Exercise - Muscle Growth

[Genx87]

The college football program I went through stressed repition and endurance more than raw strength. Our program usually started the 2nd week in Januray and ran upto spring ball. The first 3 weeks were what they called the base building phase. This meant lower wiehgt high repetition. The folowing 4 weeks after that was considered strength building where we went to 85-90% of max at 2-4 reps.

The only excercise we had that went to failure was curls. We would take a standard 45lb bar and put two 10s and a 5 on. We would go until we couldnt go anymore then have our spotter take the weight off incrementally till you eventually got down to the bar.

That would make you puke(literally). That is why they had pride buckets next to that station.

After the 7 weeks of weights we concentrated on cardio and conditioning. Moving to more running oriented drills. We did however continue lifting but in a reduced fashion. We had a pride drill we would do 2-4 times in the month of March where we had 5 stations setup. After each lifting station we had to run a 400 in between. We ran this circuit twice and it was a monster of a workout.

By this time Spring break has happened and we were now coming up on Spring ball.

The results for this imo was phenominal. My first year in this program I went from 175 and 12% body fat to 189 and 5% bodyfat. I dont know the exact number but I believe I picked up about 26 pounds of lean muscle mass in under 3 months.

I look back on it and miss the dedication and intensity of the program. I looked great and was strong as hell. I just cant get myself that motivated to do all those drills on my own. I go and workout but currently sit at 205 and about 15% body fat hehe.

 

[ApacheChief]

I really am interested in weight lifting. I assume this is so, because of my age (16)

I used to be a bit pudgey, and I'm getting back there again. I haven't ran/biked for a long time, but I just want a cut look. Big fore arms would be nice also.

All last summer I biked nearly 8 miles a day and worked out fairly hard, but I never got sore. I didn't gain much mass or much strength... which is the real point of this post: I worked out for 3 months and I got almost no results, so I quit. Starting out I could bench 130 and ending I could bench 140, IIRC.

What was I doing wrong? I'm thinking about trying that 'not looking at myself' shpeel to gain a little confidence.

 

[AbAbber2k]

Originally posted by: insolence
I really am interested in weight lifting. I assume this is so, because of my age (16)

I used to be a bit pudgey, and I'm getting back there again. I haven't ran/biked for a long time, but I just want a cut look. Big fore arms would be nice also.

All last summer I biked nearly 8 miles a day and worked out fairly hard, but I never got sore. I didn't gain much mass or much strength... which is the real point of this post: I worked out for 3 months and I got almost no results, so I quit. Starting out I could bench 130 and ending I could bench 140, IIRC.

What was I doing wrong? I'm thinking about trying that 'not looking at myself' shpeel to gain a little confidence.

I'm guessing two things were probably holding back your gains. 1. Your diet sucked. 2. You were doing too much cardio. Also, fairly hard isn't enough. If you're not putting in all your effort you're wasting your time.

So here's what you do.
1. Clean up your diet, and start eating more. When you say "a bit pudgey" I think of a guy who's "soft" looking but not fat, which means average weight but low muscle mass. Also, make sure you're getting plenty of protein, try and shoot for 1g per lb that you weigh.
2. Ease back on the cardio. Cardio is great for creating a calorie deficit as well as the numerous health benifits, but right now it sounds like your goal is strength/muscle (because in the end you need muscle to look cut).
3. Lift hard. Always warm up each major muscle group before lifting, and always lift as much as you can until you know one more rep is impossible (on post-warmup reps).
4. REST. Give yourself a day to rest between workouts. Your body needs rest to repair itself.
5. Push yourself. You should be trying to lift more every workout.
6. Don't Give Up. What you want can't be had over night, so stick with it, because if you do it right it WILL pay off.

Here's a little background info to let you know where I'm coming from. When I started my first bulking cycle I was 135lbs at 5'6". My bench max was about 165 and I was barely squating more than 200. In 3mo I gained 20lbs and my bench max went up to about 205. Aside from str gains I couldn't tell I'd made much progress, but people that hadn't seen me in 3mo could.

