nanny-statism.

So, continue splitting it up however you like, in the USA....Conservatives is where you will find claims of puritanical values. That's not to say they adhere to them when it doesn't suit their desires, but they'll still expect others to keep to it.

Nice try at a shift. His issue was with the single word, not the overall group he was talking about.

I don't think "puritanical" means what you think it means.

Sdifox was not questioning the use of the overall description, just that single word. Further, the word puritanical can be used to talk about the puritans, or how the puritans acted which would be the adjective form. You must have forgotten this, because you originally linked just the definition for puritan. Just man up and admit that you misunderstood the situation and be done with it.

You have the definition. Its clear as day that it is a adjective and a noun. The adjective form has nothing to do with Left or Right politics. It simply means someone is dogmatic and strict with their moral beliefs. That can be a Right or a Left thing as people can believe strongly in their side.

 

[realibrad]

What ARE words anyways? amirite, brosephalops?

sdifox was wrong and it was demonstrable.

 

[jackstar7]

sdifox was wrong and it was demonstrable.

I didn't see you demonstrate how nanny state ideas are moralistic in nature.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Nice try at a shift. His issue was with the single word, not the overall group he was talking about.



Sdifox was not questioning the use of the overall description, just that single word. Further, the word puritanical can be used to talk about the puritans, or how the puritans acted which would be the adjective form. You must have forgotten this, because you originally linked just the definition for puritan. Just man up and admit that you misunderstood the situation and be done with it.

You have the definition. Its clear as day that it is a adjective and a noun. The adjective form has nothing to do with Left or Right politics. It simply means someone is dogmatic and strict with their moral beliefs. That can be a Right or a Left thing as people can believe strongly in their side.

I didn't try and shift anything. It's right there, and sdfoxs response was directly questioning the validity of the assertion that liberals push a Puritan nanny state here in the USA

Flail moar.

 

[brycejones]

realibrad picks the lamest fights

 

[realibrad]

I didn't try and shift anything. It's right there, and sdfoxs response was directly questioning the validity of the assertion that liberals push a Puritan nanny state here in the USA

Flail moar.

After reading this over with my GF, I think I see what you are getting wrong.

Post 1 from sdifox.

I don't think "puritanical" means what you think it means.

He questions the usage of puritanical.

Further context given in post 2 from sdifox.

That is mostly a right wing conservative thing no? He is calling left wingers puritanical while it is the right wing harping about pro-life, anti other religion.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puritans

Puritans left Europe because it was too liberal.

What I think you and sdifox are having trouble with, is the association of puritanical with the puritans. So, a group may have traits that may not be connected to other traits beyond being part of that group. The adjective puritanical has this definition "practicing or affecting strict religious or moral behavior." That means something could be puritanical if it is religious or moral. I believe you are getting stuck on the fact that the Puritans were a religious group and thus any connection must also be associated to religion. I believe this is sdifox's belief as well as he references things that are part of the Religious Right such as pro-life. He also says that Puritans left because of liberals, so to use puritanical to describe the left would be incorrect. That is, however, not how words work.

For example, think of Nazi. Someone can be a grammar Nazi. Grammar is not a political issue inherently, but when the term is used, it does not imply anything political. That is because Nazi in this sense is used to describe someone that is very strict. This is also how puritanical is being used. To call someone puritanical-x is to say that they are either very concerned with religious OR moral behavior.

So when Glenn said puritanical nanny-statism, he is saying that there is a group (in his opinion the left) that is practicing strict moral nanny-statism. His usage is correct, and just because Puritans would be considered on the Right today, does not change that the adjective puritanical can be disassociated with religious. We know this by its definition.

 

[realibrad]

realibrad picks the lamest fights

If you dont like it, dont take part.

 

[jackstar7]

After reading this over with my GF, I think I see what you are getting wrong.

Post 1 from sdifox.



He questions the usage of puritanical.

Further context given in post 2 from sdifox.



What I think you and sdifox are having trouble with, is the association of puritanical with the puritans. So, a group may have traits that may not be connected to other traits beyond being part of that group. The adjective puritanical has this definition "practicing or affecting strict religious or moral behavior." That means something could be puritanical if it is religious or moral. I believe you are getting stuck on the fact that the Puritans were a religious group and thus any connection must also be associated to religion. I believe this is sdifox's belief as well as he references things that are part of the Religious Right such as pro-life. He also says that Puritans left because of liberals, so to use puritanical to describe the left would be incorrect. That is, however, not how words work.

For example, think of Nazi. Someone can be a grammar Nazi. Grammar is not a political issue inherently, but when the term is used, it does not imply anything political. That is because Nazi in this sense is used to describe someone that is very strict. This is also how puritanical is being used. To call someone puritanical-x is to say that they are either very concerned with religious OR moral behavior.

So when Glenn said puritanical nanny-statism, he is saying that there is a group (in his opinion the left) that is practicing strict moral nanny-statism. His usage is correct, and just because Puritans would be considered on the Right today, does not change that the adjective puritanical can be disassociated with religious. We know this by its definition.

Uh huh. Can your girlfriend explain what "strict moral nanny-statism" is?

 

[ivwshane]

sdifox was wrong and it was demonstrable.

Your schtick gets dumber and more annoying by the day. Wtf is wrong with you?