Everything You Need To Know About Protein

SVT Cobra

Lifer
Mar 29, 2005
13,264
2
0
EDIT: NEW Also take a look at my supplement flow chart


I see a lot of protein questions on here, and I also get quite amount of PM's about supplements and weight training, so I decided to make a quick quide to help out with any questions one might have on protein (creatine soon to come).

So let's make this one quick, as you can go and read forever and ever about protein and the types, but who has the time? Due to my huge budget on supplements and my 10+ years of compeition powerlifting I know some about it , but if you think I left anything out, feel free to add, or if anything is unclear or not mentioned don't hesitate to ask in this thread or via PM. Mind you this thread is for begginer lifters who do not know much about protein, and need to be informed as protein supplements is one of the most important supplements one can invest in (notice I said supplements, you must still eat, eat, eat).

So let us begin.

There are three major types of protein that you can buy, and as a begginer you should know your options. I will not mention Meal Replacement Powders in this thread as I beleive they are a waste (as they can be made) and many are quite frankly not that good, but if you have any MRP related questions ask away, but most begginers do not need them anyway.

Whey Protein: Yup this is the protein you see and hear everywhere, the most common type and the most wide spread type. This is the kind that belongs in every active person's supplement aresonal. Whey Protein is made from milk (so lactose intolerant will have to look towards egg proteins), and is readily absorbed into the body and skeletal muscles. it contains heaping amounts of esential and non-essential amino acids which aid in repairing muscle and growth, something every weight lifter wants. This protein is the quickest absorbed protein you can buy (hydrolized whey especially), so it is great for dropping the weight and picking up the shake to get some essential protein into your body immediately after a lift. Remember, you still need a lot of protein from foods, but this can help you reach the around 1-1.5gs/lb of protein per pound of bodyweight that a begginer should ingest. There are two major forms whey can come in, Whey Protein Concentrate (WPC), and Whey Protein Isolate (WPI). WPC is cheaper to process and is absorbed well but in some it causes gas and possible bowel irritations. WPI is abosrbed very quick and is a very pure form of protein, and causes no bowel irritations, but WPI is more expensive. Most common whey proteins contain both, but mostly WPC. WPC is fine do not get me wrong, but WPI is still better, kind of like Premium Gas (WPI) for your car as opposed to regular (WPC). So look for proteins with higher percentages of WPI. They will list either one first depending on the ratio on the ingrediant label. Best brand? Almost all will agree on Optimum Nutrition's Gold Standard 100% Whey Protein. It contains a lot of WPI, is still relatively cheap, tastes great (choclate, rocky road, and strawberry are great, avoid vanilla), and offers a great bang for your buck. It also contains aminogen (mostly a gimmic, but hey it cannot hurt) that is supposed to help the body break down the protein to be used. If you have more money to spend, look into Synthrax Nectar, it is almost 100% WPI and is the best protein you can buy for the most part, it is also the best tasting, and the fruit flavor (fuzzy navel, you will not be dissapointed) allows one to get away from the usual choclate or vanilla for a while. When to take: 1-2 scoops in the morning, 1-2 immediately after a workout (most important dose), and 1-2 before bed (if not taking casein). The amount and how many scoops per day depends on your diet and how much you can afford to take. Remember that the body can only absorb around 50g's of protein at once (some more, some less, and it depends on how long one has been supplementing with protein), and the rest is excreted out, so two scoops is plenty (most proteins have 23-24g's per scoop).


Casein Protein:
This protein is a bed-time protein. When you sleep you cannot eat, meaning your body does not get the protein it needs at night, so you can begin to go into a catabolic state (as opposed to anabolic) (protein synthesis wise, growth factors are at their high at this time), and the muscle can begin to slowly break down. This is why many body builders eat a meal right before bed. Casein can help. There are two types: beta and alpha casein, and you can only buy them together, and both are pretty much the same, so do not worry. Casein once digested gels in ones stomach and creates a slow digesting protein that slowly seeps through to ones intenstines and into your blood stream. It can take up to 7 hours for 15gs of casein to digest (perfect), feeding your body with a continous stream of protein as you sleep keeping you anabolic. Wait? So you are saying I have to buy a seperate protein before bed? No, many feel that the catabolic state of the body at night is not that bad (remember you grow when you sleep), and you can get by with whey. You can also mix your whey with milk instead of water to make it slow digesting. Milk contains almost all casein protein and when mixed with regular whey it slows down the whey (the whey molecules get caught in the casein gel), creating the desired effect. So what kind do I buy? Optimum Nutrition as 100% Casein protein, which is cheap and gets the job done, but it is extremely chalky and tastes bad. Your best bet is Xtreme Formulations Ultra Peptide, which has a great high quality blend of casein and tastes great, but is expensive for the amount you get. Synthrax Matrix 5.0 claims to be a bed-time protein, but does not have enough casein to justify this (they won't release the exact amounts, for good reason), so stay away. The same goes for Designer Nutrition's Sustain and other propritary blends.


