EVE!

[Martimus]

Gallente? Really? In 2010?

Gallente have been savagely beaten with the nerfbat over the past few years. When's the last time you saw an Eos flying around, for example?

The speed nerfs (the web changes specifically) savaged blaster tracking to the tune of 400%. Blasters are in your face weapons with tracking being the difference between a killmail and a lossmail. Railguns have always been lol. Which leaves only the drone boats as viable ships. Drones are easily countered, and e.g. wormhole sleepers target them over everything but remote rep.

And while on paper I get something ridiculous like 500+ dps out of a t1 fit thorax, 1000 dps out of a t2 fit brutix and 1600+ out of a hype -- but getting to USE that productively is a challenge.
.

The reason I say Gallente, is that those ships (other than the hype) are relatively cheap to fit, and are effective. I have ~150 kills in a Myrmidon, about 100 in Brutix, about 100 in a Dominix, and about 50 in a Thorax. None of those ships cost more than 120M, filly fitted with rigs.

On top of that, my Mission running Domi's are even cheaper at around 90M, and can tank anything. They may be slow, but 400DPS with a 900DPS tank can get you pretty far in L4 Missions.

I do agree that tracking sucks on the ships. They aren't fast enough to catch up to Minmatar ships, and the tracking appears worse than Autocannons. (even though on paper, blasters have better tracking.) Although you can easily tank an Amarr ship with superior tracking. (I killed a Fail fit Aaddon with a Thorax solo once, just by orbiting him at 1250m.)

I'd say if you're going to do PvE look into Caldari (kestrel, caracal, drake, raven). If you're going to do blob or large gang PvP, look into Caldari (blackbird and rokh for fleet ops with raven for pos bashing). If you want to fly a cap ship do NOT look into Caldari. If you're gonna solo or small gang it doesn't matter what you're flying, everything blows up to megablobs at about the same rate. Minmatar is probably your best bet for survivability.

Megablobs aren't all that common in Low-Sec. You rarely see gangs bigger than 20 ships. We will field 100 man gangs on occasion, but most roaming gangs are more like 10-15 members. The smaller the gang, the more important the set-up. You really need to plan out your small gangs to really be effective against any opposing fleets of size. A ten man gang of 3 logistics pilots, 5 gank ships, 1 ECM ship, and 1 Command Ship can really cause a lot of havoc to gangs even twice the size.

I can't recommend Caldari for fleet battles that much either, since an Amarr fleet will tear apart a Caldari fleet pretty easily, and those Amarr RR BS gangs are pretty popular. Although Caldari fleets are pretty mobile, since they don't have plates and can align and warp quickly.

Oh, my qualifications on this topic: a 45M sp character specialized to fly only gallente subcaps, with "all Vs" in applicable skills. She's been pretty much a ship spinner and miner ganker ever since the nano nerf of '08 made the mighty t2 neutron Mega borderline useless.

I agree with you that the Blasterthron is far less useful now than it was. It would be nice if CCP increased the tracking rate of the blasters, or decreased the Powergrid and CPU need of them.

I didn't mean to come accross like I disagree with everything you are saying, as I actually do agree with many of the drawbacks of Galente ships. I just see them as pretty cheap well rounded T1 ships. They do tend to have some of the worst T2 ships though.

 

[ichy]

If the Blasterthron has been nerfed then in your opinion what's the best ship to use as a relatively affordable solo PvP battleship. Right now I use a Drake to rat in 0.0. It's got enough DPS and tank to take out NPC rats while at the same time fitting a warm scrambler & webber. I'd though of training up to be able to use a Megathron as an upgrade, but it sounds like there are better alternatives out there.

 

[Genx87]

Ahh I miss my Myrmidon

 

[heat901]

ugh reading this thread makes me wanna reactivate

 

[Martimus]

If the Blasterthron has been nerfed then in your opinion what's the best ship to use as a relatively affordable solo PvP battleship. Right now I use a Drake to rat in 0.0. It's got enough DPS and tank to take out NPC rats while at the same time fitting a warm scrambler & webber. I'd though of training up to be able to use a Megathron as an upgrade, but it sounds like there are better alternatives out there.

I still like the Blasterthon as a cheap solo BS. A Typhoon is also good in that respect. Both can fit a good tank, good gank, and sufficient tackle/support equipment to go out alone.

Rohks can be set up with godly tanks and damage by using just T2 equipment, but you give up a MWD and Tackle to get the tank to 1 vs. all levels, and that makes it far less useful in PvP.

