Evolution....

[QurazyQuisp]

Originally posted by: kmrivers

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp

Originally posted by: kmrivers

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp
I'd like to get out that I'm a creationist, ...

You lost all credibility at this point.

I'm not trying to prove anything, I want to know what the other "side" believes. I'm a very open-minded christian, and I am interested in it. I try to give everything else a chance, although I'm ultimately a christian, and will probably always be one.

Christian != Creationist

I'm sorry that you are closed minded, and don't want to know what christianity is. Yes, you may know the general beliefs, but you probably don't know a lot about it, just like I don't know a lot about evolution, but I'd like to know more, so that I don't sound like an idiot when trying to press my beliefs on others.

Please tell me that was a joke....

How is it a joke? When you are debating, isn't the best way to convince someone by knowing both their side and your side equally well?

Um... if you are a christian your goal is not to convince someone. It is winning them over with the love of Jesus through yourself. You didn't say "debating" you said press your beliefs on someone.

Read my post above. You are mixing up concepts.

"Convincing" can be showing Christ's love, but inevitably, most stubborn minded people are going to want to refute what you have to say.

When you are debating, are you not essentially pressing your beliefs, trying to get someone to believe what you believe?

 

[kmrivers]

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp

Originally posted by: kmrivers

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp

Originally posted by: kmrivers

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp
I'd like to get out that I'm a creationist, ...

You lost all credibility at this point.

I'm not trying to prove anything, I want to know what the other "side" believes. I'm a very open-minded christian, and I am interested in it. I try to give everything else a chance, although I'm ultimately a christian, and will probably always be one.

Christian != Creationist

I'm sorry that you are closed minded, and don't want to know what christianity is. Yes, you may know the general beliefs, but you probably don't know a lot about it, just like I don't know a lot about evolution, but I'd like to know more, so that I don't sound like an idiot when trying to press my beliefs on others.

Please tell me that was a joke....

How is it a joke? When you are debating, isn't the best way to convince someone by knowing both their side and your side equally well?

Um... if you are a christian your goal is not to convince someone. It is winning them over with the love of Jesus through yourself. You didn't say "debating" you said press your beliefs on someone.

Read my post above. You are mixing up concepts.

"Convincing" can be showing Christ's love, but inevitably, most stubborn minded people are going to want to refute what you have to say.

When you are debating, are you not essentially pressing your beliefs, trying to get someone to believe what you believe?

No you are simply debating. Convincing should not be the goal. Sharing ideas is what you are doing. If you are that closed minded and are only interested in converting someone you are never going to learn anything from anyone else.

 

[SlitheryDee]

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp

"Convincing" can be showing Christ's love, but inevitably, most stubborn minded people are going to want to refute what you have to say.

When you are debating, are you not essentially pressing your beliefs, trying to get someone to believe what you believe?

I think you are thinking about this in the wrong way. For there to be a valid debate there must be logical discourse. It's all about point and counterpoint, not the pressing of beliefs. If you want to rationally debate the existence of god or his effect on evolution (impossible on both sides IMO), then you do it logically. Be ready for the refutes, that is part of debating.

 

[daveshel]

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp
I'd like to get out that I'm a creationist, ...

You lost all credibility at this point.

I'm not trying to prove anything, I want to know what the other "side" believes. I'm a very open-minded christian, and I am interested in it. I try to give everything else a chance, although I'm ultimately a christian, and will probably always be one.

Christian != Creationist

Maybe according to some of the folks who we are hearing the most from these days, but these folks are what I, and some other Christians I know, call false believers. The Bible is is full of references to them, how in the end times they will use the Word to advance their own ends.

 

[zanieladie]

I don't subscribe to the THEORY of evolution.

 

[SparkyJJO]

Originally posted by: Schadenfroh

Originally posted by: Astaroth33
Christian != Creationist

I know many Christians than are evolutionists. They believe that god is the ultimate origin of the universe and created everything we know via evolution (and maybe a nudge here and there).

The scientific evidence of evolution is far too great to ignore.

evidence? Like what, some human skull and pig teeth filed to fit?

Evolution is a THEORY and only a theory, it has never been proven. That is why I think it should be taught as so in schools, not as fact.

 

[IronWing]

I think the creationist position strongly favors abortion while the evolutionist would have to support illegal immigrants' right to play rap music.

 

[cyclohexane]

the op should just take a basic biology course, or get a basic biology book. Btw, what do you mean you're a creationist? Do you mean that you believe in the 7 days of creation, Noah's Arc, etc?

 

[chuckywang]

Anybody else think this thread was gonna be about a car?

 

[RCN]

Originally posted by: SparkyJJO

Originally posted by: Schadenfroh

Originally posted by: Astaroth33
Christian != Creationist

I know many Christians than are evolutionists. They believe that god is the ultimate origin of the universe and created everything we know via evolution (and maybe a nudge here and there).

The scientific evidence of evolution is far too great to ignore.

evidence? Like what, some human skull and pig teeth filed to fit?

Evolution is a THEORY and only a theory, it has never been proven. That is why I think it should be taught as so in schools, not as fact.

:roll:
It is taught as theory in schools.