And finally, if you ever think you don't have time to work out... you're WRONG. It doesn't take all day. Most of the time I can hit every muscle group in 45min to an hour, and really, that's all the time it should take. If you're really short on time though, my favorite (and what I think are the most beneficial) lifts are: Bench Press, Squats, Pull-ups and Sit-ups. These four exercises will hit your chest, shoulders, arms, legs and abs and you can probably work your a$$ off in all four in about 30min. Pull-ups and Shrugs are also great for forearm strength.

 

[ApacheChief]

What's a Shrug? (do you mean squat?)

By pudgey I mean a little overweight, about 20 lb's overweight, but now all I have is a little pot belly (125 lbs). I'm 5'6" and I can do about 130 bench, 30~ biceps, 25~ triceps and maybe 30~ shoulders. My diet was fairly good, I ate a couple burgers but that was about all the bad stuff I ate. I didn't get much protien or calories though.

Anyway, where do I do these work outs? Should I be sore the next day?

How do I get 125 grams of protien a day!? I bought some Whey Protien shake stuff, which tastes like news paper (surprisingly good news paper) and it gives me 22 grams of protien a serving.

 

[AbAbber2k]

Shrugs are when you hold dumbells or a bar and "shrug" your shoulders upwards. There should be no arm movement whatsoever. Its good for your forearms and will add thickness to your neck as well.

Also, now that I know your stats it's a little easier to gauge where you're coming from. First off, for your height, 125 isn't overweight. The reason you look "pudgey" or overweight is because of lack of muscle mass. I gaurantee if you lost 20lbs you'd look like a stick and that would not be healthy. The general rule is that 1lb of fat looks like a grapefruit, while 1lb of muscle looks like a tangerine... or something to that effect. I probably screwed it up.

So workouts. My suggestion is, find a gym and get a membership. Some gyms offer discounts to students. In my area, a student gym membership runs about $20/month. If going to the gym isn't an option, then you're gonna need to invest in at least a Flat Bench, an EZ Bar + weights and Dumbells/Dumbell Bars. Squats may not be do-able at home for you, so you could replace them with Deadlifts if need be. If you need examples of how to do a certain lift, head to www.bodybuilding.com and look for their encyclopedia.

Diet. 125g of Protein a day is cake. My diet for my first three month bulking cycle included 250-300g of protein @ ~3.5k calories a day, only 50 of which were from Shakes. And remember, when I started I was 5'6" and a lean 135lb, so I was far off from where you are now. The first week I was practically forcing the food down my mouth because I wasn't use to eating so much. Admittedly, I should have eased into my diet, but after the first week I was on the verge of adding more food.

Good sources of protein include:
Tuna, Milk, Cottage Cheese, Yogurt, Chicken, Eggs, Lean Beef, Pork. There are others but finding food that works for you is easy enough. Cottage cheese is the only thing on that list that I personally WILL NOT eat. The texture absolutely kills me. Some people swear by it, and if I could stomach it I'd eat it every day as it's an excellent source of protein. Most people recommend mixing it with pineable/peaches or milk.

Don't forget to eat plenty of fruits and green vegetables as well. Vitamins and minerals are extremely important, and you're better off getting them naturally than from vitamin tablets (though admittedly I took multivitamins in addition). Green beans, brocolli and especially asparagus are especially good, or at least my favorite. If you have problems with asparagus like I use to, a good way to cook em is with garlic and cheese.

Carbs are extremely important as well. Don't buy into the low carb diet trends... they're bs. Oatmeal, Wheat bread, Brown rice, Pasta... all great sources of good carbs.

That's all I've got in me right now, I feel like I just wrote an encyclopedia. Feel free to post any other questions.

 

[AbAbber2k]

Originally posted by: Sunner
Very informative thread, I'm mostly just posting to keep track of it easily

On a sidenote, I find it extremely hard to push myself hard enough to cause an ache the day after, after a few weeks of 5-6 time/week training.
After a resting period(or as it stands now, after two weeks of being sick) the ache will be a complete b!tch the first week and a half or so, but after that it will gradually settle down even though I always push myself as hard as I can.