Abaddons have a great tank along with very good damage. The issue is that you likely won't have much support equipment fitted, as they don't have many mid slots.

Macherials do great in solo fights, because they have very high DPS along with enough speed to dictate whether you want to bug out or not. These are obviously very expensive however.

Paladins do great in Solo work as well, but are again very expensive.

Anyway, I will let the more experienced members answer as well. This is based on my experience living in Low Sec, where most of our fights are solo or small gang warfare.

 

[Craig234]

I've heard this is one of the worst games there is for a new player. Can a new player enjoy it? What should they do to enjoy?

 

[Martimus]

I've heard this is one of the worst games there is for a new player. Can a new player enjoy it? What should they do to enjoy?

Join an active corp that will take you in and help you advance. Running missions with others is actually kind of fun. Joining a militia and going on raids is also fun.

Run the tutorials, and play around with the different things you come into contact with. You will find a lot of things to keep you interested at first. I found that market manipulation was pretty fun in the beginning, and even running missions was fun the first few times through alone. I found mining mind numbingly boring, and gave that up pretty quickly though. I still enjoy probing Cosmic Signatures, I enjoy hunting other people to kill, and enjoy running plexes with friends. Just don't get bogged down in one thing in this game, as it can get boring that way. There are so many different things to do, you just need to try something new when you start to get bored.

 

[ichy]

I've heard this is one of the worst games there is for a new player. Can a new player enjoy it? What should they do to enjoy?

You could look into ninja-salvaging. It's not as profitable as it used to be, but it's probably still pretty good money compared to running level 1 or 2 missions.

 

[v8envy]

On top of that, my Mission running Domi's are even cheaper at around 90M, and can tank anything. They may be slow, but 400DPS with a 900DPS tank can get you pretty far in L4 Missions.

A HAM drake is even cheaper and more effective. I used a domi for PvE myself, and waiting while my drones flew from target to target made me want to /wrists.

I do agree that tracking sucks on the ships. They aren't fast enough to catch up to Minmatar ships, and the tracking appears worse than Autocannons. (even though on paper, blasters have better tracking.) Although you can easily tank an Amarr ship with superior tracking. (I killed a Fail fit Aaddon with a Thorax solo once, just by orbiting him at 1250m.)

It's all about the range. Minmatar ships fight in falloff, for the most part. At 8km you don't need anywhere near the tracking you do at 1.25km. Yeah that Abaddon pilot had no idea what he was doing. A BS in lowsec is stupid, not trying to approach an orbiting smaller ship is stupid, etc etc. Unless you had mids full of tracking disruptors I guarantee you a non-noob would have melted you in seconds.

Megablobs aren't all that common in Low-Sec. You rarely see gangs bigger than 20 ships. We will field 100 man gangs on occasion, but most roaming gangs are more like 10-15 members. The smaller the gang, the more important the set-up. You really need to plan out your small gangs to really be effective against any opposing fleets of size. A ten man gang of 3 logistics pilots, 5 gank ships, 1 ECM ship, and 1 Command Ship can really cause a lot of havoc to gangs even twice the size.

In a 10 man gang I'd rather lose the 3 logistics and field moar ECM. The command ship is highly optional for the expense, I'd rather either spend the ISK elsewhere and just bring a HICtor.

Small gang warfare is all about the midslots. Who has the most mid slots in the game? Hint: not gallente.

I can't recommend Caldari for fleet battles that much either, since an Amarr fleet will tear apart a Caldari fleet pretty easily, and those Amarr RR BS gangs are pretty popular. Although Caldari fleets are pretty mobile, since they don't have plates and can align and warp quickly.

It's all about the range. Amarr are currently the kings of sniping, which does make them supreme at long range laggy blob on blob action. Not running out of ammo makes them very useful for both afk pos bashing and laproofing. Missiles take a long time to travel, so many will hit long after the primary is dead -- you woldn't bring ravens to a non-pos fight, you'd bring blaster and rail rokhs.

You'd also be surprised how many enemies a single scorpion can effectively remove from the field of battle.

I didn't mean to come accross like I disagree with everything you are saying, as I actually do agree with many of the drawbacks of Galente ships. I just see them as pretty cheap well rounded T1 ships. They do tend to have some of the worst T2 ships though.

No worries, if there was one true way to play eve we'd all be doing that. I don't ever think in terms of lowsec (which I guess is why you didn't mention bringing a dictor or inty in your gang, something no roam in 0.0 is ever without) since I view lowsec as "flyover country" and not a destination. Another viewpoint is always valuable.