There is plenty of evidence to support the theory.

A "theory" in science is not just joe dumbass' opinion. There are requirements to be met to be considered a "theory"

Nothing is ever "proven" in science.

 

[MBrown]

Originally posted by: kmrivers
Also, Evolution is not the antithesis to Creationism
Big Bang is what you should be looking for.

If you think about, who is to say Big Bang is wrong. Even if we were created by God, what if God used the "Big Bang" as the intro to life. If you think of it that way, the idea of a big bang should be acceptable by everyone.

EDITED: "He" again and mixed up sentence

God didn't use the "big bang"

Genesis 1
The Beginning
1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
2 Now the earth was [a] formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and He separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning?the first day.

6 And God said, "Let there be an expanse between the waters to separate water from water." 7 So God made the expanse and separated the water under the expanse from the water above it. And it was so. 8 God called the expanse "sky." And there was evening, and there was morning?the second day.

9 And God said, "Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear." And it was so. 10 God called the dry ground "land," and the gathered waters he called "seas." And God saw that it was good.

11 Then God said, "Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds." And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening, and there was morning?the third day.

14 And God said, "Let there be lights in the expanse of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark seasons and days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth." And it was so. 16 God made two great lights?the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. 17 God set them in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth, 18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening, and there was morning?the fourth day.

20 And God said, "Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the sky." 21 So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living and moving thing with which the water teems, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 God blessed them and said, "Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth." 23 And there was evening, and there was morning?the fifth day.

24 And God said, "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind." And it was so. 25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."

27 So God created man in his own image,
in the image of God he created him;
male and female he created them.

28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground."

29 Then God said, "I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. 30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground?everything that has the breath of life in it?I give every green plant for food." And it was so.

31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning?the sixth day.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp
I don't know a lot about evolution, but I'd like to know more, so that I don't sound like an idiot when trying to press my beliefs on others.

Pressing your beliefs on others is precisely the problem.

That is anti-American, congrats for hating America and everything it stands for. :thumbsdown:

 

[JDrake]

you can't prove evolution :evil:

 

[creedog]

Originally posted by: joedrake
you can't prove evolution :evil:

Well you can and you can't. For example, It can be proven that giraffes overtime evolved as their longer necks allowed them to reach leaves in high trees. Those with shorter necks could not reach as many leaves and were not as sucecfull and profiencent. Long necks in Girraffe=survial of the fittest.

If you put your brain to it you can figure it out.

However, religion is not about thinking it is about believing. That is why it is called faith. You think its true even though there really is no evidence to support your beliefs other than a book written a long ass time ago by who knows who.

Now the paradox here is that if there really was any evidence to support your religious beliefs then you would not have to have faith, which would then devalue your religions belives. As we all know the beauty of the christain faith is that you "just" belive.

I honestly do not care what you think, and if others want to debate with you then have at it. Just resepect my right, and my childrens rights, not to have to be subjected to your "faith". Science is not "faith" and is not a religion. Science is based on fact. Theory or not.

Be respectful enough of others to understand that YOUR religious beliefs should be taught in YOUR religious setting. Like church, private school, or sunday school, not PUBLIC SCHOOL.

And don't even try to come to my door, as I will meet you half way up the driveway and forcibly excort your small minded, ignorant, medieval belief system having, blindly following rear back to your mini-van

 

[Kev]

Originally posted by: RCN

Originally posted by: QurazyQuisp

First: Where did the first living things come from? (evolve from)

Chance combo of the ingredients. Likely seeded by comets.............

Second: Where did everything as we know it evolve from? How did the universe and such "evolve" from nothing? (If that is the case)

fluctuations........singularity.......inflation

Well there you have it. I know all my questions have been answered.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: SparkyJJO

Originally posted by: Schadenfroh

Originally posted by: Astaroth33
Christian != Creationist

I know many Christians than are evolutionists. They believe that god is the ultimate origin of the universe and created everything we know via evolution (and maybe a nudge here and there).

The scientific evidence of evolution is far too great to ignore.

evidence? Like what, some human skull and pig teeth filed to fit?

Evolution is a THEORY and only a theory, it has never been proven. That is why I think it should be taught as so in schools, not as fact.

God isn't even a Theory, it is an Ancient Assumption with zero evidence.

 

[IGBT]

Originally posted by: RallyMaster
My view is: whatever happened already happened and we are already here. We shouldn't argue over how we got here, but rather worry about what lies ahead. To me, I came from the union of sperm and egg and that's all that matters.

..and that's probably all we'll ever know till we get to the "other side".

 

[sao123]

Originally posted by: MBrown

Originally posted by: kmrivers
Also, Evolution is not the antithesis to Creationism
Big Bang is what you should be looking for.

If you think about, who is to say Big Bang is wrong. Even if we were created by God, what if God used the "Big Bang" as the intro to life. If you think of it that way, the idea of a big bang should be acceptable by everyone.

EDITED: "He" again and mixed up sentence

God didn't use the "big bang"

Genesis 1
The Beginning
1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
2 Now the earth was [a] formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and He separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning?the first day.