Mixed Blends: This is your Muscle Milk and your BSN's Syntha-6, and your myoplex etc. my thoughts on these are they are a waste. They can be considered an all purpose protein because they contain protiens from whey, casein, egg, etc., except you do not want an all purpose protein, you want your protein shake to be absorbed right away not slowed down by egg and other blends, and many contain fats and extra calories that you could get from foods. Syntha-6 is the best tasting protein powder you can buy, but it is expensive and I do not really have a use for it. EAS' sMyoplex is scientifically sound, but too expensive and does not offer and real advantages over regular old Whey.

A note about Muscle Milk. First of all, it is extremely popular, due mostly to good marketing. For those that know about it, 18gs of fat is too much unless bulking and while it tastes great, it really is not worth it. And, against common belieft, MM does not contain creatine, it contains a creatine precursor called glyocamine which in stuides has caused long term alzheimer's and possible heart problems. Due to a long uprising at bodybuilding.com (I am Scott, a Gaspari rep there) CytoSport has now listened and taken GA out of MM, so if you must have it, look for the new containers. Other products like BSN's NO-Xplode contain GA also, but I would not worry too much about it, just watch how much you get from some products.



So for those confused or looking for some beggining info to help you dive into the world of weight lifting, or know enough to ask questions, I hope that helps. If you have any questions ask, or a specific question about a product feel free to post it here (I have just about tried them all).

EDIT: Heh, look at that, 10,000 big ones.
 

Nutdotnet

Diamond Member
Dec 5, 2000
7,721
3
81
You are the MAN!

Very, very good info, and, for the most part, very, very accurate.

Let me ask you this: Do you have specific information in stating why the amount of fat in Muscle Milk is "too much". I haven't worked out seriously for a couple years (as a matter of fact, my first day back to the gym was today, go me!) so my memory may be a little fuzzy, but I thought I had read some information regarding why CytoSport puts as much fat as they do, and the type of fats it contains really helps with body-building...again...it's been a while and I haven't googled or gone over to the ususal bodybuilding forums to look it up.

Then again, I used to take it before the "hype" started...who knows if they quality is still the same. However, I did like taking it as my "bed-time" shake. What would you recommend in it's place?
 

SVT Cobra

Lifer
Mar 29, 2005
13,264
2
0
Originally posted by: Nutdotnet
You are the MAN!

Very, very good info, and, for the most part, very, very accurate.

Let me ask you this: Do you have specific information in stating why the amount of fat in Muscle Milk is "too much". I haven't worked out seriously for a couple years (as a matter of fact, my first day back to the gym was today, go me!) so my memory may be a little fuzzy, but I thought I had read some information regarding why CytoSport puts as much fat as they do, and the type of fats it contains really helps with body-building...again...it's been a while and I haven't googled or gone over to the ususal bodybuilding forums to look it up.

Then again, I used to take it before the "hype" started...who knows if they quality is still the same. However, I did like taking it as my "bed-time" shake. What would you recommend in it's place?

It is fine for a bed-time shake as long as you are not cutting, but if you are 18g's of fat per serving is too much. Also Cytosport claims the fats are okay because they are mono-unsaturated fats "lean lipids" which they claim to aid in fat burning, which is somewhat true, but if your diet is correct, then you are already getting enough of these fats, and too much of anything as the saying goes... Also it does not contain enough calories to be a gainer as many use it as.

 

Jadow

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2003
5,962
2
0
Does Protein right after workout make that big of a difference? I've been lifting on and off for a couple years, just casually using free weights about 2 times per week, and have noticed some gains, but not really that much. I eat a regular diet, but don't take any protein other than what is in my food. I usually lift at night before bed and don't eat till the next morning.