Seems like my friends who work out get the same thing, are we just doing something wrong, or is this just the way it is?

Soreness immediately after exercise is due to Lactic Acid accumulation, which is a byproduct of glycolysis (muscles recieve their energy from Muscle Glycogen stores). Source 24-48hrs after exercise is called DOMS which stands for Delayed Onset Muscle Soreness. DOMS is basically the time when your body is repairing the microtears in your muscles which are caused from acute exercise.

From my personal experience, after a while, regardless of how hard you lift, the soreness stops. We've actually been discussing DOMS recently in my Exercise Phys class and I've been meaning to talk with my prof about it being an indicator of efficient lifting. As far as I know though, if you're not sore, it's not necessarily because you didn't work out hard enough. Though I have noticed that soreness from OBLA (Onset Blood Lactate Accumulation) does persist.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: AbAbber2k

Originally posted by: Sunner
Very informative thread, I'm mostly just posting to keep track of it easily

On a sidenote, I find it extremely hard to push myself hard enough to cause an ache the day after, after a few weeks of 5-6 time/week training.
After a resting period(or as it stands now, after two weeks of being sick) the ache will be a complete b!tch the first week and a half or so, but after that it will gradually settle down even though I always push myself as hard as I can.

Seems like my friends who work out get the same thing, are we just doing something wrong, or is this just the way it is?

Soreness immediately after exercise is due to Lactic Acid accumulation, which is a byproduct of glycolysis (muscles recieve their energy from Muscle Glycogen stores). Source 24-48hrs after exercise is called DOMS which stands for Delayed Onset Muscle Soreness. DOMS is basically the time when your body is repairing the microtears in your muscles which are caused from acute exercise.

From my personal experience, after a while, regardless of how hard you lift, the soreness stops. We've actually been discussing DOMS recently in my Exercise Phys class and I've been meaning to talk with my prof about it being an indicator of efficient lifting. As far as I know though, if you're not sore, it's not necessarily because you didn't work out hard enough. Though I have noticed that soreness from OBLA (Onset Blood Lactate Accumulation) does persist.

When the soreness goes away you body is getting used to the workout cycle. I would do it for another week or two and do a switchup to shock the body. It can be as simple as reversing your workout routine or as complicated as doing completely different excercises.

 

[ApacheChief]

Man, I can do the work out, but I don't know about the diet!

I have a bench, a bar, dumbells, a 'belt' (not sure of the jargon), the works. My dad used to be a body builder (apparently 215 lbs of pure muscle at 5'9) and he has a ton of old stuff, including a new home gym system in his room. Similar to something like this: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi...em&category=73935&item=7145029189&rd=1

Anyway, I love cottage cheese and pineapple, I have lots of shakes and stuff. But what do I as to grams of fat? 50 a day?

Thank you _very_ much for your advice.

 

[Gibsons]

Originally posted by: insolence
Man, I can do the work out, but I don't know about the diet!

I have a bench, a bar, dumbells, a 'belt' (not sure of the jargon), the works. My dad used to be a body builder (apparently 215 lbs of pure muscle at 5'9) and he has a ton of old stuff, including a new home gym system in his room. Similar to something like this: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi...em&category=73935&item=7145029189&rd=1

Anyway, I love cottage cheese and pineapple, I have lots of shakes and stuff. But what do I as to grams of fat? 50 a day?

Thank you _very_ much for your advice.

If you're really trying to put on muscle weight by eating lots of protein (sounds like it), you're almost certainly getting enough fat along with it to not worry about. Unless you're worried about eating too much fat, in which case you just need to stick to leaner sources - eat things like fish and skinless chicken breasts, nothing fried. Be sure to drink a lot of water in any case.

 

[ApacheChief]

Me being lazy, I'm wondering if there's a website/store I can just buy like a weeks worth of food from?