 

[v8envy]

Join an active corp that will take you in and help you advance. Running missions with others is actually kind of fun. Joining a militia and going on raids is also fun.

This, 1000x this. The advice you'll get in newbie chats is to sit in a station or run level 1 missions while waiting for your learnings to finish. F that. Do that on an alt once you're addicted. Get out there, interact with pepole. Steal from miners, ninja loot at Jita 4-4 undock, get into a FW blob. Anything but sit around solo waiting for bars to increase while running the same L1 mission for the billionth time. Don't worry about grinding up ISK as a newbie. It's a huge waste of time for minimal investment. And for god's sake DO NOT MINE.

Unfortunately most really good corps won't take pilots fresh off of trial. And if you do start, hit one of the people here for a 21 day trial code. That way it's a win for you (nearly a month of free gametime) and a win for someone here if you later subscribe.

 

[v8envy]

hat's the best ship to use as a relatively affordable solo PvP battleship.

Solo, PvP, battleship, low cost, success. Pick any two.

A BS is simply gankbait. They are too slow and too easy to locate. And did I mention too slow?

HAM drake is an effective solo machine. When flying solo it's all about picking your fights, and you have a lot more unwinnable fights brought to you when you've got a giant battleship ass hanging out of your pants. That said, when I flew solo in 0.0 I did best in a Domi - due mostly to the flexibility in fitting and me *gaining* 10M isk every time I was blown up (cost 30M to build, 42.5M insurance payout IIRC).

This is purely theorycrafting since I don't do any lowsec of note but I'd imagine a 220mm AC hurricane or HAM drake would be the easiest to succeed with in low cost solo PvP. No cap issues to worry about, good range, enough midslots, drones for the smallfry, low cost, fitting flexibility. Nothing stops you from slapping a 1600mm plate, suitcase and EANM on a drake and filling your mid slots with tackle and ECM, for instance.

 

[ichy]

A HAM Drake is what I currently use and I've been pretty happy with it, just wondered if there was something better I could step up to. Sounds like I'll stick with the Drake since it's reasonably flexible and affordable to lose.

 

[Visaoni]

So it seems as if they've changed insurance a bit since I left, is the top tier still what you always want to get?

 

[Acanthus]

So it seems as if they've changed insurance a bit since I left, is the top tier still what you always want to get?

Since you will almost certainly always lose your ship in the allotted time of the insurance... Yes. Always take platinum, it will always be a net gain over lower or no insurance.

 

[Acanthus]

I've heard this is one of the worst games there is for a new player. Can a new player enjoy it? What should they do to enjoy?

It inspired this image.

 

[Michael]

Gallente is a fine and versitile race. Tracking doesn't make as much difference when you're shooting at other BS, the Mega gets a bonus and it can be fit quite nicely as a sniper. Domi can be used to pretty much AFK level 4's. Not as fast to run through the missions, but you can't aggro the room and go eat dinner in a Raven while your drones kill everything.

It is easy to cross train Amarr and Gallente. For the most part, only the guns are different.

In RR BS gangs, Amarr and Gallente shine. For medium range gangs, Drake blobs with gallente reconds (for scram range) and some shield logisitcs are golden.

To be honest, I don't find any race to be bad.

Michael (Myrdin Potter)

ps - low sec = no bubbles and gate guns kill small ships. No bubbles = expensive clones with slave sets and such. Much fewer small ships, normally you PvP in a BS or a BC. A shield-fit BC gang with logisitcs can really rip up foes.

 

[v8envy]

Anything can be made to work. My point is gallente is almost never the best choice any more. Ask yourself this: would you rather a mega sniper, or an apoc? Can a geddon, phoon or rattlesnake afk level 4s the exact same way as a domi but with lots and lots more DPS when you're at the keyboard?

Yes, the arazu and lachesis are awesome ships when used along their specialization. For every other situation there's a better solution elsewhere.

My vote is still for Caldari first. A fledgeling Caldari jockey will be highly useful while maxing out drone, ECM, capacitor, navigation, fitting and gunnery skills (in roughly that order). They can even dabble in armor tanking skills. Once the support skills top notch THEN and only then train amarr or gallente or even minmatar. Missile skills are easy to train, don't need to be maxed for best effect and are sometimes useful for other races as well (think bombers). Passive shield (or shield buffer) tanking is low SP impact as well. The only "waste" is BS IV -- which is what, 3-4 days? If the newbie specializes in BC that skill transfers straight across and the only waste is Caldari Cruiser III.

And even BS IV that isn't wasteful for the one time you need to field a scorp with your blob.