I have some EAS Whey I bought about a year ago that I haven't opened, if I start taking that in morning, after working out and before bed, will it make a difference? I don't want to take in any more calories, so if I start doing this, I'm going to eat less somewhere else.

edit - It's not EAS I have it's a brand called "Body Fortress" I bought it at Wal Mart.
 

SVT Cobra

Lifer
Mar 29, 2005
13,264
2
0
Originally posted by: Jadow
Does Protein right after workout make that big of a difference? I've been lifting on and off for a couple years, just casually using free weights about 2 times per week, and have noticed some gains, but not really that much. I eat a regular diet, but don't take any protein other than what is in my food. I usually lift at night before bed and don't eat till the next morning.

I have some EAS Whey I bought about a year ago that I haven't opened, if I start taking that in morning, after working out and before bed, will it make a difference? I don't want to take in any more calories, so if I start doing this, I'm going to eat less somewhere else.

Whey protein does not have signifigant calories, so you still need to eat the same, or more because you need to take in more calories then you burn to build signifigant muscle. And, you really should eat right after lifting. When something breaks do you repair it right away or the next time you need to use it?
 

indamixx99

Golden Member
Oct 17, 2006
1,955
0
76
Awesome man... thanks for the info! I need to get back into this stuff and this definately helps. I used to take this cheap Costo brand whey protein - any thoughts on that? I'm a I guess you can call it, a hardgainer. Takes me forever to gain weight, but I can lose it quickly if I dont eat. Where's the best place to buy this stuff from - GNC, Rite Aid, or online?
 

Sukhoi

Elite Member
Dec 5, 1999
15,324
92
91
Thank you, I've been looking for good casein info for a long time.

I take it that your opinion is casein is a waste of money compared to taking whey with milk at night? Or if I have the cash should I still do casein? I have to buy a couple months worth of protein tomorrow so you have good timing with this thread.

And cottage cheese is casein, right?
 

SVT Cobra

Lifer
Mar 29, 2005
13,264
2
0
- Sukhoi: Yup, cottage cheese is a great cource of calcium and casein and most prefer this over shakes (casein shakes are easier though, and if you are taking ZMA before bed you do not want to calcium because it will block the absorbtion of zinc). If you have the money buy some casein, but if you do not mind eating cottage cheese before bed everynight then that is a better source.

Soy Protein should only be used for women, new studies have shown that a lot of Soy increases the conversion of test into estrogen and obviously (especially for a male lifting) that can have a bad effect. So that goes for tofo also.

-CostCo protein is fine, the same goes for Wal-mart supps. They are not the best and often contain uneccesary sugars etc, but they get the job done and as a teen when I was short on cash I bought all my supps from Wal-Mart.

-Great places to go any buy are (Not FROM GNC!!!! they are extemely overpriced, and the GNC brand is crap) The Vitamin Shoppe if you have one near, they usually get new stuff in all the time and are pretty cheap (some even do price matching), or if you can wait online at dpsnutrition.com they have super fast shipping and great customer service. I also find most of my supplements from there are pretty new and not sitting around the warehouse for a while unlike bodybuilding.com or discountanabolics
 

Sukhoi

Elite Member
Dec 5, 1999
15,324
92
91
Nifty, I won't buy another container of casein tonight. It'll give me a reason to gag down the cottage cheese that is sitting in my fridge.

Over the last year I've purchased a lot of protein from www.bulknutrition.com without any issues.
 

Riverhound777

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2003
3,360
61
91
Is it bad to replace a meal with a protein shake? Many mornings I don't have time to make a decent breakfast, so I just have a shake. I assume it is better than nothing. My shake includes a cup of 2% milk, a heaping scoop of Optimum 100% whey double choc, and a banana blended.

I am also pretty hungry when I get off work around 5:30 so I have a shake then so I don't eat dinner too early. I usually work out after having this shake, then eat dinner a few hours later. I know i'm not getting the 1g/lb of my weight, but I figure it is better than nothing.

I currently am 6'1 and weigh 175 pounds, do I really need to take 175g of protein in a day? The only time I have done that was when I had a shake for breakfast(40g), 20g in my lunch burritos, shake after work(40g), chicken breast for dinner with a glass of milk(40g), and another shake before bed(40g). That came out to 180g and I was really full. I can't see myself doing that daily.
 