 

[Ahkorishaan]

Alright, I'm an extremely lean 135-140, with a very cut figure at 5'7", but there is quite simply no mass there. I don't really work out, besides Parkour, 100 or so push-ups a night, a bunch of sit-ups, and heel-ups until i quite literally cannot do them anymore, and can leg press upwards of 850-900lbs last I tried.(I can dunk a basketball at 5'7" so I think I've got pretty good leg strength.) I'm very focused on flexibility, I can quite easily do full splits, and jsut about anything along the lines of flexible. To stretch my hamstrings I need to lay on my back and have someone walk my leg over.

Like I said, I'm pretty cut, regular back-flips tone the heck out of my stomach, but I am not really that nice to look at, too many jutting bones, and sharp lines.

Do any of you gurus have an idea of what I can do to bulk up a bit?

*Note: I also eat a good 4 square meals a day, taking full advantage of my campus' buffet food services.

 

[Gibsons]

Originally posted by: Ahkorishaan
Alright, I'm an extremely lean 135-140, with a very cut figure at 5'7", but there is quite simply no mass there. I don't really work out, besides Parkour, 100 or so push-ups a night, a bunch of sit-ups, and heel-ups until i quite literally cannot do them anymore, and can leg press upwards of 850-900lbs last I tried.(I can dunk a basketball at 5'7" so I think I've got pretty good leg strength.) I'm very focused on flexibility, I can quite easily do full splits, and jsut about anything along the lines of flexible. To stretch my hamstrings I need to lay on my back and have someone walk my leg over.

Like I said, I'm pretty cut, regular back-flips tone the heck out of my stomach, but I am not really that nice to look at, too many jutting bones, and sharp lines.

Do any of you gurus have an idea of what I can do to bulk up a bit?

*Note: I also eat a good 4 square meals a day, taking full advantage of my campus' buffet food services.

Sounds like you're A: young B: very active c: a high metabolism on top of all that. All of which will make it pretty hard to add weight.

But anyway, if you're really looking to pack on muscle, switch to weights. Pushups etc are good or even great exercise in a general sense, but sub-optimal for putting on weight. Previous posts in the thread have advice about how to do the workouts. Also, it sounds like you'll need to eat even more. Like someone said previously, "eat big." Try to focus on high protein intake if possible and be sure to get the fruits and veggies mixed in.

 

[ApacheChief]

After a day or two of thought this is starting to sound too big for me now. I just want to look cut, 6 pack and nice forearms. I have _some_ triceps/biceps and pecks already.

Jogging and drinking 3-4 shakes a day sounds somewhat more enticing to me. I'm never going to be a big guy, I don't need to play sports or anything. I just want more confidence. The idea of forcing 3.5k calories and 200 grams of protien down my throat sounds very daunting and annoying. I don't want to _really_ change my life style.

I suppose I just want to know whether 60~ grams of protien a day and decent work outs will be enough to get 'cut'?

 

[Ahkorishaan]

Well 19, isn't really that young, but otherwise you got me pegged. I gotta find some time to hit the gym, and someone to do it with, i really can't afford to get myself hurt...

 

[AbAbber2k]

Originally posted by: insolence
After a day or two of thought this is starting to sound too big for me now. I just want to look cut, 6 pack and nice forearms. I have _some_ triceps/biceps and pecks already.

Jogging and drinking 3-4 shakes a day sounds somewhat more enticing to me. I'm never going to be a big guy, I don't need to play sports or anything. I just want more confidence. The idea of forcing 3.5k calories and 200 grams of protien down my throat sounds very daunting and annoying. I don't want to _really_ change my life style.

I suppose I just want to know whether 60~ grams of protien a day and decent work outs will be enough to get 'cut'?

The problem is I don't know what you want when you say "cut." I think of cut as lean and muscular. The problem is, at 130lbs and "pudgey," if you workout with your only goal being to lose fat, you'll end up just looking really skinny. Sure, you'll be able to see your abs, but a "skinny-pack" isn't the same as a muscular 6-pack. And if you DO want to build muscle... if you want to make some visible progress (ie not have to keep at it for years to look just ok) then you will have to make some changes to your diet/routine.