6 And God said, "Let there be an expanse between the waters to separate water from water." 7 So God made the expanse and separated the water under the expanse from the water above it. And it was so. 8 God called the expanse "sky." And there was evening, and there was morning?the second day.

9 And God said, "Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear." And it was so. 10 God called the dry ground "land," and the gathered waters he called "seas." And God saw that it was good.

11 Then God said, "Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds." And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening, and there was morning?the third day.

14 And God said, "Let there be lights in the expanse of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark seasons and days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth." And it was so. 16 God made two great lights?the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. 17 God set them in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth, 18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening, and there was morning?the fourth day.

20 And God said, "Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the sky." 21 So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living and moving thing with which the water teems, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 God blessed them and said, "Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth." 23 And there was evening, and there was morning?the fifth day.

24 And God said, "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind." And it was so. 25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."

27 So God created man in his own image,
in the image of God he created him;
male and female he created them.

28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground."

29 Then God said, "I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. 30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground?everything that has the breath of life in it?I give every green plant for food." And it was so.

31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning?the sixth day.

<---------- Is Christian...
<---------- Also realized that most of the stories in the bible are incomplete or are metaphorical with Truth and must be taken in context...

Specifically Speaking about creation...
The Bible Tells us That God Created... It does not say when, where, how, or how long.

it does tell us God created...
And he did everything in specific steps in a specific order... and in which order those steps came. Universe, Solar System, Earth, Plants, Animals, Man

People try to convincingly use
With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day.
to produce the young earth theory of 6000-7000 years... these people do not understand...

Everything about the bible is written in metaphors, and sometimes incomplete ones.
The specific text means that to God... time has no meaning. Not that literally one of God's days equals 1000 years.

Nothing in the big bang theory describes why these events happened... and nothing in the bible describes the physical processes by which these things occured.


No... God didnt use the big bang...
The big bang is what we call what we saw when God did his work.


I wrote a nice 2 page thread on this just about 2 weeks ago... but it seems to have been deleted... which is a shame because I wanted to save everythign that i wrote...
(far more detailed than the simple explaination I have given here.)

 

[JulesMaximus]

I believe we all evolved from pies.

 

[iamaelephant]

Well Im surprsed no one has menioned it yet, but the orgin life is caled Abiogeness. It's a complicated process so I'm not going to bother typing it out here, but if you're genunely interested (which I suspect you probably are not) look it up on wikipedia or something. Or just google Abiogenesis.

Of course theory of evolution does not deal with either the origins of life or the origins of the universe, so your thread title is flawed.

Oh, and to the guy who claimed RNA and DNA floated down to earth from a comet, please leave this thread and never come back. People like you are just making the job harder for proponents of evolution. Seriously, what a load of nonsense.

 

[GeneValgene]

evolution is not a theory of ultimate origins, and never was intended to be. it presupposes that life already exists.

 

[RCN]

Originally posted by: Falcon39


Oh, and to the guy who claimed RNA and DNA floated down to earth from a comet, please leave this thread and never come back. People like you are just making the job harder for proponents of evolution. Seriously, what a load of nonsense.

I don't think anyone said DNA or RNA was brought by comets. However I believe the components for DNA are more likely formed in "space" than on earth.

and as you said he really isn't talking about evolution.........

 

[iamaelephant]

Actually...

Originally posted by: Legend
I'm no expert, but here's what I've gathered:

The current theory is that there's amino acids/RNA/DNA out there in space on floating debris. That's how it got to earth. We've collected data from meteors, and I believe that's what's given support to the theorey.

That is such ridiculous nonsense I don't even know where to begin. The amino acids, DNA and RNA were brought about gradually on earth in a process called abiogenesis. There are no DNA molecules floating around in space. That's just..... stupid...

 

[RCN]

Originally posted by: Falcon39
Actually...

Originally posted by: Legend
I'm no expert, but here's what I've gathered:

The current theory is that there's amino acids/RNA/DNA out there in space on floating debris. That's how it got to earth. We've collected data from meteors, and I believe that's what's given support to the theorey.

That is such ridiculous nonsense I don't even know where to begin. The amino acids, DNA and RNA were brought about gradually on earth in a process called abiogenesis. There are no DNA molecules floating around in space. That's just..... stupid...

Sorry didn't see that.............amino acids do exist in space though.

Anyway just to defend his view a little the theory is called panspermia. Why do you feel it is stupid?

 

[Legend]

Originally posted by: Falcon39
Well Im surprsed no one has menioned it yet, but the orgin life is caled Abiogeness. It's a complicated process so I'm not going to bother typing it out here, but if you're genunely interested (which I suspect you probably are not) look it up on wikipedia or something. Or just google Abiogenesis.

Of course theory of evolution does not deal with either the origins of life or the origins of the universe, so your thread title is flawed.

Oh, and to the guy who claimed RNA and DNA floated down to earth from a comet, please leave this thread and never come back. People like you are just making the job harder for proponents of evolution. Seriously, what a load of nonsense.

It's called Panspermia, and no I'm not making the "job harder." If anything it's smug people like you that constantly put down other viewpoints. Science is about constantly questioning things, not a "DAMMIT YOUR HURTING THE CAUSE DUMBASS" attitude.