 

[KaOTiK]

Good showing today for the Alliance Tournament. Really looking forward to tomorrows finals.

PL made me damn happy with their Amarr(I'm an Amarr fan) setup especially with the 3 Legions ( <3 my Legion).

 

[Red Storm]

Hey guys, wold like some opinion on the best solo PVP Myrmidon setup to go with. The first one is all about effective hitpoints:

Two 1600 plates, a DC and three hardeners in the lows (trimark rigs, over 100k EHP).

The other option is the 3 rep setup that also seems to be pretty popular, with three medium reps, two nanos and a DC.

I really like the sound of 100k plus EHP, however I feel like that fit is more suited to group fighting and not solo. Or, should I forget both fits and go with a more standard two rep fit?

 

[Martimus]

Hey guys, wold like some opinion on the best solo PVP Myrmidon setup to go with. The first one is all about effective hitpoints:

Two 1600 plates, a DC and three hardeners in the lows (trimark rigs, over 100k EHP).

The other option is the 3 rep setup that also seems to be pretty popular, with three medium reps, two nanos and a DC.

I really like the sound of 100k plus EHP, however I feel like that fit is more suited to group fighting and not solo. Or, should I forget both fits and go with a more standard two rep fit?

I have killed 150+ in this setup: http://nawti.evekb.co.uk/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=1293544

Reps are better than buffer on the Myrm, because it has a good bonus to reps (7.5% per level). There are no bonuses to guns, so you can fit autocannons instead of Blasters so you don't require cap to shoot. I don't use Autocannons because I don't have good skills in them, and they are harder to fit. I put a plate on my ship because gate guns eat through your tank quickly when combined with guns, and a buffer helps greatly to stay alive.

 

[JSt0rm]

let me just say if anyone is thinking about playing and use me for the 21 day invite and purchase a month I will give them 50 million iskies. This is enough to really set you up if you are smart with it.

 

[KaOTiK]

Sigh, that last match Hydra vs PL was a total let down.

Oh well, CCP did a great job imo with this AT. The HD stream was really good and I liked a lot of the stuff they did inbetween with lil promo/behind the scenes things they did as well as alliance ads (eve uni was made lol)

 

[Martimus]

Sigh, that last match Hydra vs PL was a total let down.

Oh well, CCP did a great job imo with this AT. The HD stream was really good and I liked a lot of the stuff they did inbetween with lil promo/behind the scenes things they did as well as alliance ads (eve uni was made lol)

Speaking of Eve-University, they took a field trip through our space again. They had a fleet of 39 about half frigates, the rest cruisers, BCs and one BS. I decided it would be fun to engage them, even though we only have maybe a dozen people active at the time. We finally got about 14-15 players to take on this 39 man Eve-U blob (although 2 of those were logistics) The end result was this:
http://nawti.evekb.co.uk/?a=kill_related&kll_id=1481797

They ran! We pointed the one BS and all his support ran off. We killed the few support that stayed (or couldn't warp before they were pointed), then managed to mop up a few of them further down the chain.

I am not that surprised, but I still was hoping for a real fight. It would have been fun if they actually fought back since they definitely had numbers on us.

 

[Michael]

We went on a very long roam and found no targets. While we were about 20 jumps from home, our intel reported that there was a Macharial piloted by a station and gate hugging pilot that comes and bothers us from time to time. We get 5 jumps away and he leaves system. For some reason he decides to go to Eve Gate and a couple of us switch ships into ships that can slow the fast ship down.

This time we catch him at gate and there is no escape:

http://nawti.evekb.co.uk/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=1483143

5 of my corp mates were on the kill (including me). We did blob him, but he has been highly annoying recently.

Michael (Myrdin Potter)

 

[Visaoni]

Speaking of Eve-University, they took a field trip through our space again. They had a fleet of 39 about half frigates, the rest cruisers, BCs and one BS. I decided it would be fun to engage them, even though we only have maybe a dozen people active at the time. We finally got about 14-15 players to take on this 39 man Eve-U blob (although 2 of those were logistics) The end result was this:
http://nawti.evekb.co.uk/?a=kill_related&kll_id=1481797

They ran! We pointed the one BS and all his support ran off. We killed the few support that stayed (or couldn't warp before they were pointed), then managed to mop up a few of them further down the chain.

I am not that surprised, but I still was hoping for a real fight. It would have been fun if they actually fought back since they definitely had numbers on us.

So I take it there are better options than Eve-University? I figured it was about time I get to finding a new corp, and was hoping I might be able to be lazy about it and just join an established newbie one - like Eve-University.