Sukhoi

Elite Member
Dec 5, 1999
15,324
92
91
Originally posted by: Riverhound777
Is it bad to replace a meal with a protein shake? Many mornings I don't have time to make a decent breakfast, so I just have a shake. I assume it is better than nothing. My shake includes a cup of 2% milk, a heaping scoop of Optimum 100% whey double choc, and a banana blended.

I am also pretty hungry when I get off work around 5:30 so I have a shake then so I don't eat dinner too early. I usually work out after having this shake, then eat dinner a few hours later. I know i'm not getting the 1g/lb of my weight, but I figure it is better than nothing.

I currently am 6'1 and weigh 175 pounds, do I really need to take 175g of protein in a day? The only time I have done that was when I had a shake for breakfast(40g), 20g in my lunch burritos, shake after work(40g), chicken breast for dinner with a glass of milk(40g), and another shake before bed(40g). That came out to 180g and I was really full. I can't see myself doing that daily.

What's your goal?
 

RaiderJ

Diamond Member
Apr 29, 2001
7,582
1
76
Originally posted by: Riverhound777
Is it bad to replace a meal with a protein shake? Many mornings I don't have time to make a decent breakfast, so I just have a shake. I assume it is better than nothing. My shake includes a cup of 2% milk, a heaping scoop of Optimum 100% whey double choc, and a banana blended.

I am also pretty hungry when I get off work around 5:30 so I have a shake then so I don't eat dinner too early. I usually work out after having this shake, then eat dinner a few hours later. I know i'm not getting the 1g/lb of my weight, but I figure it is better than nothing.

I currently am 6'1 and weigh 175 pounds, do I really need to take 175g of protein in a day? The only time I have done that was when I had a shake for breakfast(40g), 20g in my lunch burritos, shake after work(40g), chicken breast for dinner with a glass of milk(40g), and another shake before bed(40g). That came out to 180g and I was really full. I can't see myself doing that daily.

I personally like the RTD shakes in the morning. Something quick and easy to get me going. During the day I'll have a protein bar and snack on some mixed nuts so that I'm constantly eating.

I'm about 200lbs, so for me I just can't do 200g of protein in a day. If I ate that much I think I'd be sick. I go for around 100-150g.
 

91TTZ

Lifer
Jan 31, 2005
14,374
1
0
I have a fact that most muscle magazines don't want you to know: Your physique is largely due to genetics. I used to go to the gym every day, and I still didn't have the build of my friend who ate doritos and soda all day. He was totally ripped. Still is.

Meanwhile, I'm doing things scientifically, measuring out my food, eating chicken, brown rice, and vegetables all the time, and I still couldn't get much under 13% bodyfat. It just wasn't in my genetics to do so.

Now if you raise your testosterone illegally, then you can drop your bodyfat percentage easily.
 

Riverhound777

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2003
3,360
61
91
Originally posted by: Sukhoi
Originally posted by: Riverhound777
Is it bad to replace a meal with a protein shake? Many mornings I don't have time to make a decent breakfast, so I just have a shake. I assume it is better than nothing. My shake includes a cup of 2% milk, a heaping scoop of Optimum 100% whey double choc, and a banana blended.

I am also pretty hungry when I get off work around 5:30 so I have a shake then so I don't eat dinner too early. I usually work out after having this shake, then eat dinner a few hours later. I know i'm not getting the 1g/lb of my weight, but I figure it is better than nothing.

I currently am 6'1 and weigh 175 pounds, do I really need to take 175g of protein in a day? The only time I have done that was when I had a shake for breakfast(40g), 20g in my lunch burritos, shake after work(40g), chicken breast for dinner with a glass of milk(40g), and another shake before bed(40g). That came out to 180g and I was really full. I can't see myself doing that daily.

What's your goal?

To gain strength and be fit, my weight doesn't really concern me. I got my first desk job after college about a year and a half ago and have gained about 15 pounds since. Starting about 2 months ago I began working out, running, and eating better along with taking protein. So far my weight has stayed the same at 175, but I have made pretty good gains in my lifting(I have pretty much stopped running sadly, but I was making gains there too) and I think I have probably replaced a good 5-10 pounds of fat with muscle. I still have a ways to go to be as fit as I would like.