 

[ApacheChief]

I of course don't mind a couple changes

I'd like to just look defined, let me find a picture:
http://members.tripod.com/~Fat_Loss_Die...builders/Andy-frontrelaxed-Nov1-99.jpg

For the most part, like that. I have pictures of myself also:
http://insolence9.com/signs/ec8.jpg

Which is just after summer, notice the horrible tan lines from an 'Employee's must wear t-shirts' rule at my summer job

 

[AbAbber2k]

In order to have a build like the guy in the top picture you'd definitly need to start eating more and hit the weights hard. Fortunately if that's all you're aiming for, you wouldn't need to "cut down" so much as you would need to just put on muscle. I'm gonna guess and say you'd need at least 30lbs more muscle to have a similar build. I'm just gonna refer you back to my previous posts about diet.

 

[mehmel]

There's no way your going to get a body like that unless you go to the gym, eat a lot, and intake at least 100 grams of protein a day.
You look like your in high school or college, go to your schools gym, and work one body part a day. This is just a basic workout, nothing too comlpex, but will work for you.
Mon: Chest: Bench Press, Incline Press, Decline Press, Chest Fly's
Tues: Arms: Curls, Pushdowns, Close Grip Bench Press
Wed: Off
Thur: Legs: Squats, Leg Press, Hamstring Curls, etc.
Fri: Back: Barbell Rows, Lat Pulldowns, Seated Rows...
Do Heavy Abs a few times a week, 10-20 rep range.
If you want that body, its not going to just appear one day cause you go biking once in a while. And you are definetely not fat at all. It wont come easy. Work hard, eat right, and don't complain if you stop doing any of these things and you don't see the results you want. Rome wasn't built in a day.

 

[ApacheChief]

Alright, but I'm not sure what you mean by this:

Do Heavy Abs a few times a week, 10-20 rep range.

 

[AbAbber2k]

Originally posted by: insolence
Alright, but I'm not sure what you mean by this:

Do Heavy Abs a few times a week, 10-20 rep range.

Basically throw in Abs twice a week. Do em on a decline and work your way up to holding a weight... do them until failure.

 

[ApacheChief]

I've always been told to do every muscle group, then rest a day.

IE What I used to do:
(I don't remember the work out names, so I'll say the group)
Pecks
Shoulders
Triceps
Biceps
Obliques

Is this method less effective, or something?

 

[AbAbber2k]

It really depends on your personal physiology and how you prefer to workout. I'm a full-body guy, 2x a week (though that's partly due to schedule). However, I've made great gains on routines similar to what mehmel posted.

 

[ApacheChief]

Well based on the fact that I'd rather work out during the day when I gain some free time, I think I'll use my fathers home gym.

I can hit all my muscles on that, but I'm a bit confused on the 'working till failure'
Do I start low, work till failure, do a seperate muscle group, then come back at a higher weight and work till failure _again_?
IE
20 LB biceps until failure
80 LB pecks until failure (Should be about a minute between each)
25 LB biceps ultil failure

Something like that?

So far my changes are: Much more protien, 5x to be _minimal_, and working until failure.

 

[Gibsons]

Originally posted by: insolence
I've always been told to do every muscle group, then rest a day.

IE What I used to do:
(I don't remember the work out names, so I'll say the group)
Pecks
Shoulders
Triceps
Biceps
Obliques

Is this method less effective, or something?

Most every expert will tell you that for weight gain you're better off concentrating on each body part/muscle group individually, rather than the "whole body" workout. If you're just looking to burn calories, the whole body route is fine.

 

[AbAbber2k]

Working til failure means, warm-up, do some "build-up" reps, and then rep til failure on weight that you can at most get 3-5 reps out of.

So, let's say your MAX bench is 205. Start out with ~10 reps at 95lbs for your warm-up, then bump it up to 145lbs, then rep til failure on 165+. You can build your set however you feel comfortable, just make sure your last set (or two sets) are pushing big weight til failure (until you fail or know your next rep will fail).