I know I should be doing cardio, but I just don't have the time or the drive with it being dark when I get off work. I have a weight bench at home so I don't have a gym membership. But I do have a few roommates who I have been working out with, so that helps a lot.
 

rocadelpunk

Diamond Member
Jul 23, 2001
5,589
1
81
Thanks for the info!

I'm about 195, 6-6'1 (wanting to get down to 170's)

I do 45min of biking on med-high resistance or 30min of rowing 3-5x a week. This quarter I'm going to start lifting a couple times a week with a friend...even though I'm only lifting a couple times, does it make sense to start taking protein...should I bother with protein if I"m just doing cardio?

Thanks :0
 

Special K

Diamond Member
Jun 18, 2000
7,098
0
76
Originally posted by: 91TTZ
I have a fact that most muscle magazines don't want you to know: Your physique is largely due to genetics. I used to go to the gym every day, and I still didn't have the build of my friend who ate doritos and soda all day. He was totally ripped. Still is.

Meanwhile, I'm doing things scientifically, measuring out my food, eating chicken, brown rice, and vegetables all the time, and I still couldn't get much under 13% bodyfat. It just wasn't in my genetics to do so.

Now if you raise your testosterone illegally, then you can drop your bodyfat percentage easily.

So true, ultimately your potential to improve your physique is determined by your genetics and/or drug use. Hard work is important, but it will only allow you to reach your own individual potential.

I have been mentally struggling with that issue for the past few months, and my workouts have been seriously suffering as a result.
 

50cent1228

Platinum Member
Oct 5, 2006
2,425
0
0
good i think this is awesome coz iv seen way too many people taking all this stuff with out actually knowing what it does and how it works..
 

bignateyk

Lifer
Apr 22, 2002
11,288
7
0
Somewhat off topic:

I am looking for some high calorie snacks to eat between my dinner and my bedtime shake. Any thoughts?

Right now I try to eat every 2-3 hours. I have my homemade weight gainer for breakfast, a 12" sub for lunch, a BSN truemass weight gainer shake after the gym, dinner, then some optimum protein mixed with milk right before bed.

I need something between dinner and bed though to add more calories, and I dont really want to drink another shake.


Any reasonably healty, high calorie snack suggestions?

Thanks!
 

Nutdotnet

Diamond Member
Dec 5, 2000
7,721
3
81
Originally posted by: Riverhound777
Is it bad to replace a meal with a protein shake? Many mornings I don't have time to make a decent breakfast, so I just have a shake. I assume it is better than nothing. My shake includes a cup of 2% milk, a heaping scoop of Optimum 100% whey double choc, and a banana blended.

I am also pretty hungry when I get off work around 5:30 so I have a shake then so I don't eat dinner too early. I usually work out after having this shake, then eat dinner a few hours later. I know i'm not getting the 1g/lb of my weight, but I figure it is better than nothing.

I currently am 6'1 and weigh 175 pounds, do I really need to take 175g of protein in a day? The only time I have done that was when I had a shake for breakfast(40g), 20g in my lunch burritos, shake after work(40g), chicken breast for dinner with a glass of milk(40g), and another shake before bed(40g). That came out to 180g and I was really full. I can't see myself doing that daily.

You'd be surprised how many people will replace a meal w/ a Protein Shake. There's absolutley NOTHING wrong with this at all. When I was heavy into body-building half of my "meals" came from shakes. It just gets expensive.

However, I used to turn my shakes into a meal. A simple whey shake is not going to be a very good meal replacement as, for one, most whey shakes are low in calories, and two, whey absorbs very quickly, you want to mix it with something to slow down the absorption rate.

My "morning meal" would consist of my whey shake, a piece of wheat bread, and a tablespoon of either Olive Oil or Flax Seed Oil. Took less than 5 minutes to make AND eat. Very quick, and it works! I had about 30g of protein, 15-16 grams of fat, 25-30 (maybe more depending on the 100% wheat bread) of carbs. A decent way to start the day for people on "the go".

- I almost forgot, Cobra- The Protein that Costco sells isn't half bad. It has 4grams of carbohydrates per serving (it uses Splenda as a sweetner). It tastes like hell, but $20 for a 6lb bag is pretty hard to pass up!
 
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